Hi I was looking for some feedback on an issue that occurred a few days ago:

I owned a 1988 Acura Integra (first car) and 2001 Acura Integra GS-r.

I have a 2005 TL with 69,800 miles. I had a standard 4 year/50,000 mile warranty.

I was driving on the highway and hit the gas to pass someone. All of the sudden I heard a horrible noise and seem to lose power.

The car was towed to the Acura dealership and diagnosed with a blown spark plug and dethreaded rear cylinder head. The dealership said I need to have all the plugs replaced, all the coils replaced and the rear cylinder head replaced at a cost of $2,600.

1) Does this seem reasonable for this to happen at this specific mileage?

2) Would you trust a local mechanic to try a heliocoil, and is it necessary to change all the coils and plugs?

3) Anyone have a similar or heard of a similar problem?

Thanks,
Nate

 

Lol that sounds like something that would happen on a 300,000 mile engine. Have you been getting regular tune ups at a decent garage? I had a 95 Grand Cherokee v8 lifted on 35's and i beat the hell out of it mud, engine fires and all. 230,000 miles and no problems like that ever.

I suspect a defect or negligent maintenance.

 

wtf? sounds suspicious. It destroyed the whole rear cylinder head? Either the spark plug was threaded on too far or not enough....

Who did the last engine-related maintenance on the car? Spark plugs, ignition coils, anything like that.

Helicoil is perfectly safe and pretty much your only option sometimes if you've got a cross-threaded spark plug. They just have to make sure they tap it straight dead-on or else it'll cross-thread your cylinder head even worse.

 

That should never happen regardless of the mileage.

It was either crossthreaded and stripped when the plugs were previously changed or the plug was very loose and ripped the last couple threads out.

No reason to change all the coils, maybe the plugs....

I don't like the 100,000+ recommended tuneups on new cars exactly for this reason. By the time those plugs get changed for the first time on an aluminum headed engine, you're risking ripping the threads out. I changed mine at 45,000.

You can helicoil the head but I wouldn't recommend doing it with the head on the engine. You normally have to drill the hole slightly larger, tap it, then install the helicoil. Too big of a risk of getting shavings into the cylinder.

Check the hole in question with your finger and see if just the last couple threads were ripped out or if the whole thing feels smooth. You *might* get away with replacing the plug if most of the threads are there. At this point you don't have much to lose by doing this. It's not going to hurt the head more if it does it again.

I'm assuming it killed the coil when it blew out so replacing that a given.

You may want to look on some of the Ford truck forums. I know the Ford 4.6L and 5.4L engines have major problems with this (too few threads). Maybe those guys have some creative fixes.

 

IHC,

Could you elaborate a little bit more on the part I made bold?

Also when this happens, if the engine is turned off right after the coil and spark plug shoot out, is there any other things that could go wrong internally (referring to the engine)?

 

There's no need to change all of the coils because only the one that was on the plug that got thrown out would be damaged.

There's also no NEED to change all the plugs, but you might as well do it as a maintenance item.

 

Way to resurrect a dead thread (2009, really?).
If you use the search function you will find this is a far too common occurrence, happens all the time. The biggest issue is whether material fell back into the head and damaged the cylinder walls or the valves/valve seats.

 

did you think that maybe he was researching and wanted to post a question? Who the hell cares how old a thread is if its informative?

With the resurrection of this thread, I learned something new even with the general experience I have in the automotive field.

 

If I didn't use the search function how the hell would I have dug up a thread from 2009?


My point exactly. Thank you.

 

If he would've fully utilized the search tool, there would've been no need to post his question.

 

I recently blew a spark plug, too. My car is a '98 3.2 TL with a little over 200,000 miles. I've had the car for a few years and I don't know when the plugs had been changed last before one of them blew. It started with a ticking sound when I idled the car in the driveway to maintain the battery charge this past winter, then when I took it out for a drive, the check engine light came on (blinking because it had misfired). Of course back then, I didn't know what to do and kept going to my destination about an hour and a half away. On the way home, as soon as I got off the highway midway through the trip, it started screech-ticking pretty badly and I thought I wasn't going to make it home. I managed to get it to a mechanic and they changed all the plugs and put in a heliocoil. The total, including a full synthetic oil change, was $647. They said they had to vacuum out all the debris from the spark plug blow-out and they didn't really come out with a full plug, which is rather concerning, but my guess is it got crunched up in the cylinder and the missing pieces were in the vacuum (I hope). The mechanic didn't sound too sure if the job would hold up, but the tech at the shop reported that the engine ran smoothly. I honestly don't know that much about cars, but I would not expect to have this problem with less than 100,000 miles on the car. In my experience, it seems like now that the car has passed 200,000 miles, something different falls apart every other week, but I'm doing my best to stay optimistic 'cause I love my TL. I see this was originally posted in 2009, so I hope you got it all sorted out by now!

 

We'll I am glad he did. Your post was completely unnecessary so you should follow your own advice.

 

Definitely keep us posted on how well your car holds up. I just dropped mine off today, but I decided to replace the head instead of going the heliocoil route. It is going to cost me more, but I like having the peace of mind.

I'm pretty sure my spark plug flew out, but I could be wrong. I'll know for sure in a few days.

