North American Auto Industry Crisis news **Pontiac's Last Day (page 28)**

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Old 10-08-2008, 12:02 PM
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North American Auto Industry Crisis news **Pontiac's Last Day (page 28)**

Trade association head blames credit and economic problems, urges implementation of the $700B rescue plan.

DETROIT (AP) -- The chairwoman of the National Automobile Dealers Association says the credit crunch and economic problems are likely to cause 700 auto dealers to go under this year.

Speaking to the Automotive Press Association in Detroit, Annette Sykora on Tuesday urged fast government action on putting a $700 billion financial industry rescue plan in place.

The Texas auto dealer says quick action will thaw frozen credit, restore consumer confidence and help the auto industry.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/07/news...ion=2008100714
Old 10-08-2008, 12:13 PM
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NBC NY news just did a little story last night on 2 dealers in the area who are closing down in the next few days. One can't blame only the economy for its problems, IMO, because it's a Chrysler dealership. We all know those aren't selling very well at all right now, and it's not just because of the economy. However, it definitely is rough out there and dealers are having a tough time securing credit to pay for cars on the lot, etc.

So many businesses are being affected by this recent problem. It is unfortunate that the actions of these poorly run companies are affecting everyone else.
Old 10-08-2008, 05:25 PM
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let me guess, its gonna take 1 billion per dealer to fix?
Old 10-08-2008, 09:01 PM
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A lot of these dealerships will most likely get bought out by the big auto groups. The good old family owned dealership is gone, replaced by giant corporations.
Old 10-09-2008, 02:39 AM
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^ nope - when there are fewer units to sell you need fewer dealerships.
Old 10-09-2008, 01:00 PM
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Ouch.


GM, Ford fall sharply as outlook dims
A new report says U.S. auto sales will hit recession levels this year, threatening their survival.
By Alex Taylor III, senior editor
Last Updated: October 9, 2008: 11:40 AM ET

NEW YORK (Fortune) -- How bad is it going to get for automakers? Worse, much worse.

Investors made a shocking vote of no confidence in the future of U.S. automakers Thursday. GM (GM, Fortune 500) stock was down more than 14% to $5.92 a share, while Ford (F, Fortune 500) fell 7.5% to $2.46. That gave GM a market capitalization of $4.3 billion - chump change for this industrial behemoth - while Ford stood only slightly better at $6.6 billion.

The stock selloff effectively puts these companies on death watch and it is easy to see why. A new report by Global Insight, the economic forecasting and consulting firm based outside Boston, shows U.S. auto sales hitting recession levels this year - and then sinking lower in 2009.

"We won't get back to where we were in 2006 until 2013," said George Magliano, director of forecasting for North America. Global Insight is forecasting sales of 13.8 million units this year and only 13.4 million in 2009, compared with 16.1 million last year.

The impact of oil prices at the beginning of the year was mild compared to the squeeze from the credit crunch. As Nigel Griffiths, Global Insight's managing director of global forecasting, points out, expensive oil merely meant that wealth was being transferred to oil-producing countries like Russia from oil-consuming ones like the United States. Now, the credit crunch is destroying wealth and making it impossible for customers to buy.

"The impact is worse than if the price of oil had been sustained at $200 a barrel," he said.
No help from foreign markets

It turns out that auto finance companies were as guilty as mortgage lenders in providing loans to subprime borrowers - and their generosity is coming back to haunt them. Lenders dramatically cut standards for credit worthiness at the beginning of 2008 and now delinquency rates have been shooting up to levels not seen in 30 years.

"Some 18% of sales volume came from people with bad credit scores," said Magliano. "Now the subprime buyer has been squeezed out."

There is little relief overseas. According to Global Insight, at least half a dozen countries in Western Europe experienced greater house-price appreciation over the last 10 years than did the United States. Ireland led the way with a nearly 250% rise and the United Kingdom was not far behind. With that kind of wealth accumulation unlikely to be repeated, sales experienced a "total collapse" in July and have gone into a "violent downshift."

