When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Suggestions needed: Dealership can't figure out what is wrong with my car LOL
Since the dealership can't seem to figure out what is wrong, maybe our experts can help me identify the potential causes for this minor issue.
I dropped off my car about a month ago at the dealership for a loud noise that only occurs (sometimes) when reversing and the steering wheel in full lock position. The noise usually was just one time and loud enough to disturb the passenger and i could feel it through my legs.
It feels like i just drove over and smashed a decent size of rock. (There is no rock)
Otherwise, the car drives perfectly fine. No noise going over bumps, or acceleration and car drives straight.
When i dropped it off, i thought it was going to be a quick fix. Either the strut bearing or control arms was what I told the SA.
1 month later, the dealer has replaced the following:
Front control arms
Full steering rack
Front brake rotors
Front struts.
and the noise is still there. They dont know what to do anymore and waiting for BMW to give them instruction.
TBH, I really dont know what else could cause it either at this point. They still have my car and they wont release it until it is fixed since they dont know the cause (safety concern).
Suggestions?
Oh, car is RWD, so no front AC joint.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 04-18-2023 at 04:06 PM.
Feel it in seat or steering wheel? If you feel it in your seat it might be the rear diff or half shafts. Could also be bushings and/or tie rod ends at the front but that would be felt through the steering wheel, not only the seat.
Only thing I can think of if you're sure it's the front are ball joints and bushings. Sounds like something is binding intermittently. Maybe a wheel bearing? But that would for sure manifest in other ways.
Only thing I can think of if you're sure it's the front are ball joints and bushings. Sounds like something is binding intermittently. Maybe a wheel bearing? But that would for sure manifest in other ways.
I did ask them to check the wheel bearing. We will see what they say. The tech there is running out of ideas... waiting for BMW...
And this exposes why BMW's service tech training is such garbage. They literally plug a computer into the car and use a manual to tell them the repair tree based on the codes. No codes, no idea what to do. It's like the techs don't have a damn clue how the cars actually work.
And this exposes why BMW's service tech training is such garbage. They literally plug a computer into the car and use a manual to tell them the repair tree based on the codes. No codes, no idea what to do. It's like the techs don't have a damn clue how the cars actually work.
Yah.. i kinda got that feeling that i know more about cars than they do. I think they are all IT engineers
I'd imagine if it was a wheel bearing you would hear it at higher speeds, i.e. manifest as Sam said.
Good luck. Hope they can solve it. Otherwise, M340i time!
yah i dont hear anything when the car is moving. So i wont count on it. But hey they already changed most of the stuff in the front, might as well get me some new bearing
Replaced the rack, but what about the PS pump/motor? Unless it's part of the rack?
I dont know. they told me they replaced the whole steering rack. I dont think it is the pump or the motor (EPS).. or even the rack since the feel doesnt come from steering wheel... it is more coming from the suspension.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 04-19-2023 at 02:27 PM.
I just texted the SA and ask them to check with the tech on the bushing. It would be so stupid if they didnt check that while replacing the strut since the issue is a tension noise.
Replaced the rack, but what about the PS pump/motor? Unless it's part of the rack?
EPS = no pump. I believe the motor is part of the rack.
Originally Posted by oonowindoo
I just texted the SA and ask them to check with the tech on the bushing. It would be so stupid if they didnt check that while replacing the strut since the issue is a tension noise.
Bushing is part of the control arm assembly so they'd have to remove them to replace the control arms.
Also have them look into the sway bar end links and bushings.
SA replied. All bushing were replaced as well at the same time (Control arms, struts). At least they were on the parts list that was used to order parts for my car.
He is checking with the tech to see if he actually replaced them.... So the mystery continues
On the non-related note, this SA is very responsive and helpful. Unlike the last one i had..... bitch wont even reply my text.
BMW is spending a lot of $$ on this minor issue, hopefully they can just give me a new car
Last edited by oonowindoo; 04-19-2023 at 05:12 PM.
Bushing is part of the control arm assembly so they'd have to remove them to replace the control arms.
Also have them look into the sway bar end links and bushings.
I was referring to the strut mount bushings that allow the strut to turn with the steering knuckle.
They are between the strut and the strut tower (part of the chassis), and not part of the control arm.
I believe you're thinking of the control arm bushings which are shown as the pink bushing in the lower part of the drawing. Most control arm bushings are pressed into the control arm and do not need to be removed in order to remove the control arm. Removing the bushing bolt is sufficient to remove the control arms.
Sometimes a strut mount bushing can fail or become worn which can cause poor steering motion and clunking noise/knocking in the suspension since all the Z load of the front suspension is going through the strut to the bushing to the chassis.
I was referring to the strut mount bushings that allow the strut to turn with the steering knuckle.
They are between the strut and the strut tower (part of the chassis), and not part of the control arm.
