Belzebutt

Can someone check on their SS if they also have the following problem:

When I'm coming to a stop sign, or going to do a right turn, if I forget to downshift ahead of time, I notice that I can't downshift at the last moment while I'm breaking. I basically have to either make sure I come to almost a full stop and let the SS go to 1 for me, or I have to stop breaking for a bit, do the downshifts, then stop.

The real problem is that I'm driving in 4th, I slow down to make the right turn and downshift a couple of times at the last minute to go into 2nd, but when I accelerate to come out of the turn I realize I'm actually still in 3rd of 4th! Really annoying, especially if there's a car coming and you need that kick.

Here's how to get this, on my car anyway (a 2004):
- Drive at around 60 km/h in 4th gear towards a light or a stop sign
- Start breaking, not downshifting
- Stay in 4th while braking, and wait until you're going slower than you would normally drive in 4th
- When you're about 20m from the stop sign, do a couple of downshifts and see if your gears are going down (not sure about the exact distance, but basically downshift "at the last minute").

While this is happning, I can basically keep downshifting all I want and nothing happens. If you're doing this on a road and not at a stop sign, you can see that downshift doesn't work while you're breaking, but magically starts working again after you let go of the brake.

This always gets me in the morning, I put it in SS mode and upshift, but I sometimes forget to downshift early enough before a turn or a rolling stop...

slobeatz

I have found the same problem with downshifting. If I am coming to a quick stop and try to downshift, sometimes it doesn't go. Usually, I let off the brakes for a second and it will shift down.

afici0nad0

so you can't brake and downshift at the same time? is this only during hard braking?

Ellas9

I've never tried the process you've described, but if I ever 'hard brake' I can always downshift easily. You maybe confusing the computer.....sometimes it may want to downshift but you've instructed something while it automatically thought that and it decides to do neither. I don't know....in fact, the other day, my car while in SS had downshifted to 2nd (fairly rare for automatic) just before I was instructing it too. I can't complain....although I don't think its a good idea to leave little time between shifts (ie two quick downshifts) it may cause more harm then good.

Belzebutt

It's not as clear cut as that, most of the time it works.

As far as I can tell, downshifting doesn't work if you're breaking AND your RPM is very low with respect to the gear you're downshifting from. So for example, if you're in 4th, slow down gradually to 20-30 km/h (without going so slow that it will automatically downshift) and then brake while trying to downshift to 2nd.

I think what Ellas9 is saying might be true, the computer might be "thinking about downshifting" because it notices the rpm is getting too low for the current gear, and when you tell it to downshift nothing happens because it's confused or something. I'll have to email Acura about that one...

And yes, usually I notice it when breaking fairly quickly, not during only slight braking.

Still Water

And I might add the computer could also be anticipating a "soon to follow" get on the gas request to accelerate after hard braking. This coupled with its over-riding job of protecting the tranny & engine presents it with a Hobson's choice as what is best to do. Just my guess.

Reach

I think its far more simple, the SS mode only allows 1 downshift per second or two seconds rougly, and if you do 2 or more in rapid succession the latter ones tend not to catch. This is what I've noticed on mine, regardles of speed, braking, or other factors.

Remember, its not really a manual.

Belzebutt

But I don't have any problems doing two quick downshifts when I'm driving at a constant speed! In this case, there is no downshift whatsoever happening within a span of 5 seconds or so, even after the first time you pull the shifter.

derbaff

It's possible the computer is just having to throw away your downshift request because it's fairly unimportant compared to the other tasks it's handling in that scenario. The computer has to operate in real time, unlike your standard computer you are reading this on. It can probably only handle so many tasks at a time, so if it gets too many, it has to prioritize them and ignore the ones which it sees as less important. If it didn't do this, and instead queued your request to downshift (like your home computer will do sometimes when you are typing something and the letters don't appear ontthe screen until a few seconds later), the car would downshift much later than expected, which could be worse than not downshifting at all.

