BolderKeith

There seemed to be a lot of controversy about whether the G35 or the 2004 TL had the stronger acceleration so I went looking for objective road tests. The G35 tests that I found showed 0-60 times of 6.2 seconds. The only acceleration test that I could find for the TL was for a 2002 TL-S with a 0-60 also 6.2 seconds.

No BS

04TLmayB

this is not a debate on street racing and that is what is unfortunate. Just simple comments like "good kill" and not one comment that street racing is uncool. BTW are you the self appointed board policeman? I think you are the one who needs to chill out as my post did not warrant dripping sarcasm.

Peters

Reads like a PTA meeting. I for one, have never accelerated too briskly to avoid inadvertently exceeding the speed limit or getting a headache.

Now back to the point. I don't think my new 5AT is that fast actually. I feel like the drive-by-wire has numbed it compard to my 01. I thought the numbers for the 0-60 time in a new 5AT were more like 7 secs. I've seen some threads comparing it to the '03 S and infering the acceleration times are comparable, but I think that's optomistic for the auto. Maybe the G35 does have an advantage to 60 - in auto form?

greenseed

I agree! My wife has a '04 Maxima w/5AT. The auto tranny on her maxima is VERY well suited to the 3.5 engine. And after my 3rd test drive today of an '04 TL (2 autos, 1 manual) I firmly believe that the Maxima (or any G35) is extremely potent with an auto. I cannot comment on 0-60 times for either car, but I can merely suggest that I feel that the 5AT in the TL is a very tame tranny. Very smooth shifting and quiet. Whereas my wife’s Maxima seems to have torque at any press of the pedal -- anywhere.

I agree with Peters, the 5AT feels numb. When pressing the pedal with the auto, it feels as if it’s pushing back. I didn’t feel any of this when I was testing the 6MT. Which is the tranny I'm ordering!

crazymaxe

Jimminy crickets this thread (stupid as it started) sure is getting a lot of air play. I want to keep it going as long as possible now.
Fortunately in alberta we can race all we want , just don't get caught. Anyways i raced a boxter sport 3 times and (never mind the look he gave me ) but I kicked his poor butt every time UNTIL 160K then the tl craps out like a lame pile O crap because the fuel shuts off and the boxter goes cruising past me like I was stopped for a pisss .
Damned canadian beer,

But I am wondering if the 18"wheels could be screwing up the sceptor shaft to the tsp valve ??? Or shuld I just take the car back to the dealer for a refund

Any help will be greatly appreciated

Peters

Geeze, and I thought only the guys in Manitoba had the privilege of racing their asses off. Man, Ontario's a curse...

Donte99TL

Well, it looks like you shut blk_gcpe up real fast. I like how he called you dumba@@ and he was the one that didn't know what he was talking about. Well we all come hear to learn.

jrock65

"Just for the record, the Honda 3.2 liter is far from being pushed to it's limits. If they wanted to, and I'm not sure if they do, I'm sure they could modify it while maintaining the 3.2 L displacement and crank out 120 hp/ L like they did in the S2000. So the "limit" would be close to 400 HP really.

In Nissan's case, you're right that they moved to reduce costs. The only bad part of that is you can get teh same 3.5 L engine that comes in a "luxury" G35 that comes in an entry level V6 Altima and nearly every other V6 they have on the market. "

I didn't mean that the TL v6 was tweaked to its maximum limits, just that it was tweaked so that it would get more hp from a smaller engine. Bottom line is that Nissan's most cost effective method is to put in a 3.5 v6, and Acura's most cost effective method is to put in a 3.2 v6. Has nothing to do with who is more technologically advanced. Nissan's VQ engine is widely regarded as one of the best engines in the world. Honda's v6 gets rave reviews as well.

I don't think it really matters that Nissan uses the same 3.5 v6 in many of their cars. Every manufacturer does this. I believe the TL 3.2 is the same engine as the Accord 3.0, just increased 7% in size.

