mantis23

I'm a Dallas fan, and I'll be happy if we win 2 against the Suns.

G

So, who saw the Spurs game last night?? I don't think that I have ever seen such bad officiating this season. The best comment of the after-game show was:
"You know why NBA players whine? 'Cause it works! All you needed to do was get within three feet of Allen and you got a foul!"


Allen is an a$$hole. Last night, he and Manu were running down the court-Allen sliped and fell, and Manu got the foul. As Allen was getting up, he was f@cking smirking from ear to ear. That dude needs to be taken out.

Not one of the fouls called against people who were guarding Allen was an actual foul. The guy who sits next to me turned to me and said:
"It is a good thing that the Spurs are winning 'cause if they weren't, there would be a riot in here." So true.

Sorry, just venting. But it will all work out in the end, Spurs are going to sweep Sonics

badboy

Looking forward to:
Heat & Pistons
Suns & Spurs

Not much interested in the current series.

Doom878

I think it's gonna be Spurs and Pistons. As a Heat fan I'm disappointed because with Shaq hurt we won't be able to stop Detroit.

Shaggz2Dope

yeah allen is a pussy.... one of the first games between the spurs and sonics, bowen was guarding allen and allen was not able to perform the way he wanted to. He was talkin crap how "bowen needs to give me some space." Sorry its called defense.
He whined because he thought it would give more leverage to him against bowen. Im glad it didnt turn into a freethrow shoot out like in Denver.
Spurs will take the championship for sure....i mean...

G

Allen just can't score like he usually does when Bowen guards him. He just doesn't have the cojones to admit that Bowen is a better player than him.

cmark

Yeah, the whining about Bowen's defense is pretty lame. By no means is Bowen a better player than Allen, however - to say that is delusional. Bowen just happens to be a very good defender.

Ray just needs to play his game and let the refs do whatever they do.

Either way, my Sonics are in a world of hurt. But I'm ok with it because they had an amazing season that no one could've predicted.

In fact, I'll be rooting for the Spurs once they finish us off because I would like Brent Barry to get a ring since he gave some good years to the Sonics prior to this season.

ccannizz11

Tripp11

The Pistons got a little lazy in the second half and just dropped all defensive intensity they played with for the first 5 quarters of this series, but I think it's sort of amusing how everyone, and I mean everyone, is going ahead and talking about the Pistons vs. Heat in the Eastern Conference.

Oh well, the Pacers have been underdogs since the brawl and that's just the way I prefer it.

badboy

They would have had a better chance if ron was playing.

I think the pistons just got lazy. They thought indiana could never come back being down 15 points.

Its the playoffs, anything could happen, so they have to play with intensity until the game is over. There is no excuse to let a 15 point lead slide.

Tripp11

When Ron was playing and everyone was healthy, they went into the Palace and pounded the Pistons by 15 points. After that, I think the Pistons game down to Conseco and beat us twice and we went back up there and beat them once.

I think the series is going to be better than anyone initally thought - of course, after the brawl, everyone wrote off our season and said we wouldn't even be a .500 ballclub and we wouldn't have a chance in hell to make the playoffs. So much for those theories.

I agree w/ the fact that the Pistons played lazy in the second half, but you have to give our bench credit - they stepped up and just simply beat the Pistons in the second half.

badboy

inidan is a good team...but detroit is the better team....I give indiana credit for getting the W yesterday, but I also think they will have a hard time winning another.

Tripp11

I would say at this time, yes, Detroit is the better team. However, without the suspensions and injuries, I would say Indiana was the team to beat in the East along with the Heat.

I don't think any other team has dealt with as much adversity as the Pacers this year, and we've still made it to the second round.

Time will tell I guess, but I would be willing to mail you $100 if the Pacers don't win another game - that is of course if you're willing to drop the same if the Pacers do win another.

badboy

notice I said they will have a hard time...didn't say they won't win...

if you really wanna bet, we can bet on each game, I'll take detroit offcourse for every game we bet on.

G

So, why is it then that Spurs are the only team that Allen cannot seem to get his typical 20-30 pts per game?

Allen is just an a$$hole. Sorry, I am a little tainted on this one.

By the way, I do give props to the Sonics for pulling this season off though.

G

Brent Barry is an interesting player. It seems like he one game he shines, then the next, he is as dull as a lightless night. I just don't think that he is really gelling with the Spurs.

ccannizz11

Didn't he get 25 the other night?? anway, how does that make bowen a better player just because he can check allen for few minutes?

badboy

on defense Bowen > Allen
on offense Allen > Bowen

overall player Allen > Bowen

Lets end this now.

cmark

11/7/2004
Allen: 39min 24pts

12/8/2004
Allen: 43min 29pts

1/31/05
Allen: did not play

3/30/2005
Allen: 38min 14pts (playing on sprained ankle)

5/8/2005
Allen: 13min 8pts (left game with sprained ankle)

5/10/2005
Allen: 42min 25pts

Looks like he's scoring fine to me (when he's healthy).

cmark

Exactly. And it's not like Bowen does it alone. How nice is it to be able to ride Allen and direct him right into a shot blocker like Duncan??

