NetEditor

That's Torre. Torre is about trust, and he didn't trust Mussina. Perhaps that's the best reason why he should go. He can't judge his players objectively anymore.

NetEditor

How's resting Zambrano for Game 4 workin' for ya?

Yumcha

I almost feel sorry for A-Rod. Almost.

NetEditor

You CANNOT feel sorry for someone being paid $25 million a year.

Eoanou

That's why Torre is losing his job, poor managing skills.

JediMindTricks

GIBSON6594

I don't know why the text is red.

Torre is a terrible manager, especially when it comes to his pitchers.

Pull_T

.267, a homer, 2 walks...that's fine for 4 games.

GIBSON6594

I feel worse for Jeter, that double play he hit into was brutal

Pull_T

I wonder if the media will label him a choker for hitting under .200 in the series like they did for A-Rod.

IlliNorge

Jeter is the Captain (who doesn't need the C on his uniform). He had a horrible series, but is untouchable. The Yankees lost when their starters at home went a combined 3 1/3 IP.

I hope they re-sign Mussina, bring back Randy Johnson, pull Clemens out of retirement in July and make another run at an ALDS title next year.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

I'm not a fan of Arod, but he really can't be blamed for this. What about Jeter's 4 double plays, & NY's lack of offense?

This series was lost on bad NY pitching. The pitchers should be blamed. Not Arod or Torre.

And I have no idea why anyone is questioning Torre's manger skills.

Lets see someone else manage players that have been in MLB for 10+ years & command zillions in salary, & have egos the size of small moons. Getting all them to play together. Then simply being in NY with all the media hype.
And then leading the Yankees to the world series & winning so many, & 13 straight postseasons.

Yeah he's a bad manger alright

Eoanou

Bringing back 40yr old pitchers won't win an ALDS, Randy Johnson had season ending surgery the man is done, he might give it a go next year but he will get injured. Clemens wasn't that impressive this year, and was injury prone as well. And Mussina, he has no more gas left in his tank.

The Yankees to rebuild their pitching and get some young aces. If they get Tom Glavine I will laugh my ass off.

Eoanou

I'm not sure if Mussina would have done a good job pitching anyway. :2 cents:

NetEditor

Probably not. They were just outplayed, plain and simple. I don't think it's a coincidence that the Yankees keep getting beat by younger teams. This is why I didn't think the Yankees would go far in the playoffs. Every October for the past three years, they seem lifeless and tired. The old guys look spent when the playoffs roll around. Luckily, they have some good young arms (Hughes, Kennedy, Joba) for next year.

GIBSON6594

I don't think he deserves to get booted. I think what you just said is why they need him, he fits that team like no one else could. But I do think he makes terrible managerial decisions...i.e. pitching decisions.

Scottman111

I honestly don't know why someone would want to work for a person like Steinbrenner and manage a group of guys with huge egos like that.


Seems like the worst managerial job in baseball if you ask me.

IlliNorge

You ever see his facial expression in the dugout? He looks like a man who has experienced a lifetime of torture crammed into one season. Shellshocked would be the word.

NetEditor

He's the highest-paid manager, went from a sub-.500 to Hall of Fame manager and won four World Series rings. I think Torre made out pretty well.

Scottman111

I just couldn't imagine working for a boss that doesn't want you even after everything you've done for him, for a bunch of fans and media that aren't happy unless you win the World Series every year and jump on you at every chance they get.

And on top of that, throw in a bunch of whiny bitching players that you have to babysit everyday.


I still don't see what it's worth if you win the WS a bunch of times, go to the playoffs all the time and make the HoF if none of your "fans" appreciate it.

NetEditor

For the most part, sports writers and fans want Torre to stay.

Yumcha

I love your sarcasm Chipndale.

Rodney

3 inexcusable errors....

1)Torre should have demanded the game be called in the 8th when the field was inundated with bugs. It would not have been unprecedented because a game was called in the 50's due to bugs. The theory that it was fair because both sides had to deal with it is nonsense. I felt like I was infested sitting on my couch looking at all those bugs on Jobas neck. Nasty shit!!

2)Starting Wang in game 4. Why let a guy who had a tremendous year with 19wins go out like that. He was shot with 3 days rest. Mussina would have been the way to go. He has proven himself to be a better postseason pither IMO.

3)Using Clemens and Giambi. They should have been waterboys and that it!!! Completely fucking worthless. I seriously cant remember Giambi hitting the ball, except a homer like last month. And clemens WTF. Just a nightmare. 45, overpaid, ailments all over, what a clusterfuck.

I mines well keep going. Damn I hate Jeter, and not just because he was lousy in the post season. He just is one pansy ass bitch. He looks like a fairy at the plate. So dramatic. Has no fluid motion, no smooth professional swing, just juts his ass out after every pitch trying to fool the ump!?!?!?! Totally Erattic. Only reason people like him he because he's done some superman leaps into the stands. If I were the coach and he tried to look like a hero jumping into the stands and seriously risking a season ending injury, I'd smack him right in the mouth. Damn, I just contradicted myself. I hope he keeps diving into the stands and kills himself.

