View Poll Results: What do you like Better?
Accord Concept Rims and Bodykit
54
73.97%
2004 Acura TL A-Spec Bodykit and Rims
19
26.03%
Voters: 73. You may not vote on this poll
Honda: Accord News
10-18-2004, 09:15 AM
#481
Race Director
I had to remind myself that we aren't anywhere near April 1st when reading this.
It would only make sense if it was Canada only - since the USDM Accord market is rather small - no way in the US. Canada does have Civic and EL in the same market so a Euro Accord and TSX might be possible.
It would only make sense if it was Canada only - since the USDM Accord market is rather small - no way in the US. Canada does have Civic and EL in the same market so a Euro Accord and TSX might be possible.
10-18-2004, 09:30 AM
#482
Burning Brakes
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It might be possible to have the Euro accord competing against the TSX (a la EL vs Civic), but I think that this move would be a step back in Acura's attempt to raise it's brand image to the level of the big boys (hello lexus?).
10-18-2004, 09:34 AM
#483
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Impossible unless Honda builds another plant. You don't just replace 400,000 cars. The Euro Accord/TSX is sold in much smaller numbers, maybe 50k worldwide. The American made Accord is a 400,000 a year sold cash cow.
Remember, the Camry lost it's title before with the previous gen. So they revamped it. I am sure Honda will do the same.
Remember, the Camry lost it's title before with the previous gen. So they revamped it. I am sure Honda will do the same.
10-18-2004, 11:32 AM
#486
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Originally Posted by sauceman
Don't even think foreign or domestic oil. Price is all regulated by a worldwide market. This is why if one Oil company in Russia goes bankrupt, our prices at the pump go up even if we don't buy shit from them.
You need to go back and learn about the laws of supply and demand. Oil is about the best example of how prices are affected by supply and demand, and what variables might affect supply and demand.
If demand goes down, prices go down. But realistically, it's not about how demand will go down, with China's emerging economy already weighing in as second highest oil consumer behind the US only, and with its demand increasing by 7-8%, oil prices will follow with an even steeper curve, given we are already at or past peak oil (or at least we are being educated that way, which influences the gas prices accordingly).
So it's all about the prices going up on an ever sharper increase, and what you will do personally to keep this from affecting your own wallet. I think about my money, and I sure as hell don't like spending it on something as volatile as gas, so the less I can spend on it, the betteroff I am.
5 years ago, it took a few 100k miles to make your hybrid woth the investment. Today, it has gone down a lot. Ask DEVO, he has done the calculations a few times here. At the rate gas prices increase, in 5 years, that extra investment will be money in your pockets after merely a year, due to higher gas costs, but also lower costs for buying the tecnology, because it is becoming more spread and accessible. Then who's going to be missing the bandwagon...
All pure economics here. No tree-hugging bullshit. Quit the redneck reflection and welcome to today.
You need to go back and learn about the laws of supply and demand. Oil is about the best example of how prices are affected by supply and demand, and what variables might affect supply and demand.
If demand goes down, prices go down. But realistically, it's not about how demand will go down, with China's emerging economy already weighing in as second highest oil consumer behind the US only, and with its demand increasing by 7-8%, oil prices will follow with an even steeper curve, given we are already at or past peak oil (or at least we are being educated that way, which influences the gas prices accordingly).
So it's all about the prices going up on an ever sharper increase, and what you will do personally to keep this from affecting your own wallet. I think about my money, and I sure as hell don't like spending it on something as volatile as gas, so the less I can spend on it, the betteroff I am.
5 years ago, it took a few 100k miles to make your hybrid woth the investment. Today, it has gone down a lot. Ask DEVO, he has done the calculations a few times here. At the rate gas prices increase, in 5 years, that extra investment will be money in your pockets after merely a year, due to higher gas costs, but also lower costs for buying the tecnology, because it is becoming more spread and accessible. Then who's going to be missing the bandwagon...
All pure economics here. No tree-hugging bullshit. Quit the redneck reflection and welcome to today.
This man is smart
10-18-2004, 11:45 AM
#487
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what soopa said... the Mazda6 is having the problem of being euro-sized...
I can't imagine Honda giving up a name with so much history and customer loyalty in the US market... the Accord is part of the automotive landscape, it would be too much of a change...
