I just picked up my car from the dealership. They were looking into the vibration issue my car has from 50mph and up.

They said that there is no fix at this time. The problem is the motor mounts. The 2005's have different motor mounts and 2005 haven't been coming in with vibrations. The Acura engineers are working on the fix and they hope to have one in the future. (I'm NOT holding my breath)

btw... they lost my keys and had to cut me a new one. This required them to program the key, which in turn made my other keys null and void. I will now have to drive an hour back to the dealership with my other keys to have these reprogrammed. I'm beginning to think the same people who run Ford run Acura.

 

I remember that a few of members of 05TLs have ever reported they get the similar vibration on theirs. ..

 

BS flag is up at your dealer.......

If it was the motor mounts then their would be a "fix", you replace problem 04 mounts with new 05 mounts... I guarantee Acura is well aware of "what" the real problem is but are also well aware of the cost associated with fixing it.....
The internet is a wonderful thing. It can help and hurt us in regards to products and manufacturers. The minute Acura actually fixed several cars the word would get out, and that would be like "admitting" their was an issue beyond a "normal characteristic" of the vehicle...
Many people feel that if they prove a great number of people with the same vehicle have same issues their case would be won... The problem with the BBB etc. is this type of info actually confirms the manufacturers claim that it's "normal".
The manufacturer has the upper hand... I've been through it.

The minor driveline vibration or "lugging" at 1500 rpm doesn't bother me a bit. Maybe my 04 TL is one of the better ones.. What does bother me is the constant vibration over 65mph. At the moment I feel it's the "crapstone" (Bridgestone) tires. Next year I will replace them with a set of Michelin's... Who knows..

Best of luck

 

I agree with KJ...
Acura has not issued a fix for the vibration problem, but they know there is an issue. I have heard nothing about different motor mounts in the 05, Seems like BS to me. My vibration problem was made better when my dealership (after five tries) replaced the EL-42 with michelans. The problem is still there just not as noticable. There seems to be a harmonic vibration that starts in the tires and ends at the motor, the motor is the vibration you are feeling but it is not the source of the problem. The dealership I deal with said they have replaced everything trying to fix the problem on some cars and nothing worked, other times a simple balance made the issue go away. I think a lot has to do with how sesitive the driver is to vibrations. I am very sensative so I can feel it and to me it is a big deal. The motor mounts actually stiffen as speed increases. They are hydraulic mounts with a vacuum adjustment to the mount to make it stiffer as speed increases. (Not sure how this works, just what I have been told) Apparently as the harmonic vibration goes through the car the motor starts vibrating at 50+ mph. Not all TLs have this problem and some cases are much worse than others. So if you dont have a problem you are doing great, but if you do, report it to Acura. The more of us there is with the problem the sooner Acura will find and Have to implement a fix for it.

 

I can't tell exactly from reading the service manual, but it appears you will have to take it back to the dealer. This is for linking to the immobilizer circuit, which is activated by the chip in the key, so when they coded it to your new key, it made the other two inoperative.

If the other two keyfobs still open the doors, etc, but will not allow you to start the car, then I am probably correct , but I am still not sure because I couldn't find any procedures for linking the transponder (chip) in the key with the immobilizer receiver.

 

I too raise the BS flag at the dealer - I doubt there is ANY difference between the mounts on the 2004 and 2005. A simple way to determine this is to determine if the part numbers have changed - I would lay bets that they have not.

2nd: Many of us have absolutely no vibration issues at all. If there were a known defect endemic to the product, we all would have an issue - that is logically obvious. Since we don't, these vibration issues are local issues, and i would bet that any experienced tech and determined dealership could cover them.

There has been a lot of "noise" of various kinds from nitwit dealers, nitwits at Acura CS, and just plain nitwits.

If someone were to produce a document from AHM "in writing" that confirms there is a known defect in the 2004 - 2005 TL that is the proximate of "vibration above 50", and can explain why all the TL's are not affected, then I for one would give this issue more weight. I think the dealerships are pointing at AHM to make you go away. Get it in writing, and press for answers.

