Mokos23

This person on the vtec forum put this thread title on there "Infiniti: Everything you want Acura to be".

I saw this thread title there and I kept thinking this guy does have some valid points, but others are nonsense. Does Nissan really have a better racing history than Honda? I don't think so.

http://www.vtec.net/forums/one-messa...item_id=671370

Scratch that,
Nissan: Everything you want Honda to be

1) Torque
2) High Revving V6 (VQ35HR)
3) V8s
4) ATTESA-ETS
5) Turbos
6) Low Displacement High Output 4 cyl (although it was years ago, still proves they have the know-how) SR16VE N1
7) RWD platforms
8) (Infiniti) Can actually be compared to BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Lexus and be taken seriously
9) Good styling (subjective)
10) CVT and now Hybrid (with the help of Toyota)
11) Racing Heritage

So many things right... makes you wonder about Honda

S14 n Tsx

I almost bought a g35 before I got my tsx. I wish I could got the g35 but still happy with my tsx.

Crazy Bimmer

Depends who you ask. Not everyone wants those things that are listed.

I know my dad wont buy Infiniti because he thinks Acura's interiors are far better. I would tend to think thats how most consumers are.

They care about price and looks... but then again BMW doesnt have the greatest interiors.

S14 n Tsx

I thought the acura's interios were much better back then but now new infiniti models are getting better and better. I would say coin toss to me at this point.

ilitig8

The only racing heritage I give a rats ass about is F1. Although Honda has NEVER been able to build a decent chassis (in their first foray into chassis building they built a car that their lead driver said was undrivable and would not race it, their second driver drove it...and died) they have shown they can build some world beating engines. Only two manufacturers have a better engine building resume' in F1: Ford (Cosworth) and Ferrari.

Acura is the value leader in almost lux and almost sport with a strong dash of driver interactive tech, great reliability and excellent fuel efficiency, but comes in last in the upline import full line builder cache fight. IMHO it is a company that couldn't sell a single car based on heart, it sells everyone based on the head. Thats not a bad thing unless you want to conquer the world as an auto maker. Further, anyone who bought a Acura can rest assured they probably bought the car in the niche which made the most fiscal sense but just not the type of choice that fuels the heart fires of the average enthusiast.

psteng19

If that were the case, then domestics would not have sold so well for so long.

I'm pretty sure interiors are one of the last things on people's minds when shopping for a car.
It's just that Internet car forums has turned everyone into dash strokers recently.

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

Correct me if im wrong but in 2006 year didnt acura sell 80,000 more cars then infiniti?

psteng19

What's your point?
Because X sells more cars then Y, therefore X is better?

I guess GM makes the best cars in the world then.

S14 n Tsx

you stole my words..

subinf

I'm still partial to the interior of the early 90's Q45, except I'd like cupholders.

I'm mixed on whether infiniti is better than Acura, I like some things Infiniti offers and others that Acura offers

Zippee

I seem to recall Renault having some success in F1.

The "DF" series of Cosworths was one of the greatest engines ever built but Ford just put their name on it and really didn't do much as far as the actual design and building.

LuvMyTSX

Maybe for some people, but I bought my TSX based on a combo of both heart and head (but mostly heart). I fell in love with the car the second I saw it, then when purchase time came I thought hard about what was really important to me (value, reliability), and the TSX still came out on top for me. But it was mostly an emotional purchase for me. It all depends on the person and comes down to personal preference.

IMO one or the other is not "better" just "different."

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

Is Infinit > Honda? Meh. Really depends on what your looking for in a car IMHO.

synth19

Give me an Acura interior any day over an infiniti. imho.

phile

Infiniti is improving, though. The new G35's interior and the EX concept's interior, which looks positively production ready, are signs of good things to come.

Although I think Acura is still a few steps ahead with the avant-garde designs. The RL with that huge ass boomerang of wood on the dashboard was a surprise. And the new MDX's interior is quite nice. I can't wait to see it in person at the auto show!

derrick

Infiniti = better marketed than Acura right now without a doubt.

