Has anyone installed a new VTC Mechanism
03-13-2008, 02:18 AM
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It's useless to JUST swap the VTC Mechanism; it would not take any advantage due to a bigger degrees because the TSX will NOT allow to go pass 25 degrees. This has nothing to do w/ mechanical items; it's more like the engine management. Only K-Pro will solve that.
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03-13-2008, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by TSX 3Pedal
Please excuse my noobness, but what's a VTC Mechanism?
Is VTC controlled by the ECU or is it purely hydraulic? Or both?
03-13-2008, 04:08 PM
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I thought it was electronic? I could very well be wrong. It's most certainly controlled by the ECU though. Is there anything at all in the drive train that isn't anymore? Hell, you can't even control the throttle without the the ECU filtering the input first.
Not that any of this is a bad thing.
Not that any of this is a bad thing.
03-13-2008, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by feuss2
Can you ask this person for pics?
besides as others have mentioned it does no good at the moment
03-13-2008, 07:43 PM
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It's very involved, if you know your way around the head, install and removing internals, cams in particular, timing chain, lining things up, etc.. go for it. If not then leave it to an expert.
03-19-2008, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by feuss2
This has been done without removing the intake cam...
I guess the question is, how does the ECU do its ignition timing calulations?
I guess the question is, how does the ECU do its ignition timing calulations?
03-19-2008, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by feuss2
This has been done without removing the intake cam...
I guess the question is, how does the ECU do its ignition timing calulations?
I guess the question is, how does the ECU do its ignition timing calulations?
With that being said, resort to your source that has done so w/o removing that cam.
The ECU would respond the same you're just adding a modified VTC. The ECU has not been programmed to utilize advancement or even control the VTC anymore or differently then you began with prior to the intsall
03-19-2008, 11:31 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by TSX2345
With that being said, resort to your source that has done so w/o removing that cam.
The ECU would respond the same you're just adding a modified VTC. The ECU has not been programmed to utilize advancement or even control the VTC anymore or differently then you began with prior to the intsall
The ECU would respond the same you're just adding a modified VTC. The ECU has not been programmed to utilize advancement or even control the VTC anymore or differently then you began with prior to the intsall
03-20-2008, 11:02 AM
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^^^^What would be the difference between the 2 then? I believe they are the same, just being referred to by different names. VTC mechanism? VTC gear?
03-20-2008, 11:41 AM
#19
Special-K
Originally Posted by TSX2345
^^^^What would be the difference between the 2 then? I believe they are the same, just being referred to by different names. VTC mechanism? VTC gear?
Unscrew (with a special tool) those 4 screws/bolts/hex or whatever they are, and inside you'll find the VTC mechanism.
03-20-2008, 02:08 PM
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Yes, I have changed the weight on the end of the Intake cam to get 45 deg. My TSX will now climb thru the revs faster. I had material removed from one of the keys on the weight. It's very soft metal. The whole thing is shown on some web page. Hondata? They have a write-up on it, so I gave it a try.
03-20-2008, 05:56 PM
#22
Originally Posted by Abouttime
Yes, I have changed the weight on the end of the Intake cam to get 45 deg. My TSX will now climb thru the revs faster. I had material removed from one of the keys on the weight. It's very soft metal. The whole thing is shown on some web page. Hondata? They have a write-up on it, so I gave it a try.
Does anyone know how the ECU calculates ignition timing? Is it relative to top dead center on the crank position sensor, or the cam position sensors on either the intake or exhaust cam? Maybe a combination of 2 or all 3?
03-20-2008, 06:53 PM
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Sorry, No pics... but here is the link, with all the info you need. http://www.hondata.com/tuning_k24a2_tsx_engine.html
I bought a VTC mech. for $150.00. Remove the 4 screws and cover plate. It will look just like the Hondata picture. There are 8 little pins in the tiny square holes. They fall right out, just remember which end is up. They look like bobby pins. The center weight can be removed and is about 1" thick. Find a machinist to trim off the 2 ends, just like the picture.
Put it back together, just don't torque the screws until it is mounted back on the end of the cam and everything is aligned. I had a shop remove the VTC and replace it with my new one. Good Luck
I bought a VTC mech. for $150.00. Remove the 4 screws and cover plate. It will look just like the Hondata picture. There are 8 little pins in the tiny square holes. They fall right out, just remember which end is up. They look like bobby pins. The center weight can be removed and is about 1" thick. Find a machinist to trim off the 2 ends, just like the picture.
