Stroupck

Just got a new RLX with 3,000 miles and the tie rod on passenger rear sheered right off on the highway. Anyone ever heard of such a thing? The car was driving fine, then got loose and bam it broke off.

neuronbob

Welcome to AZ! I moved your thread to the RLX section.

I can tell you that you are the first to report this problem. Do let use know what your dealer does to help the problem so that others can be aware of a solution.

I will also add, this is a distinctly unusual problem for any Acura product.

jshaw

Weren't the rear tie rods replaced by the P-AWS actuators in the RLX's rear suspension setup?

neuronbob

Here's Edmund's walk around of the RLX suspension. Seems to be both tie rods so far as I can tell and the P-AWS actuators are pretty small.

http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/t...alkaround.html

Edward'TLS

Were there any bumps or pot-holes on the highway ?

Stroupck

No potholes. About a month after I got it I felt the back get loose and didn't know what it was. It went away shortly thereafter. Now 1 month later it got real squirrelly on the highway again. Pulled into a driveway and the wheel just caved it. No damage under the car at all. I'm guessing the bolt was not tightened and just sheered right off after wear. Can you upload pics on this site?

neuronbob

Yes, you can upload pics.

Click "go advanced", then "manage attachments". Max JPEG size is 19 MB. You can also host elsewhere and use the [IMG][/IMG] tags.

Stroupck

I heard back from the dealer. They told me the bolt was not tightened properly at the factory and that I was very fortunate that the scenario was not worse. It was loose and over the course of 3,000 miles the bolt finally gave way.

I'd suggest other RLX owners have their cars checked since it happened at the factory.

Chad

victorber

Stroupk,
Really glad to hear that there were no secondary problems when that failure occurred and no one got hurt...
I'll bet that Acura stops the assembly line and does an inspection of that part to insure nothing gets out of plant with the same problem...

Hey Colin, have you heard anything thru the grape vine in regards to this report??

While reading this I was thinking of our trip thru Glacier NP and the narrow road on Ride To The Sun.. That would have been interesting!!!

Stroupck

Thanks Victorber,

The picture you posted with the yellow arrows is the part that broke off. Seems like my rights to post attachments is set to "No" or I would upload a picture of it. I should get the car back today.

Fabvsix

Those folks in Ahlabama better check their work......so far Japan made car's are still the best......

jshaw

The RLX is only made in Japan. Alabama got the MDX this year, but that model was formerly made in Canada.

Rocket_man

Just to clarify.... you first said 'sheared off' but then the dealer said the fastener was not properly torqued. Actually there are two links in that photo, which one came loose? Did the link actually break? Or did it come loose from one end and fall off? And which end came loose?

This could have been dangerous if you were at highway speed. Glad nothing worse happened.

victorber

I think what might have occurred was the bolt loosened and as it had room to move, it started to apply a shearing stress at either the head or nut and then failed.
It would be of interest as to which end had the failure, Inner or Outer end? Both ends look to have an elastromeric bearing on the inside the housings where the bolt clamps up the parts.

Hey Chad, did you get get her back from the dealership???

Stroupck

It was the left side that broke free. The side more towards the middle. The dealer fixed it and I got a call back from Acura Client relations. They said the car met the standards when it rolled of the lot and suggested vibrations might have caused it to come loose and sheered off. That news was very discomforting. I would have rather heard that a mistake was made at the factory. I was told it could possibly happen again in 3 months and I was offered an extended service contract. I told her that an extended warranty won't help me when this happens again. I truly believe it was a mistake at the factory but now I am a bit worried!

miner

When properly torqued a bolt/nut will not shear off due to vibration in a 3000 miles time period. Sure, it may have met standards when it left the factory but maybe those 'standards' need to be reevaluated. You can bet if this happens to me a lawyer will be involved since Acura is now aware of this anomoly and seems to not concern them. Stroupck, thank you for sharing tis information with us.

terdonal

I would be a little concerned about the answer they gave you as well. If they were offering an extended warranty for the whole car for free I would take it though. I am sure they will be watching for this in the future though both at the factory and the dealers.

Edward'TLS

It could be a parts supplier problem. Maybe one or a couple of bolts that have slipped pass the QC process, have made it to the production floor.

