Any doubts on 2nd gen TLX for 2020? Err...make that 2021?
#81
According to many reviewers and users, it seems Acura is controlling RDX power in first couple of gears to protect the SH-AWD (or reduce wear and maintenance in long term). I hope they figure out a way around that for 3.0T.
#82
Seriously doubt that they would end production of TLX in March with a possible summer/fall release. We would see pretty much finished mules running around with camo. Unless, the next Gen will only be tweaked on the outside with major changes in power train and interior. If you look at the all new RDX and compare it to the refreshed TLX on the outside it is not that drastically different.
#83
Confirmed from SVP at American Honda at NADA 2019n- new TLX will be released this year and a new ILX & MDX will be released next year. Type S models will be coming within 24 months.
https://www.autonews.com/nada-show/p...-acura-dealers
https://www.autonews.com/nada-show/p...-acura-dealers
The following 3 users liked this post by joshuaren:
#84
Three Wheelin'
Confirmed from SVP at American Honda at NADA 2019n- new TLX will be released this year and a new ILX & MDX will be released next year. Type S models will be coming within 24 months.
https://www.autonews.com/nada-show/p...-acura-dealers
https://www.autonews.com/nada-show/p...-acura-dealers
#85
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
That's 1 & 1 on my bet so far. TLX this year is good but wrong on platform. Never read much on the SUV, my bad. Will see how the 350 horsepower plays out next. If the base TLX V6 is 350BHP the S upgrade could really be a player in the low 4 second or sub 4 second 0-60 run.
IIRC without bothering to look it up all the Germans they are showing testing with are in the 350BHP range for their V6-I6 products.
IIRC without bothering to look it up all the Germans they are showing testing with are in the 350BHP range for their V6-I6 products.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-26-2019 at 11:42 AM.
#86
That's 1 & 1 on my bet so far. TLX this year is good but wrong on platform. Never read much on the SUV, my bad. Will see how the 350 horsepower plays out next. If the base TLX V6 is 350BHP the S upgrade could really be a player in the low 4 second or sub 4 second 0-60 run.
IIRC without bothering to look it up all the Germans they are showing testing with are in the 350BHP range for their V6-I6 products.
IIRC without bothering to look it up all the Germans they are showing testing with are in the 350BHP range for their V6-I6 products.
#87
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
Honda is already selling 306BHP 4 cylinder 2.0T in the Civic. A 2.4T would be an easy bump to 350bhp. 2.0T 350BHP while there are a number out there might be a stretch cost wise for Acura. Rather see the 3.0T V6 but if they want to play they have the tech.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-26-2019 at 12:53 PM.
#88
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I don't see anything in the press release about a type S this year. The next "24 months" seems consistent with what the GM at my dealer said the corporate rep told most likely Nov 2020 for the Type S. Do people still expect it out this year in light of this more "official" statement??
#89
Pro
I don't see anything in the press release about a type S this year. The next "24 months" seems consistent with what the GM at my dealer said the corporate rep told most likely Nov 2020 for the Type S. Do people still expect it out this year in light of this more "official" statement??
#90
Pro
Could happen if they go conservative. That said there are a number of 350BHP Turbo 4's on the market.
Honda is already selling 306BHP 4 cylinder 2.0T in the Civic. A 2.4T would be an easy bump to 350bhp. 2.0T 350BHP while there are a number out there might be a stretch cost wise for Acura. Rather see the 3.0T V6 but if they want to play they have the tech.
Honda is already selling 306BHP 4 cylinder 2.0T in the Civic. A 2.4T would be an easy bump to 350bhp. 2.0T 350BHP while there are a number out there might be a stretch cost wise for Acura. Rather see the 3.0T V6 but if they want to play they have the tech.
#91
I don't see anything in the press release about a type S this year. The next "24 months" seems consistent with what the GM at my dealer said the corporate rep told most likely Nov 2020 for the Type S. Do people still expect it out this year in light of this more "official" statement??
#92
Burning Brakes
Went from 2015 TLX to 2016 TLX and then finally moved to 2019 TLX. Could not wait any longer for a 2020.
The following users liked this post:
Curious3GTL (01-27-2019)
The following users liked this post:
tlxsteve (01-27-2019)
#94
#95
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
In the past the 335 series was 300BHP base & 320BHP MPPK THP were individual options. My 2014 435 was equipped this way. My 2011 335is Coupe was also 320BHP/THP over the base 335 coupe. "IS" was a grouped set like the S-Type.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-27-2019 at 12:00 PM.
