George Knighton

That might very well be!! His is still the only photographic evidence of failure that I've seen anywhere.

The recall letter is phrased differently from my invoice that quotes the TSB. I'll have to check into that when I drive by the dealer next.

sotiri

well, it appears that we're not the only ones who lose wheels or suspension linkages...
I've got the RLX, which had the recall done, now I guess I will have to wait and see if it will also be a recall on my Stingray... LOL!
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c7-g...-came-off.html

rudedogatx

My wife was pulling into our neighborhood and felt a clunk. Luckily she was close to home. Looks like the bolt fell out to this control arm. I even had the recall done a few months ago. This is not good.

dzionny_dzionassi

^^^^ it is just sad... I would be mad as hell

rudedogatx

Here are more pics. First one is rear passenger side tie rod bolt missing.



Second one is rear drivers side that seems to be fine:



Too late to call service dept, guess I'll wait till the morning. Not happy.

BTW I have 10K miles. Had the recall done back in Feb.

stagefoursurvivor

WHOA NellieBelle!
The feds need to get on this immediately. Someones' gonna get seriously hurt or killed.
Whatever "fix" they performed back in February ain't working!

"Not good"' is an understatement...

rudedogatx

Yes, the fact that I had the recall done and this happened either means either the bolts weren't properly torqued by the dealer doing the recall work or there is a more serious problem. I don't even know which bolts were re-torqued for the recall. Was this one of them?

stagefoursurvivor

In my youth my comment would have been along the lines of...this is some serious A$$ $hit to deal with.
I sure in hell wouldn't let anyone else drive this car for awhile

rudedogatx

Any recommendations on how to handle this when I call the dealer tomorrow morning? I mean this could have been really bad had it happened at high speeds.

TampaRLX-SH

This is serious.

Before calling the dealer I would report it to Acura Corporate. I would express hesitation contacting the dealer who may have not performed the recall properly. And if the dealer failed with the recall service, this is serious enough to call them out to corporate before they brush you off and cover their tracks. If they had performed the recall properly, Acura has a bigger problem.

I would give Acura opportunity to mitigate this before you contact the the dealer. They should offer to pick up the car and may or may not have it examined at that same dealer. At minimum they should engage the regional rep.

They should also be smooching your glutes that they are not mitigating property damage, injury or worse. I would also request they supply you with a loaner that is NOT an RLX to underscore your distrust and safety concerns. I would now report this to NHTSA.

Keep your cool, don't get the brush off and please keep us posted.

neuronbob

I'd call both the dealer and Acura Corporate to let both know that the recall fix did not work.

Hope the dealer works with you quickly in getting this fixed.

stagefoursurvivor

OK, since you asked...this is precisely what I would do by phone and certified letter to the dealer and Acura Corporate.
Please supply me with a nearly comparable Acura, such as a MDX advanced or late model RL until which time you can have a new RLXh parked in my driveway as a replacement, at no additional charge.
Failure to comply with these terms in writing within XX days will result in very swift legal retention(and maybe a youtube demonstration).

ReLaX

I would call them the first thing tomorrow morning and email these pics. This needs to take priority over anything the dealer has going on. Do not settle for anything less than immediate attention in this matter. What is most troubling is that this was supposedly fixed in the last recall. Someone could have been killed! I just finished looking at my rear suspension found nothing but I'm calling tomorrow anyway. Loved this car when I bought it a few months ago and starting to wonder if I made a mistake.

rudedogatx

We loved the car, and I'm hoping it was just bad recall service work (not thats any better) and not a bigger problem affecting more cars. Of course how are they going to tell...the bolt is completely gone and I'm sure dealer is going to deny any wrongdoing.

Terragotti

Dam, luckily u was close to home. Good luck with that seriously

Edward'TLS

This is a serious safety issue, not unlike the GM ignition switch problem.

ReLaX

Rudedogatx, I think TampaRL's suggestion (post #90) would be most prudent. If this is a case of shoddy recall work Acura's corporate office needs to know about it.