Acura = Honda = conservative. Infiniti = taking a chance ... winning a lot of editors (and consumer's) hearts.

They need to shake things up -- just like when Acura started (ie Legend, Integra, NSX) ... those captured the hearts of drivers. Look at it now? Acura doesn't even have a coupe ... 4 door, very conservative looking cars (I can say that since I own a 2002 TLS + 2007 TSX) with a hint of sport and a few 'techie' SUVs. I'm sure the founder of Honda is shaking his head right now (up in the sky) ...

I'm sure things are profitable but cars are not always practical solutions. There has to be an element of desire / passion to it. I think Acura needs to think outside the box, just as it did back in the late 80s / early 90s to bring its grassroots followers back into the fold. Because right now ... I'm looking elsewhere for the next new car ...

calgary2800

Have you guys ever shifted a manual G35, its not a well designed shifter. You can feel the vibes on your foot and hand. Recently Car and Driver blasted the drivetrain in a comparision with the 328i.

There is no way I would ever buy a Nissan/Infiniti manual car.

picus

The shifter vibration thing is only in VQ cars; the problem is Nissan/Infiniti use the VQ in, well, everything. Apparently they fixed the problem in the new G37. It's been in every manual VQ car I've driven though, so I am not holding my breath.

Ken1997TL

I have some good feelings about Acura's future in general and the next TSX and TL in particular.

Dan

Yes, Infiniti makes a rear wheel drive coupe.

Dirty Type-S

i still prefer Acura Over Anything honestly....

its the love of the company.. been around honda.acura my whole life.. its like the guys with ford or chevy.... thre probably is better stuff out there,, but nothing really can take over the nice 3rd gear jerk of vtech....

S14 n Tsx

I hope so..

mrdeeno

I think the original creators of Acura forgot why they had it.

Honda = mass market, sensible, fuel efficient, family oriented, safe
Acura = should be the passionate, bolder, little compromise, performace, more-than-you-need-and-wililng-to-pay-for-it luxury brand.

Instead, they just turned Acura into an extension of the Honda lineup, and with too much overlap with Honda's upper-end models also. If you look at each infiniti's model DNA and each Acura model's DNA, it's pretty obvious...most infinitis are built on the same platform as a RWD sports car, while most Acuras are built on the same platform as a FWD family sedan.

mrdeeno

After the RL and the RDX, I have my doubts about Acura's future.

vishnus11

starting to think it was just me after having driven 2 manual G35 coupes (one brand new) that had the same damn problem - a level of harshness and vibration near redline that is downright UNACCEPTABLE in a luxury car. THen I saw that G35 review in car and driver, and they blasted it for the same thing.

Its not the motor itself, because the auto is smooth as butter near redline.

ironsurfer129

IMO, i think Acura's interior is best I seen. Sport + Luxury + Futuristic. I seen my friend's G35, the interior layout is too complicated and old fashion. When I first saw the 3rd Gen TL's interior, I was very impress.

However performance wise, I think Infiniti > Acura, unless Honda starts using FR and break the FF curse. (excluding S2k and NSX)

sbuswell

You mean Toyota must make the best cars in the world then as they overtook GM in overall sales last year. In this case I would have to agree as Toyota does make the most reliable cars in the world, 2nd would be Honda IMO.

SHYUperman

iTrader: (1)

^ agree

SiGGy

Dude, does it matter who has a better history?

As you said the guy is mostly right...

Now he is ONLY focusing on performance... which is probably what is important to him.

Honda doesn't sell anything that resembles a race car or stellar performance. The RL is the highest output engine they sell and it's pretty pathetic at that. The S2000 is the best performing car Honda sells now and it's a 4 banger Nissan has the new Skyline GTR they are releasing soon and the 350z.

Honda is at the bottom of the barrel for performance. Once they ditch FWD they might have a chance. Assuming they wake up and make more powerful engines to go with.

