Why do you need a little box?
#1
LOLZ McCain Sux
Thread Starter
Why do you need a little box?
So um I have a Plasma Samsung and I don't have cable. I get normal tv but it is HD and since there is a huge antenna in my attic it comes in pretty clear. My question is is Cable HD better? Because I can't see why you would need a little "HD box" and pay extra when normal channels broadcast it for free.
Just popped into my head, if anyone can explain.
Just popped into my head, if anyone can explain.
#2
Go Giants
To get HD cable channels....
#6
is learning to moonwalk i
Originally Posted by JJ4Short
Well i dont need a box to get hd normal channels so why do u need a box to get hd cable channels.
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#8
is learning to moonwalk i
Originally Posted by Crazy Sellout
So you dont have cable at all and getting HD channels from the antenna?
That doesnt sound right.........
That doesnt sound right.........
#9
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Originally Posted by JJ4Short
Well i dont need a box to get hd normal channels so why do u need a box to get hd cable channels.
#10
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Originally Posted by moeronn
Because the cable companies want money. They put the HD channels high enough in the channel line up that your TV can't get them, so they make you get a box and pay extra.
#11
is learning to moonwalk i
Originally Posted by joerockt
No, your TV would have to have a digital HD tuner built into it, which dosent exist because its much cheaper to get a box from your tv provider.
![Scratch](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/scratch.gif)
#12
Team Owner
Originally Posted by moeronn
Some cable companies do send out their HD channels unscrambled where your TV can view if it has an HD tuner - that would get you cable channels in HD without a box, but it isn't garuanteed.
Also, you don't need a box if your TV supports cablecard. Ofcourse the cable company is going to charge you a few bucks for that.
#13
Team Owner
Originally Posted by JJ4Short
My question is is Cable HD better?
#14
LOLZ McCain Sux
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by joerockt
Because cable channels dont broadcast over the air. That's why they're called "cable".
Originally Posted by joerockt
No, your TV would have to have a digital HD tuner built into it, which dosent exist because its much cheaper to get a box from your tv provider.
I was asking this question because I was curious if it was just bullshit they add on to add onto your bill or is it really necessary?
#15
no it's all bullshat, actually if you can point your antenna real accurately you might be able to get TNT, ESPN, and all the others!! Just go into your attic and adjust, run downstairs and see if it worked, run back upstairs and repeat. do this several thousand times and get back to us and let us know how it is.
no, really they can pipe it through a cable right to the back of your TV via the cable "card". the card will decode the signal that is being sent through the cable. but with the card it is a one way communication; no DVR, OnDemand, or pay per view. if you opt for the box, you pay $10/mo or whatever due to the fact that "the box" probably costs $600-$800 and it's their insurance you don't run off with it or technology changes so rapidly their not stuck with it.
Is it better OTA than cable or Satellite? You bet, its not compressed like cable or satellite are. you also have a greater selection of channels; CBS in my area is 33-1,33-2,33-3...very nice during March Madness and they are broadcasting three games at once!!
no, really they can pipe it through a cable right to the back of your TV via the cable "card". the card will decode the signal that is being sent through the cable. but with the card it is a one way communication; no DVR, OnDemand, or pay per view. if you opt for the box, you pay $10/mo or whatever due to the fact that "the box" probably costs $600-$800 and it's their insurance you don't run off with it or technology changes so rapidly their not stuck with it.
Is it better OTA than cable or Satellite? You bet, its not compressed like cable or satellite are. you also have a greater selection of channels; CBS in my area is 33-1,33-2,33-3...very nice during March Madness and they are broadcasting three games at once!!
#16
LOLZ McCain Sux
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by New Car TL-S
no it's all bullshat, actually if you can point your antenna real accurately you might be able to get TNT, ESPN, and all the others!! Just go into your attic and adjust, run downstairs and see if it worked, run back upstairs and repeat. do this several thousand times and get back to us and let us know how it is.
no, really they can pipe it through a cable right to the back of your TV via the cable "card". the card will decode the signal that is being sent through the cable. but with the card it is a one way communication; no DVR, OnDemand, or pay per view. if you opt for the box, you pay $10/mo or whatever due to the fact that "the box" probably costs $600-$800 and it's their insurance you don't run off with it or technology changes so rapidly their not stuck with it.
Is it better OTA than cable or Satellite? You bet, its not compressed like cable or satellite are. you also have a greater selection of channels; CBS in my area is 33-1,33-2,33-3...very nice during March Madness and they are broadcasting three games at once!!
no, really they can pipe it through a cable right to the back of your TV via the cable "card". the card will decode the signal that is being sent through the cable. but with the card it is a one way communication; no DVR, OnDemand, or pay per view. if you opt for the box, you pay $10/mo or whatever due to the fact that "the box" probably costs $600-$800 and it's their insurance you don't run off with it or technology changes so rapidly their not stuck with it.