Be safe and, as others have mentioned, please keep us posted.

rudedogatx

One last pic that shows it well:



Thanks for the advice. I'll give an update tomorrow.

stagefoursurvivor

In the world in which we now live, don't you honestly think Acura WILL blame the dealer. Throw the dealer "under the bus"!
How likely is ACURA to say, "Oh yeah, we're still working on that glitch"?
At this point, the Feds need to thoroughly investigate any "accidents" involving the RLX. Especially any single car accidents or those deemed inconclusive.
I know nothing of suspension dynamics but, might this be related to the RLXh delay?

Rocket_man

It looks to me like there is no back-out prevention on these fasteners. No inserts in the threads of the control arm, just pre-load on the fastener to keep it in place. Obviously this is not enough. There needs to be a secondary form of back-out prevention. A bolt with a Poly Patch or a locking insert would have prevented this. Or a castle nut and pin.

As I said way back in the thread, I'd mark these bolts with torque striping and check them on occasion. There is no torque striping on these. How do you know when they have loosened. You can't tell if the other one is fine or not. It may have lost its pre-load but just hasn't backed out yet. If they torque striped the bolt you would know.

I'm just waiting to hear Acura say 'it's normal for these bolts to fall out.'

2011TL

This post (#97) from the "Suspension Rattle Anyone? -RLX" thread might be relevant to your case:

Defect
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgalbr22 View Post
With still no root cause or permanent corrective action in sight, I filed for arbitration with the national center for dispute resolution under the ohio lemon law. Hearing will be within 2 weeks.
Ohio law requires arbitration prior to filing a lemon suit. At the arbitration hearing today, Acura announced that every 2014 RLX has a defect in the struts, springs, dampers (unclear exactly where, what the nature of the defect is and what the corrective action is-whether design, material assembly or what). This contradicts what some owners have been told.

rudedogatx

I decided to drive by the exact spot my wife said she felt the problem, and look what I found laying on the street:



Like I said, luckily this was a low speed/low traffic area that was one block away from the street we live on. Maybe they can get a better idea of what happened with the actual bolt in hand.

miner

The threads looked stipped which tends to point towards not torqueing down enough.

George Knighton

First thing I did was zoom in, and I agree.

I'm very sorry to see another documented incident of this, but very glad that it happened in an environment that nobody would be hurt.

I can't imagine how this went wrong. The instructions are quite clear.

rudedogatx

Well there she goes:



Update:

I called Acura Customer Care first thing this morning and explained the situation. At first they didn't seem to grasp the seriousness and simply referred me to roadside assistance and the dealer. They didn't offer to pick up the car or send a loaner and simply said they don't do that. I finally got them to dispatch roadside assistance while on the phone with me. Then they said this would be referred to district a case manager. When I asked to speak to them, they weren't available and I was told turnaround time was 1 business day, but since they marked the issue urgent it should be sooner.

Not wanting to hold my breath I immediately contacted the dealer. They seemed to realize how serious this was and immediately sent an MDX loaner (I said no RLX!) to my house. The service manager brought it himself. I asked what he thought could have caused it and he mentioned it is possible the technician mis-torqued the bolt(s), but they won't know until looking into it. So off the car goes. I got a much better response from the dealer though. Still haven't heard from this "district case manager" four hours later.

miner

For Acura not to take this more seriously does not sit well with me. I have onwned nothing but Hondas/Acuras since 1991. I am afraid my next purchase will be a competitor.

Mike_TX

Or torquing down TOO MUCH. You normally strip threads by overtightening. These threads may be damaged by wallowing around loose in the control arm end, but i don't think it's a matter of under-torquing.

.
.

TampaRLX-SH

rudedogtx, that is a good report. I can somewhat understand Customer Service not understanding the context of the situation. But it was important to make that contact SHOULD the issue be an engineering flaw vs a failed repair. On either account, this is a serious risk to your safety.

It is more relieving to hear that your dealer responded accordingly and went as far as potentially accept responsibility from the tech. That is reassuring that they will not try to dodge it. Mistakes happen. It is a world today where no one takes responsibility for mistakes, so I personally will pay attention to those who do.

If it turns out NOT to be an err of the tech, and it appears to be an engineering flaw, you should report this to NHTSA. You already did due diligence by reporting to Acura Corp so you could not be accused of blindsiding anyone or acting solely as a disgruntled customer.