Put it back together, just don't torque the screws until it is mounted back on the end of the cam and everything is aligned. I had a shop remove the VTC and replace it with my new one. Good Luck
03-21-2008, 02:19 AM
#24
Special-K
Originally Posted by Abouttime
Sorry, No pics... but here is the link, with all the info you need. http://www.hondata.com/tuning_k24a2_tsx_engine.html
I bought a VTC mech. for $150.00. Remove the 4 screws and cover plate. It will look just like the Hondata picture. There are 8 little pins in the tiny square holes. They fall right out, just remember which end is up. They look like bobby pins. The center weight can be removed and is about 1" thick. Find a machinist to trim off the 2 ends, just like the picture.
Put it back together, just don't torque the screws until it is mounted back on the end of the cam and everything is aligned. I had a shop remove the VTC and replace it with my new one. Good Luck
I bought a VTC mech. for $150.00. Remove the 4 screws and cover plate. It will look just like the Hondata picture. There are 8 little pins in the tiny square holes. They fall right out, just remember which end is up. They look like bobby pins. The center weight can be removed and is about 1" thick. Find a machinist to trim off the 2 ends, just like the picture.
Put it back together, just don't torque the screws until it is mounted back on the end of the cam and everything is aligned. I had a shop remove the VTC and replace it with my new one. Good Luck
03-21-2008, 07:44 AM
#25
Does anyone know how the ECU calculates ignition timing? Is it:
Relative to top dead center on the crank position sensor
Timed off the cam position sensor on the intake cam
Timed off the cam position sensor on the exhaust cam
Based off a map of RPM vs ignition advance stored in the ECU
...or is it some combination of the above (and if so, what)?
Relative to top dead center on the crank position sensor
Timed off the cam position sensor on the intake cam
Timed off the cam position sensor on the exhaust cam
Based off a map of RPM vs ignition advance stored in the ECU
...or is it some combination of the above (and if so, what)?
03-21-2008, 09:03 AM
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IIRC there is no crank position sensor. There is at least one cam position sensor. I would guess probably two since you need a base point to know how far advanced the intake cam is.
I would suspect the same map that drives the cam advance drives the ignition. There are going to be other sensors involved, most likely MAP and O2 and what ever else is used to figure out engine load. The base timing is probably mapped against the exhaust cam position.
This is all wild speculation but it makes sense.
I would suspect the same map that drives the cam advance drives the ignition. There are going to be other sensors involved, most likely MAP and O2 and what ever else is used to figure out engine load. The base timing is probably mapped against the exhaust cam position.
This is all wild speculation but it makes sense.
03-21-2008, 10:38 AM
#27
Originally Posted by LukeaTron
IIRC there is no crank position sensor. There is at least one cam position sensor. I would guess probably two since you need a base point to know how far advanced the intake cam is.
I would suspect the same map that drives the cam advance drives the ignition. There are going to be other sensors involved, most likely MAP and O2 and what ever else is used to figure out engine load. The base timing is probably mapped against the exhaust cam position.
This is all wild speculation but it makes sense.
I would suspect the same map that drives the cam advance drives the ignition. There are going to be other sensors involved, most likely MAP and O2 and what ever else is used to figure out engine load. The base timing is probably mapped against the exhaust cam position.
This is all wild speculation but it makes sense.
CAMSHAFT POSITION SENSOR B (PIN 6 ON CONNECTOR A)
CRANKSHAFT POSITION SENSOR (PIN 7 ON CONNECTOR A)
CAMSHAFT POSITION SENSOR A (PIN 19 ON CONNECTOR A)
03-21-2008, 11:01 AM
#28
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Does anything connect to the crank position sensor pin? I could be totally wrong but I thought I read a while back that there's no crank position sensor.
It does sound like there's a cam position sensor for each cam shaft though. If you know where the exhaust cam is, you know where the crank is. The only reason you'd need both would be to detect timing chain jumps. It doesn't mean they didn't put one in there though.
It does sound like there's a cam position sensor for each cam shaft though. If you know where the exhaust cam is, you know where the crank is. The only reason you'd need both would be to detect timing chain jumps. It doesn't mean they didn't put one in there though.
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