Tread

The notice also lists the 2004 Accord as recalled, who knows?

rets

The respondence from 04TL's tranny is totally different than 03's, but maybe Acura just upgrade 2G TL's tranny. Then, after 2.5 months production, they add the new lubrication kit iside...

yield2s

At my last three tranny replacement I ask the service managers if the 04 had a completely redesigned 5spd, Of coarse they said yes. IS IT? All I know is its the same 3.2 block, same shifting patterns(as noted above),same 2nd gear lube issue as the 02-03 MDX, and what does a redesign mean anyways? the problem according to the part of the NTHSA report i saw originated from qa issues w/ some of their suppliers(although that to me sounded alot like what big mighty Ford did to Firestone with the Exploder issue). So are there new supplier?
I'm set with not owning another auto in a 6 or v8 any time soon, anybrand unless they've proven themselves. Ofcoarse this will throw some into the deffensive mode but thats where I'm at after 4 trannies,and all of my friends;girls, guys, old, young, getting new autos.

EZZ

Depends on your definition of fucked over. I would feel fucked over if my 2nd gen tranny failed 3 times and I forced acura to give me my money back. Instead they give me deal I can't beat on an 04 TL because they assure me that the new TL is a completely new car... Now I learn that its probably the same tranny and its being recalled again

This really didn't happen to me (Sorry Peter...I'm kinda picking on you) but I can empathize with the people that do own the TL. I honestly would feel a little fucked over :'(

rets

To those who strongly believe 04TL tranny is the same as 03 TL's, could you provide some experts' opinions why Acura only recalls 5AT out of first 14224 TLs but all of them?

You think Acura is not yet to acknowledge that all 04 tranny would have the same issue?
Or Acura is soon to recall later VINs' 04TLs?
Or Acura did complete the testing of new tranny and put them into 04TLs after 14224?
Or Acura just likes to recall group by group and make less crowded in their nationalwide dealership?

Thanks.

fsconsult

Earlier than the previous fiasco (2nd gen, Accord,etc), but still it took awhile for this anouncement.

If the last VIN effected was VIN 4A014224, supposedly then, by the 14224th car, they knew of this problem, hence they made changes to the 14225th car.

And of course they knew a problem existed even before then, since it takes some time to develop and implement the fix on the 14225th car.

The VIN must be in the 60000's by now, and they are just releasing this?

Yes, true...Acura did learn from the previous errors...somewhat. Imagine if Acura repeated the same mistake in this TL as they did in the previous gen....

I think people are suprised and worried/upset for a good reason. Acura repeatedly stated that the 04 TL auto trans were completely re-designed. Acura should have made this trans BULLETPROOF. Other car makers have various problems...yes...but this is pretty rediculous for a car manufacturer to have the same problems over and over again with multiple makes/models across several generations.

I don't think Acura (or any other car manufacturer) would recall cars...with an estimated cost at over 200 million to do so on a drop of a hat if the problem was not real. Acura can state any type of scenario or try to downplay the problem, but even if the chances are slim, why should I be exposed to a tranny failure at high speeds, while many(most) other cars do not have repeated problems with tranny.

Just the thought of a high speed tranny failure (no matter how slim the chances are) makes me second think before having passengers in my car.

How many fixes and versions of fixes is Acura/Honda going to have this time around?

For those of you saying relax...do you have the whole truth about the severity of the problem? Of course not! Or are you too concerned of what this news will do to your resell value. "F" my resell value! Me and my passenger's safety comes first.

my .02 cents.

Lore

rets:

That's a very good question - one that I wonder about. I have a feeling that they may extend another blanket recall a few more months later to "make sure" that there's nothing wrong with those with VIN 14225 and later.

yield2s

I've lived through the progressive recalls on my 2nd gen, this is probably only the first wave IF history repeats itself. But let's hope not.

DC5_Integra

Anything things on the Canadian TL's?

TL_6SPD

You don't know everything.

TL_6SPD

Actually it took Acura 3 years to issue a recall. 2 years to issue a extended warranty. I would say thats sitting back doing nothing.

cullal

I just got off the phoe with ACS. My VIN# is xx80xx and I am affected by the recall. The lady on the phone told me that the letters will be going out starting sometime next week and could expect mine in a few weeks time.
The first thing I was asked for was the mileage on the car. I wonder how the mileage has anything to do with the transmission issue...

HTownTL

Thank God, Mine is not in recall. VIN#xxxxxxxxx4A039790 3-04

need4spd

The higher the mileage, the more likely it has damage, or clogged cooling paths.