#96
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
Congrats on your new car, one of my favorite colors. Similar to my TL.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-27-2019 at 12:08 PM.
The following users liked this post:
neuronbob (01-27-2019)
#98
Senior Moderator
You left a step out. 330 I4 base, 340 base I6 (320BHP) intermediate, 340 I6 MPPSK/THP (355BHP) = Type S. New 2019 330 I4 base 255BHP. M340 base I6 (382BHP), Performance (S-Type) version unknown - usually introduced 2nd or 3rd year in series.
In the past the 335 series was 300BHP base & 320BHP MPPK THP were individual options. My 2014 435 was equipped this way. My 2011 335is Coupe was also 320BHP/THP over the base 335 coupe. "IS" was a grouped set like the S-Type.
In the past the 335 series was 300BHP base & 320BHP MPPK THP were individual options. My 2014 435 was equipped this way. My 2011 335is Coupe was also 320BHP/THP over the base 335 coupe. "IS" was a grouped set like the S-Type.
#99
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
#100
Pro
You left a step out. 330 I4 base, 340 base I6 (320BHP) intermediate, 340 I6 MPPSK/THP (355BHP) = Type S. New 2019 330 I4 base 255BHP. M340 base I6 (382BHP), Performance (S-Type) version unknown - usually introduced 2nd or 3rd year in series.
In the past the 335 series was 300BHP base & 320BHP MPPK THP were individual options. My 2014 435 was equipped this way. My 2011 335is Coupe was also 320BHP/THP over the base 335 coupe. "IS" was a grouped set like the S-Type.
In the past the 335 series was 300BHP base & 320BHP MPPK THP were individual options. My 2014 435 was equipped this way. My 2011 335is Coupe was also 320BHP/THP over the base 335 coupe. "IS" was a grouped set like the S-Type.
Last edited by hondu; 01-27-2019 at 08:01 PM.
#101
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
First time the car was to a dealer was for its annual oil change & NC state inspection. As for Hondata its a 3rd party tune like the JB4 or Dinan for BMW. The 440 MPPSK is a BMW developed tune with a BMW performance exhaust system.
All the performance items on the 335is could have been bought as dealer installed items except for some trim parts that made in car unique. Most of the performance parts in the various packages can be bought individually like the IS, ZHP packaged parts etc, but they cost a lot more. Also if you have the dealer do it you have dealer instillation charges you don't have if BMW does it.
No shock that you can get a lot of performance parts from the dealer as BMW is in the performance parts business to support the various amateur racing series.
So yes you can also get the MPPSK & MPPK installed by the dealer when you buy from the lot or desire to add one to a car you have from a dealer & have it installed. What also needs to be said when the car is tuned at the dealer its done remotely not by the dealer. They just plug it into the BMW computer system.
AFAIK the THP Track Handling Package which includes the Dynamic Suspension & Variable Rate Steering, Brembo Performance Brakes (blue caliper) & Michelin PPS tires is not a dealer item. When I got the 435 MPPK those 4 items were separate options on the cars build sheet instead of a single item.
That said regardless of how you want to split it there is a third performance level provided directly & warranted by BMW, have personally done as low as 0-60 in 4.0 seconds available to any 3/4 series car. Really can't see the difference. Having looked at the TL type S they were a very slight effective power increase with 200CC more displacement, wheels, exterior, seat trim & more weight.
Chose an end of the year '06 TL 6MT over an '07 TL Type S.
If you look at whats in the base 340/440 line the M-Sport versions already have the aero, Front & Rear fascia, seats, wheels on them. Only thing missing is the extra power & handling of the packages.
Add the packages & you have an S type equivalent. Or maybe what the S-Type hopes to be this time.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-27-2019 at 09:42 PM.
#102
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 1,494
Received 869 Likes
on
413 Posts
I would suggest that you change cars too often, but as I also leased a 2015 (3.5 SH-AWD Tech, 2016 2.4 Tech and now a 2018 2.4 Elite ASPec, that would be a little silly Congrats and enjoy - and of course, a great looking car!
#103
Pro
My MPPK, MPPSK were not dealer installed. You can order them with cars being built to order in Germany. In fact my dealer for the last two cars is in Oregon the 335is in GA. I live in NC & picked the cars up at BMW Performance Center in SC as part of a track day program. All my BMW's have been built to order as the dealer lot stuff has no real interest to me.