Just a thought, I'm not expert on Honda ECU design.

jlukja

I just tried this while running errands at lunch. Result (as quite freqently happens with the dealer) = Could Not Duplicate

jimbo3123

I think you're right.
I would guess that it's done to give the synchros time to spin up the lower gears.

sm2004

Maybe I'm nuts... why would you do this anyways?

shitbox

my 04 got the same issue here but i lived with it

ILoveMyHonda

I usually anticipate downshifting and go down from forth to third, then start braking then right before the turn shift to second. Then power out the apex.

But as far as you have described.....
"Customer states that ...."
"After several test drives, could not duplicate complaint"

drkabe

what I remember from my 04 5AT. If in 5th gear and slowed down to 20 miles or less without shifting, then the car would select 3 rd gear but if you time it right when that happens and u downshift..i think it ignored your downshifts.

godfather2

my 05 auto doesn't have the same issue

Belzebutt

By the way, when I said you should try downshifting 20-30 m before the stop sign, it's too much. You should actually come to the stop sign in 4th gear, while braking harder than usual, and then try to downshift at the last minute just a few meters before the stop sign/light/corner.

Everything works great when I anticipate the turn and downshift when I'm supposed to, it's only when I forget to downshift before the turn and then try to downshift at the last moment that this happens.

RaCeR4LiFe022

put it in D lol happens to me all the time

RaCeR4LiFe022

i agree ^

Billy M

through my experience with this, i have figured out why it does this, i think...

for the record, i don't like it either, but i think there is a logical reason why it is there, and it is not an accident...my hypothesis here is all with sport shift mode

from what i can tell, this is not scientific research, just my good memory for pointless things, when you are in 5th, it will automatically shift down to 4th at ~32mph, and to 3rd at ~20mph, and 1st at ~8mph. It will never automatically downshift to 2nd. If the computer senses you will be going below the above written speeds, you will need to flick the shifer that many times in order for it to sense it and actually downshift for you. For example, you are going 50mph in 5th and slow to 25mph, the car will automatically click down to 4th for you without you using the SS at all, in order for you to get to 3rd you need to pull the shifter down twice (presumably because the computer assumes your dumb and don't realize it put it into 4th automatically) it doesn't want to shock you when its suddenly in 3rd and you were expecting 4th. Take the same circumstance: 50mph in 5th, and you slow to 15mph, you are now in 3rd automatically without you doing anything, when you want to now go into 2nd, the computer thinks that you think you are still in 5th, so to get to 2nd you need to hit the shifter down three times. Basically it doesn't bother with what gear it IS in, but rather with the LAST gear YOU put it in, since it doesnt put it in any gear upshifting, we only experience this while downshifting

cibs

^^... i donno if i'd buy that as an explanation...


have you tried it yourself???

Billy M

well, yes, i said (or at least implied) it was from my personal experience... and i have found that to be true 100% of the time.

jaobrien6

I actually don't downshift all the way when approaching stop signs because of a different annoyance with the car in SS mode.

I found that I would repeatedly wait until what i felt was the last minute (not intentionally, just 'cause it felt like the right time to shift) to do the 3->2 shift, and *just* before I shifted, the car shifted to 2nd on it's own, and my shift would end up being a 2->1 shift, and the car would lurch. So my choices were downshift earlier, or don't downshift at all... if I *know* I'm going to stop, like a stop sign, i just let it downshift to 1 on it's own now. At red lights, i'll often downshift earlier so that i can get back on the gas if it goes green.

cibs

k, i was just wondering...


cuz even now the post right underneath you contradicts it...


maybe someone needs to just go out for a few hours and test out all the various hypothesis...

Billy M

I noticed that...

but I can say with 100% absolute certainty that MY car, a 2006, will never downshift into 2nd on it's own. Whether the software is different with different model years, I do not know, but I am 100% certain of at least my own car and the way it behaves.

Tsx536

Yeah, I've noticed this too. You have to come to a complete stop in order for it downshift to 1st. I've gotten use to it, but it's kinda annoying and can be dangerous. Good description of the problem though.

...And oh yeah, page 2 just got

Belzebutt

Is your car the only TSX that does a 3->2 shift??

PhiSigBrotha

my 06 will downshift into first just before coming to a stop. if cruising at a very low speed in SS mode and in 2nd gear it wont downshift to 1st unless i have the brakes applied.

luther