JetJock

You would think Acura would forget building automatic tranny's, and just buy them from GM like everyone else does. These recalls must be killing their bottom line.

caball88

damn acura really dropped the ball on this one. they knew what happen to the 2nd gen tranny and yet they did little to change this one. i hope everything turns out for you 5AT'ers.

TBone2004

they told me if you are > 15000 miles you probably have damage.

rets

If this is the limitation early-built 04TLs can drive, three of friends' cars are already far more than this number. And, mine will be there right before my upcoming schedule of examination. :shit:

At this moment, I start to consider 05RL and trade in my 04TL... RL's tranny is much much better than TL, right?

caball88

so do the non effected TL's have a different tranny or do they have the fix in already?

TBone2004

someone must have clued in around the time the 14,000+ car was completed - so they began putting in the trannies without this issue. Probably used up the last batch of trannies they had then switched to new batch. (The trannies come in big racks to the plant.)

Dr.Murdock

i just bought my TL last week with the vin # 49xxx. Do you guys think i am safe?

TBone2004

yes. but would not hurt to call. 1 -800-382-2238 have your vin and mileage handy

Dr.Murdock

thx for the number.

jdrasin

I'm VIN 43884 and am not affected. I asked her why the ask for milage, and she said it's asked every time you call in.

Joe

yield2s

thats funny considering that GM buys the 5spd auto tranny and v-6 from Honda for the Saturn VUE. But Ya I agree, build a good one or find a good one,but dont keep putting crap in an awesome car.

And this "Jetkit fix",, Ever heard of "polishing a turd"?

Teh Jatt

I'm @ 14k miles (vin: 17xxx) and i'm not affected... but I got a 3rd brake light parts on order and when dealer calls me i will again tell them to check my car to see if it got any tranny problems.

nick04tl

where in my post did i claim to? thats right nowhere. do u have some sort of issue with me or are u just a tool?

5Zigen

I'm going to call them first thing tommorrow, the Canadian Customer Relations number is 888-922-8729.

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

Only time will tell on this one ... it'll be pretty darn interesting to say the least to see what Acura will do if the 04's are affected as much as the '00-03's were...

FirstAcura

I haven't been to the site in a while; glad I just did.

My VIN is in the 7XXX's; I just made an appointment for next Wednesday to get the oil-jet?? added.

Plus to look at some paint defects..............

thanks for the useful info as usual

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

Galeforce, this '04TL must be your first TL ... you sound like me when I tried defending the reliability of my 2002 TL Type S before my first tranny failure (~10,000 miles on the ODO).

copter

That's why I waited!!!!!

yield2s

[QUOTE=PeterUbers]Galeforce, this '04TL must be your first TL ... you sound like me when I tried defending the reliability of my 2002 TL Type S before my first tranny failure (~10,000 miles on the ODO).[/QUOTE

You still have your lawyers # handy?

caball88

dun think anyone with a 5AT wants to hear that. i'm glad i have a 6MT as well but i feel bad for those that might have the problem.

Road Rage

No doubt. As I recall, there were some heated opinions about what the problems was - some said it was fluid, but I held it was mechanical. Acura sub-contracts these trannies, and it did seem to take forever to determine that the second valve system was weak.

For all 5AT owners, I would recommend changing the fluid every two years - I do not much on the MID - that is a sucker bet, made to reduce TCO stats for marketing advantage.

Don't believe me? Some history: when BMW owners had to pay service, 3750k oil changes were required - when BMW went to maintenance provided, that doubled or tripled. Huh? Same engine, same drivetrain. Figure it out - were they lyinh then, or now? I suggest the truth is somewhere in between.

The tranny only holds 7 qts total, 3 are replaced at fluid change. My Outback has nearly twice that for 2.5L 168 HP, and lots of air space for cooling to boot. No wonder these cars are super reliable.

I am contacting Amsoil Tech Svcs to see if they certify (warranty) Amsoil ATF as compatible with ATF-Z1. If they do, it might be a wise choice, as it has superior heat and oxidation resistance. I will advise.

GaleForce

We're talking about the 2004 TL. Welcome to the 3G forums.

Road Rage

http://amsoil2.cpinternet.com/script...msoiloaf:index

Type in 2004, hit enter, enter Acura, hit enter, pick the 3.2L, and it will reveal approved lubricants.

It DOES list SLF (their Synthetic ATF) as meeting Z1 spec - I have also contacted Tech Svcs via email to confirm that Amsoil wil stand behind that. I have a gallon of the stuff in my vast arsenal of lubricants in my garage (it really is scary), and will try it next summer and report back.