First time the car was to a dealer was for its annual oil change & NC state inspection. As for Hondata its a 3rd party tune like the JB4 or Dinan for BMW. The 440 MPPSK is a BMW developed tune with a BMW performance exhaust system.
All the performance items on the 335is could have been bought as dealer installed items except for some trim parts that made in car unique. Most of the performance parts in the various packages can be bought individually like the IS, ZHP packaged parts etc, but they cost a lot more. Also if you have the dealer do it you have dealer instillation charges you don't have if BMW does it.
No shock that you can get a lot of performance parts from the dealer as BMW is in the performance parts business to support the various amateur racing series.
So yes you can also get the MPPSK & MPPK installed by the dealer when you buy from the lot or desire to add one to a car you have from a dealer & have it installed. What also needs to be said when the car is tuned at the dealer its done remotely not by the dealer. They just plug it into the BMW computer system.
AFAIK the THP Track Handling Package which includes the Dynamic Suspension & Variable Rate Steering, Brembo Performance Brakes (blue caliper) & Michelin PPS tires is not a dealer item. When I got the 435 MPPK those 4 items were separate options on the cars build sheet instead of a single item.
That said regardless of how you want to split it there is a third performance level provided directly & warranted by BMW, have personally done as low as 0-60 in 4.0 seconds available to any 3/4 series car. Really can't see the difference. Having looked at the TL type S they were a very slight effective power increase with 200CC more displacement, wheels, exterior, seat trim & more weight.
Chose an end of the year '06 TL 6MT over an '07 TL Type S.
If you look at whats in the base 340/440 line the M-Sport versions already have the aero, Front & Rear fascia, seats, wheels on them. Only thing missing is the extra power & handling of the packages.
Add the packages & you have an S type equivalent. Or maybe what the S-Type hopes to be this time.
First time the car was to a dealer was for its annual oil change & NC state inspection. As for Hondata its a 3rd party tune like the JB4 or Dinan for BMW. The 440 MPPSK is a BMW developed tune with a BMW performance exhaust system.
All the performance items on the 335is could have been bought as dealer installed items except for some trim parts that made in car unique. Most of the performance parts in the various packages can be bought individually like the IS, ZHP packaged parts etc, but they cost a lot more. Also if you have the dealer do it you have dealer instillation charges you don't have if BMW does it.
No shock that you can get a lot of performance parts from the dealer as BMW is in the performance parts business to support the various amateur racing series.
So yes you can also get the MPPSK & MPPK installed by the dealer when you buy from the lot or desire to add one to a car you have from a dealer & have it installed. What also needs to be said when the car is tuned at the dealer its done remotely not by the dealer. They just plug it into the BMW computer system.
AFAIK the THP Track Handling Package which includes the Dynamic Suspension & Variable Rate Steering, Brembo Performance Brakes (blue caliper) & Michelin PPS tires is not a dealer item. When I got the 435 MPPK those 4 items were separate options on the cars build sheet instead of a single item.
That said regardless of how you want to split it there is a third performance level provided directly & warranted by BMW, have personally done as low as 0-60 in 4.0 seconds available to any 3/4 series car. Really can't see the difference. Having looked at the TL type S they were a very slight effective power increase with 200CC more displacement, wheels, exterior, seat trim & more weight.
Chose an end of the year '06 TL 6MT over an '07 TL Type S.
If you look at whats in the base 340/440 line the M-Sport versions already have the aero, Front & Rear fascia, seats, wheels on them. Only thing missing is the extra power & handling of the packages.
Add the packages & you have an S type equivalent. Or maybe what the S-Type hopes to be this time.
My point is that BMW, Mercedes and Audi all offer a 4 cylinder turbo "base" model with their 330i, C300 and A4. You want the 6 cylinder? You have to step up to a M340i, AMG C43 or the S4, which are their performance lines. Yes, BMW used to offer a 335i, 335is, 340i, but it looks like they won't have a 340i for the next gen 3 series, just the M340i.
So it appears Acura will do something similar with the TLX and have a base model 2.0T and a 3.0T Type S model. Seeing how Acura typically has simple package options and not 10 million options like the Germans, I would think the 3.0T only comes in one Type S "flavor".
#104
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
For marketing reasons I was thinking an I4 base car with full option sets, DOHC V6 mid level say 350bhp +or- with full option sets. Then an S with more boost for say 380bhp +or- as the top end product.
