Motavar

Need some help (sigh)

Performing a timing belt change on my 04 TL.

I had everything at TDC and was putting the belt back on.
Started at the back camshaft going clockwise.
While wrapping the belt around the water pump the back camshaft moved a few teeth clockwise and stopped.

I didn't have a whole lot of pressure on the belt but it seems to move and stop on it's own.

If I try to rotate the camshaft counter-clockwise (back the direction it came from) to line up the marks I'm met with some resistance...

Question:
Should I continue to try and rotate back to where it was with some more force (I was trying to move it with both hands) going Counter Clockwise ?

Question2: While the back moved 1/4 turn maybe.. it shouldn't have done damage right if it came to stop on it's own resistance or do you think I did damage?


Man I'm soo pissed because everything was going perfect up until I put just a slight force going around the water pump to make sure there was no slack. ugh..


-Motavar.

nfnsquared

The service manual procedure is to start at the crank pulley and go counter clockwise from there with the new belt...

I believe you should be able to just rotate the rear cam pulley clock wise (I wouldn't go CCW) by hand back to #1 TDC and start over with the belt, but this time use the SM procedure for installing the new belt.

Have you seen the DIY on this forum? It's very good. Go to step 12.

https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-2004-2008-93/122-diy-105k-service-timing-belt-water-pump-spark-plugs-thermostat-%2Apics%2A-784622/

I was supposed to be doing the same thing tonight, but freaking FEDSUX didn't deliver my TB kit. Tracking says "on van out for delivery" since 7:03 a.m this morning. It's 9:31 p.m. and it ain't here yet. Oh well, I did the valve adjustment while I was waiting. Glad I didn't take the rest of the car apart yet. Looks like package won't be here until Monday now...I'm so frickin' pissed at FEDSUX.

Good luck with your job!

I hate cars

As long as it came to rest on it's own you're fine. I've actually bent valves by hand with a wrench on the crank and you have to turn pretty hard. Valve spring pressure made yours turn and it's no where nearly enough to do damage.

I should add, do not turn the crank. Move only the cam and move it in the opposite direction it rotated. You won't be able to bend valves with your hands on the pulleys so don't worry.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

If it moved clockwise, I wouldn't continue to turn it one revolution to get it into place as the valve(s) will contact the top of the pistion, rotate it in the reverse direction it moved and align the marks accordingly.

Looks as though IHC stated the same.

I hate cars

I'm one of the dumbasses that continued the wrong way one time. Probably one of the only people ever to bend valves without a running engine lol.

nfnsquared

And I might have been one of them also....wasn't even registering that the cam and crank were off.

With the rear cam off ( or either cam off) wouldn't you reach a point where you couldn't turn the cam pulley any further either direction? I mean, it will move CW and CCW from TDC only up to a point, at which extreme force would be needed?

Guess you must have put a big ol wrench on that sucker?

Motavar

(im still learning so I appreciate the help)

It seemed like it jumped. So if I understand what you're saying is that the springs helped move the cam a bit.

So far two out of three people are saying I should be able to rotate the cam back to the position it was in. So if it rotated clockwise it should be safe to move it counter clockwise back to where it was.

Sounds simple..am I missing anything else?

Another question: do they want you to run the belt starting at the crank shaft because it has more resistance to help prevent the cams from moving as you weave the belt between the pulleys?

nfnsquared

It's 3 out of 3 now that I've pulled my head out of my ass

That's my assumption. This will be my first TB change as well. If you do the valve adjustment, be careful re-torqueing the valve cover bolts. I just broke one.

Motavar

Valve adjustment wasn't on my radar. I guess it's time for me to search around and google some stuff to see what it's all about and if I should do it. This stuff is new to me (I'm late to the game).

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

At least you're learning and saving money, got to start some where, some time. I'm sure we could fill a page describing some of the dumb things we did when working on vehicles.

Normally the valve are adjusted if they are noisy, but if you adjust them some time in the future it's a good time to do a spark plug replacement as it's easier to turn the engine over when the plugs are out. No resistence.
Good luck

nfnsquared

Actually, it's not too bad with the plugs in. I was kind of surprised. I was using a 1/2" rachet and 20" extension on the crank bolt.

Now I get to find out how good I am at bolt extraction....Guess from now on I'm going to keep a left hand carbide bit on hand and not use a 1/2" torque wrench for a 8.7 ft/lb bolt. Live and learn....

I hate cars

2 foot wrench was required to destroy my engine lol. You have to basically TRY to bend valves by hand.

Motavar

Well I tried to move the cam shaft back to where it was and of course it moved and then WoooP* past the mark it went. It keeps flip-flopping between positions on the camshaft (if this makes sense).

So what I *think* I need is a 2-pin spanner wrench? So I can slowly move the camshaft I'm guessing?

Right now I'm putting the old belt onto the camshaft and pulling on it to slowly move it.. then it like gets to a spot and jumps. hehe I dunno.

Another Note: I looked up the valve adjustment. Doesn't look that bad so I have some seals on order and I'll do that Monday night.

I hate cars

Is it possible to get the belt on everything but that cam and then wrap it around as you hold it in place? If you were going to do a valve adjustment you could back off the valve adjusters a bit to help out (reduce valve spring tension) and then readjust. Consider that as a last resort of course.

Motavar

Unfortunately every time I get near that top spot it skips past it.
It's no biggy I'll see if I can find a 2-pin spanner wrench and try that.

I already have the plugs out of the engine and I plan to do the valve stuff on monday. So If I understand correctly I could just pop the valve cover off the back then go to each valve (4 per cyclinder) and losen the nut on each one and loosen the bolt and that will allow the spring to move up more.. allowing less tension on the camshaft.

Then all i would have to do is just adjust the 12 of them back to where they should be (which is what I'm going to do on Monday). It doesn't sound like additional risk I don't think.

Motavar

Ooh wait..

Can I just put a normal wrench on the camshaft gear bolt in the center to move it? Or would that losen the camshaft gear/pulley?

Motavar

I R N00B

So I just put a normal wrench on the center bolt and moved it back to TDC for that back camshaft gear. Sweet. No need to purchase a stupid 2 pin spanner wrench.

I also saw a video clip where this guy used tiewraps to hold the belt into place on the cams while doing stuff. waay cool.

hehe off to drink beer and monkey with this some more. Thanks again for your help.

Motavar

Timing belt back on and everything is lined up!
Thread closed - Thank You!

(I learned a lot! now for valve adjustment hehe)