Porsche: Taycan News
#121
Porsche’s software update for the Taycan falls short of Tesla’s over-the-air mod
Potential Taycan owners: rejoice. You guys have to visit a dealership, sit in the waiting room, have a coffee (and possibly pay the fees) to “install the OTA updates” .
In the years before the Taycan’s unveiling, Porsche stated that the all-electric sedan, then called the Mission E, will feature over-the-air updates. Such a function would provide the all-electric Porsche a comparable ownership experience to Tesla’s vehicles, which receive consistent OTA updates every few weeks.
This was mentioned by Porsche CEO Oliver Blume, who noted that some of the Taycan’s OTA updates would allow a 400-hp version of the Mission E to be bumped to 450 hp. Such statements definitely suggest a Tesla-like update process, but if a recent letter from the German automaker is any indication, it appears that software updates for the Taycan will be a bit more old-fashioned, at least for the time being.
In a letter shared by Nicolas Boehmer on LinkedIn, the automaker stated that OTA updates are only used for the Taycan’s smaller patches for now. When it comes to major updates, Taycan owners would have to drive over to a Porsche Center to have the update manually loaded onto their vehicle. This, according to Porsche, is partly due to the size of the update itself, since physical centers have a high-speed internet line.
“The OTA system is already used for updates of a smaller scope. However, for compound updates such as this one, such a large amount of data is transferred that a smooth update in the Porsche Center is ensured with a high-speed line. Subsequently, the function of all control units is verified with a test. With a technology carrier such as the Taycan, the complexity of the systems is at a very high level, so we decided on this procedure,” the company wrote.
As noted by Mario Herger of The Last Driver License Holder, the size of the software update likely has little to do with Porsche’s decision to conduct manual updates for the Taycan. Tesla, for example, regularly rolls out software updates that are worth hundreds of megabytes or even gigabytes of data, and they are usually downloaded using a mobile network or on a regular home broadband connection without issue. With this in mind, Herger stated that the complexity mentioned by Porsche likely refers to the Taycan’s electronics, which are far more complex than those found in Tesla’s electric cars.
Tesla is vertically-integrated, and it manufactures a significant number of its vehicles’ components in-house. This allows Tesla to simplify its cars’ electronics architecture with relatively few ECUs and AI chips. Traditional automakers do not follow this model, with the Taycan’s electronics reportedly having over 100 ECUs, many of which are from varying manufacturers. This ultimately makes it very difficult to coordinate regular software updates, which likely encouraged Porsche to simply perform the Taycan’s software upgrades manually.
“The coordination of a software update with so many suppliers is certainly no honeypot and the Porsche management seems to have taken the easiest way to periodically order Taycan owners to the workshop for an update. The fact that Porsche itself has to adjust to a rhythm of software updates lasting several weeks is challenge enough. If dozens of suppliers have to be coordinated, the complexity increases enormously,” Herger wrote.
That being said, Porsche still deserves some recognition for actually following through and rolling out a legitimate software update for the Taycan. As the company continues its push for electric vehicles with the Taycan Cross Turismo and the electric Macan, there may be a chance for the automaker to be more vertically-integrated in the near future.
In the years before the Taycan’s unveiling, Porsche stated that the all-electric sedan, then called the Mission E, will feature over-the-air updates. Such a function would provide the all-electric Porsche a comparable ownership experience to Tesla’s vehicles, which receive consistent OTA updates every few weeks.
This was mentioned by Porsche CEO Oliver Blume, who noted that some of the Taycan’s OTA updates would allow a 400-hp version of the Mission E to be bumped to 450 hp. Such statements definitely suggest a Tesla-like update process, but if a recent letter from the German automaker is any indication, it appears that software updates for the Taycan will be a bit more old-fashioned, at least for the time being.
In a letter shared by Nicolas Boehmer on LinkedIn, the automaker stated that OTA updates are only used for the Taycan’s smaller patches for now. When it comes to major updates, Taycan owners would have to drive over to a Porsche Center to have the update manually loaded onto their vehicle. This, according to Porsche, is partly due to the size of the update itself, since physical centers have a high-speed internet line.
“The OTA system is already used for updates of a smaller scope. However, for compound updates such as this one, such a large amount of data is transferred that a smooth update in the Porsche Center is ensured with a high-speed line. Subsequently, the function of all control units is verified with a test. With a technology carrier such as the Taycan, the complexity of the systems is at a very high level, so we decided on this procedure,” the company wrote.