Chilli

Could you guys imagine if the year was 1970 and this forum and the internet existed back then. We'd be debating who was faster, a Stage 1 Grand Sport vs a GTO Judge vs a W-30 442 vs a Chevelle LS-6. And that was just General Motors. Now we get excited about a front wheel drive 6 banger. Boy, have times changed.

For all the "grannies" who feel the need to denounce street racing on this forum, this whole discussion began when someone accelerated quicker than another to 60 mph-not really a scene from The Fast and the Furious! If you feel that max acceleration to 60 is inappropriate, then you shoud be driving a Prius, not a sports sedan.

crazymaxe

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chilli
Could you guys imagine if the year was 1970 and this forum and the internet existed back then. We'd be debating who was faster, a Stage 1 Grand Sport vs a GTO Judge vs a W-30 442 vs a Chevelle LS-6. And that was just General Motors. Now we get excited about a front wheel drive 6 banger. Boy, have times changed.

For all the "grannies" who feel the need to denounce street racing on this forum, this whole discussion began when someone accelerated quicker than another to 60 mph-not really a scene from The Fast and the Furious! If you feel that max acceleration to 60 is inappropriate, then you shoud be driving a Prius, not a sports sedan. [/QUOTE

OOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
I guess we've been told
boohoohoo
jacka$$

Teh Jatt

:argue: HONDA/ACURA IS BETTER!!!!!!!

:thefinger

ColdFusionTL

i think that race is BS. Maybe that g35 driver was just a really bad driver cuz i dont think you could have won otherwise

Donte99TL

How can the 3.2 TL motor be pushing the limits when it'a a ULEV.

vandy786

Beat a black 04 Maxima SE on the highway last week before installing my Icebox. We ran from about 20 MPH to 80 MPH. He was merging onto the highway behind me and started tailgating me. So I slowed down and when he got onto the highway I floored it while I was still in the merging lane. He had the jump but I pulled and was safely able to move in infront of him just as my lane ended.

Yesterday, I pull out of the gas station after filling up and out of all people, I see the same Maxima infront of me. He must live near me somewhere or something. Both getting on the highway, but this time I'm behind him. It was kinda ironic because the same situation happened again except the roles were reversed. He saw me and floored his car while in the merging lane. I got onto the highway and slapped SS into 2nd and gunned it. By 80, I had a car and a half on him and he just gave up. All in all, even with the late start the second time, the Icebox seemed to make more of an impact than I thought.

vandy786

I see your point but a 3.2 L engine does not = 3.0 L engine. They are different. Many of Nissan and Infiniti's cars share the SAME IDENTICAL 3.5 L engine. That comes across as really cheap and too much cost-cutting for me.

ragin

Sorry for the ignorance, but what is an icebox? Cold air intake? If so, I thought the TL already had a cold air intake deisgn. So this mod shouldn't have much of an improvement?

vandy786

Oops, I forgot to mention. I have a 2002 TLS and it does not come with a CAI. I bought my own Comptech one last week

samkws

they are in the same J-series family

J30 A4 and J32 A3

the engines can virtually swapped for each other, just like the civics and integras used to do

EZZ

I've yet to see a 04 tl 5at get 14.3 on the strip. The g35 with 5at has gotten this. BTW, the VQ in the g35 has been consistent in terms of horsepower in its rating in the G35 series. If anything the CLS consistently dynoed less that the G35 sedan and both have 260hp. Something to think about.

The only reason you see some of the VQ autos get much slower times is that the ECU adjusts the VQ to the drivers style. Many drivers have gotten slow times soon as they get done with their break ins because of how they babied their cars through the break in period (1200 miles). When they reset the ECU, they've consistently got 0.3 to 0.5 seconds slower than the manuals. Just because Nissan screwed up with their sentras does not mean their whole lineup of cars are slow. BTW, I'd trust a RWD Nissan tranny developed for a V8 over a fragile Honda tranny thats made of glass (ie. last get TLS). Right now, until I get confirmation that the new tranny is completely redesigned, I don't trust the 5AT.