I believe you're thinking of the control arm bushings which are shown as the pink bushing in the lower part of the drawing. Most control arm bushings are pressed into the control arm and do not need to be removed in order to remove the control arm. Removing the bushing bolt is sufficient to remove the control arms.
Sometimes a strut mount bushing can fail or become worn which can cause poor steering motion and clunking noise/knocking in the suspension since all the Z load of the front suspension is going through the strut to the bushing to the chassis.
Some BMW suspensions have a FCA bushing carrier that's separate from the control arm itself. The bushing is pressed into the carrier which is bolted to the subframe. The stem of the FCA then goes into the middle of the bushing. The pic you posted is for an AWD car and those suspensions are different from RWD cars.
Top strut mount is different, I agree, and something else that should be addressed as a potential cause. Ditto for sway bar end links and bushings.
Another thing to have them check is the front strut to knuckle connection. If this is loose, it can slip under full lock as well and make a loud banging noise.
The thing that gets me is that all this stuff would be obviously felt through the steering wheel and not through your seat. If it's through your seat rather than the wheel, the issue may be coming from the rear of the car with halfshafts binding or something like that. Or a rear diff that is failing.
IIRC, the OP has a F30. The F30 front suspension is essentially the same for the AWD/RWD, even the thrust control arm is curved (for the driveshaft) for both with slight variations but both AWD/RWD is strut with two separate lower aluminum control arms with pressed in bushings. One thing that surprised me is the BMW strut mounts is the bolts for the strut mounts are now self-tapping which is kinda shocking for me. Also BMW have both older 3 bolt and newer 5 bolt strut bushing mounting to the strut tower.
Some BMW suspensions have a FCA bushing carrier that's separate from the control arm itself. The bushing is pressed into the carrier which is bolted to the subframe. The stem of the FCA then goes into the middle of the bushing. The pic you posted is for an AWD car and those suspensions are different from RWD cars.
Top strut mount is different, I agree, and something else that should be addressed as a potential cause. Ditto for sway bar end links and bushings.
Another thing to have them check is the front strut to knuckle connection. If this is loose, it can slip under full lock as well and make a loud banging noise.
The thing that gets me is that all this stuff would be obviously felt through the steering wheel and not through your seat. If it's through your seat rather than the wheel, the issue may be coming from the rear of the car with halfshafts binding or something like that. Or a rear diff that is failing.
^ starting at 4:13 in this YouTube comparing the G20/F30 suspension comparison you can see the struct bushing I'm referring to. He calls it the "thrust bearing" which is a piece of plastic that rotates round under the struct mount to allow the strut to rotate with the steering. These bearings can be get worn/damaged/broken/... Also good to spray some pure silicone lubricant on that bear/bushing to reduce friction and wear.
Thanks. Since the strut was replaced, that bushing must have been removed or replaced in the process. If it was damaged, i think they would have seen it... or those tech really shouldnt be working there.
This might sound weird, but fully search under your seat for any spray cans/bottles that might be rolling back and forth under your seat. A friend of mine insisted that I take my car to the dealership due to a noise/sliding feeling similar to what you've described. Luckily Acura asked us to come back and before we could, I found a large Victoria's Secret perfume spray under the seat, among other things. lol
After an unsuccessful warranty parts cannon for a noise in my MDX, the dealer installed a chassis mic system, where they plug in dozens of mics in all sorts of places then do a testdrive to identify the location of a reproducible driving sound. Ended up identifying a motor mount which I never would have guessed in my unidentified noise case.
Perhaps you can ask the SA if their dealership has that kind of system? Or maybe another dealer in their ownership group might?
This might sound weird, but fully search under your seat for any spray cans/bottles that might be rolling back and forth under your seat. A friend of mine insisted that I take my car to the dealership due to a noise/sliding feeling similar to what you've described. Luckily Acura asked us to come back and before we could, I found a large Victoria's Secret perfume spray under the seat, among other things. lol
Yah but nah, that is not it. you will not mistaken a tension "clunk" coming from the suspension with an object moving under your seat.
Well this morning when i backed out my garage, no noise. But it only happened once in a while anyway.
What is interesting is, per the repair sheet (invoice) i received, the tech noticed abnormal noise when going over bumps, which i never have and every major part (EPS, tie rod, struts and etc..) they replaced not only the main part but every associated parts on the assembly. Many were mentioned above.
What i can confirm now is my alignment is good now. it will take some time for me to know for sure if everything is fixed. My OCD is bugging me on the idea that with so many parts replaced, there might be new noises that weren't there before.
On a non-related note, after driving the 540Msport for about a month, i forgot how rough M340i is and much much much nosier in the cabin. Am i getting old?
04-18-2023, 04:04 PM
which is kinda shocking for me. Also BMW have both older 3 bolt and newer 5 bolt strut bushing mounting to the strut tower.