 

I hope this is not what happened to me yesterday. Not sounding to good for me. My '05 base TL began to get this ticking noise at a light. The ticking was while giving gas even at a stop. I drove through the next light to hear what sounded like a hose bursting/ loss of compression. Saw my check engine light blink twice while i was pulling over. The car shutdown once i stopped. The check engine light never came back on after that. I found the middle rear coil blown out. Towed the car around the corner down the street to the dealership. I will hear what they say today. At least they were able to get me a loaner in the meantime. Fuuuuuuking Sh*********t!!!!

 

I have to had blown a spark plug out. Found a vid on youtube on how to properly drill out, re-tap, & install an insert for the spark plug. Where could you get this done right. Or where could you get the kit for a TL and do it yourself? Not no half ass jobs. I know Acura is gonna call me back with a ridiculous quote to fix it.

 

It all depends on whether or not the threads were damaged. If they aren't damaged, you're only out a spark plug and coil, and whatever ridiculous labor charge from Acura.

If the threads are damaged, I don't know if you can helicoil the rear head while still on the car...It's tight back there...

 

The front number 5 cylinder which is common is a piece of cake. I think the rear could be done, just need to go slower and ensure the tap is going in perfectly straight. Put some grease on the tap to catch the metal and then blow it out once done. I also cranked it up without that plug in the first time to blow out any other junk.

There are multiple types of helicoil kits. With the long spark plug tube, we have to use the one that fits a 3/8 ratchet or extension into it, as you can't put a socket on the tap down the hole.

 

Drilling the hole on the rear head would be my biggest concern, not the tapping part. I've only done it once to a plug hole with the engine in the car and I used a good shop vac right on the drill bit. For the bit I used a light lube (WD-40). I used grease on the tap since there was no worry of it spinning fast enough to fling the grease off, and I constantly removed it to clean and regrease. Starting it with the plug out to blow out shavings is kind of iffy. You're going to get a vacuum through the spark plug hole on the power stroke and a lot of the intake stroke. It could work, I'm not saying it's wrong or it's right, more of a personal preference thing.

 

They still haven't seen my car yet. I'm looking up kits but don't know which one will work for the TL. Anyone know a full kit and the sizes? I would have to tow my car home, get the kit and do the work asap.

 

It happend to my 07 tls with 87k then at 89k. I just tapped and heli coiled the head both times. When it happend it did destroy both coil packs. There's no reason to replace all coil packs but plugs hell yes.

 

I have it at karen Radley right now. They called me saying to bring in the coils and plugs. I have to pick them up this afternoon and drop it off to them.

 

I'm far from a mechanic, but wanted to share my expereince. I have an 07 TLS and just had the #5 plug come completely loose. I was lucky none of the threads were ruined. Also, 4 and 6 were very loose as well. Another issue with this car that Acura just sticks their head in the sand about.

 

Tried to PM you back, but your box is full.

This is definitely common to the J series motors. I can't figure out if it is an assembly problem, but I'm inclined to think it is a design flaw of some sort. My car had 200K when it happened and I know the plugs had been changed in the past. If it were assembly, I'd expect more to have it happen, or other cylinders. It seems like #5 is fairly common, but all are possible.

I've seen it on Ridgelines, Odysseys, MDX, etc. I think it might just be cheap insurance to check the torque on the plugs every 10 or 15K..easy enough to access.

 

Thanks for the info. I just registered to the Forum and didnt know before I messaged you that I cant access PMs yet.

 

troll!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

btw i just did the service including spark plugs a week ago , and since then i have read like 5 of these types of threads so i think its a sign and i will be double checking my work...

 

Let's not forget that detonation loosens plugs. It has been stated that one or two cylinders run leaner than the others. I think #5 was one of them but you guys would have to search. The intake manifold distribution thread was from a long time ago and I think it had to do with the turbo Odyssey if that helps at all.
The fact that it seems to happen both on the original set of plugs and after they have been changed, I think it's possible.

I personally prefer tapered seat plugs over gasket plugs. The gasket type that the J series requires is more prone to loosening over time as the gasket compresses. Maybe the torque spec needs to be adjusted to make sure the gasket is fully compressed or people need to pay closer attention to torque vs thread lube. Once a leak occurs, things go downhill quick as the gasket gets overheated and cut, exponentially speeding up the blow out process. I don't use a torque wrench. I tighten until I feel the gasket completely compress. I've never had an issue getting the plugs in or out.

 

normal strength tight and a little nudge past that?

 

I got my car back from Acura 4 days later. They gave me a loaner for the week free of charge. I provided 6 new plugs and one new coil. Acura helicoiled cylinder #2 after doing a compression test that came back good. Cost was $280. Not too bad considering I took it to the dealer.

 

Im curious as well. Is there a consensus out on good practice for these spark plugs? It seems like the spec they are providing isn't cutting it or people are following it. I believe mine were a bit over tightened and they've lasted several years now and about 80k miles id say, but with the frequency of blown plugs, im beginning to dread my whenever I change them next.

 

If you tighten it fairly slowly you can feel the gasket compress. It goes from tight but a constant torque/turning to a quick ramp up in torque required to turn the plug as it fully compresses. I usually stop at that point. No idea if it's more than spec.