1SICKLEX

http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104677

Some good reading here.





Edited by rets: This is the good write-up, but ways too long. 42 pages with 11,468 words. Thanks for your copy & paste.

:sqnteek:

1SICKLEX

http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146048

More good reading. This explains more of WHY there is an issue.

I'm sure that the 2nd gear problem is being addressed. The TSB says so. They get you a gear sprayer if 2nd gear isn't already fried. If the gear is fried, they get you a new transmission (well rebuilt or new – so you have no guaranty of getting a new tranny for one that has a bad clutch or other Q/A problems.)


If you CAN CLEARLY see that the scope of the replacement is for wasted or soon-to-be wasted 2nd gears, why do people think the MAIN problem is solved? Why do people think that the quality control issues have been fixed? I haven’t seen a single word to imply this.

Is logic lost on people?

The majority of the problems we've been seeing have been clutch flare and slip problems. And, one of the problems is having to return again and again to get multiple replacement transmissions. I’d be rather excited if Acura said, “We have a fix for the clutch slip and quality control problems. Bring in your car for an inspection. If we determine that you transmission is from a suspect build lot, and doesn’t have updated parts to correct the clutch problems, we will install a new transmission with improved quality control and stronger clutch packs." (Hey, they can put in the 2nd gear sprayer too if they like.)

For those owners that trashed their 2nd gear, I think they are on the road to recovery. The TBS is clear about this and if it isn't -- well, Acura can go back to the drawing board. At least they can inspect the gear. Perhaps it would be nice to add an additional inspection to cars that get the mod to see if it actually works.

Analogy: If Acura issued a "transmission recall" that replaced a reverse solenoid that might cause an accident because they got a bad batch of them and the TBS says, "Recall authorized to correct possible problem," is everyone here going to just start saying "Recall == good." We've finally won! Hurray!

I've been as hopeful as anyone about getting a real beefed up transmission. I’ve also gone to bat with the NHTSA and the LA Times to let them know that people were really having a problem (others did too – so lets me clear about this.) And, the bulk of the failures and the bulk of the docs related to the CLS failures have been related to the clutch packs.

THERE IS NOTHING IN THIS RECALL THAT IS GOING TO HELP THE CLUTCH PROBLEMS -- PERIOD!

YOU ARE NOT GOING TO GET A NEW TRANSMISSION FOR YOUR CLS IF YOUR SECOND GEAR IS OK.

YOU WILL GET A TRANSMISSION IF YOUR CLUTCH PACKS ARE TRASHED -- AND THIS IS JUST AS IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN. NO CHANGE. REPEAT -- NO CHANGE.

You are STILL going to have to take in your slipping tranny to get it fixed. They are not saying, “we are going to replace the early 01 transmission if we think the clutches are screwed up.” Perhaps they plan on doing this; however, they are not doing this right now. The recall has nothing to due with the problem -- period!

There are many people that have been injured as a result of the fifth to second spontaneous downshift. This was NOT a result of the second gear. SO TELL ME HOW THIS HELPS the biggest problem that CL owners are having?.

IOW, nothing has changed except:

You get to take the car in and have them look at second gear. They do their thing, depending on mileage.

Now, if you clutch packs are 0.5mm shy of failing, you still get to drive away. They are going to do some inspection to look inside the clutch packs *or* even check the contents of a new fliter that they add to look for clutch particles. The clutch packs are still screwed up and Acura still seems to have trouble getting people replacment trannies that aren't worse than the originals.

And, when you get your replacement transmission, be sure to REQUEST A NEW -- NOT rebuilt tranny. And, even if you ask for it, you will still have the chance of getting a transmission that is still not sorted out. This is still the same.

-- NOTHING HAS CHANGED IF YOU AREN'T HAVING 2nd GEAR TOOTH PROBLEMS --


BTW, if anyone thinks that a 2nd gear oil jet is going to cool down the 3rd gear clutch packs -- or even the 2ng gear clutch packs, please explain their reasoning. There is a flood of ATF that is moving through the clutch packs and it gets into DIRECT contact with the clutch disks and carries away the heat caused by the friction during the shift transitions. The oil squirter is squirting the outside of a different gear and will do very little. The squirter is like the piston squirters in an engine's block, and saying this will correct an oil flow/temp problem that is tearing up crankshaft bearings is similar to the transmission analogy. A bit more oil will fall on the crankshaft, but its impact on a crankshaft's bearings reliablity would be minima

l.

TL_6SPD

Well you weren't exactly right on your comments about the tranny on the tl now were you, even though you were blaming someone else with misinformation.