Is it better OTA than cable or Satellite? You bet, its not compressed like cable or satellite are. you also have a greater selection of channels; CBS in my area is 33-1,33-2,33-3...very nice during March Madness and they are broadcasting three games at once!!
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
#17
Suzuka Master
Cable card is a pretty horrible option. In many cable systems, they simply do not work. They are very buggy, and you do not get any premium services with them. You just simply get more stations then you do without a cable card. So it is similar to what you are looking for. All the stations with no box. Now of course you have to pay for the cable card too, so why not just get a box and have all your premium services too.
#18
Make MyTL Great Again
Originally Posted by 2001AudiS4
Cable card is a pretty horrible option. In many cable systems, they simply do not work. They are very buggy, and you do not get any premium services with them. You just simply get more stations then you do without a cable card. So it is similar to what you are looking for. All the stations with no box. Now of course you have to pay for the cable card too, so why not just get a box and have all your premium services too.
Cablecard 2.0 is supposed to come soon which fixes those problems: http://www.engadgethd.com/tag/CableCARD%202.0/
#19
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Originally Posted by JJ4Short
BUZZZZZ WRONG! Why can't they pipe it through the CABLE instead of needing an HD box is what I am asking. From what I hear you pay an extra fee for that stupid box. I understand getting one if you want DVR but lets say you don't want that, can't they just pipe in hd content through the cable freezy like normal broadcast do?
READ.
CABLE AND SATELLITE SUBSCRIBERS
All satellite and most cable subscribers do not use the televisions built-in ATSC tuner when receiving a signal. Instead, they use their service providers set-top box to receive and decode the digital signals. The only exception are those people who use a CableCARD, which is a small credit card type of chip that takes the place of a set-top box. It is inserted into the television, and is only available through certain cable providers.
Because most cable and satellite subscribers don't use their built-in ATSC tuner, some might think that they made a mistake by paying extra for an unused feature. I contend that the tuner is an added benefit, and not a burden. Here's why:
Cable and satellite providers will charge at least $9.95 a month to receive HD channels. While the HD tier is growing, not all people want to pay ten dollars a month for channels they don't watch. Some people just want their local stations in HD. By purchasing an antenna from the local electronics store for $25-100, a person with a built-in ATSC tuner can now enjoy their local stations for free. In the process they will save a few bucks for a rainy day.
As analog signals cease and digital becomes the standard, cable and satellite providers will probably provide the local networks for free if they don't do already. However, you will still have to buy or lease the HD box, which right now costs a minimum of $199. And the problem with leasing a HD box from a cable or satellite company is that they will probably charge you for the HD programming.
All satellite and most cable subscribers do not use the televisions built-in ATSC tuner when receiving a signal. Instead, they use their service providers set-top box to receive and decode the digital signals. The only exception are those people who use a CableCARD, which is a small credit card type of chip that takes the place of a set-top box. It is inserted into the television, and is only available through certain cable providers.
Because most cable and satellite subscribers don't use their built-in ATSC tuner, some might think that they made a mistake by paying extra for an unused feature. I contend that the tuner is an added benefit, and not a burden. Here's why:
Cable and satellite providers will charge at least $9.95 a month to receive HD channels. While the HD tier is growing, not all people want to pay ten dollars a month for channels they don't watch. Some people just want their local stations in HD. By purchasing an antenna from the local electronics store for $25-100, a person with a built-in ATSC tuner can now enjoy their local stations for free. In the process they will save a few bucks for a rainy day.
As analog signals cease and digital becomes the standard, cable and satellite providers will probably provide the local networks for free if they don't do already. However, you will still have to buy or lease the HD box, which right now costs a minimum of $199. And the problem with leasing a HD box from a cable or satellite company is that they will probably charge you for the HD programming.
WOW Wrong again! Unless you are cheap and get one without most have HD Tuners. Mine does. Unless you are paying $300 for your tv there is a more then likely chance it has one built in.
I was asking this question because I was curious if it was just bullshit they add on to add onto your bill or is it really necessary?
I was asking this question because I was curious if it was just bullshit they add on to add onto your bill or is it really necessary?
Yea, its all bullshit...The fucking man is taking your money.
![Roll Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
#20
Senior Moderator
I don't think there is any technical reason why they don't send it directly over the cable into your TV. It's a business decision. The box gives them more control, and lets them sell you things like VOD.
#21
dɐɹɔ ǝɥʇ ʇɐɥʍ
I'm not sure if I under stand the question correctly, but the reason you need box and its not sent over normal cable lines is due to a lack of bandwidth required for HD channels.
#24
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Originally Posted by Doom878
So it's possible to get all HD cable channels OTA with a super strong antenna?
Also, keep in mind that a lot of providers scramble HD channels so that only the box they provide can view them. Its usually because its part of a more expensive package.