RhodeRunner

The TL will not beat a G35 manual transmission. I have a G35 and also test drove a TL with auto transmission. The G has more get up and go due to the higher torque numbers.

jrock65

"they are in the same J-series family

J30 A4 and J32 A3

the engines can virtually swapped for each other, just like the civics and integras used to do"

This is what I meant. I don't think it's that difficult for a manufacturer to increase the engine size from 3.0 to 3.2. I for one am glad that Nissan (as well as Honda, BMW, Toyota) uses basically the same engine in many of their vehicles. Those cost savings eventually trickle down to the consumers. And we still get the same great engine. If I were a G35 owner, I couldn't care less that an Altima, Z, Maxima, or a FX owner has the same basic engine. But I guess some people do mind.

LVSBB6

HP and TQ measured at the flywheel does not say it all.
Wheel HP and TQ measured from dyno is what the actual numbers the car is actually putting on the ground.

G35 is RWD vehicle, thus the power loss from the drivetrain/axle will be greater than that of a TL with FWD.

Here's a dyno of a stock G35 coupe 6MT that I found from www.6MT.net:


G35 coupe has 280hp and 270lbs of tq. As you can see, a G35 coupe on dyno shows a 31% drivetrain loss in HP and 26% drivetrain loss in TQ.
A G35 sedan with 260hp and 260lbs of tq would put down even lesser numbers than these, approximately 198 whp and 206 tq base on the same caculation as above.
We have yet seen any dyno of the 2004 TL, if anyone can post a dyno of a TL Type S we can compare the graphs and analyze from there.

niko14

Here's the final answer:
I have the G35c (5at with ~3500 miles) and my co-worker has the 04 tl (5at with ~2200 miles). Well we had a similar debate. And my coupe beat him 4 out of 5 runs to 0-80mph, by at least a car length( lost once because i hit rev limiter in first and second). Also, we did a 40mph roll on the freeway to about 125 mph and the G DESTROYED him by 2 car lengths. I ve had much closer runs with 01-03 TLs equiped with CAI & headers than my co-workers 04 TL

jimthegreek

:smackhead

Ive raced 3 g35c that my friends own... the auto G35 is close.. the TL beat them each time.. the G35c 6 speed vs. a TL auto.. killed me every time though..

now a 6speed of each model would be close again

niko14

well, I'am not completley stock on my g35c I have a CAI and Borla exahust. Give some more specifics, not some MALAKIA like the TL beat it each time.

niko14

I run consistantly 14.2 at the track...Like to see a 04 TL AT do that..

Tecworld

1. Why are there so many G35 owners reading this board? It seems that you must either be a little unsettled by the TL, or you feel the need to prove something by making claims (claims which probably aren't true seeing as this is the Internet)

2. Everyone has stories about racing "a friend's G35" or "a friend's TL" and beating it. How can one guy "beat his friend's" 04 TL 4 of 5 times, and another guy with an 04 TL race his friends' G35 coupes and beat them each time???? At this point, I am inclined to not believe anything people claim here. As I said before, two cars like this- it almost falls into who sends those brain signals to the foot and pushed down on the pedal .3 seconds earlier.

3. These two cars are very similar in straight line performance. This is already a tribute to the TL's performance capabilities because the TL is putting up numbers similar to a RWD car of equal power (or greater) and weight. A more exact comparison would be the TL vs Maxima or I35 (both are FWD, 3+ liter V6 cars putting out 260+ hp). In that range, the TL does very well against its Nissan competitors. If Acura ever released a RWD V6 sport sedan, then we can have some more logical discussions comparing it with the G35.

Peters

Well some of the cars seem to have performance modification like niko's or some posters are just full of SKATA. I'm sure Road & Track will be running a comparison soon.

