LateRally

My '06 TL 5AT has crapped the bed (127K miles). This is my first experience with a failed transmission, so apologies in advance for the noob questions, but I am in desperate need of advice.

First of all, should I rebuild or replace the transmission? What are the pros and cons? And should I get the work done at a transmission specialist, a local Acura/Honda specialty shop (which is where I get all my routine service done currently), or a dealer? Who would do the best and most reliable job (money aside)?

Cost is not the overriding factor. In other words, I'm more than willing to pay extra now for whatever option will get me the longest-lasting tranny.

Thanks in advance for any help.

jpm3071

I bought my car with a rebuit transmission. I found the car through a friend of mine who owns a transmission shop. He said the build was 3000. If you put a used tranny in you run the risk of having the same thing happen to you and the dealer will cost a fortune. Your best bet is to do you research and find a reputable shop to work on it.

pohljm

Some of the rebuild kits have modified a couple things that will supposedly fix some of the flaws that these transmissions have. Natpro (National Transmission Products) was the last kit used on our odyssey. I do not know what kits to recommend. I would for sure have it rebuilt. a used or honda sourced replacement will not have any of the improvements. I have had 6 transmissions between the TL and our odyssey.

I hate cars

I agree. If you find a GOOD rebuilder you will likely never have another trans issue. Trans-go is another shift improver kit.... not a shift kit but a fix for any common problems with the trans.

Make sure the switches are replaced with new ones. Make sure the torque convertor is cut open or replaced with one that's had the bearings replaced along with a new clutch lining.

LateRally

Thanks so much for the advice guys. Really appreciate it.

How would I go about locating a good rebuilder? I would love to go this route but it sounds like finding a reputable shop is critical, and I'm guessing Yelp isn't really going to cut it. BTW I'm in the Bay Area.

FWIW the tranny shop where my car is sitting now is recommending a replacement, not a rebuild. But I'd prefer to rebuild like you guys are saying assuming I can find a good shop.

I hate cars

You can look at ATRA on google and find a shop in your area. It doesn't guarantee it's the best but it gives you a better shot and the warranty will be honored at any of shop affiliated with them. I know of a great shop over here but the $10,000 tow bill might not be worth it lol.

Actually, you can look for Bruce Toelle of Performance Transmissions. Probably the best in the country. I'm running one of his transmissions and converters in my GN right now. This guy is on a different level than the other 99.9% out there. He was in Sacramento, at least back when I was still racing. To give you an idea, he has an 850hp Regal that he tests his rebuilds in before they're turned over to the customers for the racing stuff.

LateRally

Thanks again. I used ATRA and did find a shop in San Jose that looks pretty solid. But I actually wouldn't mind getting the number of the shop in your area. No I'm not planning to tow my car to Bakersfield, but maybe your shop might be able to recommend a really good place in my area. Feel free to message me the info if you prefer. Thanks.

ep3kid914

sorry for jumping in the thread but does anyone know what consist in the tranmission rebuild for an auto 04 tl?? what questions should i be asking thats going to be replace ?????

EATSLEEPRACE

iTrader: (1)

Converter,seals,sensors,filter...there is more

LateRally

OK part 2 of my saga now...

So I went ahead with the tranny rebuild and got the car back a week ago. Everything with the tranny has been working great, but yesterday the check engine light came on. Had the codes checked and it came back that there's a problem with the EVAP system.

Then this morning, CEL is still on, but the VSA and "!" lights come on, and the car goes into limp mode (at least I think it's limp). Accelerates very slowly from a stop, but eventually will reach high speeds (though RPM doesn't seem to go above 3k). Anyway I shut off the engine, restart, and the VSA lights went away but CEL is still on.

My question is, could these problems - the EVAP code and VSA - be related to the tranny work somehow? Maybe not directly, but maybe they messed with the wiring or sensors while pulling the thing in and out? I'm taking my car back to the tranny shop on Monday, and I don't want them to give me the runaround saying this is all unrelated stuff.