Last edited by joerockt; 01-30-2008 at 11:00 AM.
#25
Suzuka Master
Originally Posted by joerockt
Yea, and its ONLY FOR OVER THE AIR DIGITAL TRANSMISSIONS. So like mentioned above, unless you have a cablecard, and your provider supports it, you're not getting HDTV over your cable...Period.
Yea, its all bullshit...The fucking man is taking your money.![Roll Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
Yea, its all bullshit...The fucking man is taking your money.
![Roll Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
#26
LOLZ McCain Sux
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by joerockt
You're asking the fucking hypothetical and your telling me IM wrong? Ok dude. You might as well ask why doesnt gold come out of your ass when you shit.
READ.
READ.
I get normal tv but it is HD and since there is a huge antenna in my attic it comes in pretty clear. My question is is Cable HD better? Because I can't see why you would need a little "HD box" and pay extra when normal channels broadcast it for free.
Originally Posted by joerockt
Yea, and its ONLY FOR OVER THE AIR DIGITAL TRANSMISSIONS. So like mentioned above, unless you have a cablecard, and your provider supports it, you're not getting HDTV over your cable...Period.
Yea, its all bullshit...The fucking man is taking your money.![Roll Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
Yea, its all bullshit...The fucking man is taking your money.
![Roll Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
#27
Just dial 1911
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Originally Posted by 2001AudiS4
So you are saying all those lcd tv's I am forced to hook up for customers straight cable ready with no box, and then auto search the digital stations which include a handful of high def stations, is not high def?
![ugh](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/ugh.gif)
The HD stations you're picking up are Broadcast channels made available by the Cable provider. By LAW (FCC), they are required to provide them.
#28
Suzuka Master
Originally Posted by joerockt
Do you seriously not know the difference between Broadcast TV and Cable/Satellite TV? ![ugh](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/ugh.gif)
The HD stations you're picking up are Broadcast channels made available by the Cable provider. By LAW (FCC), they are required to provide them.
![ugh](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/ugh.gif)
The HD stations you're picking up are Broadcast channels made available by the Cable provider. By LAW (FCC), they are required to provide them.
"without using a digital cable box, your high definition television with a built in digital tuner will receive high definition channels through your cable service."
Simple enough? High Definition signal. Through cable wires. Now if YOU want to read into where that broadcast originates, by all means, have a ball. Now if you want to act as though you have some superior insight when all you are doing is reading between the lines in everyones posts, then perhaps you need to take a closer look at what everyone is saying.
#29
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QUOTE]MY question was do you need the BOX not if you needed cable. You answered that I needed cable to get cable...I am not that thick. Thanks for the insight. My question is not if I can get cable without cable. My question is can I get HD CABLE WITHOUT PAYING FOR A BOX.[/QUOTE] Everyone else here seemed to get it except you.
[/QUOTE]
Wrong, this is the question you asked trying to clarify your first question:
That pretty much to me sounds like you're asking if you can get cable without cable to me.
No, most others were confused by your dumb question as well..
Finally you get to the question you've been trying to ask.
Bottom line is they're not obligated to provide any cable content (HD or SD) to you what-so-ever, but that would kind of make it hard to compete with other providers.
[/QUOTE]
Wrong, this is the question you asked trying to clarify your first question:
Originally Posted by JJ4Short
Well i dont need a box to get hd normal channels so why do u
need a box to get hd cable channels.
need a box to get hd cable channels.
Everyone else here seemed to get it except you.
Well thats my question if OTA can do it why cant cable? If its marketing I understand but I wanted to know if it was only marketing or if it was really impossible. People have brought up the answer already and I thank them. You on the other hand did nothing useful, thanks too.
![rofl](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rofl.gif)
Bottom line is they're not obligated to provide any cable content (HD or SD) to you what-so-ever, but that would kind of make it hard to compete with other providers.
#30
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Originally Posted by 2001AudiS4
I not only know the difference, I deal with these questions daily. I will try to simplify it for you as I have to do, again, on a daily basis for people to understand.
"without using a digital cable box, your high definition television with a built in digital tuner will receive high definition channels through your cable service."
Simple enough? High Definition signal. Through cable wires. Now if YOU want to read into where that broadcast originates, by all means, have a ball. Now if you want to act as though you have some superior insight when all you are doing is reading between the lines in everyones posts, then perhaps you need to take a closer look at what everyone is saying.
"without using a digital cable box, your high definition television with a built in digital tuner will receive high definition channels through your cable service."
