oo7spy

I have hope. Honda has admitted that they went down the wrong styling path recently. As I've mentioned here before, if you are going to do something great, you have to take a chance. Honda has done it numerous times in the past and can do it again. The people who designed and built the cars that captured our hearts haven't disappeared. The last chance Honda took with the styling failed, but you never shoot 100%. However, you always miss the shots you don't take.

TonyCD

When did they admit that? Last I saw, even the NSX show car still had a variation of the beak.

Rocket_man

It is almost certainly the TSX that is getting the axe. The last few months it has been the #2 seller behind the MDX and slightly edging out the TL. From this standpoint it hardly makes sense, but it is the fact that it is built in Japan and with the poor dollar it is no longer cost effective to import it. They want a car they can build in north America. I'm betting that when the new Accord platform is released as a 2014 model the TSX and TL will combine into a new car between the ILX and RL. Then both the ILX and new TL will be built in the US. I'm hoping this new car will have folding rear seats. I use this about once a month in my TSX. I had it in my 3 series, don't know why it can't be in the TL.

We'll see how this all pans out but it is looking less and less that my next car will be an Acura.

BTW Lexus will stop importing the HS250 to the US in Jan due to poor sales.

TonyCD

Alas, this sums up neatly how well the new strategy can be expected to work.

Someone mentioned recently that the Acura exec responsible for the beak has been promoted to authority over both Honda and Acura in the U.S. My one hope for Acura was that we'd somehow outlast whoever was to blame for this era, much as BMW eventually outlived Chris Bangle. Guess not.

VOdoc

Another fine example of the Dilbert Principle...certain companies tend to promote the least competent people to get them out of the way of productive work, limiting the amount of damage they can do. Unfortunately, at upper levels of management, you get the opposite!

I think at one point a couple of years ago on this forum there was mention of tar and feathers (or was it a rabble with pitchforks?) for those responsible for the proboscis. We Acura fans now seem to have given up.

neuronbob

Source for this? Sad to read if this is true.

DOWN WITH THE POWER PHLEGM GRILLE! Kill it with fire!

oo7spy

I posted this in the Acura/Honda Versus the World Debate thread:
And if you are talking about this bad boy,


I see nothing wrong with this design. A beak is not a disaster, a LARGE beak is a disaster.

dwboston

Colliver (gone) and Marek were the two responsible for the "corporate grille". Colliver was the exec and Marek the design guy. The beak better be gone from the 2013 RL or I will be.

thunteratl

I was at a dealer yesterday and the ILX bears a striking resemblance to the 1 Series BMW. It doesn't look anything like a Civic. Also, the new design of the TSX, is beautiful btw, although I think I am in a minority on that one, lol, it is similar in a lot of ways the 3 Series BMW. It is sort of a 328i look, but still very different.

I believe that the new lineup with the ILX being added will stay the same.

RL - flagship - think 760 Bimmer
TL - 5 Series
TSX - 3 Series
etc...

Of Course, I could be wrong, but it is extremely logical to me being a huge Honda/Acura fan that they are going after BMW in a big way. And the best thing is Honda Reliability vs BMW Reliability - no contest the Honda wins every time. BMWs break down so much, one needs to have a separate bank account funded by Warren Buffet to pay the repair costs. I just traded a 2006 Accord LX had 133000 miles on it. Ask me how many repairs I made other than normal maintenance like tires etc... 0 that's right none, zilch, nada! BTW, I bought a 2010 TSX.

thunteratl

And I will say another thing... that NSX Show car is so hot it makes an Acura R8 look like a piece of garbage.

oo7spy

Welcome to the forum, and interesting first two posts.

You are not alone on the TSX. It is the one model that a lot of people in AZine, or at least Car Talk, would consider buying. I think it looks great. Which really is a shame since it will get the ax. It is larger than a 3 series and is the size of older TLs. The ILX is the size of a 3 series as 1 series are coupes or 4 door hatchbacks. When the TL is redesigned, many expect it to get slightly smaller to replace the void the TSX will leave. I see your comparison to BMW and think it is valid as far as size goes which is a huge step for Acura.

I'm not sure how long you have been a fan of Acura, but if you stay tuned for a while, you will realize that you cannot guess what they will do next using logic. It will bite you every time.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

uh... welcome.

Post pics.

TampaRLX-SH

The UK has already been told the Euro Accord (our US & CA TSX) will be discontinued. That would leave North America as the sole market for the TSX, and as discussed, the TSX overlaps the TL (which overlaps the current RL), especially since the next TL is expected to be trimmed down.