Nor is Asia likely to provide a safety net. Sales growth in China is slowing markedly and vehicle demand in India is also ebbing. Even the much publicized $3,000 Nano car developed by India's Tata Motors is off to a slow start. Plans for an assembly plant in India have been scuttled by local opposition and Global Insight says Nano "will only see a big build-up in volumes from 2010."

"When will the credit crunch free up enough to allow consumers to finance again?" asked Griffiths. "That is the several-trillion-dollar question. It is the core assumption on which all forecasts will be based and it is unforecastable."

To combat this flood of negative news, GM has adopted the Sarah Palin approach: bypassing the media by communicating directly with customers and investors. GM executives can now be seen in videos posted on its Fast Lane Web site talking about the company.

In the first video, posted Sept. 22, chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner responds to the question "What's GM's future look like?" by saying "GM's future is actually quite bright." After ticking off progress on new models, technology and sales in developing markets," he concluded by saying, "though times are challenging, we're really making sure that we keep planting the seeds for what we think should be a very exciting future for General Motors."

Three weeks later, you have to wonder what he'd be saying today?


Find this article at:
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/09/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes
Old 10-09-2008, 02:46 PM
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The automobile industry is on the brink.

I think 700 dealers closing is gonna be the tip of the iceberg.
Old 10-09-2008, 06:02 PM
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Mebbe massive shutdown sales could be had at my fave manufacturer's dealership for a good price, mebbe...?
Old 10-09-2008, 06:31 PM
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^^ Everything must go!!! All sales are final!!!
We are SLASHING prices!!!
Old 10-09-2008, 08:18 PM
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50-70% off of all merchandise at a Porsche dealership? Maybe?
Old 10-10-2008, 04:08 AM
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Once everyone can afford to pay cash for a car the market will stabalize.
Old 10-10-2008, 04:23 AM
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^Sad, but true
Old 10-11-2008, 03:44 PM
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North American Auto Industry Crisis news **GM Receive 2nd Loan on 01/16 (page 11)**

GM, Chrysler in merger talks - source
Companies declined to confirm talks are taking place, as struggling automakers cope with economic downturn.
Last Updated: October 11, 2008: 11:32 AM ET

DETROIT (AP) -- General Motors Corp., Chrysler LLC and Cerberus Capital Management LP have held preliminary talks about a merger or an acquisition of Chrysler by GM, according to a person familiar with the talks.

Chrysler, which is 80.1% owned by Cerberus, already has a joint venture with GM making a hybrid gas-electric powertrain, and has discussed a full merger or acquisition with GM, said the person, who did not want to be identified because the talks have not been made public.

The Wall Street Journal, citing people it described as familiar with the discussions, reported that Cerberus, a private equity firm that also owns 51% of GMAC Financial Services, proposed trading Chrysler's automotive operations to GM in exchange for GM's remaining 49% stake in GMAC.

The New York Times, also citing people familiar with the talks, reported that the automakers were discussing a merger. GMAC, primarily an auto lender, also has significant mortgage lending operations that have been hit hard by the crisis in that industry.

The talks have stalled because of the recent turmoil in the financial markets, according to the Journal. Its sources said negotiations could resume if markets stabilize because both GM and Cerberus want to quickly divest the assets under discussion.

The negotiations between 100-year-old GM and 83-year-old Chrysler began more than a month ago. The Times said its sources pegged the chances of a merger being completed at "50-50."

"Without referencing this specific rumor, as we've often said, GM officials routinely discuss issues of mutual interest with other automakers," GM spokesman Tony Cervone said in an e-mail.

"The company is looking at a number of potential global partnerships as it explores growth opportunities around the world," Chrysler said in an e-mailed statement issued Friday night. "Beyond those partnerships already announced, however, Chrysler has not formed any new agreements and has no further announcements to make at this time."

Making history. A tie-up between the automotive giants would be historic for the industry and solidify GM's position as the global sales leader, which it has been in danger of losing to Toyota Motor Corp.