Simple enough? High Definition signal. Through cable wires. Now if YOU want to read into where that broadcast originates, by all means, have a ball. Now if you want to act as though you have some superior insight when all you are doing is reading between the lines in everyones posts, then perhaps you need to take a closer look at what everyone is saying.
http://www.highdefforum.com/showthre...t=20611&page=2
I realize was JJ was getting at, he wanted to know if he could receive his local broadcast stations through his digital TV tuner. Its been answered that, yes, he can. But then the question came up regarding the reception of ALL HD channels without a provider's box, which isnt going to happen anytime soon...
Any tv with a QAM tuner can receive LOCAL HD (no TNT, HBO Universal type channels) for free WITHOUT a box per FCC rules. To repeat, I said any LOCAL HD or subchannel signal that the cable company company pipes through will be available on all digital sets with a QAM tuner. Customer service reps are ignorant of this and sometimes so are the techs. Plus they make more money by not informing you of this.
Last edited by joerockt; 01-30-2008 at 07:44 PM.
#31
Team Owner
So to answer the original question:
Local HD such as NBCHD, FOXHD, ABCHD, CBSHD, PBSHD, and the channel that used to be the WB (availability varies per region) are available without a box.
Other HD channels such as TNTHD, TBSHD, ESPNHD, etc, a box is required
Is that correct?
Local HD such as NBCHD, FOXHD, ABCHD, CBSHD, PBSHD, and the channel that used to be the WB (availability varies per region) are available without a box.
Other HD channels such as TNTHD, TBSHD, ESPNHD, etc, a box is required
Is that correct?
#32
The Third Ball
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Im not reading through all the bullshit.
If you have external HD rabbit ears...the HD image quality can actually be BETTER then the HD of a cable company...why you ask. COMPRESSION.
If you have external HD rabbit ears...the HD image quality can actually be BETTER then the HD of a cable company...why you ask. COMPRESSION.
#33
Originally Posted by yunginTL
what about a QAM tuner...
Somebody said it, with a QAM tuner you should be able to hook hook the cable and go, I don't think you'll get any HBO's or what not but should get everything else.
A QAM tuner is a device present in some digital televisions and similar devices which enables direct reception of digital cable channels without the use of a set-top box. QAM stands for "quadrature amplitude modulation," the format by which digital cable channels are encoded and transmitted via cable. QAM tuners can be likened to the cable equivalent of an ATSC tuner which is required to receive over-the-air (OTA) digital channels broadcast by local television stations. Many new digital televisions contain both and are labeled "with ATSC/QAM Tuner". Unlike the case with ATSC tuners there is no FCC requirement that QAM tuners be included in new television sets, but the same hardware is used for both and QAM is commonly included.
An integrated QAM tuner allows the free reception of unscrambled digital programming sent "in the clear" by cable providers, usually local broadcast stations; however most digital channels are scrambled because the providers consider them to be extra-cost options and not part of the "basic cable" package. Which channels are scrambled varies greatly from location to location, and can change over time. In the United States a television that is labeled digital cable ready can have a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box.
QAM-based HD programming of local stations is sometimes available to analog cable subscribers, without paying the additional fees for a digital cable box. The availability of QAM HD programming is rarely described or publicized in cable company product literature.
Although technically most digital and high-definition programming on cable uses QAM, the term is generally reserved among viewers for discussions of unlabeled channels. These are not included in guide information on devices like TiVo DVRs, and can be unexpectedly moved from channel to channel. This makes watching QAM channels frustrating for the casual viewer, encouraging them to purchase a "digital cable package" which includes a set top box and guide data.
An integrated QAM tuner allows the free reception of unscrambled digital programming sent "in the clear" by cable providers, usually local broadcast stations; however most digital channels are scrambled because the providers consider them to be extra-cost options and not part of the "basic cable" package. Which channels are scrambled varies greatly from location to location, and can change over time. In the United States a television that is labeled digital cable ready can have a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box.
QAM-based HD programming of local stations is sometimes available to analog cable subscribers, without paying the additional fees for a digital cable box. The availability of QAM HD programming is rarely described or publicized in cable company product literature.
Although technically most digital and high-definition programming on cable uses QAM, the term is generally reserved among viewers for discussions of unlabeled channels. These are not included in guide information on devices like TiVo DVRs, and can be unexpectedly moved from channel to channel. This makes watching QAM channels frustrating for the casual viewer, encouraging them to purchase a "digital cable package" which includes a set top box and guide data.
#34
Because Of You
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Originally Posted by JJ4Short
...is Cable HD better?
contents wise, Cable (HD or not) offers a hold lot more.
quality wise, Cable (mostly) sucks because they have to pack SOOOO much channels into one tiny wire.
#35
not to make matters worse but...i was over my in-laws who have COX cable and while i was flipping the channels i found channels like 107-1, 99-2, 108-3 and all were coming in as HD. Even the TV's info button confirmed current resolution as 1080i. Yes i checked a standard channel and it said 480i. i couldn't believe it, so yes i guess you can get cable HD without a box and without a cable card. they must not have been scrambled stations.
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