FWIW I looked up a bunch of old threads related to VSA/!, and these seem to be the most common causes:

- APP sensor
- TPS sensor
- TDC sensor
- VTEC solenoid valve sensor
- VTEC oil pressure switch circuit
- brake switch
- bad throttle body
- wheel/speed sensor
- reverse lock-out switch
- EGR valve
- VSA/ABS modulator (ruled this out since ABS light isn't on)

Same question - could any of these be easily messed up during major tranny work? Thanks again in advance everyone.

I hate cars

Sorry I missed everything. The shop I used to work at is Kern Transmission. They're a very small shop and the owner himself does the rebuilds now but he's very up to date on the latest electronics.

An overhaul can cause those issues. It's easy to smash wires between the bellhousing and transmission when they're bolted back up, I've done it myself before once they're smashed. Sometimes it takes a while for the wires to ground out. I would check this area visually. Most cars have grounds that bolt up to one of the bellhousing bolts, something to also check visually. Look for loose bolts or ground wires not hooked to anything.

They could have damaged the reluctor rings on the axles, the ones used for individual wheel speed readings for the ABS and VSA. If the ABS light is not on, it's probably not one of these sensors.

It could be any one of many sensors not plugged in. The fact that you get an evap and vsa which are totally unrelated makes me lean more toward a pinched wire or bad ground.

LateRally

Holy hell. As of this morning the car won't start at all. Engine won't even crank. Apparently these guys fixed the tranny at the expense of every other damn thing. This blows.

I hate cars

Is the battery dead or will the starter not work? I would check the battery connections, that can cause every symptom.

YeuEmMaiMai

^what he said. In additon take off your covers and inspect harneses

LateRally

Just checked the battery and connections. Everything seems to be fine. Also looked at the fuses. They looked ok but I'm pretty ignorant about this stuff so I could be missing something. Also no obviously messed up wiring or anything else, but again I don't fully trust myself here.

Is it worth calling roadside assistance to see if they can at least get the car started? I don't know how I'm even going to get the car back to the shop at this point, at least without paying a massive tow bill.

LateRally

Update and (another) question.

The car's back at the tranny shop now, and they diagnosed the issue with the car not starting as... wait for it... a starter problem. He says it needs to be replaced. Is there any way I can make the case this is related to the tranny work they did? I just find it hard to believe that one week after this major job, the starter goes out. The guy actually used the word "coincidence."

Luckily, the rest of the issues (CEL, etc.) were related to wiring and voltage problems from all the heavy lifting, like IHC said above. They acknowledged this and won't charge me for any of the fixes, but I'm really skeptical of this sudden starter issue.

LateRally

Quick update (in case anyone cares) - picked up the car from the shop this morning. They didn't end up charging me for anything, including the new starter, so I was pretty pleased with that. Hoping everything holds up at this point, and I can stop posting in this damn thread.

Thanks to everyone for their help, especially IHC.

I hate cars

I've never looked at the TL but with many cars if the starter is not hooked up or the wires are loose the car won't run (assuming you magically started the car without the starter lol). The starter is kind of a junction for some of the wiring. If the TL is laid out this way I would say 99% for sure it was loose wiring at the starter or something pinched and they were covering their asses.

Most shops will leave the starter just hanging there by it's wiring when the trans is out. Even if they didn't make or break a connection, this can cause a loose connection or a broken starter post which is more common than you think.

There is a chance it's coincidence. Back when I worked on cars for a living, that kind of stuff happened and the customer would be looking at me like they wanted to kill me. In fact, if I had to change or take the tension off the serpentine belt, I warned them that any of the accessories driven by the belt may make a noise when it's put back on. Especially alternators, I've probably had over a dozen alternators lose the bearing shortly after the tension was taken off the belt and put back on. I doubt it was coincidence in this case but you never know. I'm so glad I got out of that industry 15 years ago.

sbstnce

I hate to keep this thread going as I am sad to see this happen to anyone.