GM and Toyota finished 2007 essentially even in vehicles sold worldwide. This would not be the first time Detroit's automakers have explored mergers.

GM talked with DaimlerChrysler AG in 2007 about acquiring Chrysler before Cerberus made a deal to acquire most of the automaker, but the talks fell through when GM decided it should concentrate on cost savings and efficiencies by globalizing its own operations.

In 2005, GM and Ford Motor Co. reportedly held talks regarding a potential business combination. Cerberus acquired its GMAC stake in 2006 for $14 billion and bought 80.1% of Chrysler from Daimler AG in August 2007 in a $7.4 billion deal.

Cerberus and Daimler confirmed last month they are in talks for Cerberus to acquire Daimler's remaining Chrysler stake.

The auto industry has been hit hard in recent weeks by the effects of the credit crisis, prompting GM and Ford to issue statements Friday to dispel the notion that they might be headed for bankruptcy.

GM and Ford shares were battered with the rest of the stock market this week, falling to lows not seen in decades. GM (GM, Fortune 500) shares lost about half of their already-depressed value during the week, closing at $4.89 on Friday. Ford shares fell similarly, ending the week at $1.99.

GM said Friday, in response to the stock price, that it is nor considering a bankruptcy filing.

"Clearly we face unprecedented challenges related to uncertainties in the financial markets globally and weakening economic fundamentals in many key markets, but bankruptcy protection is not an option GM is considering," a company statement said. To top of page
First Published: October 11, 2008: 6:13 AM ET


Find this article at:
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/11/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes
Old 10-11-2008, 11:49 PM
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fail + fail = Fail x 2
Old 10-12-2008, 12:03 AM
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^ I was thinking the same thing when I read about this earlier. It's like putting wings on the Titanic and expecting it to fly. I guess they are thinking it can't get any worse.
Old 10-12-2008, 01:30 AM
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General Mopar, sounds pretty mean to me.
Old 10-12-2008, 02:01 AM
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Cobalt with a Hemi?
Old 10-12-2008, 10:44 AM
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If this merger makes sense or not will be defined by HOW it will be implemented. It could make a lot of sense, or it could fail miserably. It's up to the quality of the people who design the merger. Btw, I happen to be a GM shareholder and am betting in the survival of GM.
Old 10-12-2008, 01:27 PM
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Cerberus is so eager trying to find ways to get rid of Chrysler, now that it realizes it has purchased a piece of junk from Daimler.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:06 AM
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^ True.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:22 AM
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Chrysler = Fail. GM = Fail.

Chrysler + GM = don't know...
Old 10-13-2008, 03:29 AM
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Originally Posted by gavriil
If this merger makes sense or not will be defined by HOW it will be implemented. It could make a lot of sense, or it could fail miserably. It's up to the quality of the people who design the merger. Btw, I happen to be a GM shareholder and am betting in the survival of GM.
I agree, if executed correctly it could form one hell of a power house, because there are so many synergies that could be created and the significant reduce in multiple process/dealer networks, and would certainly see the killing of a few brands/models/dealers themselves, the only downside I see is that there will be LOTS of jobs lost.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:42 AM
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Imma do a school project on this. It sounds interesting.
Old 10-13-2008, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
fail + fail = Fail x 2
Old 10-13-2008, 11:01 AM
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Why? GM has enough brands as it is, and Chrysler models target similar demographics as GM models do. It made sense for BMW to buy out MINI, somewhat for MB to buy Smart, etc. but GM and Chrysler? Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.... I'm betting that it never will happen.
Old 10-13-2008, 11:42 AM
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GM is like the guy who just got his VD cured and Chrysler is like the $5 hooker standing outside of the clinic he's about to walk out of. GM needs to steer clear of this.
Old 10-13-2008, 11:47 AM
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I think Cerberus wants GMAC. That's where the $$$ is.
Let the Fed bailout the bad debt from GMAC...and Cerberus has a winner!
Old 10-13-2008, 12:30 PM
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Sounds like the sequel of the Studebaker and Packard deal.