As noted by Mario Herger of The Last Driver License Holder, the size of the software update likely has little to do with Porsche’s decision to conduct manual updates for the Taycan. Tesla, for example, regularly rolls out software updates that are worth hundreds of megabytes or even gigabytes of data, and they are usually downloaded using a mobile network or on a regular home broadband connection without issue. With this in mind, Herger stated that the complexity mentioned by Porsche likely refers to the Taycan’s electronics, which are far more complex than those found in Tesla’s electric cars.
Tesla is vertically-integrated, and it manufactures a significant number of its vehicles’ components in-house. This allows Tesla to simplify its cars’ electronics architecture with relatively few ECUs and AI chips. Traditional automakers do not follow this model, with the Taycan’s electronics reportedly having over 100 ECUs, many of which are from varying manufacturers. This ultimately makes it very difficult to coordinate regular software updates, which likely encouraged Porsche to simply perform the Taycan’s software upgrades manually.
“The coordination of a software update with so many suppliers is certainly no honeypot and the Porsche management seems to have taken the easiest way to periodically order Taycan owners to the workshop for an update. The fact that Porsche itself has to adjust to a rhythm of software updates lasting several weeks is challenge enough. If dozens of suppliers have to be coordinated, the complexity increases enormously,” Herger wrote.
That being said, Porsche still deserves some recognition for actually following through and rolling out a legitimate software update for the Taycan. As the company continues its push for electric vehicles with the Taycan Cross Turismo and the electric Macan, there may be a chance for the automaker to be more vertically-integrated in the near future.
#124
Someone in my neighborhood bought a Taycan Turbo a couple weeks ago. It looks absolutely stunning. Whether or not the Model S is a better EV is one thing, but in an area where Model 3 and Model S's are a dime a dozen, the Taycan is without a doubt a looker.
#125
They’ll sit at home and enjoy a Model X loaner while their car is being fixed, and it’ll be will be delivered at home. .
#126
#129
Few people remember this, but the concept car that previewed the model was shown at the 2018 Geneva Motor Show, which happened less than three years ago.
The short time between the concept's reveal and the launch of the production model can only be made possible by the advent of Virtual Reality technologies at Porsche, whose engineers can now test a huge number of systems and components in a virtual environment. Even so, the Taycan Cross Turismo was delayed by several months because of the international health crisis.
This way, the process is not only many times cheaper, since not as many pre-production prototypes need to be built and then ultimately destroyed, but it is also many times faster than the traditional way.
As a matter of fact, virtual prototypes of the Taycan Cross Turismo have already completed over 20 million kilometers (12,4 million miles) by now, which is why the real pre-production models have been rarely seen in the wild in the last year.
The car is so close to being officially revealed that Porsche hasn’t even bothered to throw any more camouflage on the prototypes it sends on the streets nowadays.
Porsche's second electric-only vehicle after the ‘regular’ Taycan, all that the swoopy station wagon wants is to steal a slice of the Tesla Model X market, even though it will be quite a bit more expensive and won't offer a 7-seat version.
That said, just like Model X, the Taycan Cross Turismo is an all-electric luxury crossover/wagon with all-wheel-drive and slightly higher ground clearance, so it's bound to be cross-shopped at some point.
Identical under the hood with the regular Taycan, it's expected that the car will also have similar performance figures despite a slight increase in weight.
We are talking about a lithium-ion battery that's based on the 800-volt architecture, permanent magnet synchronous electric motors and at least three versions: a Taycan Cross Turismo 4S as the entry-level, followed by a Turbo and a Turbo S version, with up to 761 horsepower in boost mode.
The top spec version should be able to go from 0 to 100 kph (62 mph) in under three seconds in the best conditions, meaning that the Porsche Taycan Cross Turismo will not only be the most expensive station wagon on the planet, but also the quickest accelerating family car out there.
There are rumors that Porsche is even going for the Nurburgring lap record in the station wagon class, with a 7:30 minute time being chased by last summer’s prototypes.
Even though the Mission E Cross Turismo Concept, upon which its design is based, was a four-seater, the Taycan Cross Turismo should be offered with either a 2+2 or a 5-seat arrangement, not unlike the ICE-powered Panamera Sport Turismo.