Please do not mistake my comments to in any way belittle your pain. There have been many posts on this topic, and I walk away from the totality shaking my head. But I have made a career of keeping a clear mind on these things, and am reminded of Rudyard Kiplings classic poem "If".

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs"...

http://www.blupete.com/Literature/Poetry/KiplingIf.htm

 

I looked up part numbers for engine mount related parts for AT-equipped 2004 vs. 2005 models. There are 54 different parts! Almost all of them have the same part number between the years, but not all. Some of the parts for 2004 ended in ""A01" where 2005 ended in "A02" (or, similarly an increase from A02 to A03). Examples are Rubber Assy RR engine mounting, same for FR rubber engine mounting, FR transmission rubber mounting, RR transmission rubber mounting (lower), and an electronic control mounting clip. Not all of the rubber parts changed - only about 1/3 did. Various brackets, bolts, etc. didn't change.

I don't know what the suffix change means. So I looked up another part I know changed - front seat bottom cushions, in black leather. 2004 part number: 81531-SEP-A01ZA. 2005 part number: 81531-SEP-A11ZA. The "A" at the end indicates the black color. So the rest of the suffix apparently indicates a design change.

So, to me, it does look like Acura made some changes in the rubber they used on SOME of the engine and transmission mounts. Maybe. I don't know. This isn't info. you can take to Acura or the dealer and demand action. (Even if they did change parts, they aren't obligated to upgrade 2004 cars to 2005 specs.) But it does seem to indicate a change was made. (Maybe it wasn't even for the vibration reason). Also, I have to remain silent on how I obtained the part numbers (sorry).

 

some of you guys need to learn how to spell....

 

Probably not a spelling issue as much as concetrating to much on typing and not worrying about the spelling. But either way I am sure your comment helps calpon with his issues.

 

Hybrid...thanks for the info, I will look further into it. If Acura indeed made a change it sure would be nice to know why.

 

Useful, but again, no one seems to be dealing with the "why don't they ALL do it" question. Generally, parts change #'s year to year - what i should have made clearer is that part changes WITHIN years often tell a clearer story when sleuthing design changes.

Any why all the cloak and dagger? - I have access to Acura parts express - and my parts guys do not consider these National Security issues. They have never refused to offer full disclosure to any query I have made.

?????

 

Hey guys, thanks for the input. BTW I didn't believe the dealer either, I was just passing on the ever evolving excuses that are passed on to we, the customer.

The only other answer they gave to me beside the M. M. excuse, was to give me the customer care 1 800 #. Thanks, but that was an obvious one.

 

When a service department tells a customer there is no know fix, they're usually telling you the truth. Or at least the truth as they know it.

It is quite common for a manufacturer to tell a service department NOT to attempt a repair if they are in the middle of engineering a fix for it. Attempting a repair on a known problem before a viable solution is available is foolhardy & exposes the dealer & manufacturer both to liability. The only time it's in anyone's best interest to attempt a repair is when the issue is a safety concern.

Trust me when I tell you cost is of little concern to Acura. They will spend money to make someone happy like you wouldn't believe, ESPECIALLY if it's a known problem. When I worked at an Acura dealer, the first question from my Acura service rep was "Will it make the customer happy?" and if the answer was "yes' he ok'd the repair.

The caveat here is that Acura wants to spend their money in an intelligent, logical manner. Throwing parts (and labor, for that matter) at a condition deemed to be normal, or an annoyance that is considered a normal characteristic of a vehicle, is a waste of money & manpower. Field engineering & technical developement is where issues like engine resonance & tire flat-spotting (and butt prints, for that matter) are reverse engineered & improved, almost never at the dealership level.




hanving said all that, there are a couple of other things I would like to address:

-If one key is cut & programmed, all the other keys will not start the vehicle. You MUST take all of the keys back to the dealer & have the programmed at the same time. Sorry. I've lost keys before, it's unfortunate but I'm sure it's not personal.