My old college professor described that deal as two drunks helping each other cross a busy road.
Old 10-13-2008, 12:32 PM
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GM would seek cash to acquire Chrysler
But its unclear whether Cerberus willing to pay the price, analysts say

Oct 13, 2008 04:30 AM

Ton Krisher
Associated Press

DETROIT–For General Motors Corp. to acquire Chrysler LLC and all of its warts, GM would have to get desperately needed cash as part of the deal. Lots of it, according to industry analysts.

With both automakers struggling to survive amid slumping sales, a slowing global economy and an unprecedented credit crunch, it's unclear whether Chrysler's majority owner, Cerberus Capital Management LP, would be willing to pay up, or whether Washington might even get involved to save one or both struggling automakers.

"There's got to be more in it for GM than just Chrysler," said Erich Merkle, an auto industry analyst with Crowe Horwath LLP, an accounting and consulting firm. "If you put two auto companies together, both that are losing money, both that are losing market share, you've just got an auto company that's losing market share faster and losing more money.''

GM and Cerberus, which owns 80.1 per cent of Chrysler, have held preliminary talks about an acquisition or other combination of the two automakers, according to persons familiar with the discussions who did not want to be identified because the talks have not been made public.

A tie-up between the automotive giants would be historic for the industry and solidify GM's position as the global sales leader, which it has been in danger of losing to Toyota Motor Corp.

GM and Chrysler already have a joint venture with BMW AG making a hybrid gas-electric powertrain. While melding the companies could save money by combining management, engineering, manufacturing and administrative staffs, analysts say consolidation would bring more costs and the rewards probably wouldn't come for several years.

That might be too late for both automakers.

Auburn Hills-based Chrysler, a privately held company, doesn't have to open its books, but it lost at least $510 million (U.S.) in the first quarter and $1.6 billion last year. Its sales are down 25 per cent so far this year, the worst drop of any major automaker.

Detroit-based GM is burning up more than $1 billion in cash per month, with several analysts predicting it will reach its minimum operating cash level of $14 billion sometime next year. Sales are down 18 per cent, and the company has lost $57.5 billion in the past 18 months, largely because of tax accounting changes.

All of this comes as U.S. sales have slowed to their lowest point in 15 years, making bankruptcy possible for all of the cash-strapped Detroit Three if things don't turn around soon enough.

Not exactly the prime scenario for a GM-Chrysler combination, said analyst Kevin Tynan of New York-based Argus Research Corp.

"Even though you're getting the rationalization of folding the two businesses together, it doesn't make sense at this time," he said. "There's got to be some sort of outside motivation for them to do that sort of deal, especially in this market.''

That outside motive, analysts speculated, could be the federal government, which would inherit massive pension liabilities if either company went under.

In exchange for taking on Chrysler, analysts envisioned that GM could be given access to low-rate emergency borrowing from the Federal Reserve's discount window, used in normal times by banks.

GM, though, said it is not going to the Fed at present.

"We're not actively pursuing anything at this time," said Greg Martin, GM's Washington spokesperson.

The Wall Street Journal reported late Friday that Cerberus might trade Chrysler for GM's 49 per cent stake in GMAC Financial Services. Cerberus bought 51 per cent of GM's former financial arm for $14 billion in 2006, but since then GMAC has suffered because of bad mortgage loans.

GMAC could look good to Cerberus now, Merkle said, because its insurance and auto businesses are profitable and the federal government may take on its bad mortgages through the $700 billion financial bailout plan approved earlier this month.

If a merger were to go through, GM could move quickly to cut costs and save billions, said Van Conway, a mergers and acquisitions expert and partner with Birmingham, Mich.-based Conway & MacKenzie. The company would have to calculate whether it has enough cash to stay alive and fund the deal, he said.

If the numbers work, a lean, merged automaker would be in a strong position to make money once the U.S. market recovers and people start buying vehicles again, Conway said.


