http://www.pbase.com/image/1072591/original

 

that hurts to look at
that's prolly the most significant damage there is to your poor TL-S...

 

Woah, that's pushed in there.... I'd be a little cautious. There are ways for the bodyshop to determine if geometrically the remainder of the frame has sustained damage (if anything if off on alignment). It may just be that part, but because of where it is, that's part of the cage that protects the driver. If it were my car, I'd be worried about what would happen in that zone should you be in a frontal accident in the future, it may cause a larger amount of footwell intrusion because the steel will be weakened. I'd want Acura's opinion on the matter. Try calling Torrance, and see if you can send their safety division the picture for comments. Also, if you can remove more interior panels in the surrounding area that might help, but if it was my car I'd want Acura (and not the dealer) to make a comment on it before proceeding. I'd be alittle worried about what's behind that panel and what the remainder of the cage (with extra support) looks like behind the dash.

 

Thanks. I will forward the picture to Acura. I will make the body shop and the insurance company aware of it and will not approve repairs until I am satisfied with an answer.

 

Oh no, Jack! What happened to your car? wow: Yeah, get it checked out by a professional.

-josh:

 

Would you happen to know how I could contact Torrance by phone? The car is at the body shop now, Acura(dealer) recommended, and I can't get easy access to it as it's 30 min away. I will speak with the body shop to see when they can tear it down a little.

Since this is a safety issue, what are the repercussions pertaining to the car being totaled?

 

Acura Client Services
Acura Client Services stands ready to answer questions and address concerns with your U.S. Acura vehicle. You may contact us several ways:

By Phone
Monday through Friday, 6:00am to 5:00pm Pacific Standard time at the toll-free phone number (800) 382-2238

You can give this number I try. They might not be able to answer any technicals questions, but perhaps they could direct you to the appropriate number after that.

If your car is indeed totaled, boy that must have been a bad impact, then you should be able to get a new one from your insurance company since your car is practically new still. You will be paying high insurance rates for awhile though.

Hope it all works out.

 

I would try Acura Client Services, and if that doesn't work in getting someone you can email the photo to, try calling American Honda in Torrance (Acura). Their number is (310) 783-2000. If neither of those can produce the safety department that could comment, then lemmie know and I'll call my insider contact and see if they can supply me with a contact.

 

You guys are great. Looks like someone at Acura is concerned for me. I spoke with a rep and they said someone (I'll disclose his name by PM) is working on it and the rep also asked what body shop my car was at.

 

Jack, sounds like they are at least willing to work with you, please keep us posted as things progress.

I showed the pic to a bodyshop friend of mine and he did NOT think that would lead to structural weakening of the passenger compartment.

 

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Ok, now I didn't pay much attention to that one from the back that shows the damage by the rear door. I'd run that by Acura too..... I'd want to be on the 100% safe side, and only a response from American Honda would give me that kind of feeling.

 

Ok. Acura client-services:

They say they do not have a "safety division" and really couldn't comment on the damage unless there was something that malfunctioned or did not work properly during the collision. Then they would send someone out to inspect the car. But with regard to whether or not the car is safe to repair, they say they can't really comment on it since they don't have affiliations with any body shops.

Any other ideas? You think I would have any luck elsewhere. I called Torrance directly before client-services called me back and they just forwarded me to client-services when they heard my concern.

If you want to see more pics: http://www.pbase.com/blulegend/acura_tls/after

If you want to see my original post about my accident: http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=32083

 

Hey Jack, I'm no expert but it's amazing what and how thing can be fixed. The most important thing in my opinion is the shops reputation and skill.

When I crashed my '92 Z, I brought it home and spent a month searching and researching a shop. Found an amaing place only to get a "sorry, but were very busy". I found a friend of a friend of the place and got in. 3 days later, insurance totalled it.

If I took it to a any old Joe Bidyshop joint it might have been fixed. But I know the work would have been shoddy. The owner of the shop said it himself, "you are lucky you came to us...most other shops would of fixed it incorrectly/cuttin corners and you'd wind up with a sh!tty car that you would never be happy with".

Moral of the story, research and find a very reputable shop. There are more Cutting Corners Autowerks then there are good ones.

BTW, I LOL on the comic in your photo's. Sort of got the Keith Haring theme going.

 

I just asked the local dealer who they recommend most highly and took it there.

They are not really affiliated with any insurance company because they will not accept the liability for things that might cause safety problems and usually opt to replace than repair critical components.

But he said in my case it still probably won't get totaled. I'm assuming the car is worth about $27500 with 7500 miles on it, purchased 10/23/01. Correct me if I'm wrong, this is just a guess for now. I don't know what percentage of the value the repair estimate needs to be before they opt to total the car. I am persuing my claim though my own insurance yet the 3rd party's insurance will ultimately pay, so who decides the write-off?

Also, the guy at the shop (Stroyer Bros. Auto Body and Paint, Escondido, CA) said they wil likely need to replace the pillar in the front where the door pushed in the door frame (eg. cut the unibody, and weld on new pieces and paint/fill/whatever the structure before replacing other damage). Also, the same with the back, he said the whole rear wheel cage needs to be cut off and replaced (rear window, door, other stuff needs to come off). They will spot weld everything back (don't know how reliable that will be, but he said that is how the put the body together in the factory). Overall I feel okay about taking my car there, and he said I can come by any time and check out their operation and see pictures he takes while the repair process gets going.