-If the part number changes, there is a difference in the part. Sometimes the part will retrofit, sometimes it won't. I don't think you will find a dealer on this planet that will install anything other than the correct part number unless they have been ensured by the Manufacturer that it will perform in the same manner as the original, and not render the car unsafe.

-There are many manufacturers that use liquid-filled or adjustable engine mounts. These were designed to eliminate as much engine vibration as possible. They do what they are supposed to do. Inherent in all engines, but especially 4 cylinders & V6's, are certain places in an RPM range that create a resonance. Some of it is due to the angle of the cylinders, some due to design of intake manifolds, overlap of intake & exhaust camshafts, etc etc.


Complaints of engine resonance go back to the '91 Legend.


edited to add:

Many times a part number change mid-year is due to a change in vendor of that part. It's not always due to a design change or update.

 

And an even bigger question is why is it intermittent as well. My car does it sometimes and sometimes it does not. It does not matter what road surface I am on and can act differently on the same road on the same day. Its an odd problem for those of us with it. And as you stated different years can have the same part with different numbers. I have driven several TLs and have found every one to have the problem. Like I stated earlier it may be the sensitivity of the driver. But of course not all TLs have the problem.

 

I'm comforted by Blue Note's information, seeing that he has been there and done that at the service level with Acura.
They did tell me that a rotate and balance would not fix this and they were not going to start changing out tires (I have the HPT) and wheels because they have been assured that this would not solve the problem. They are not telling me that this is within normal operating parameters for this. They have told me this is NOT normal and they will fix it when there is a fix for it. The issue I have is.... I am not confident there will be a fix, hence I don't believe they will be fixing this. I don't think they are lying in the true sense of the word, but they may be leaving some things out that doesn't paint the truest picture.

I think KJ may be onto something and my gut was telling me this when they mentioned the motor mounts. If it was as simple as that and the 05's were not doing it, then why not just use 05 mounts and components on the problem 04's. I wouldn't be surprised to find out there is more to it than motor mounts and the fix might be too much of an expense for Acura to fess up to. I think if it were a true safety issue (car blows up or wheels fall off) they would fix it no matter the cost.

My contention is this is causing alot of my rattle problems that have sent me to the shop on numerous occations. In the long run, what else will shake loose and how will this affect our resale. Resale was one of my criterian for choosing to buy this car. Yes it is only an annoyance problem now.(I like a little shake, rattle and roll, but not in my car) How will this manifest later in the life of my vehicle?

To Blue Note...They explained that the other keys (and the one they just programmed) would all need to be reprogrammed at the same time for them to be functional. They were very apologetic and seemed sincere. Hell, mistakes happen!
I was more pissed that they left my car in their front lot, with the doors all unlocked, and not a clue where the key was, over night on a busy stretch of road in a not so nice section of town. They told me the car had been pulled around the afternoon before, expecting me to pick it up that day. (even though I told them I work 14hr days mon-wed and couldn't pick it up until thur)

 

Well, FYI, my AT 2004 doesn't have any objectionable vibrations either. If you're really looking for it, there's some minor vibration in the lower rpms of 5th gear, but I would just consider that "normal" and it's not all that much.

The reason for not disclosing the parts info source is that the people that gave it to me did so under the condition that I not spread it around, which would have the effect of shutting it down, apparently.

 

Carland rotaed balanced realigned my car and the problem was the same or worse. They finally changed out the old EL-42 for new ones...that did not help. So the last shot was changing to Michelans, they actually took the tires and wheels off a 05 and put them on mine. The car has much less vibration (still has the flat spotting in the morning) and the road noise seems to be quieter. I almost had a droaning sound with teh second EL-42's. The dealership did all this without going to Acura. I did buy the car from them so maybe they felt obligated to try to make it right.

 

I was told something to do with the subframe, but no fix yet.

 

My switch to Dunlop winter tires got rid of the jiggle vibration at 65+ mph I've experienced with two sets of EL42's and several rebalances. The Dunlops definitely flat spot when cold though.