Neither GM nor Chrysler would confirm that they've talked, but each said discussions between automakers are routine. There also were weekend reports that Chrysler was in talks with Nissan-Renault, and The New York Times reported that GM had approached Ford Motor Co. about a merger earlier in the year, but Ford wanted to stay independent.

The auto industry has been hit hard in recent weeks by the effects of the credit crisis, prompting GM and Ford to issue statements Friday to dispel the notion that they might be headed for bankruptcy.

GM and Ford shares were battered with the rest of the stock market this week, falling to lows not seen in decades. GM shares lost about half of their already-depressed value during the week, closing at $4.89 on Friday. Ford shares fell similarly, ending the week at $1.99.
http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/516427
Old 10-13-2008, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by chill_dog
GM is like the guy who just got his VD cured and Chrysler is like the $5 hooker standing outside of the clinic he's about to walk out of. GM needs to steer clear of this.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:14 PM
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Like the proverbial two drunks trying to hold each other up - except this is worse.

Not gonna happen. Cerberus doesn't have the cash to pay out and GM has too many brands already. The Jeep brand is the only one worth anything and it is rapidly losing value in the face of our oil constrained future.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by The Dougler
I agree, if executed correctly it could form one hell of a power house, because there are so many synergies that could be created and the significant reduce in multiple process/dealer networks, and would certainly see the killing of a few brands/models/dealers themselves, the only downside I see is that there will be LOTS of jobs lost.
For sure lots of jobs will be lost and Detroit really needs a severe trimming, if not clipping, of its workforce. We needed fewer, more competent people in that industry if it's to survive. However I am sure it will survive simply because the gov't wont let it not survive. It will just be redefined. About time. We will only see better product out of this turmoil.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + TL
Imma do a school project on this. It sounds interesting.
THis is a great case study for school. These are historic times we are witnessing guys. In 2060 people will be saying "remember the financial crisis of 2008?....blah, blah...."
Old 10-13-2008, 03:41 PM
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Originally Posted by gavriil
For sure lots of jobs will be lost and Detroit really needs a severe trimming, if not clipping, of its workforce. We needed fewer, more competent people in that industry if it's to survive. However I am sure it will survive simply because the gov't wont let it not survive. It will just be redefined. About time. We will only see better product out of this turmoil.
Let's hope.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by I Go To Costco
Why? GM has enough brands as it is, and Chrysler models target similar demographics as GM models do. It made sense for BMW to buy out MINI, somewhat for MB to buy Smart, etc. but GM and Chrysler? Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.... I'm betting that it never will happen.
Btw, right now, it is just an idea that's officially being discussed. Far from a sure thing. Plus if it is to happen, GM will need some serious cash infusion in order to do it. And with the credit markets being as they are, only the gov't can provide that kind of infusion. Plus it will take years before it shows any results, if it even will show any at all. Lots of ifs, buts and maybes.
Old 10-13-2008, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
I think Cerberus wants GMAC. That's where the $$$ is.
Let the Fed bailout the bad debt from GMAC...and Cerberus has a winner!
Two things I believe are main points here about Cerberus and you mentioned one:

1. Cerberus wants to dip into GMAC
2. Cerberus wants to get rid of Chrysler because they know they bit more than they can chew with it.
Old 10-13-2008, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by gavriil
For sure lots of jobs will be lost and Detroit really needs a severe trimming, if not clipping, of its workforce. We needed fewer, more competent people in that industry if it's to survive. However I am sure it will survive simply because the gov't wont let it not survive. It will just be redefined. About time. We will only see better product out of this turmoil.
Cutting jobs, closing factories ..... Hmm, it's not gonna be so easy with UAW chief Ron Gettelfinger still around. However, go Chapter 11 and pressure the Supreme Court Judges to rewrite union contracts. Now this is the way out.

Cerberus is smart. It doesn't want to deal with the unions no more, because Cerberus knows it's a dead-end.
Old 10-13-2008, 05:40 PM
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The key to the success of the M&A is clearly eliminating lots of product. Here's my rundown:

Dodge trucks will be entirely eliminated in favor of GM/Chevy trucks. A cummins option will become available.

