Some surprising and interesting excerpts from the January 04' review:


Highs: Acura's second-best V6 to-date, slick manual transmission, sophisticated styling inside and out.

Lows: FWD propulsion, underwhelming tires, torque-steer symptoms.

The Verdict: A rear-drive-shaft shy of getting our full recommendation.

"Acura has stubbornly resisted building a rear-wheel-drive, V6 powered sports sedan."

"It would make sense because only so much power can be delivered through the tires that are also called on to steer. The competition is well aware of this, rear-drive cars are the best-balanced, best-handling vehicles."

"All that power and torque gets channeled through the front-drive dam like a school of spawning salmon, bogging down the drivetrain as it tries to put the power down. Gobs of wheelspin ensues until the tires are finally able to hook up, launching the TL upstream with serious authority."

"On our loop, where twisty roads abound, the TL couldn't attack curves with the same speed and vigor as the Infiniti and BMW, inspiring less confidence because of its heavier front-loaded nature.

"Balance is key here, and the Acura's 60/40 bias can't match the BMW's perfect 50/50 or Infiniti's 53/47. The TL feels heavy and not nearly as light on its feet as the G35, which weighs even five pounds more. The steering is light, and there's too much assist."

"The LSD can't mask the torque steer, as if each pound-foot were a G.I. Joe action figure in a tug of war. "

"We're usually not ones to say stuff like this, but the automatic is arguably the more fitting transmission for the TL's lofty power numbers."

"We wonder how many drivers will appreciate DVD and Bluetooth capability. Likely not as many as those who'd appreciate the 270 horses exerting themselves through the rear wheel."

"Until it sends power out back, it'll be hard pressed to get our nod over the rear-drive competition."

The 3 counterpoints given are even harsher than the review saying the car has a fatal flaw. A Honda engineer is even quoted saying, "We think we might have gone a little too far."

 

It's all true.....sadly.....

 

yep. all true

 

So much for the TL putting Acura back on the map.

 

Despite what internet message boards might lead some to believe, most car buyers don't care which wheels get the power and or push the car hard enough for it to make a difference. If Acura went RWD, it would lose much of the cost savings of sharing platforms with the Accord which will NEVER go RWD. Not to mention what happens to RWD in the snow and ice.

 

thats why awd is the answer my friend, specifically VTM-4

 

 

4 an enthusiast, the tl will not cut it, imo


however, 4 those that like a fast car and wont push it as much in terms of handling, the new tl is a nice choice...i.e. you dont plan on driving the car no more than 8/10 of its ability....

 

ooops, can some one move this to car talk

 

i wouldnt say that. the tl has its place.... and it will sell well.

 

Why does everyone think its impossible to drive RWD in the snow?

 

cuz thats what people used to say back in 1986. They forget cars these days have traction control which is fine in snow. For those who live in the snow climate, look how many RWD cars are on the roads. There are MANY.

 

nah the car is really nice, I'd buy it if i were looking for automatic 4 door sedan.

 

I love the new TL. If I wanted a new 4dr sport sedan and didn't wanna go over $40k, I sure as hell wouldn't buy a weak-ass 525i or an all-too-common-and-ugly G35S over it--despite not being able to WOT from a stop with the wheel turned.

 

CL RWD here we come.

If Car and Driver gives you a bad review you gotta do SOMETHING.

I ain't never saw a C&D write up quite like that before.

 

Where is this torque steer? I test drove one and pushed it pretty hard and really didn't have any issues. The only time I really have an issue with it is when I hit the gas hard up a fairly steep hill. I still prefer FWD in the rainy weather here. My old BMW just loved to bring that back end around in the wet. I guess when most Acura drivers start taking their cars to Autocross events and drag racing every weekend they will need to switch drivetrains.

 

whats the first best V6 from Acc? Legend, im assuiming?

the legned was fucking SWEET for it size, money and power back then... used to have a 91 in the family.... that thing was so awesome, and still doesnt look TOO outdated

 

uhm, maybe the NSX

 

NSX V6

 

It's true... there are a ton... especially in Westchester. And when it snows I pass them b/c they're either stuck on the side of the road, or having traction issues. When taking turns, if there's a BMW or similar RWD car in front of me, I give extra space b/c 9 out of 10 times they slide... and that's with snows. I'll take FWD/AWD any day of the week.

 

I've driven RWD cars in the snow before, and it all comes down to the driver's ability to control the power.

Hell, I used to make my car slide out on purpose. I had that shit down perfectly. RWD in the snow doesn't bother me one bit.

Don't take this the wrong way, and it's not intended at any specific person, but most people who complain about RWD in snow I've met are the ones who have no control. Just gotta learn it. And if you can't do it even with TCS/VSA, then you don't deserve to drive in the snow, period. Just stay home and watch TV.