RAdams

I hate to burst everyone's bubble, but magazine times rarely mean anything when it's two end users racing their cars. Do you honestly think that two cars that were tested to be .1 or .2 seconds different in the 1/4 mile are going to show those exact same results every time they're pitted against each other?

The biggest factor here is driver. Sure, a RWD car has physics on it's side when launching, but it's not just a "stomp and go" proposition as some of you seem to think. If drag racing were as easy as that, we'd all be professional racers.

I also find it amusing when people ask "was the other guy/girl racing?" Let's face it... no matter which car is faster (in this case, the TL or G35) neither of them is so much faster than the other that you'd be able to just stay with your opponent without trying. It's always been fairly obvious to me when people were "trying" to race.

The bottom line is that the driver factor will always decide the outcome.

(Also, as a side note, to the guy who says you don't hit VTEC in first gear: VTEC is activated at a certain RPM in EVERY gear... if you want to exceed that RPM threshold, just floor the gas. You mentioned tipping in to the 2/3 or 3/4 throttle... doing so will obviously make the car shift before redline [and often times before VTEC engages] This applies to both using D5 and SS with the auto 1-2 upshift)

Monte TLS,MAX

Well said, but the reason you see otheres reading this board is because people like to see what competitors are doing plus alot of people have some valuable info to provide. You will see lots of TL forum guys lurking at the G35/Maxima and other sites as well.

tonio

I read these boards because for one I was all over the tl till the G35 coupe came out and none of the boards for the G35 compares to this one. Its no secret that the two cars are very similar as far as price range goes so most buyers probably compare the G35 sedan and the tl. Now as for the race, there are a few variables, one is the rev limiter..if he hit it there was no way for him to win..I can't stand when I hit it and I am still learning. number two is the traction control..if it was on then it was a factor..the G35 is much faster with the traction control off. I'm not going to say a tl couldn't beat a G35 because you never know what the conditions were.. even a full tank of gas could have made a difference. I have to say I am amazed at all of the people siding with the G35 though on this forum though.

LVSBB6

Quote from Car and Driver.com:

All that power and torque gets channeled through the front-drive dam like a school of spawning salmon, bogging the drivetrain as it tries to put the power down. Gobs of wheelspin ensues until the all-season Bridgestone Turanza EL42s are finally able to hook up, launching the TL upstream with serious authority. Zero to 60 mph comes in just 5.7 seconds, with the quarter-mile following 8.7 seconds later at 99 mph. The 3.2 revs easily and willingly, emitting a mechanical soundtrack that perfectly complements its 6800-rpm threshold. Typical of Honda manual transmissions, the TL's enters and exits its six gates with short, velvety throws, making rowing the gears more a joy than a chore. The optional Bridgestone Potenza RE030 summer tires ($200), available only with the six-speed manual, would likely improve acceleration, but still, the TL is indisputably fast. The G35 with a six-speed manual (C/D, October 2003) is 0.2 second slower to 60, and the 330i (C/D, February 2002) is 0.7 second behind. The Infiniti outsprints the TL to the quarter-mile by 0.2, with the Bimmer trailing it by 0.5 second.

Source: http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=1

Enough said.

Peters

Without a doubt, driver factor is an issue. But the debate is, which car accelerates better on an apples to apples basis, to the extent you can create a comparable enviornment? LVSBB6 has a relevant source.

In any event it looks like the G35 and 330i are quite close and would indicate that in real world conditions, drivers would be hard pressed to notice significant differences in acceleration. Personally, I always find the 35 mph to 65 mph acceleration most relevant since that's what you experience when getting on the highway.