Sub-standard bolts will break or shear off because they don't meet the strength requirement in the 1st place.

wstr75

I echo Edward'TLS's comments. The RL(X) has always seemed to be Honda's low volume field trial platform for new technology. I bet they will take the information from your rear tie rod failure and come back at some point in the future with a bolt or design change that is better, i.e. no failures at 250K miles. If they have to make the bolt out of titanium, they will do it because from running and observing Honda products over the years, it appears that accepting sub-standard quality performance is not in Honda's DNA. In other words, your RLX's tie rod failure is likely a big deal to them.

neuronbob

Exactly. Honda=engineering company first, car company second. They will do this right even if it takes more time and data.

Rocket_man

That response is pretty disturbing. If this is true then what they are saying is that the design is faulty. No properly designed fastener should come loose or fail under expected loads. To be told that it might happen again in 3 months is unacceptable. Is an extended warranty going to help you when you lose control of the car? That response would not be okay with me.

I'm not sure how I could drive a car knowing that the manufacturer just told me the rear end tie rods might break at any time. Did you get this in writing? I'd take that extended warranty as a way to document this design flaw.

Agreed!

After their ridiculous non-response to the thousands of faulty rear struts on the RDX and ILX I'm not very confident the way Acura deals with problems with their cars unless forced to.

neuronbob

Or the 5AT fiasco of 10-11 years ago.

I didn't say they were perfect in their response. That's where we forum members come in. We point them out over, and over, and over, and over, and sometimes (like the 5AT failures) generate a little media exposure...and Honda/Acura folks do monitor our little site.

victorber

When looking at the actual part that broke, there sees to be a "Self-Locking" mechanism on the nut and the cause of vibration induced I feel is very shallow. I would pull all the current stock of bolt/nut and have them tested for the proper hardness.
There is no where near the vibration on that part as there is in a rotating Bolt/Nut combo in a Helicopter rotating flight control system.
I would hope Acura is looking very closely at the problem and avoid statements as provided from their Customer Service, above.

Bob you are correct on both accounts, but the rep provided a statement is usually dictated from Pgm. Mgt/Eng. and doesn't reflect the emotion that the customer feels.

2011TL

If this was my vehicle and Acura Client relations responded that "this could happen again in 3,0000 miles" I would do two things: 1) File a complaint with the NHTSA for a safety recall (can do online), and 2) Contact an attorney.

Can you imagine if this happens at 65 mph on a crowded highway? Fortunately no one was hurt with the OP, but this is a potential loss of life issue.

Mr Marco

the case of the flying RL!!!

Edward'TLS

Another doomsday scenario for the already slow-selling RLX.

Rocket_man

If this really was a fastener backing out than current owners should have their cars inspected. Either by the dealer, or since these should be in plain sight, by the owners. Maybe just stick a camera under the rear wheels, front and back and take some pictures and inspect them on your computer. If I had one of these cars you bet I would be under the car checking it out myself.

db22

It's too late for the owners to back out.

Stroupck

I wanted to thank everyone for your post! It has been very helpful as I navigate this issue. I talked with Acura Client Relations again today. They told me the info has been passed on but there would be no further communication as to my issue unless a recall or other bulletin is issued. They also extended my Acura Link Connect services through the 3 year lease of both my new RLX and MDX. This way if I am in another accident at least the car can call on my behalf.

I also took the advice and logged a complaint with the NHTSA today. I'm still uneasy about driving and find myself second guessing as I am turning. At this point I am not sure there is much left to do.

seanlin

Thanks Stroupck for reporting this issue.

It makes me a little bit worry.
Can you tell us how did you notice it? and will you feel anything before it actually break?

Thanks

Rocket_man

If you want a little peace of mind you could put a torque stripe on the nut end of the fasteners. This is not back-out prevention but you will be able to see if the fastener has lost its pre-load and is backing out. It is very common in the aerospace industry. It can be removed if you or a mechanic ever needs to remove the nut. You'd just need to stick your head under there every once in a while and see if the torque stripe is broken. If so take it to the dealer.

http://www.skygeek.com/torque-seal.html

Stroupck

Seanlin,

I first noticed it after about 1 month. I was driving on the highway and the back got loose. The car swerved left to right almost like a strong cross wind was hitting the car. It lasted about 5 seconds and went away. I wasn't sure at that point if it was the road or just something weird about the AWS. Then a month later it happened again but this time more violently. At that moment I knew the two were related. I gained control, pulled off the highway and into a driveway. When got out the tire was sunken into the car and the rod was laying on the ground. The picture above with the yellow arrows is the part that was dragging. When it happens you'll know it! I'd inspect those rear rods or take it to the dealer to make sure it's is right. My profile still says I can't add attachments or I would post pics. Send me your email and I can send you the pictures.

seanlin

Thanks for the info. This helps.