Tripp11

Yeah, I noticed what you said - "They (Pacers) will have a hard time winning another." From your statement, it sounded like you think this series will be over in three more games. Well, I just asked if you would like to back up that statement? It's ok, you did a good job of backpedalling out of it.

I'm a Pacer fan, but I'm not foolish enough to think an injury riddled and short handed team like the Pacers will beat the Pistons in a seven game series. If it happens, great! However, the cards are stacked against it happening.

iamhomin

Even with Shaq, the detroit would take it in 7.

CLforDreser

Go WIZ! Hopefully We can make the series go to game 5 tonight........ I will be satisfied with just winning one game, two games would be freaking a gift from the man upstairs....

Doom878

With home court and a 100% healthy Shaq I don't know about that but we'll neve know since Shaq's hurt.

badboy

I'll put down 100 bucks for the next detroit vs indiana game, let me know if you are in.

G

Offense wins games and defense wins championships. Ended.

G

Cause Bowen is a generally good dude. Allen is a straight up a$$hole.

Anyways, we can debate this issue all we want, it really comes down to who you favor. They are both good at playing-with different strengths.

badboy

keep in mind we are comparing two players, not teams.
What you said is true for teams, unfortunately not every championship team has all great defensive players.

G

True, very true.

Anyways, I will admit that I just flat out don't like Allen. So I guarnetee that that taints my view towards him and his skills.

ccannizz11

Hmmm, that's why allen was mentioned numerous times for consideration for mvp in that thread I wonder where bowen was..... guess it really doesn't come down to who you favor personally. I like both of them, but to say that bowen is a better player is just

And I'm going to take a WILD guess and say you don't know allen, so calling him an asshole requires a number of assumptions on you part. But obviously you already don't like him, so I'm sure it's not hard for someone to show you something that "validates" those assumptions.

G

I have season tickets to the Spurs game, and have seen Allen play. So, no, I don't know him personally. However, I have seen him play and do not like the person that is on the court. You understand?

Do you know Allen?

G

Allen personally blamed Bowen for his "sprained" ankle, and shoots his mouth off about how bad Bowen pushes him around (ahh, it's called defense). Plus, his little smirks for whenever a Spurs player got a foul whenever they got within three feet of him. But, they didn't show that on TV, so, you wouldn't have seen that.

Tripp11

Nah, I'm just wanting you to back up your original statement - that's it. Like I've said before, I'm not foolish enough to think the Pacers will pull out the series nor foolish enough to bet you on any given game, but I would bet you that Indiana will win at least one more game.

ccannizz11

I understand why you don't like him, not why bowen is a better player.

And no I don't know allen, but I'm not the one who said he was an asshole, nor did I say he wasn't.

badboy

the bet you are proposing is not a fair bet...you have to give me odds inorder for me to consider it....

G

In my mind, Bowen is a better player because he does not have the attitude that Allen has. Is Allen a better ball handler, maybe so. But in my mind, I like ball-players who play the game, and don't do the kind of stuff that Allen does.

Oh, and this is why I think that Allen is an asshole:

ccannizz11

Ya, no way allen could say that stuff just because bowen frustrates him. He has to be a total asshole to say it.

Look, bowen is handsy away from the ball. And that annoys and frustrates players. There is nothing really illegal about what he does, and he's a great defender. But he does more than just play straight up squeaky clean defense to get inside a players head. Venting that frustration by calling him out doesn't make someone an asshole. Allen may get inside bowen's head that way But in reality, what allen does to bowen doesn't make him any more of an asshole than the stuff that bowen does to allen that makes bowen some kind of asshole.

As for the ankle, I didn't see the play. so I can't comment.

To be honest, I've met allen. I don't know him, but he does not have an attitude problem from what i do know.

cmark

Now if you just said that Allen was an asshole because he said what he said, then all would be fine - that is your opinion.

What you're trying to do is convince people that Allen is a worse basketball player than Bowen because he talks too much. Maybe Bowen is a better person by not having that kind of poor attitude but it surely doesn't make him a better player.

I don't know if you play basketball yourself but if you did, I'm sure you'd understand how irritating it is when you are hacked, undercut, pulled, tripped and shoved.

btw, Allen was given the Joe Dumars Sportsmanship Award for the 2002-03 season

sidemarker

I think of late Ray Allen has said some stupid stuff. "Team USA should get paid..." "Bowen gets away with a lot of fouls..."

He is a good player but these examples have shown that he has no class whatsoever...

sidemarker

ccannizz11

He didn't say they SHOULD get paid....

and bowen does get away with a lot of fouls, not any that should be called all the time, he just does them more often than most players.