Further, Japanese assembly is no longer cost effective with the strong Japanese yen. The RLX may initially be built in Japan (nothing official announced) but the NSX is already announced for US assembly. The RLX will likely be built in the US as well as it is intended to be a North American focused vehicle. The TL, MDX and RDX are already a North America build.

The TSX / Euro Accord cannot accomplish needed profit margins being assembled in Japan. Dropping the TSX will also discontinue the cross branding of Honda & Acura models and better seperate the brands, locally and globally (should Acura revisit expanding to new global markets).

Honda, Nissan and Toyota are moving the majority of their assembly offshore from Japan (to the US, UK, China and more). They are suffering from the competition syndrome they created for the Europeans that they started 30+ years ago. Except this time the Japanese are the target victims.....from the Koreans now, and soon the Chinese.

Rocket_man

I don't think either "TL" or "TSX" monikor will survive. The new "TLX" will be a sort of tweener car assimilating them both. A bit smaller than the TL, maybe slightly roomier and upscale than the TSX. Based on the new Accord. I just wonder what range of models they will offer. On the ILX they offer a wider range than Acura normally does. So perhaps the TLX will have a 4-cyl, Hybrid, and 6-cyl, all based on Earth Dreams engines and transmissions. In the case of the 4-cyl I'm afraid that may be a CVT. I'm looking forward to this car. May be my next car. IF they give me the fold down rear seats

gbriank

TSX is going, with an updated and smaller TL.

nj2pa2nc

neither-need to have choices like the other car brands offer

TampaRLX-SH

Despite the title of this thread, you will have 3 sedan choices.

Sedans: ILX, TLX (presumed) and RLX
Crossovers: RDX, MDX and ZDX (presumed until end of cycle)
Sports car: NSX

I am sure there are other models in speculation. Perhaps a hatch variant of the ILX to replace the loss of the TSX wagon? Perhaps a coupe variant of the presumed TLX as the ZDX is not anticipated to live past the current generation.

This realignment does homogenize the naming conventions (which I still do not like) and with the exception of the NSX, it removes cross branded models from Honda and Acura better differentiating the brands.

mcoard954

The ILX seems like it is too small to replace the TSX. I sat in one at the dealer on Friday (while I was getting my oil changed) and it was very uncomfortable. I drive a 4G TL, but even the current TSX is like a stretch limo compared to the ILX. I guess it will be okay for anyone with short legs...

TampaRLX-SH

The current TSX was a product of Acura's attempt to move more upscale and upsize. That is why the TSX now overlaps the TL.

But if you compare the metrics. the ILX is very close in size to the last generation TSX and the former Integra. I think size-wise it better realigns the ILX to the entry level of the Integra Sedan and last generation TSX. Whether or not it offers similar driving experience is a different story. But in the Goldilocks style of size / vs model position in a brand, I think I see where Acura was going with the ILX.

Interior Dimensions:
ILX 5-Spd AT
TSX 5-Spd AT
Integra GS Sedan

Front Headroom (in.)
38.00
37.80
38.90

Rear Headroom (in.)
35.90
37.30
36.00

Front Legroom (in.)
42.30
42.40
42.20

Rear Legroom (in.)
34.10
34.20
32.70

Front Shoulder Room (in.)
55.60
55.40
52.00

Rear Shoulder Room (in.)
53.50
53.50
50.30

Front Hip Room (in.)
50.20
50.40
50.70

Rear Hip Room (in.)
51.70
52.40
49.90

Exterior Dimensions & Weight
ILX 5-Spd AT
TSX 5-Spd AT
Integra GS Sedan

Curb Weight - Automatic (lb.)
2910
3345
2767

Wheelbase (in.)
105.10
105.10
103.10

Length (in.)
179.10
183.40
178.10

Width (in.)
70.60
69.40
67.30

Height (in.)
55.60
57.30
53.90

Track Front (in.)
59.40
59.60
58.10

Track Rear (in.)
60.30
59.60
57.80

Fabvsix

Ba Bye ZDX....

Rocket_man

I think the TSX had to move up in size because the JDM Accord got bigger whether Acura wanted it to or not, they were along for the ride. So did the US Accord pushing the TL slightly larger. But this new strategy allows Acura to re-align all their sedans back in 'order' with the entry ILX, mid level TLX, and flagship RLX. The RLX will be priced too high to be a big seller. The TLX will probably sell pretty well unless the screw it up. The ILX seems a little over priced but the jury is still out.

When I sat in the ILX it felt smaller than my 1G TSX. The numbers look very similar, but it sure felt smaller to me.