TacoBello

Well I haven't created a thread in a very long time, so now I'm curious- what in the name of sweet baby Jesus is considered "Luxury" today when it comes to cars? It seems the line that used to define luxury and non-luxury brands/cars are becoming more and more blurred.

I'm not talking about RRs or Bentleys, but more so, "regular people" brands.

I foresee (or secretly am hoping) for a shit show of a discussion to erupt here, so everyone, what are your thoughts?

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

Acura is luxury.


The fuck is this Taco?

TacoBello

But really, TLX owners keep arguing their car IS a luxury vehicle, but with the new accord supposedly having more features, save for SH-AWD, is it now a luxury car too?

I don't get it.

Why is Lexus luxurious, and Acura not? What's the difference? I honestly don't know any more, save for past feelings of which brand is luxury and which isn't.

Ford stepped up their game. They have some super expensive vehicles. Their Platinum trucks are gorgeous. Are they luxury vehicles now? Is an A3, entry level C-class, or IS250 considered luxury cars? If so, why? If not, why?

cu2wagon

Well, I know it's gotta have wood in it if you're gonna call it luxury.

cu2wagon

Heated steering wheel and USB charging port in the back seat.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

So is my Accord luxury?

I have LED fog lights. That counts for something right?

oo7spy

It would be cool if a real, earnest discussion could be had here, but I won't hold my breath.

I agree with you that the lines are definitely blurred these days. It used to be "leather" versus cloth, wood trim versus plastic, and electronic versus manual that defined a luxury car over a non-luxury. However, all of that has changed from a black and white scenario to many shades of grey due to the advances in manufacturing.

I don't think you will find a decent consensus that is supported by objective measures any more.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

In all honesty,

I think the GS is luxury... I feel that there is base, semi luxury and luxury. (60k and under)

cu2wagon

I don't think a car can be truly luxury if it's not large enough to lounge out in the back. I.e. one needs a driver.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

Sit behind passenger seat, put feet up on passenger seat headrest. "lounge out in the back"

thoiboi

Luxury unfortunately has become this coined marketing term that companies have used to tack on extra $$ on their cars. It's also has evolved through time. CD players in cars used to be luxurious. Car phones... Cassette players..(looking at you 3G TL...)


We joked about the other OP and his IS but I definitely would consider a Lexus as my next vehicle. The new IS's are freaking gorgeous. And the GS F sport... don't even get me started.


Also luxury is also about perspective. An Acura to someone in poverty is luxurious. An Acura to a 1%er.. probably not as much.

thoiboi

hey hey hey... give us 3g 'natives' some credit.. we can most definitely have a real conversation here

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

FYI, this thread is now in Car Talk so it has been cleaned a bit.

Let's keep this an actual discussion. If you'd like to try your hand at comedy, feel free to visit the "Push Button" thread in Ramblings...

Sarlacc

Seriously...my penis comment made this thread.

Now its just....Its just....this

Ugh

nist7

Pretty much.

My mom replaced her 01 Sentra with a 14 Corolla....wow. The features are astonishing (granted my household haven't owned a car newer than 2006 since last year so there is some bias there).

But you're right the features are all trickling down to the base entry models...back up camera, HID headlights, power seats, etc.

An Accord Touring has almost everything the TLX has at same price point...save for the DCT/AWD/AWS.

Acura's website actually has a nice vehicle comparison tool and looking at a mid level TLX with the 9AT and AWS (not SHAWD) pretty much almost same except for the drivetrain difference and some small features (head restraint, cooled front seats, integrated HDD, etc.)

So it has to be pretty much even more high tech features and the styling (such as the new Jewel eye headlights on Acuras) and of course the fit and finish and obviously riding on the history of that particular brand/prestige.

edit: Looking at the top end TLX with the top end Accord.
The TLX SH-AWD with Advance package is 45k, Accord Touring is 35k.
The 10k gets you: SH-AWD/9 DCT/paddle shift, cooled seats, front armrest storage, HDD with dvd player, puddle lighting, active head restraints).