Anyone have any ideas how I can push to have the car totaled? He estimated about $15k just looking at it, but he said he needs to get inside to see more damage. I have also written the 3rd party's insurance claims handler about getting a diminished value payment in the event my car is not totaled since I might just sell it. AAA (my insurance) has already stated they won't pay diminished value at a first party claimant. But I read that 3rd party claimants have been able to get these payments since they (me) are not bound by contract to the 3rd party's insurance company.

 

Good research Jack.... I'd followup with the 3rd party insurance and push hard. It's true that is how the body is assembled, some of it is spot welded, other welds are also used to ensure integrity in accidents. I'd be worried a little about the weld, but the shop should be certified, and as long as it's the same specs as Honda, and that they grind the old weld out completely I'd expect the same integrity. Again thought, you went from 8k to 15k, and they still haven't removed everything. I'm betting with replacing 2 pilars that you're pushing the envelop on totalling. If you want it totalled, tell the insurance company you won't accept it due to safety concerns with 2 pilars being replaced.

 

The place seems like they would do great work if they repaired it. I just don't like the idea of having pieces of the car cut off and replaced. Makes me cringe at the thought.

I think the cost of the 2 pillars is included in his eyeball estimate. I hope there is something serious that pushes the cost over the top. I just need to find out the borderline between total and no total. I am certainly concerned with safety and will write to the 3rd party once I get a better estimate going. My research has also told me to write directly to the 3rd party and have them make claim with their insurance regarding the matter since their insurance will need to back them up regarding deminished value, etc since THEY hit me, not their insurance.

About the value of my car pre-loss: I contacted my salesman to see if he can give me a ball-park figure on what it was worth. He wasn't in today and should be calling me in the morning.

About totaling: If the cash value of the car is lower, pre-loss, it's more likely it will be totalled (logical). But that means I need to scrape up the difference to get it replaced (they obviously don't just buy you a new car, do they?). Vice versa...

About legal assistance: When do you think it's time to really seek legal advice?

About repairing and selling: If I do recover the diminished value, and sell the car, would you recommend just trading it in at the dealer?

 

Inspecting car is part of my job so I'll let you know what I think. There does not seem to be any significant problems that I could see. The Body Shop should be able to print you up a measurement of before and after of the frame. If they are a reputable shop, they should have a frame machine measured by laser. A good frame machine is called Genesis. The only thing that concerns me is the left front tower damage. Be sure to also ask for an alignment readout after it has been fixed. Last but not least, check to see if your body shop will guarantee the work for the life of the car. Most shops do.

 

That is one of the most painful things i have had to look at in awhile. Hope everythin works out for you and they fix her back up to 100%. Keep us updated

 

Same here...the thing is I can't keep myself from looking at it thinking...WTF was wrong with that guy. He was diablo's minion or something.

 

"...the thing is I can't keep myself from looking at it thinking...WTF was wrong with that guy. He was diablo's minion or something."

:wow:

Very unfortunate.

Moral of the story: look both ways when YOUR light turns green. Odds are: there'll be some suicidal idiot trying to run a red light.

Nice photography, nevertheless.

 

Yes, we were both the first cars at the light before making the left. Not necessarily picking on you, but for some reason people keep telling me that, though my diagram shows that I was to the right of another car which blocked all vision to the left (plus it was at night). We also hesitated about a second before pulling into the intersection. Lastly, we were hit near the middle of a 5 lane intersection.

If there is a moral, I think it would be to let the guy next to you go through first.

 

[edited] accidentally double posted. and can't delete for some reason. [/edit]

 

im real sorry, Jack. look on the bright side. yea, im real sorry.

 

I'm hoping everything turns out for the best, but from what I see you're taking good steps, double-checking everything, and so I think you'll be ok in the long run. BTW, did you buy or lease your car, you may have more options available to you if you've leased it..... Worst case scenario is you might be able to take the cash you get from diminished value use that to trade the TL in for another 02 TL-S and walk out even or close to it.... It's possible with the 03's on the way, you might be able to strike a little bit better deal, especially if you go the Nav route because the 03's will have the Onstar advantage over the 02's.

 

Bought.

 

Well, so much for gap insurance... Well, I'd say keep doing what you're doing, talk to the 3rd party, and get those quotes. You're defidently on the right track that's for sure.

 

awwww.... I feel your pain... Such beatiful car...at such young age... hope it can be fixed....

 

Me and you buddy. I'll give ya a hug if I could

 

"If there is a moral, I think it would be to let the guy next to you go through first. "

Well, SH*T happens. Just glad no one was seriously injured.

I'll remember to drive my in-laws' car next time I'm in San Diego.

:p

 

The latest official estimate is $14,209.

They need to pull the A-pillar, the shock tower, and some other things on the frame machine.

The dealer told me they won't take a car that has been frame-damaged as a trade-in.

 

 

My thoughts exactly. Wish there was something I could do.

 

(I moved the text to the "raped car" thread, sorry)

 

sorry to hear this...um about the lost value on the car that had got in the accident, a friend of mine just about that today he said " once a car had got in accident, you will automatic lose from $ 5k - 10K, that just a lose value on ur car not including the depreciate value each year on ur car" so IMO i think ** ok don't quote me on this ok ** ur car won't worth more than $20K or maybe lower, like i said before that just my opinion, can somebody confirm this?? once again i'm sorry to hear about this and keep us post.