I was thinking back in the day the S was part of a two car set by necessity as they did not offer a 4. Hugh amount of wailing & crying on Acurazine about the price jump. With the flexibility of turbo boost on the exact same engine package they have the opportunity to cover that open pricing slot this time.
Can't tell with some of the boners Acura marketing has pulled over the last 10 years but a 3 line spread with the current option sets in two of them would give them good segment coverage & not price the V6 out of the mid level 4 to 6 pricing crossover area.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-28-2019 at 11:42 AM.
#105
Some Guy Who Loves Cars
I was going to say a while back in this thread that Acura has a bit of an identity crisis. Everyone here is an enthusiast. Or you’re here (like me) because some issue or combination of issues brought us here. But instead think about the typical Acura buyer. Like a Honda buyer, he/she is smart and sensible, looking for a combination of appearance, sporty and reliability. Acura buyers don’t want a dragster or a track car. I don’t want research a Bimmer or MB to find out what engine I want with what body and accessories. I don’t need that speed, don't want to spend that kind of money and don't want the maintenance headache on those down the road. Just give me a car and let me pick its package (for me, always the fully loaded version). In the old days, Acura was a step up from Honda. Civic to Integra or Accord to TL. Nowadays, Acura and Honda are poaching buyers from each other. An Accord Touring offers more features for less money than a TLX base. Bad form. The biggest battles for Acura are against Lexus and Audi, and they are losing to both of them, by far, based on the magazines and reviews I read. Not good.
Listening to you guys in this thread makes me think of the IS-F. Google it if you’re not familiar. It was a phenomenal performance automobile designed to compete with the M3 and other cars you are discussing here, but presumably without sacrificing legendary Toyota reliability. But that isn’t the typical Lexus buyer. The price was probably high for so much performance and the car was discontinued due to poor sales. That is exactly what will happen to a TLX V6T Type S. It’s simply not what the typical Acura buyer wants. Anyone looking for that level of performance is shopping at Audi or BMW. I don't think any Acura will attract people away from those. I think Acura knows that, which is why they will keep pushing boners like a 2.4 A-SPEC (a complete poseur that caters well to Acura buyers) rather than develop a true Euro killer. Maybe time will prove me wrong.
This is all fodder for discussion and just my two cents.
Last edited by someguy11; 01-28-2019 at 01:21 PM.
#106
Pro
What you are suggesting is the TLX will be a 4 cylinder car for up to two years? Or that the S will be release day I as part of a two car set I4 base & DOHC V6 S?
For marketing reasons I was thinking an I4 base car with full option sets, DOHC V6 mid level say 350bhp +or- with full option sets. Then an S with more boost for say 380bhp +or- as the top end product.
I was thinking back in the day the S was part of a two car set by necessity as they did not offer a 4. Hugh amount of wailing & crying on Acurazine about the price jump. With the flexibility of turbo boost on the exact same engine package they have the opportunity to cover that open pricing slot this time.
Can't tell with some of the boners Acura marketing has pulled over the last 10 years but a 3 line spread with the current option sets in two of them would give them good segment coverage & not price the V6 out of the mid level 4 to 6 pricing crossover area.
For marketing reasons I was thinking an I4 base car with full option sets, DOHC V6 mid level say 350bhp +or- with full option sets. Then an S with more boost for say 380bhp +or- as the top end product.
I was thinking back in the day the S was part of a two car set by necessity as they did not offer a 4. Hugh amount of wailing & crying on Acurazine about the price jump. With the flexibility of turbo boost on the exact same engine package they have the opportunity to cover that open pricing slot this time.
Can't tell with some of the boners Acura marketing has pulled over the last 10 years but a 3 line spread with the current option sets in two of them would give them good segment coverage & not price the V6 out of the mid level 4 to 6 pricing crossover area.
FWD 2.0T
AWD 2.0T
Hybrid 2.0T
Type S V6T
My guess is the 2.0T comes out around mid-year 2019 and the Type S ~6 months later. I read the 24 months for launching as all of the Type S models, not just the TLX.
#107
Burning Brakes
I don't think it will take 2 years for the Type S on the TLX to be released, but yes, there will be no "in-between" V6T. Several insiders have already commented on this website and other websites. The line-up will be:
FWD 2.0T
AWD 2.0T
Hybrid 2.0T
Type S V6T
My guess is the 2.0T comes out around mid-year 2019 and the Type S ~6 months later. I read the 24 months for launching as all of the Type S models, not just the TLX.