And they tried a euro-sized Accord, remember two gen's ago? That wasn't recieved too well by the general public. And Honda reverted back to US-marketed size and design.
hmmm... it is curious though, that all this weird Honda news is coming out. They must have something going... where there's smoke, there's usually fire...
And weed...
Junkster, who wants a wagon back in the line-up somewhere for Honda
I can't imagine Honda giving up a name with so much history and customer loyalty in the US market... the Accord is part of the automotive landscape, it would be too much of a change...
And they tried a euro-sized Accord, remember two gen's ago? That wasn't recieved too well by the general public. And Honda reverted back to US-marketed size and design.
hmmm... it is curious though, that all this weird Honda news is coming out. They must have something going... where there's smoke, there's usually fire...
And weed...
Junkster, who wants a wagon back in the line-up somewhere for Honda
10-18-2004, 12:49 PM
#488
I'm the Firestarter
If you look ahead and consider that gas prices can only go up and people will consider fuel economy more important in the future, I think the resale value of hybrid cars will be disproportinately higher than that of regular cars. So 5 years from now when you go sell your Accord hybrid you'll probably preserve more of your initial cost than with a TL.
10-18-2004, 01:32 PM
#489
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Originally Posted by MrChad
Hybrids are a novellty and not the norm. I like the look of the Accord hybrid but for the money you actually get MORE car bying the TL over the Accord Hybrid, unless you count an Eco light as an option. HHmmm, hybride light or six speed manual?
Besides, with increasing production of this technology along with standardization of components, prices on hybrids will start coming down. This is the way with all new technology. In days gone by, you couldn't get a DVD player for less then say $300...not you can find them at grocery store for $30. I'm not saying you're going to find hybrid cars at grocery stores for $30...I'm just saying, prices always start high when it comes to new technology...but they don't stay high forever.
10-18-2004, 11:52 PM
#491
Race Director
While it seems far fetched how about this scenario:
2007 Model line up
Entry/compact - Jazz
Small - new Civic
Tweener - Euro Accord
New real full size car to compete with the likes of new 300/Magnum
Honda's current biggest car is the Accord which at 189 in overall and only a 108in WB is at the rather short/mid end of the mid sized sedan range. With gas approaching $3/gal what would get Americans off their SUV diet but a real full sized sedan a la 300/Magnum. Honda could make a 120in WB and 200 in overall length car and folks would be trading in their Explorers by the thousands. This car would also make the ideal platform for that all important top of the line V8 powered full size S class/ 7 series competitor on the Acura side.
2007 Model line up
Entry/compact - Jazz
Small - new Civic
Tweener - Euro Accord
New real full size car to compete with the likes of new 300/Magnum
Honda's current biggest car is the Accord which at 189 in overall and only a 108in WB is at the rather short/mid end of the mid sized sedan range. With gas approaching $3/gal what would get Americans off their SUV diet but a real full sized sedan a la 300/Magnum. Honda could make a 120in WB and 200 in overall length car and folks would be trading in their Explorers by the thousands. This car would also make the ideal platform for that all important top of the line V8 powered full size S class/ 7 series competitor on the Acura side.
10-19-2004, 01:37 AM
#492
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Originally Posted by Junkster
And they tried a euro-sized Accord, remember two gen's ago? That wasn't recieved too well by the general public. And Honda reverted back to US-marketed size and design.
10-19-2004, 06:40 AM
#493
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Sounds way out to me. North America is Honda's biggest market, and they already have a significant investment of capital here in the form of manufacturing capacity and people. Importing cars from Europe or Japan in large numbers would not be an option, not to mention that to import the Euro Accord would be a step backwards for the Acura name after everything they've done to move it upmarket in the past two years. Perhaps there would be a new vehicle based off of the Euro Accord platform that would be sold as a Honda, or a change in the lineup similar to what biker said. Since almost everyone has pointed out the folly in such a move, this sadly sounds like something made up to get some attention (until we see it mentioned in a big mag like C&D or R&T).
10-19-2004, 08:28 AM
#494
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Originally Posted by lokman
Sounds way out to me. North America is Honda's biggest market, and they already have a significant investment of capital here in the form of manufacturing capacity and people. Importing cars from Europe or Japan in large numbers would not be an option, not to mention that to import the Euro Accord would be a step backwards for the Acura name after everything they've done to move it upmarket in the past two years. Perhaps there would be a new vehicle based off of the Euro Accord platform that would be sold as a Honda, or a change in the lineup similar to what biker said. Since almost everyone has pointed out the folly in such a move, this sadly sounds like something made up to get some attention (until we see it mentioned in a big mag like C&D or R&T).