Would be a very good deal to buy it just few years used....but for new car buyers they'll have to decide if the premium is worth the cost.

thoiboi

on the bright side, at least now the thanks button is applicable

nist7

Heh like me. I upgraded from a 95 Accord to my 06 TL couple years ago...and for the first few weeks in my TL I was like: SO THIS HOW THE 1% LIVES OH YEAH!

Perspective definitely is there.

So with that logic the actual luxury buyers are going to want more and more features to distinguish from the plebian wheels. And imo it really would have to have a large difference...almost-chauffer like (without getting into the Maybachs of the world). Something like a LS 460L-ish

Yumcha

Lots of brands have diluted their product for accessibility because well, everyone wants a taste of that "luxury".

Look at Mercedes' GLA, CLA or BMW's X1, 2-Series, and etc. Accessible generally speaking to any mid-class income family if they really want it.

Personally, I think true luxury brands are any car manufacturers' cars that START at $80K and up?

So, I'd guess our "entry" would be Maserati?

MTEAZY

It used to be about features but now you can get most KIAs with radar cruise and heated/cooled seats.

So I would say part performance, part quality, part service, and part image.

Booya4139

I don't think it has really changed... It was never really about features, but about brand cache, exclusivity and cost. Those brands DID have tech features the more mass market cars didn't have back then, and what we are seeing now is a tightening of the gap of tech features... But that doesn't mean that the more mass market cars are luxury. its like the defintion of pron, you can't define it but you know it when you see it...

Sarlacc

2014 Durango RT - 5.7 Hemi with 360HP, full leather with heated seats (didn't get the nappa with cooled option, couldn't find it) 8.4" Connect screen, heated steering wheel, bluetooth audio, keyless entry/lock, such button start, LED DRL, bi-xenon headlights, fog lights auto tailgate, 7" LCD. ETC ETC ETC ETC ETC

2014 Jeep Cherokee Limited - 3.2 V6 271HP...same as the other vehicle...except it does have the cooled seats.

I dont call them luxury cars...but they could be.

carz0159

In my mind, it's the service and experience more than about the cars themselves. Sure, you can get a Kia or Hyundai with more options, features and a bigger engine than Acuras, Lexus's and the like for tens of thousands cheaper, but at the end of the day, you still won't get a loaner when you bring it in for a complimentary oil change. That's what separates BMW, Audi and MB and Lexus from everything else. Walk into a Acura dealership and than a Lexus dealership. It's the experience that's very different. Free snacks, drinks, breakfast, etc.

TacoBello

So if I'm hearing everyone correctly-

Acura is not a luxury brand, as it has nothing, save for the NSX, that can crack the 80k mark.

Lexus, MB, Audi, BMW are luxury brands, but most of their offerings are not luxury cars. Not until you hit the higher echelon of their offerings.

Although Hyundai and Kia pump out respectable cars, loaded with features, these are not luxury cars, as neither are fords, chryslers, GMs, volkswagens, nissans, Hondas, mazdas, etc.

While you get better customer service at brands such Lexus and MB, that equates more to the brand as a whole being a luxury brand, not their lower and mid offering cars.

Wow. This discussion went surprisingly well

Doom878

Meh why do we have to categorize everything as human beings. Not everything is cut and dry.

cu2wagon

How else will one know that they are better than another?

Doom878

Good answer

quanaman

iTrader: (4)

You know its luxury because the commercial on tv says so.

TacoBello

You can thank marketing for that.

SamDoe1

The luxury scale is defined as how many standard features can you make individually optional and still get people to pay more for them.

TacoBello

And on that note... Porsche called...

SamDoe1

Porsche is definitely luxury.

usdmJON

I dont think you will find a definite answer.