FWD 2.0T
AWD 2.0T
Hybrid 2.0T
Type S V6T
My guess is the 2.0T comes out around mid-year 2019 and the Type S ~6 months later. I read the 24 months for launching as all of the Type S models, not just the TLX.
Acura has already carried the "value" badge with a lower entry price, having to decide between a bigger engine or smaller engine with modest price difference is not necessary. Along with trim levels and SH-AWD option. That is too many.
#108
Suzuka Master
I don’t think there will be a hybrid TLX.
If the Type-S is delayed more than 6 months then they need 2 different I4 Turbos, one with say 250HP and another in ASPEC with 300 then do Type-S at 340-360. I don’t think they will do this and if the Type-S is 2 years later it conflicts with MMC release and a 2020 date just hurts the first 18 months of sales. The mule has been on the road, so unless they need far more testing and have likely been developing it for over 2 years then why wait?
If the Type-S is delayed more than 6 months then they need 2 different I4 Turbos, one with say 250HP and another in ASPEC with 300 then do Type-S at 340-360. I don’t think they will do this and if the Type-S is 2 years later it conflicts with MMC release and a 2020 date just hurts the first 18 months of sales. The mule has been on the road, so unless they need far more testing and have likely been developing it for over 2 years then why wait?
#109
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC - USA
Age: 82
Posts: 7,674
Received 2,599 Likes
on
1,581 Posts
Not a bad model actually. Went back to their 3G model with just one engine. You'd only have to choose Tech or Non-Tech. I like that.
Acura has already carried the "value" badge with a lower entry price, having to decide between a bigger engine or smaller engine with modest price difference is not necessary. Along with trim levels and SH-AWD option. That is too many.
Acura has already carried the "value" badge with a lower entry price, having to decide between a bigger engine or smaller engine with modest price difference is not necessary. Along with trim levels and SH-AWD option. That is too many.
TL 3.2L @ 258BHP & new in 2007 TL-S 3.5L @ 286BHP.
The 6MT & 5AT were available in the 3.2 untill 2007 when only the TL S had both from then to the end of the generation. The TL 3.2L was limited to the 5AT after 2006.
Was the reason I bought an 06 rather then an 07. Wanted the 6MT without the S.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-28-2019 at 06:47 PM.
#110
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
A Type-S TLX willl be end of next year. Turbo V6. For what the 2nd Gen TLX non type-S has under the hood we will find out.
#111
The new platform the TLX will use isn’t related to any Honda platform. It’ll be unique to Acura sedans as it has DWB’s, the Honda modular platform cant accept a V6 (packaging is imited) vs the Acura platform nor can it support the larger diff of SH-AWD. The only thing the next gen TLX and current Accord will share is the 2.0t/10AT combo which will be similar but the TLX will get similar power/torque as the RDX.
#112
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 1,494
Received 869 Likes
on
413 Posts
This thread has wandered on and off topic and I've been reluctant to participate in so much speculation, but I think you guys are pretty close to the bullseye here. Considering where the Accord went, I think you will see 1.5T or 2.0T base and some upgrade from that as an S. Someone in this thread said the J35 is dead. If that’s the case, the K24 probably is too, and it’s a shame. I still have a really hard time believing whatever is next will be a 3.0T or any V6T, because those simply aren't in Honda's DNA. Maybe they will prove me wrong.
I was going to say a while back in this thread that Acura has a bit of an identity crisis. Everyone here is an enthusiast. Or you’re here (like me) because some issue or combination of issues brought us here. But instead think about the typical Acura buyer. Like a Honda buyer, he/she is smart and sensible, looking for a combination of appearance, sporty and reliability. Acura buyers don’t want a dragster or a track car. I don’t want research a Bimmer or MB to find out what engine I want with what body and accessories. I don’t need that speed, don't want to spend that kind of money and don't want the maintenance headache on those down the road. Just give me a car and let me pick its package (for me, always the fully loaded version). In the old days, Acura was a step up from Honda. Civic to Integra or Accord to TL. Nowadays, Acura and Honda are poaching buyers from each other. An Accord Touring offers more features for less money than a TLX base. Bad form. The biggest battles for Acura are against Lexus and Audi, and they are losing to both of them, by far, based on the magazines and reviews I read. Not good.