Hyundai is even catching up to Honda...


Honda is a conservative manufacturer with performance NOT in mind. I don't know why people think they are some huge powerhouse for performance. It's just not the case they are TOO conservative. That's their entire business model.

And Acura has been ran into the ground by bad marketing and poor technology choices. Acura needs to be revamped with a new lineup and new drivetrain options. And maybe in a 5 years people will take them seriously...

This is the same info I've repeated for years...

I love my TL, and wouldn't trade it up for anything. But I also got a good deal on it

So performance wise Honda is a joke.

But if your looking for a conservative nice car with good performance they can't be beat, I was, and that's why I bought one....

F23A4

IMO, Infiniti is not necessarily better than Acura (although arguably more popular). Rather, Acura seems to have chosen to go on a road less traveled than its Infiniti counterpart.

Acura just needs a few "tweaks" to their lineup to make their products more attractive (i.e.: SH-AWD avail on all models, K23A in the TSX, a V8 option for the RL and maybe a couple of coupes based on both the RL and TL each)

But, I do commend Infiniti for taking it to BMW and having put them on notice. However, this is just not Acura's mission at the moment.

picus

The VQ can get thrashy over 5500rpm. Both of mine did; not horrible, but not nearly "inline 6 smooth".

As for the shifter; yes... in my coupe over 4000rpm it was almost unbearable. Part of the reason my sedan was an auto. I thought for sure it'd be fixed on the new '07's but if anything it is worse.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

i agree, the TL's short throw MT is better than the G's.

mrdeeno

maybe it has something to do with that commercial showing honda vehicles (minivan, civic, accord, etc.) driving with F1 engine sounds in the background, and when the vehicle is up against a window it shows the reflection as an F1 car.

Or maybe because they constantly compare themselves to sportier alternatives and try to find "work-arounds" to their FWD platform limitations such as better suspensions and SH-AWD in order to make them more "performance" oriented. Acura portrays itself as performance oriented, but sends conflicting signals in its products such as lack of V8 or especially RWD and coupes. Sure, their models are relatively decent performers, but if they want to BE what they portray themselves as, then they should EMBRACE performance without compromises rather than finding "workarounds" for inherently less performance capable platforms (FWD).

Like i said before, most Acuras are built on the same platform as a FWD family sedan, while most Infinitis are built on the same platform as a RWD sports car.

to me, Acura's is like the homosexual that is still unsure which way it should swing (come out of the closet? he doesn't even know if he is in the closet!). no one would knock it one way or the other as long as it came out and showed what it wants to be...but people knock it because it sends conflicting signals between the marketing and the products.

Mokos23

Well, back in the late 80s and early to mid 90s Honda kinda had performance, but yes Honda never had a car to compete performance wise to the 300zx Twin Turbo. Hmm which makes me wonder if the NSX vs 300zx TT, who would win that race? The Prelude kind of had sports car aspirations, but w/o modding it, it had all looks and no go. I've never driven an S2000, but is it really faster than a 350z or G35 coupe?

I don't know why Honda wants to be conservative or don't want to take risks. Maybe because they don't want to mess up the formula which is make quality balanced cars and sell them at a descent price. Actually Honda should keep doing that, but Acura shouldn't.

tsx19's

Man I Think That Honda Has A Better History....
Nissan Are Good But Cant Beat The Honda Power!!

mrdeeno

not speaking of racing heritage, but of production heritage...when people think of Honda heritage, they think of Civics and Accords and motorcycles.

When people think of Nissan heritage, they don't think of Sentra or Altima, they think of the Datsun Z.

Mokos23

When I think of Nissan heritage I think of the Datsun/Nissan Maxima too

Jackygor

When i hear Nissan, I think of this...



gota love those twin snails

and this guy



I dont know why

S14 n Tsx

^ I can see that but remind me of my 240.

mrdeeno

yeah, this dude doesn't come to mind when i think nissan.