As I dont think there is a definite answer to what makes a "sports" car. Back in the day a 240sx was a sports compact. Today I think the same car would simply be a compact car and lose the title of a sports car compared to the current market.

Wiki explains it pretty well I believe. Really it is subjective.

"The term suggests a vehicle with higher quality equipment, better performance, more precise construction, comfort, higher design, technologically innovative modern, or features that convey an image, brand, status, or prestige, or any other 'discretionary' feature or combination of them. The term is also broad, highly variable and relative. It is a perceptual, conditional and subjective attribute that may be comprehended differently by different people; "what may be luxury for one may be premium for another."

So while many may think the ILX for example is entry lux. Many others would say it is simply premium. Likewise, with Flips comment about his Accord. He may only see it as premium while compared to other cars that the company might consider luxury, like a TLX or even the ILX, then Id argue there the Accord can be a luxury car too if you compare it to a lower end "luxury".

Basically. I dont think it is as black and white as being able to just draw a line.
You have cars that are without a doubt luxury. You have cars that are without a doubt daily family commuters. And you have some that sit inbetween. You also have some that may lean to one side but the company fights to claim its something else... like the ILX maybe.

Saintor

Let's establish order here.

You can handle attributes by quantity or quality. Before that, you have to define the criteria.

LUXURY has to been defined. It is a subpart of a PREMIUM attribute. Car-wise, a PREMIUM attribute can be generally SPORT or LUXURY. And then you can have others, such as ECO for which some people will spend tons of money. PREMIUM doesn't have to mean HIGH-END LUXURY or HIGH-END whatever.

The attribute PREMIUM has to be (1) pretended and (2) recognized/perceived as such, not by trim but per model. The first intent of the model has to be PREMIUM and it must come spending much more money than usual for the content.

It has nothing to do with specific equipment.

A $36K Accord is not a PREMIUM car, but a $33K TLX is. A $36K Mazda6 or Taurus isn't a PREMIUM car, but a $36K C-Class is.

Didn't I make your like a lot easier? Of course.

*Definitely some truth in this*

012TL-GLM

Luxury equates to excess. Almost every car on the market is obtainable with luxury features. If we consider a vehicle's purpose is to get from point A to point B then all it needs to provide is some manner of seat, steering wheel, and pedals. There was a time when drink holders were luxury. I can't for the life of me figure out why people still place the Germans on a pedestal. If nickel and diming the consumer defines luxury they definitely win.

svtmike

That made little sense to me. Perhaps if you capitalized more words it would become clearer.

Saintor

Of course, your brain is clearly in overload mode.

svtmike

No, I am just comfortable with ambiguity. I don't need a specification of luxury, and I don't need an artificial hierarchy of attempted specifications of other useful yet also ambiguous terms.

I don't feel any need to decide if a car or brand or feature is True Luxury or not.

csmeance

Luxury = Features and options that aren't needed, but help provide a better experience than a standard option would.

Luxury would be reclining rear seats on my 760 with heat/cooling. No rear passenger needs that but it's a LUXURY to have.

Every car made now has radar based cruise control optional. That used to be a defining option for luxury auto brands like my 760 in 2005. It still is an upscale feature, but can't be used to differentiate a luxury car vs a premium car vs economy car anymore as all offer it.

Same goes with Projector headlights and LED headlamps.

Another example:
My 760 had almost 20K worth of wood in it new. Dark and light wood with inlays, 1/2 the dash wood needed to be replaced after a tech slipped with a screwdriver, BMW paid 4K for a new wood trim. All 4 OH SHIT handles needed to be replaced, each one was $750 since the lacquer cracked. That is a luxury feature whereas simulated wood is a premium feature and painted plastic is economy grade.

In short, Luxury in automotive field is defined as something extravagant that many mainstream cars do not have. For example the new scent system in the S-Class and 7-series. Luxury, Yes, Stupid, somewhat.

Sarlacc

Hey, I can't tell...do you have a 760 or something?