As for attach the photo. You can upload your picture to flickr.com and just post the link here.

Stroupck

Here is the latest. Acura offered to extend AcuraLink through the lease on my car. They asked that I pay for it and submit the receipt to their email for payment. So I paid for it last night and was told that can't issue a receipt. So now I have to deal with getting paid back. On top of that my AcuraLink button is now broke. I called AcuraLink and they don't see any errors so they wouldn't open a ticket. I drove to the dealer and they said they need the car for 3 hours to replace the unit. So now I have paid for a service to call on my behalf if I get in an accident that I might not get re-imbursed on to find out the button is broke in the car and wouldn't call out even if I don't get paid back. I don't think I could make this stuff up! It was relevant to earlier post but when I first got the car it took Acura over 24 days to get the service initally activated. They told me many others were having the issue and that it was new and they needed to work out a few bugs. Crazy!! Maybe wait until 2015 to release this car.

I hope this link works for the pics: http://www.flickr.com/photos/1047701...7636593091726/

wstr75

I tried to open your link but it said you have to authorize me to look at the pictures. Maybe you can make this link open to public viewing.

I feel your pain regarding all these issues. The AcuraLink issue is particularly nettlesome. Thanks for sharing your information with the Acura RL/RLX community.

cyph

I was able to view it but had to sign in to Flickr first.

That car sounds like a lemon with all the issues. The Acuralink counts as two; one more to demand a refund?

seanlin

Thanks for sharing these photos. Hopefully Acura will do a recall and fix this. It seems just need a set of stronger bolts+and+nuts

Rocket_man

Thanks for the pics. I was able to view them after I logged in. There may be a setting to let anyone with the link to view them.

The fastener appears to have backed out. Likely it was not properly tightened/torqued/pre-loaded what ever you want to call it at the factory. I suspect the nut was gone long ago. Then the bolt itself started to work out of the bracket and bushing. When one side came out completely that is probably the first odd feeling you felt in the rear end. It probably never felt right after that but with little seat time in the car you may not have felt that the handling was 'off.' Then when the fastener finally came out completely, that is when you had the major malfunction. I don't think anything sheared off. Just an improperly installed fastener.

In a way this is good news. It doesn't look like there is a design problem... but of course you can't look and 'see' a design problem. If that fastener were properly installed I doubt it would have backed out. Still it would be wise for owners to have these checked ASAP. If there was a tool malfunction or out of spec on the assembly line it could have affected other cars. Maybe the tools were working properly and they just specified the incorrect torque. Even worse, more cars could have this problem.

The good news part to me is that if they replace the link and install the fastener properly this should not happen again. What the customer service rep told you was... well kind of dumb. No car should plan on suspension failure every 3 months.

It looks like when the wheel was angled over that the PAWS actuator may have been under unusual load. I can see the boot looks odd. Like it is being bent over further than it should. Or maybe it always looks that way. Hopefully they inspect that.

I'd still apply torque stripping there and inspect on a regular basis until it looks like nothing else is coming loose. If they had the torque spec wrong there could be more fasteners without the proper pre-load.

A few more things I noticed in the pictures. On the other lower control link you can see the thread end of the fastener that is no longer there on the one that came out. It is hard to see if there is a nut there or not. Looks like it might be there. There is a silver colored fastener that is holding one end of the PAWS unit. You can see two sets of markings. Blue dots and white stripe. Those look to be inspection marks. An indication that the fastener was torqued and checked, then marked and would be something an inspector would look for. It is hard to see in these pics but it does not look like 'torque striping' since the marks look insufficient to tell if the fastener is coming loose. There is no similar type of markings on the remaining control link fastener. So the only verification/inspection on those fasteners is just the worker and the tool he used.

Stroupck

I had to take the car back in today to have the Acura Link replaced in the car. I had a good talk with the service manager. He informed me that when they checked the other tires they found them not to specification and they were able to give the fastener a half turn each. I drove about 200 miles since then and the car still doesn't feel right. After they fix the Acura Link they are going to check the tires again.

Edward'TLS

What's wrong with the Acura Link ?

Is this a software upgrade ?