LVSBB6

Acura TL

C/D TEST RESULTS

ACCELERATION (Seconds)
Zero to 30 mph 2.2
40 mph 3.3
50 mph 4.4
60 mph 5.7
70 mph 7.6
80 mph 9.4
90 mph 11.9
100 mph 14.6
110 mph 17.8
120 mph 21.8
130 mph 28.6
Street start, 5-60 mph 6.3
Top-gear acceleration, 30-50 mph 10.4
50-70 mph 10.3
Standing 1/4-mile 14.4 sec @ 99 mph
Top speed (governor limited) 152 mph



G35 sedan 6MT

Vehicle type: front-engine, rear-wheel-drive, 5-passenger, 4-door sedan
Price as tested: $35,395 (base price: $29,645)
Engine type: DOHC 24-valve V-6, aluminum block and heads, port fuel injection
Displacement: 214 cu in, 3498cc
Power (SAE net): 260 bhp @ 6000 rpm
Torque (SAE net): 260 lb-ft @ 4800 rpm

Transmission: 6-speed manual
Wheelbase: 112.2 in
Length/width/height: 186.5/69.0/57.7 in
Curb weight: 3526 lb

Zero to 60 mph: 5.9 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 14.4 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 6.3 sec
Standing 1/4-mile: 14.2 sec @ 99 mph
Top speed (governor limited): 146 mph
Braking, 70-0 mph: 153 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.87 g
EPA fuel economy, city driving: 20 mpg
C/D-observed fuel economy: 20 mpg

Source: www.caranddriver.com

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

I agree w/ you man... TL's are way overplayed... i'm FULLY MODDED .. and i, at this point, might run consistent 14.5's .. and I'm probably pushing 300hp at the crank w/ all my toys (I/H/E/UR)

G's are fast.. I"ve seen it first hand .. stock G took my modded TL-S in a very fair street race, we did it again, it was even, maybe me on top by a little... that's fast, b/c I regard my MODDED TL-S as pretty quick ..

Lots o' respect for G35's .. it would have been my next car had it been out sooner than the TL-S.

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

It's no problem at all -- we're both wiser b/c of it!

You should be able to pick up a used TL-S w/ your search criteria for about $20K .. I've seen that cheap around here in the Chicago burbs... Your warranty does definitely transfer ownership, so if that doesn't bother you about a possible problem w/ the tranny so long as it's covered.. then by all means power to you.

I personally couldn't buy a car knowing that the tranny could still be defective, regardless of the warranty I was getting with it. It just seems... hmm... i dunno, something's not right about it.

Lemme know what you end up getting, I'd be very interested to know. best of luck w/ that.

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

um, ok. Look, honestly -- if it truly offends you, there are other ways that you can make a difference to help put and end to street racing other than draping your own moral sanctions on this particular thread. "Dripping sarcasm," ??? That reads like Maya Angelou... touche!


BTW, trust me, the issue of street racing has been feverishly debated on this forum, and the CL-S forum many many times... in the end, it just came down to mindless, immature, name-calling.. I kid you not.

niko14

I've had great runs with some modded 02/03 TLs (I/H/E) and have lost some. (close till about 110mph). I use to own a modded 02 cl and my wife still drives a STOCK 03 TLS, that's why i visit this website. I have much respect for the new TL, but the G35 coupe gives you a lot more sports car feel than the TL. The lease on the wifes tl is up in September, so 04 TL here we come. (best of both worlds)

SilverBulletCLS

You suck at the track then.

I had only headers and HKS mufflers and ran 14.42 at 99.8 mph in my CL-S Auto. That was with a 2.239 60 ft.

vandy786

Yea something's definitely up with Peter's TLS. On like the 4th run of my very first track visit ever, I ran 1/4th in 14.71s when I was stock. Some other dude on this board ran 14.6 stock stock too if I remember correctly. With Icebox, he ran 14.5. I am definitely going to make a run when the tracks open up, now that I have the Icebox. My friend said my 60 ft. times were horrible, plus I had a full tank of gas, left my spare tire in, and it was in the summertime on a hot day. I'm hoping I can match the 14.5 with just Icebox.