Listening to you guys in this thread makes me think of the IS-F. Google it if you’re not familiar. It was a phenomenal performance automobile designed to compete with the M3 and other cars you are discussing here, but presumably without sacrificing legendary Toyota reliability. But that isn’t the typical Lexus buyer. The price was probably high for so much performance and the car was discontinued due to poor sales. That is exactly what will happen to a TLX V6T Type S. It’s simply not what the typical Acura buyer wants. Anyone looking for that level of performance is shopping at Audi or BMW. I don't think any Acura will attract people away from those. I think Acura knows that, which is why they will keep pushing boners like a 2.4 A-SPEC (a complete poseur that caters well to Acura buyers) rather than develop a true Euro killer. Maybe time will prove me wrong.
This is all fodder for discussion and just my two cents.
The following users liked this post:
someguy11 (01-29-2019)
#113
There are four lights!
I don’t think there will be a hybrid TLX.
If the Type-S is delayed more than 6 months then they need 2 different I4 Turbos, one with say 250HP and another in ASPEC with 300 then do Type-S at 340-360. I don’t think they will do this and if the Type-S is 2 years later it conflicts with MMC release and a 2020 date just hurts the first 18 months of sales. The mule has been on the road, so unless they need far more testing and have likely been developing it for over 2 years then why wait?
If the Type-S is delayed more than 6 months then they need 2 different I4 Turbos, one with say 250HP and another in ASPEC with 300 then do Type-S at 340-360. I don’t think they will do this and if the Type-S is 2 years later it conflicts with MMC release and a 2020 date just hurts the first 18 months of sales. The mule has been on the road, so unless they need far more testing and have likely been developing it for over 2 years then why wait?
#114
I don't think it will take 2 years for the Type S on the TLX to be released, but yes, there will be no "in-between" V6T. Several insiders have already commented on this website and other websites. The line-up will be:
FWD 2.0T
AWD 2.0T
Hybrid 2.0T
Type S V6T
My guess is the 2.0T comes out around mid-year 2019 and the Type S ~6 months later. I read the 24 months for launching as all of the Type S models, not just the TLX.
FWD 2.0T
AWD 2.0T
Hybrid 2.0T
Type S V6T
My guess is the 2.0T comes out around mid-year 2019 and the Type S ~6 months later. I read the 24 months for launching as all of the Type S models, not just the TLX.
The following users liked this post:
hondu (01-29-2019)
#116
A-Spec is a sport/appearance package and not a performance package. A-Spec will only be available with the 2.0t. The 3.0t is exclusive to the Type-S.
#117
Moderator
This thread has wandered on and off topic and I've been reluctant to participate in so much speculation, but I think you guys are pretty close to the bullseye here. Considering where the Accord went, I think you will see 1.5T or 2.0T base and some upgrade from that as an S. Someone in this thread said the J35 is dead. If that’s the case, the K24 probably is too, and it’s a shame. I still have a really hard time believing whatever is next will be a 3.0T or any V6T, because those simply aren't in Honda's DNA. Maybe they will prove me wrong.
I was going to say a while back in this thread that Acura has a bit of an identity crisis. Everyone here is an enthusiast. Or you’re here (like me) because some issue or combination of issues brought us here. But instead think about the typical Acura buyer. Like a Honda buyer, he/she is smart and sensible, looking for a combination of appearance, sporty and reliability. Acura buyers don’t want a dragster or a track car. I don’t want research a Bimmer or MB to find out what engine I want with what body and accessories. I don’t need that speed, don't want to spend that kind of money and don't want the maintenance headache on those down the road. Just give me a car and let me pick its package (for me, always the fully loaded version). In the old days, Acura was a step up from Honda. Civic to Integra or Accord to TL. Nowadays, Acura and Honda are poaching buyers from each other. An Accord Touring offers more features for less money than a TLX base. Bad form. The biggest battles for Acura are against Lexus and Audi, and they are losing to both of them, by far, based on the magazines and reviews I read. Not good.
Listening to you guys in this thread makes me think of the IS-F. Google it if you’re not familiar. It was a phenomenal performance automobile designed to compete with the M3 and other cars you are discussing here, but presumably without sacrificing legendary Toyota reliability. But that isn’t the typical Lexus buyer. The price was probably high for so much performance and the car was discontinued due to poor sales. That is exactly what will happen to a TLX V6T Type S. It’s simply not what the typical Acura buyer wants. Anyone looking for that level of performance is shopping at Audi or BMW. I don't think any Acura will attract people away from those. I think Acura knows that, which is why they will keep pushing boners like a 2.4 A-SPEC (a complete poseur that caters well to Acura buyers) rather than develop a true Euro killer. Maybe time will prove me wrong.