 

wERD

And all this FWD saves me in the snow crap=:ghey: :ghey:
The last TL-S placed 6th in the last comparo, I am sure the new TL will finish better than that.



Also, PRICE. THe last loaded TL-S was 31k, the new one was what, 35k tested. They didn't like that, no matter what extra features were offered.

 

didnt a loaded TLS in 2002 come up to like 35k neways?... or were u referring to the 02, not the 04?
as a matter of fact, when the 02s came out, one with kit, spoiler, navi, etc, cudnt that get into like 37k sticker?

 

It's not impossible but FWD does have an advantage.

Taken from the article...

".... only so much power can be delivered through the tires that are also called on to steer."

They list this as a disadvantage, but in the snow putting power down to the road with the steering tires means you can actually "pull" the car through the corner. On a RWD car the front tires are more akin to the front ski's on a snowmobile.

 

I know about driving dynamics, and I maintain that if an RWD car is driven properly in the snow, it is every bit as manageable, albeit one needs more experience and a good set of snows for that.

 

I'm one of those RWD cars on the road, and I do just fine, thanks.

 

Yeah its wayy too ugly Remeber that up until this redesign the TL looked like it might have been a Camry from 98 up...I love the TL and used to drive one...but the styling was not unique in ANY way.

 

This is key right here....I would argue that a FWD car without snows is a lot easier to drive than a RWD car without snows. Optimally equipped RWD is certainly driveable.

Here in Seattle we get snow maybe 2-3 times a year and it only lasts a few days. Unless people routinely go to the mountains people never buy snow tires and are generally "suprised" when it snows. In this situation FWD has a better chance of getting me home.

 

We agree. But some are stating you will die driving RWD in the snow.

 

I'm not sure how much ice/snow you get in your area but we get more than our fair share. I've driven both RWD (with/without traction control) and FWD cars and have found the FWD to be much easier to manage. I'm not saying you will die driving a RWD but that doesn't make it equivalent to a FWD. In purchasing the CLS, my criteria was a relatively powerful, 2 door FWD car. I really like the looks of the G35 but wrote it off because of it's capabilities in the winter. The two people I know with G35s garage them in the winter.

I find having a year-round car more important than the speed in which I can take it into a corner. Each to their own.

 

Experience and snow tires doesn't change the driving dynamics, so FWD is still better in slippery turns than RWD.

If everyone would tuck their manly *I can drive better than U* egos away for a minute, they'd acknowledge this to be a fact.

 

I'll agree, to a point. I grew up in Higgins Lake, MI and we got our fair share of snow. All of our vehicles were Fords, including a '95 Mustang GT (damn I feel old now). For the average snowfall RWD doesn't really hinder the driver much. HOWEVER, for that occasional real blizzard, RWD will get you into the ditch w/ the SLIGHTEST mistake w/ the throttle. I've had to drive 5mph at times in that GT. No traction control is gonna fix the thick white stuff. This is where FWD and AWD kick butt (and for FWD at least, the only place).

I'm not saying I wouldn't rather see Acura make a 2-door RWD/AWD car, but they know their market and they are making cars to suit them. Those that really want ALL of the performance will just shop elsewhere. I mean come on, do you really think Acura hasn't weighed the cost/benefit of making RWD cars???

 

remember that WOMEN also drive sedans, and would shy away from driving 260HP+ rwd sedan in extreme conditions. Ever notice how the majority of rwd snow drivers are men?

 

RWD or AWD would have been a nice touch.

 

Might be true, but having RWD for rest of the year makes up for a couple of days in snowy weather. I mean its not like those with RWD cars are selling them to buy FWD or AWD just because they got stuck once or twice. Main reason they get stuck cuz they are dumb and are still driving on summer tries which most RWD cars come with.

 

actually BMW never intended their RWD cars to be used in snowey reigions. If you read the 3-series brocheur it clearly states: "and for our customers who live in snowey climates, we created the 330XI, 325XI," etc.

 

I admit that it is easier to drive an FWD in the snow, but its not like RWD is impossible like many people say/think it is. If the snow is not really deep, then its not that bad...and with plows out when it snows...for me it was a non concern, before I had the TL, I had a 4WD truck that was RWD unless you switched the transfer case and hubs over, so I got used to RWD dynamics, and near the end almost never used 4WD.

But I still think that an experienced driver with a properly equipped RWD vehicle will do better than a properly equipped FWD/AWD car with a driver who thinks they are invincible because of AWD/FWD, like many people drive, especially with AWD.

 

Those two could drive their G35s if they wanted to...I live in Utah, we get a lot of snow, especially when the lake effect kicks in.

 

EXACTLY

 

I couldn’t have said it better myself.

Shawn S