I am a new acura tl owner. I got an 06 with 99,000 miles on it. I am super worried this might happen to me. I noticed when I floored it that sometimes it wont switch gears from 2nd to 3rd and will eventually red line being in regular mode. I would then let go of the gas because it really freaked me out and didn't seem normal. It happened twice since I bought it monday. I still have the 3,000 or 90 day warranty (whichever comes first) and have no cel light thrown. I'm having it inspected by Acura tomorrow since I bought this from a hyundai subaru dealer as well as doing the power steering recall hose.

How can I get them to do the preventative maintenance? What can I do as preventative maintenance if they don't cover this. Any help is appreciated! APP sensor? Pressure Switches? Hopefully Acura will have a report on it and I can bring it back to where I bought it and ask them to perform these services.

I am very happy with the car at the moment, its everything I hoped it would be and look forward to modding this bad boy!

I owned a 97 honda accord ex and ran that thing into the ground! It died at 340,000 miles and am really looking forward to having this car at least to 250k miles. Thanks in advance guys!

I hate cars

Is there an actual problem? Did it hit the revlimiter or did it just get close to redline?

sbstnce

went to red line so i took my foot off the gas.

I hate cars

Redline or the revlimiter? It's supposed to go near redline when you floor it.

pohljm

Welcome sbs! I believe you hit the revlimeter when it didnt up shift. I have an 06 as well with 84K I dont believe that you have an issue, or at least I hope you dont. I have had that 2 -3 shift hang up prolly 4 times or so. Only when going WFO, but its taken 5 years not 1 week like you have experienced.

I always chalked it up to some sensor not being happy in a complicated program to allow the shift. I have never been able to duplicate it with similar conditions, etc. I am sure that since you are enjoying the car perhaps you have been having a little fun with it and have just had a similar glitch.

If you can have the dealer swap out the pressure switches and a 3x3 ATF change for you that is great preventive maintenance. The dealer may be able to pull up some stored tranny codes that wouldnt throw a cel but may point you in the right direction.

I will not bore you but I am on tranny #3 all under warranty. I do not think my 2-3 hang had anything to do with those issues.

Congratulations!! only your 3rd post and you have obviously done enough looking around the site to find out about the switches and APP.

You should check out the SD thread in the Regions section. Think we will be getting together for some spicy pork on the 21st!

sbstnce

LOL i hate cars, it didnt shift up so thats why i took my foot off the gas. thanks for making my day.

pohljm, a minor hiccup is what i thought it would be too and my friend was in the car and said his is250 does that sometimes too, probably just bad timing when i decided to floor it. it was my third time trying to open it up and feel the v6! so i guess i was having a little fun!

you being on your 3rd tranny discourages me somewhat even under warranty ... I have been researching and stalking this forum for a while before buying a tl and this was my main concern but wasn't a huge deterrent for me getting my practical dream car within my budget. Is it inevitable that I will experience a bad tranny even if i keep up with regular maintanence? thats the jist I am getting now. I will try for the pressure switches and the 3x3 atf change and keep my fingers cross that they will do this for me or get a quote if i can't get it under my warranty. thank you for the heads up! also i will be looking into the sd thread. thanks so much again!

sorry op for stealing your thread!

pohljm

Although I am on number 3 in both our honda v6's Odyssey and TL and you will read of many transmission issues here, your not going to get people coming on and saying their tranny is working flawless. you only hear of the problems. Honda has sold a tremendous number of these transmissions. Many hundreds of thousands are flawless. Mine were not. I think its surely a place where they can improve reliability.

you may want to check on the price of an extended warranty if still possible? depending on the cost it could be decent insurance.

LateRally

Heh, I think this is exactly right. Probably why they did the work "for free" to try and make me feel better. I just realized I never even got any paperwork yesterday. If they had actually replaced the starter, you would think they would document it.

sbs or anyone else, by all means steal, use, and abuse this thread. As a car noob, I really appreciate the more knowledgeable folks helping people like myself get a little more educated. It's a huge help for me, and hope it can help others.

jonjonbingbing

New AZ member and new TL owner with 108K so this was very informative indeed. Thanks to all contributors.