If the technical bits, including the battery, are identical to the Taycan sedan, the range will probably be slightly lower, but Porsche might have listened to the nay-sayers and might improve the number of available kWh slightly to keep things proportional.
There is obviously no word on pricing just yet, but considering that the Porsche Taycan Turbo S starts at $185,000 in the U.S., you can expect a Cross Turismo in similar spec to cross the $200,000 mark. And yes, it will be offered in the United States, just like the Panamera Sport Turismo is offered as well now.
Sure, some may say that number is nowhere near the current most expensive wagon, which is the Ferrari GTC4 Lusso, but that is more of a shooting brake and doesn’t even have rear passenger doors, unlike the Porsche.
The short time between the concept's reveal and the launch of the production model can only be made possible by the advent of Virtual Reality technologies at Porsche, whose engineers can now test a huge number of systems and components in a virtual environment. Even so, the Taycan Cross Turismo was delayed by several months because of the international health crisis.
This way, the process is not only many times cheaper, since not as many pre-production prototypes need to be built and then ultimately destroyed, but it is also many times faster than the traditional way.
As a matter of fact, virtual prototypes of the Taycan Cross Turismo have already completed over 20 million kilometers (12,4 million miles) by now, which is why the real pre-production models have been rarely seen in the wild in the last year.
The car is so close to being officially revealed that Porsche hasn’t even bothered to throw any more camouflage on the prototypes it sends on the streets nowadays.
Porsche's second electric-only vehicle after the ‘regular’ Taycan, all that the swoopy station wagon wants is to steal a slice of the Tesla Model X market, even though it will be quite a bit more expensive and won't offer a 7-seat version.
That said, just like Model X, the Taycan Cross Turismo is an all-electric luxury crossover/wagon with all-wheel-drive and slightly higher ground clearance, so it's bound to be cross-shopped at some point.
Identical under the hood with the regular Taycan, it's expected that the car will also have similar performance figures despite a slight increase in weight.
We are talking about a lithium-ion battery that's based on the 800-volt architecture, permanent magnet synchronous electric motors and at least three versions: a Taycan Cross Turismo 4S as the entry-level, followed by a Turbo and a Turbo S version, with up to 761 horsepower in boost mode.
The top spec version should be able to go from 0 to 100 kph (62 mph) in under three seconds in the best conditions, meaning that the Porsche Taycan Cross Turismo will not only be the most expensive station wagon on the planet, but also the quickest accelerating family car out there.
There are rumors that Porsche is even going for the Nurburgring lap record in the station wagon class, with a 7:30 minute time being chased by last summer’s prototypes.
Even though the Mission E Cross Turismo Concept, upon which its design is based, was a four-seater, the Taycan Cross Turismo should be offered with either a 2+2 or a 5-seat arrangement, not unlike the ICE-powered Panamera Sport Turismo.
If the technical bits, including the battery, are identical to the Taycan sedan, the range will probably be slightly lower, but Porsche might have listened to the nay-sayers and might improve the number of available kWh slightly to keep things proportional.
There is obviously no word on pricing just yet, but considering that the Porsche Taycan Turbo S starts at $185,000 in the U.S., you can expect a Cross Turismo in similar spec to cross the $200,000 mark. And yes, it will be offered in the United States, just like the Panamera Sport Turismo is offered as well now.
Sure, some may say that number is nowhere near the current most expensive wagon, which is the Ferrari GTC4 Lusso, but that is more of a shooting brake and doesn’t even have rear passenger doors, unlike the Porsche.
#132
If you go by the flawed EPA ratings, more than likely. It's the same drivetrain and battery after all.
The people buying these cars couldn't care less about the range anyway, as long as it's 'sufficient'. Just like the 911 buyers are not going to worry about what their mileage is. That's for plebs and people who drive by paper-specs.
The people buying these cars couldn't care less about the range anyway, as long as it's 'sufficient'. Just like the 911 buyers are not going to worry about what their mileage is. That's for plebs and people who drive by paper-specs.
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Comfy (01-12-2021)
#138
#140
#141
#142
These EA chargers can be pretty hit or miss. I'm 30 min in to this video and he's plugged into 5 different EA chargers and all of them have had some sort of issue from taking way to long to start charging before he gave up and moved to another charger, to charging over the stated 150kw rate and then dropping down to 50kw, to charging up to 270kw then crashing. I was watching the TFL MachE vs Y video yesterday and they had similar issues with the EA chargers. Apparently not all charging networks are the same. I'd like to see more info on his Taycan cannonball run seems like he had good luck there.