Pull_T

I enjoy seeing a Yankees fan that isn't a Jeter fan.

He is the most overrated player in the past decade.

Eoanou

He is a pretty good SS if you ask me, great defense, and one of the best SS bats there are. Of course compared to other MLB players he's is probably not on the top tier, I think Miguel Tejada has him beat.

Eoanou

Go say that on Mike and the Madd dog show, those biased fucks need to get some sense knocked into them. I honestly think they are probably the worst two sports talk show hosts ever, they are like Jim Rome.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Rodney

You sound a bit upset there. You certainly don't sound like a Yankee fan.
You most certainly DO NOT speak for the NY fan base.

I man damn, Jeter should kill himself? WTF!

Scottman111

Do you agree that the media and fans are extra critical of him, more so than other cities are to their managers?


A manager that has won 4 WS in any other city would be a God...

NetEditor

Yes, they are. But that's N.Y. in general. It goes for all the pro teams there.

And as far as Jeter being overrated, c'mon. He has a .317 career batting average and has more hits in fewer at bats than Pete Rose at the same time in their careers.

Ask any GM if they would like to have Jeter on their team. What do you think the answer would be?

I do think he did not handle the A-Rod situation correctly. Being the captain, he should have reached out to him and worked things out.

GIBSON6594

Since 1996, he leads the major in hits, total bases and runs scored, 3rd in doubles, 9th in walks, 10th in RBIs.

Granted he also leads the majors in games played during those years.

And by the way, I hate him too, but it's hard to over-rate someone with those stats.

Eoanou

and considering he plays for a position that is consider a weak bat, that only makes him even better.

Chr8808

iTrader: (1)

Lets go ROCKIES , I want them to go all the way

gocubsgo55

So is anyone here a Rockies or D'backs fan? Is there such thing as a Rockies or D'backs fan?

Here's a ticket for Game 2 at Chase Field:

Outfield Reserve 329 25 Up to 10 $14.00 each View Details

$14.00???!!

Pull_T

1. I'm not saying Jeter isn't any good....just saying he is overrated. I do not believe him to be among the very limited elite in the game. I'm not saying he isn't an All-Star or even a hall of famer.

2. Stats such as "leads the major leagues since ____" can be misleading. Mainly because the sample size he gets compared to in those samples is reduced. Many more productive players than him didn't play during that entire span of time...as in their careers ended before now or their careers began after 1996.

At any particular point in time during that span he was not consistently the leader in hits or total bases or run and was not the same rank in doubles, walks, RBI etc.

3. His defense is particularly overrated. By statistical measures of defense...zone rating, range factor, DPs, %, he is consistently league average.

Eoanou

For example, Albert Pujohls would certainly have better overall numbers, but he didn't start playing til 2002?

Pull_T

Yes.

That stat doesn't compare Jeter to the majors as a whole, just to the portion of players who had the primesof their careers during all of the last 12 year...in other words, are within a couple years of age as Jeter. He's not competing against the likes of Pujols, Bagwell, Belle, Ichiro, Michael Young, and many others.

Not to mention your stat is fucked saying he leads the majors in runs since 1996:

A-Rod - 1482 (led league in 1996, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2007)
Jeter - 1374 (led league in 1998)

Matter of fact, Jeter only beat A-Rod in runs twice in that span...



Your total bases stat is fucked, too:

A-Rod - 4182 (led league in 1996, 2001, 2002, 2007)
Jeter - 3417 (best league finish was 4th in 1999)

I knew the Total bases one was fucked the other day but never looked up the numbers...imma see who else I can come up with that beats Jeter

Bonds - 3262...falls short barely even with all the walks and the subpar 05 to 07
Biggio - 3100...past his prime recently
Manny - 3747
Vlad - 3520...even tough he only became a regular in mid-97
Chipper Jones - 3529
Thome - 3299...100 games missed in 05 killed his chance
Sheffield - 3161...faded recently
Sosa - 3409...same thing, and missed 06
Garrett Anderson - 3308...a bit behind Jeter, but for Jeter to actually be closer to Garrett Anderson than he is to *actually* leadng the majors in TBs makes me lean to "overrated"

Pull_T

I also believe the "9th in walks" in bullshit, too seeing as how Jeter averages about 65 walks a year since 1996....a total of 758.

Bagwell - 1036...barely even played past 2003
Bonds - obviously has more...has 755 just in his last 4 MVP years
Giambi - 1101
Thome - 1272
Sheffield - 1079
Palmeiro - 859

Just to speed it up and find more than 9 i'll just take career total from guys who didn't debut until 1996 or later:

Abreau - 1087
Vlad - 655...and he NEVER walks
Brian Giles - 1070
Helton - 980
Berkman - 784...became a regular in 2000
Posada - 766


I bet I could find two dozen more with more walks than Jeter.

Chr8808

iTrader: (1)

Gagne, the difference maker

NetEditor

Gagne FTL.

subinf

I'm a huge Boston fan, but I want to see a real series. Good for Cleveland. Take it to a few extra games to have the series decided. That's what I love about baseball.