Saab will be sold, and so will Hummer
Jeep will be cut back to 3 models

On the GM side I would slice them apart. They would only be allowed 1 model per segment, they are currently building too much crap that's all the same with different names. 1 small fit sized car, 1 entry level civic sized car, 1 accord style sedan (mailbu), 1 large full size sedan, 1 minivan with 2 trim levels, 1 small suv, 1 medium, 1 large (suburban), 1 station wagon.

to simplify manufacturing processes, every care would come with 2 models base and LOADED. Base would include: Power Windows/locks, CD w/mp3, AC, remote entry, 6 air bags, ABS, stability control. Vehicles valued 30k+ will have HIDs standard and comfort access.

Loaded versions will have all of the above + Power seats, sunroof, better stereos, larger wheels, navi, bluetooth, HIds, Comfort access, and probably something I'm forgetting.

I would close all the chrysler factories as well their quality speaks for itself. A % of their factory workers would be integrated with GM, I would base my factory closers such that to meet attainment numbers all factories running would have to be running at 110% capacity, hopefully creating about a month shortage of inventory. It's better to have the workers working all the time then this up down crap.

Suppliers would be aligned so that parts are sourced from fewer suppliers to increase volume discounts.

Dealers, out of the 3 dealers, simply the largest ones in each respective town will be selected, the rest closed.

Beyond that well a bunch of white collars will get fired.
Old 10-13-2008, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by The Dougler
The key to the success of the M&A is clearly eliminating lots of product. Here's my rundown:

Beyond that well a bunch of white collars will get fired.

You could have simplified your rundown to one sentence. There is very little logic to this merger other than an excuse to become "too big to fail" and hope an Obama presidency throws a lifeline to the GM+C. They're burning cash too darn fast.

Who's the genius who said consumers are crying out for: Enclave + Acadia + Outlook + Traverse? Adding more brands to a company who already has too many is not a recipe for recovery.
Old 10-13-2008, 07:41 PM
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Charger (contracts for police fleets) vs. G8 (COTY candidate)
Ram vs. Silverado/Sierra
Tahoe vs. Durango
Camaro vs. Challenger
etc.

Almost every single model that Chrysler/GM has is similar or are direct competitors to one another. If they kill off unsuccessful models then fine, but they're going to have a lot of hard decisions trying to differentiate the models.... GM has a bunch of badge-engineered models as it is.

Also, check out what I found:
Bill Vlasic, the man who was kind enough to drop the GM/Chrysler pseudo-bombshell on us late Friday night, posted a follow-up to his remarkably unremarkable story claiming that General Motors originally had talks with Ford about a possible merger before approaching the Pentastar people.

Again, the New York Times' scribe cites two unnamed sources about the merger discussions, reporting that GM approached Ford with the proposal, only to have FoMoCo execs shoot down the idea after several meetings. The talks included GM CEO Rick Wagoner, president Frederick Henderson, Ford's executive chairman Bill Ford Jr. and chief exec Alan Mulally.

According to the NYT's shy sources, the Blue Oval boys broke off talks in September when Ford and Mulally came to the conclusion that Ford would be better off reorganizing on its own rather than being tied to another automaker.

The Detroit News got in on the action yesterday, citing another anonymous source that said, "There were never in-depth, substantive discussions that went on. It was more an expression of interest [on GM's part], as in, 'Do you want to talk?'" Ford declined.

While all these reports are great at selling dead trees (and generating page-views), it deserves noting that high-level discussions between automakers are nothing new and hardly uncommon. Recent discussions – particularly those in the cited time-frame of three or four months, when federal loans to Detroit's Big Three were on everyone's lips – are surely newsworthy, let's not forget that parts sharing, from transmissions to hybrid drivetrains, have been happening routinely over the last few years. All this leads us to believe that business between Motown's finest will continue unchanged (for better and worse) and that unbelievable headlines are exactly that.

[Sources: NYT, Detroit News]
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/10/13/i...ord-about-mer/


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