Hi guys. I know there are a lot of threads on the whole 3rd gear issue in most of the manual TL's--I did a search and see a lot of them starting in 2007and I am at work and cant read thru all of them so I figured I would just toss a question out and hopefully someone will be nice enough to answer.

I see the GM synchromesh tran fluid fixes the problem but possibly voids the warranty. The idea of voiding the warranty on my brand new car I just bought sickens me.
So, I see they have issued a TSB. What exactly does Acura do to fix this issue ? Do they put in their own fluid ? Do they replace the clutch ? What do they do ?
Isn't the synchromesh just masking what the real problem is ?

 

Most folks have gone with the GMSFM (General Motors Synchromesh Friction Modified) fluid, part #12377916. Some have had the TSB done with mixed results. I suppose your decision is going to be based upon how much of a problem you are experiencing. If your problems are slight, the GMSFM fluid is almost certain to completely take care of it. If, on the other hand, the problems are serious and frequent, you should take it in for the TSB. And since this is a new car to you and you do have the warranty, you just might want to consider taking it in anyway for the fix.

This has nothing to do with the clutch since a clutch assembly is completely separate from a transmission. It almost always involves the third gear set which is what will be replaced.

 

GMSFM took care of my 3rd gear pop out.

 

I can't see how using a different brand of tranny fluid would void any warranty. I do know that acura told me they would not put it in for me, had to bring it to a local shop to do a drain and fill with it myself. 3rd gear was popping out for me when I bought the car and it's been smooth ever since.

 

Depends upon how the contract is worded.

 

That does seem absurd that using a different lubrication fluid would void your warranty. So if we dont use Honda brake fluid and we crash our car Honda isnt liable ? Makes no sense.
Can anyone explain from a mechanics perspective what exactly Acura does to fix it ?
If I elect to go with the Synchromesh is there anyway Acura can tell its a different fluid ? (sounds dumb but figured I would ask)

I drove my 04 TL for 7 years and probably popped out of gear once. With my new TL-S its happened about 4 times in 3 days. Somehow 3rd(and 4th) gear just feel a little more "notchy" than 1,2 and 5 and 6. If that makes sense.

 

If they test the fluid.....but that is highly unlikely.
testing takes time and money.

Southernboy explained...

 

Me too, instantly made things Keith Stone SMMMOOOOTTTTTHHHHHH.

Been that way for 20K miles.

 

Would the dealer even be able to tell if you put in GMSFM? I think I'd do it on a brand new TL without hesitation. I guess if I heard of someone having their warranty voided by this I'd be concerned, but I haven't.

I can't speak much for mine since I never had the 3rd gear problem, although when I swapped the fluid it did seem noticeably smoother?

 

There is no such thing as "voided warranty" but I guess if they could somehow prove that you used this fluid, and somehow prove that it caused some type of failure, they could deny warranty coverage on that particular failure. I'm doubtful that they could or would try to prove those things. Don't go telling them that you put in the GM fluid.

 

Posted 03/02/11
Posted 03/03/11
reports of dealers messing up reverse when attempting the TSB.

 

GM fluid FTW.

 

I plan on trying the fluid, and if I'm not happy will do swap it out and bring it to the dealer. I have no pop out just a rough engagement some time. I really don't like going to the dealer at all. They may have some good mechanics but it is luck of the draw.

 

^do the GM juice. you'll love it

 

+1, 31k miles or 50 000 km

 

At about 19k miles, I swapped out the Honda MTF in my 09 Accord Coupe because I was getting notchiness in 3rd gear and I had a couple of 3rd gear pop-outs. Notchiness is gone and I haven't had a 3rd gear pop out since. (about 4k miles).

http://www./forums/showthread.php?t=...ction+modified

 

I stopped by local dealer (not where I bought the car) on the way home yesterday, to procure the crush washers for the fill/drain plugs. Guy gave me the washers for free. Granted, probably $2 worth of parts (retail) or 30cents cost, but it was appreciated.

 

^awesome!

 

I changed out my fluid on my TL-S at 115,000 to the GM Friction Modified when I had problems with 3rd, even though the previous owner had it done at the 105k service. The fluid that came out was a very light color while the new fluid I put in was a darker reddish brown color. If they pay attention while draining they'll be able to tell. That being said, they would have to prove that the type of fluid you put in had caused the problem which would be hard for them to do if they'd already drained it all into their big catch receptacle. I'd just go in and tell them the problem you're having and ask if using the GM fluid would cause them to try to deny your warranty claims. If they say it voids it tell them you'll check with your lawyer about it, they may change their tune. Some dealers try to deny things for warranty work because they usually get reimbursed at a lower rate by the manufacturer than what they charge us.

 

I spoke with an Acura dealer. They said to fix this issue is a 8 or 9 hour job ?!?
The thought of having some of the 15 year old looking kids they have working at my local Acura dealer doing this kind of work on my new TL makes me very nervous, I think I am going to go with the Synchromesh. How much do I need and where do I get it ?