This is all fodder for discussion and just my two cents.
I was going to say a while back in this thread that Acura has a bit of an identity crisis. Everyone here is an enthusiast. Or you’re here (like me) because some issue or combination of issues brought us here. But instead think about the typical Acura buyer. Like a Honda buyer, he/she is smart and sensible, looking for a combination of appearance, sporty and reliability. Acura buyers don’t want a dragster or a track car. I don’t want research a Bimmer or MB to find out what engine I want with what body and accessories. I don’t need that speed, don't want to spend that kind of money and don't want the maintenance headache on those down the road. Just give me a car and let me pick its package (for me, always the fully loaded version). In the old days, Acura was a step up from Honda. Civic to Integra or Accord to TL. Nowadays, Acura and Honda are poaching buyers from each other. An Accord Touring offers more features for less money than a TLX base. Bad form. The biggest battles for Acura are against Lexus and Audi, and they are losing to both of them, by far, based on the magazines and reviews I read. Not good.
Listening to you guys in this thread makes me think of the IS-F. Google it if you’re not familiar. It was a phenomenal performance automobile designed to compete with the M3 and other cars you are discussing here, but presumably without sacrificing legendary Toyota reliability. But that isn’t the typical Lexus buyer. The price was probably high for so much performance and the car was discontinued due to poor sales. That is exactly what will happen to a TLX V6T Type S. It’s simply not what the typical Acura buyer wants. Anyone looking for that level of performance is shopping at Audi or BMW. I don't think any Acura will attract people away from those. I think Acura knows that, which is why they will keep pushing boners like a 2.4 A-SPEC (a complete poseur that caters well to Acura buyers) rather than develop a true Euro killer. Maybe time will prove me wrong.
This is all fodder for discussion and just my two cents.
I think they want to portray a sporty upscale image - but they need to walk a fine line of keeping the value high and the performance just high enough to satisfy most. Marketing may claim they compete with BMW but the truth is for the most part they really don't. The market for a true sport sedan is pretty crowded and given the downward sales trend for sedans is it really fiscally smart to go to market with a Type-S at 50K+? Most (not all) people want the correct badge to go along with that kind of investment. To be fair I don't know the margins and how many they need to sell to break even or turn a profit. As you note - there are a lot of enthusiasts on this site who would love a super duper Type-S, but how many would actually pony up the cash for one beyond a handful of enthusiasts? Same with manual transmissions - sure you see a demand for it here - but they stopped investing in them for a reason and it wasn't because they were selling like hotcakes.
I hope they do come out with a respectable Type-S at a value oriented price point and I suspect that's where they're aiming. It should be fun to see how it all shakes out!
#118
There are four lights!
Yes, everyone knows that. KeithL just brought up an option that Acura could go with in the event the Type-S is delayed, or won't appear anytime soon. And maybe Acura should give the A-Spec a small boost in drivetrain performance to go with the looks.
#119
Burning Brakes
3G had two V6 engines:
TL 3.2L @ 258BHP & new in 2007 TL-S 3.5L @ 286BHP.
The 6MT & 5AT were available in the 3.2 untill 2007 when only the TL S had both from then to the end of the generation. The TL 3.2L was limited to the 5AT after 2006.
Was the reason I bought an 06 rather then an 07. Wanted the 6MT without the S.
TL 3.2L @ 258BHP & new in 2007 TL-S 3.5L @ 286BHP.
The 6MT & 5AT were available in the 3.2 untill 2007 when only the TL S had both from then to the end of the generation. The TL 3.2L was limited to the 5AT after 2006.
Was the reason I bought an 06 rather then an 07. Wanted the 6MT without the S.
#120
Marketing may claim they compete with BMW but the truth is for the most part they really don't. The market for a true sport sedan is pretty crowded and given the downward sales trend for sedans is it really fiscally smart to go to market with a Type-S at 50K+? Most (not all) people want the correct badge to go along with that kind of investment.
Dodge is selling 50 grand Chargers all the time (Charger did +20% in 2018 vs. 2017, despite the sedan crisis and FCA cut to fleet sales), Kia is doing fine with the Stinger, I see a lot of them on the road, including the GT.
Not many people spent that kind of coin on an Audi 15 years ago, now they do
Right content at the right price does sell.