Last edited by #1 STUNNA; 01-11-2021 at 09:52 AM.
#145
These EA chargers can be pretty hit or miss. I'm 30 min in to this video and he's plugged into 5 different EA chargers and all of them have had some sort of issue from taking way to long to start charging before he gave up and moved to another charger, to charging over the stated 150kw rate and then dropping down to 50kw, to charging up to 270kw then crashing. I was watching the TFL MachE vs Y video yesterday and they had similar issues with the EA chargers. Apparently not all charging networks are the same. I'd like to see more info on his Taycan cannonball run seems like he had good luck there. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR41-IS9HTU
Although, for $140k, it should be.
#147
I had a friend who drove up from LA to SF in an e-tron. Just a 400 mile trip up I-5. What was supposed to be a 7 hour drive with 3 charging stops ended up taking 12 hours. Frankly there just isn't that many DC fast chargers yet. He had planned on stopping off just outside of Bakersfield for the first charge, but of the 7 stations available, 2 were broken, and the other 5 were already taken with a dozen other cars also waiting. Similar wait at the stop outside of Coalinga that had 7 stations, which incidentally is next to a "small" Supercharger lot with about 20 Superchargers (there's a bigger 40 Supercharger lot a few exits down the freeway). By the time he rolled into Gilroy, it was well past midnight so there was no wait for the chargers there.
And there-in lies the issue with non-Tesla EVs currently. Everyone, including Teslas, can use (fight over?) the comparatively small network of CCS stations, but only Teslas can use the massive network of Superchargers. It might get better as time goes on, but currently one of the competitive advantages that Tesla holds that nobody else can offer is the exclusive use of their vast charging network. I'm no fan of Tesla because of their shoddy build quality, but I have to admit that a BEV for long trips just isn't in the cards for me until there's some parity for the non-Supercharger infrastructure.
#148
They might be doing the same as they do for engine performance. They rate it under worst case conditions, not normal performance. That's why you see them making engines that are advertised 300hp (for example) at the crank and people measuring that at the wheels.
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kurtatx (01-11-2021)
#149
I know Audi significantly underestimates everything, too
#150
i seriously doubt anyone who can afford a $200k Turbo S Taycan really give a shit about range. If they needed to go far, they will either fly first class, private jet, or drive their other $200k SUV.
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Comfy (01-13-2021)
#153
It's not underestimated, it's just rated in "worst case" conditions. So they'll test it in hot weather at high altitude or something and publish the output in those conditions. That way you're not pissed off when your car underperforms when you're on top of a mountain in a desert. Basically stating it can be no worse than this, but it can certainly be a lot better in better conditions. It's the difference of using the term "at least" vs "up to" in marketing info.
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Yumcha (01-14-2021)
#157
Good, looks like the EV competition is heating up. Now will Acura and the other Jap brands, please will you join the fray?
#159
Electrify America and Porsche were very involved with this trip, they got super special treatment. EA sent out techs to all 28 charging station on their route to make sure that the 350kw charging was working at each one. They were were given the phone numbers of all the EA management staff even the CEO so they could call if anything went wrong.
Porsche shutdown one of their service centers for a day just so they could work on the Taycan before it left and had to rip parts out of others cars to get it working.
So not your normal cross country trip, you ain’t getting that kinda service. The normal person gets the EA that Kyle experienced the day before where 11 out of 15 chargers gave him issues or didn’t work.
Porsche shutdown one of their service centers for a day just so they could work on the Taycan before it left and had to rip parts out of others cars to get it working.
So not your normal cross country trip, you ain’t getting that kinda service. The normal person gets the EA that Kyle experienced the day before where 11 out of 15 chargers gave him issues or didn’t work.
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Comfy (01-22-2021)
#160
Making my way through this video. So far all of the 350kw chargers are still crashing with the Taycan, every single one, has to use 150kw. Not sure if it’s a Porsche or ea issue but either way they’re both owned by VW so they should’ve known about this problem years ago. It seems it’s only with certain model 350kw charger but so far that’s the only ones installed at the stations he’s going to.