 

Just a rant. I called two Acura dealers to discuss the 3rd gear popping out in the manual trans cars---both of them acted like they never heard of the problem and that its VERY random. Really ?
I test drove at least 5 TL-S manuals before buying one and 4 of them had the problem to varying degrees. I love how even with a TSB they act like the problem doesn't exist. Dopes.

 

3 quarts does the trick and you can get it at any local GM dealer

 

picked mine up for ~13/qt at the local dealer. Call them up and they can hold them for you. Mine did at least.

 

Yea....dealers suck! There is a TSB for our "gas cap error" message and I referred the dealer to the TSB and they still acted like it didn't exist. They called Acura Services to verify, "hey wait a minute, there is a TSB on this car."

Have them try to call Acura Services. That's what it took for them to figure out how to fix my "gas cap error message." Hope it all works out...

 

is there a part number ?

 

Yes, in the very first response to your post...#12377916

 

Good grief, all of these questions have been answered many times over in countless GMFMSM threads....

 

^ Apparently we aren't supposed to say that kind of thing... just supposed to spoonfeed the info again and again.

 

Constant recital of the answers ensure you keep things fresh up top.

 

to make it worse, some dont listen and get the TSB done.....
then come back bitchin that their car is messed up

 

I just wish for simplicity's sake, we'd keep these kinds of major subjects consolidated into as few threads as possible.

Then when someone actually takes the time to do a search (instead of starting a new thread on an old subject, JAB JAB), they don't have 50 different threads to sort through....

 

I put in the gm fluid and although i don't have 3rd gear popping out any more it still does not feel smooth when shifting. It is quite notchy in second and third. I am debating the tsb before my warranty is up.

 

In this day and age, its a microwave world.
every one wants information this instant.

No one takes the time to read or to study any more.
the few that do, will make it here on azine.

 

When did you have it done?
to further expand, at what mileage did you put it in?
did you always experience 3rd gear pop out and or not smooth shifting?

the Check delay valve makes it hard to shift smoothly. you might want to re-drain and fill with GMSFM and take out the check delay valve.

 

 

I bought it with 60k km, did it when I got it, I put 3k on it and then put the gm fluid in. It now shifts ok and I don't worry about it popping out but it just doesn't feel smooth. I have put about 9000 km since the fill.

 

If you are still under a full warranty then they should fix the issue for free and offer you a loaner etc because they acknowledged that there is an issue with the third gear. No they dont just drain it and refill it. They actually rebuilt the transmission. I got quoted somewhere in the neighborhood of 2000 for everything to be right.

 

hanks for all the replies guys. Yes I know this has been mentioned many times over but sometimes its hard to search through 50,000 different threads while at work. Not to mention a lot of them were PRE-TSB. But make no mistake--I definitely appreciate the time a lot of you take out to answer and I always try to do the same. Its what keeps this place going.

Anyway--my car is under full warranty(Im assuming this is covered by the bumper to bumper and NOT the powertrain) . Im going to think about it a bit but seems to make sense to try the GM synchromesh and see where it goes from there. It doesnt grind so perhaps its just not that severe. My car only has 27,000 miles on it.

 

You asked earlier how much to use. A drain and fill takes 2.3 U.S. quarts, which is 2 quarts, 10 ounces rounded. Your fill plug is going to be very hard to remove, unless it has been removed before and at only 27,000 miles I would bet it has not. You will most likley need a breaker bar. You do not need to remove anything up top other than the cover over the battery. The fill plug takes 33 ft/lbs when you put it back in and the drain plug takes 29 ft/lbs.

Several of us have done extensive writeups about this. Mine was in 2005. You would be well advised to read these and make sure you understand what you are doing. It is a simple drain and fill and in fact the easiest and least messy one I have ever done on any of my manuals.

Do yourself a favor and read the writesups first.

https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-2004-2008-93/replace-mt-tranny-fluid-gm-sfm-morning-3g-garage-c-013-a-580319/

NOTE: I said I used 2 quarts 5+ ounces. That is not what you use. Refill with 2 quarts, 10 ounces and you'll have what you need. Just make sure your case is level.

Here are a two links with pictures. Once again, you do NOT need to remove all of this stuff.

https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-2004-2008-93/%2A-6-spd-tranny-fluid-change-%2A-3g-garage-c-013-a-558814/
https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-2004-2008-93/manual-trans-fluid-change-pics-3g-garage-c-013-a-574738/

 

OP you shouldn't have any issues doing it yourself but you do feel uncomfortable just take it to a shop. They shouldn't charge you more than for 1/2 hours worth of labor. If you do make sure that they put back the panel underneath that is required to remove to access the drain plug. Other than that. Simple drain refill. It's like taking a bottle of spring water, pouring out what's in there and pouring back in tap water hahaha but it's a positive change