I hope it works out and your faith in the car, dealer and the brand will be restored. I believe you are taking all the appropriate steps. I appreciate you sharing your experience and details with us.

wstr75

Acura should change the design to a longer bolt with a cross-drilled hole and castellated nut with a quality, corrosion-resistant cotter pin. Redundant fastener aspects to prevent this from happening again is a good thing and for maybe $10 additional vehicle cost.

Malibu Flyer

I hope it works out and your faith in the car, dealer and the brand will be restored. I believe you are taking all the appropriate steps. I appreciate you sharing your experience and details with us.[/QUOTE]

Given all of the apparent mismanagement which we have all seen in regard to the RLX and hybrid RLX this represents an excellent opportunity for Acura to restore our faith in the brand. To me this is the most important part of this issue. I know it is a serious problem but how they respond will tell me a great deal more about whether Acura has changed.

Acura ......show us you are still a quality company that respects its customers.

holografique

wow...seeing this really doesn't sit well with me. especially considering we have the exact same color (exterior/interior) and trim.

literally going to check mine before I drive home today from work.

holografique

btw...I noticed you have the rear-bumper applique on yours. that's the only thing I don't have on mine. (I've got the mud-guards as well).

when this fiasco is over for you, would love to see some pics of yours with the rear applique on it. was always curious how it would look on mine.

thanks and good luck. please keep us posted!

Rocket_man

It looks more like the bolt was run over a few times on the street. Great job finding it.

The threaded section looks like it is machined down a little to allow the shaft to have a tight fit in the bushing. You can't tell by looking at it if it was over or under torqued. For a fastener in such a critical application you need to have more than one way to keep the bolt from backing out. Acura is only using torque. Once it loosens (looses its pre-load) it is only a matter of time until it falls out. It could be that the tech did not apply the right amount of torque, in which case it may not happen again. Or the design is just not adequate for this application.

rudedogatx

Latest update is that the district case manager called late yesterday to tell me he is aware of the situation and will work with the service department of the dealer that the car is at now. Due to the holiday weekend, it will probably be early next week. In the mean time I am going to take the loaner 2014 MDX on the planned road trip to Dallas and count my blessings that this didn't happen while on I45 at 80mph between Houston and Dallas. I already miss the RLX, it was such a good road trip car.

JM2010 SH-AWD

Agree. I am surprised not to find a longer bolt with a locking nut (and perhaps a little loc-tite to boot).

neuronbob

My only comment is

Hope Acura gets right on this. The dealer's response seems exemplary so far. They don't need anything else to screw up the RLX's already pretty awful launch.

As always, TampaRL offers sound advice and I agree.

anoldpunk

Very unsettling. You better believe I just took a look under the rear suspension of my wife's RLX to ensure those bolts are still fully intact.

Rocket_man

The more you look at this joint the more you realize how hard it is for just torque to keep this bolt in place. The fork of the control arm fits over the metal insert of the bushing. So the clamping force of the bolt has to deal with this interface. But this interface moves as the suspension moves. It can open and close ever so slightly as the suspension moves. As the wheel goes up and down it looks like it could put a twisting force on the fastener. All it takes is enough movement to loosen the bolt and it is all downhill from there.

When you look at the bolt you can see the wear marks on the shaft. The marks look like rings that go around the bolt. It looks like it has been rotating for awhile.

It is a poor design. It could be easily fixed with a different bolt. I assumed this is what the bolt kit was, something with a poly-patch on it or some other locking feature.

Maybe your dealer didn't install the updated bolt kit? Does anyone have a picture of them?

Rocket_man

I looked back at Stroupck's post. He first reported a bolt backing out. It was this same lower link but his was the other end of the link. But these are the same bolts on both ends.

Part #28, 33
http://www.acurapartsnow.com/auto-pa...peed-automatic

Funny there are a lot of locking nuts on this assembly, but not on these bolts.

mgalbr22

Clearly, the suspension on this car has been poorly designed and inadequately tested prior to production launch. See suspension rattle thread regarding Acura statement that every 2014 RLX has the same defect in the strut assembly for which another recall will have to be issued once the root cause and corrective action(s) are determined, testing completed and revised struts produced.