How can Japan + Europe factory have the capacity to supply 400,000 Accord/year? How much it cost them to ship it over? Even the dock loading capacity will having an issue! Also, how serious impact to the local suppliers? too many reason to support to say NOT THE CASE! unless the sale of Accord return back to < 50,000 unit/year! 
10-19-2004, 08:35 AM
#495
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Originally Posted by soopa
Won't happen.
America won't accept a TSX sized family sedan...
America won't accept a TSX sized family sedan...
Unless Americans have gotten smaller without my noticing, this can't happen.
10-20-2004, 11:54 AM
#496
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2005 Honda Accord Hybrid - - The Hidden Hybrid: This Is For Folks Who Don’t Want You To Know They’re Driving A Hybrid - - LARRY EDSALL - - Source: Autoweek
...
But there are two things the driver of a Honda Accord Hybrid isn’t likely to ignore: This car will beat a 2005 Accord EX V6 from a standing start to 60 mph—by half a second—and visits gas stations much less frequently.
...
...
But there are two things the driver of a Honda Accord Hybrid isn’t likely to ignore: This car will beat a 2005 Accord EX V6 from a standing start to 60 mph—by half a second—and visits gas stations much less frequently.
...
10-31-2004, 10:10 AM
#498
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Originally Posted by soopa
Won't happen.
America won't accept a TSX sized family sedan...
America won't accept a TSX sized family sedan...
It doesn't make much sense considering the civic will be getting larger and all cars in general getting larger. All they need to do is come up with a decent exterior design for the new model.
11-01-2004, 08:41 AM
#499
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by heyitsme
Actually they already have, the Mazda 6 sells.
Mazda 6 sales area fraction of what Accord and Camry sales are. Add the large Altima into the mix and M6 sales look even worse.
11-01-2004, 04:45 PM
#500
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Sure, but I think that has a lot to do with it being a mazda, for them its doing fine, compared to the big jdm 3 its not in the same league, just like mazda3 vs civic sales. I'd bet a euro accord taking the place of and being priced like the american accord would do quite well. I'd definately take one whereas with the american accord I'm not really interested in it.
11-05-2004, 10:58 AM
#501
Senior Moderator
Honda Cautious About Accord Sales
Honda cautious about Accord's future, predicts sales decrease in U.S.
YUZO YAMAGUCHI | Automotive News
Posted Date: 11/5/04
TOKYO -- Honda Motor Co. expects U.S. sales of the Accord to fall this year as much as 7 percent to about 370,000.
"We're cautious about the Accord," says Honda Executive Vice President Koichi Amemiya. "We'll spend (incentives) mainly on the Accord."
Amemiya says that gasoline prices of about $2 a gallon in the United States, delivered "a body blow" to the industry.
The cautious outlook for Honda's most important model pushed the automaker to cut its North American sales estimates for the fiscal year through March to 1.56 million from the 1.565 million it projected earlier.
Amemiya expects 16.5 million to 16.6 million light vehicles to be sold in the United States this year.
"I'm not so optimistic" about the prospects for the industry, he says.
Last year, 16.7 million light vehicles were sold in the United States.
In the fiscal first half ended Sept. 30, Honda's North American operating profit slid 12.2 percent to 165.8 billion yen, or $1.55 billion at current exchange rates. The decline was the result of increased incentive spending on the Civic and Accord in the first quarter.
Unit sales in North America for the six months fell 3.2 percent to 757,000.
But operating profit in Europe jumped 37.2 percent to $216.6 million, thanks to the well-received diesel-powered Accord, the Civic and Jazz.
Business at home also was healthy with a 17.5 percent leap in operating profit to $781.6 million.
Robust profits in Japan and Europe, along with cost cutting and other efforts more than offset the North American results.
For the April-to-September period, Honda's consolidated, or group, operating profit rose 4.7 percent to $3.0 billion. Net income edged up 0.9 percent to $2.17 billion on top of revenues of $37.52 billion, up 3.5 percent.
YUZO YAMAGUCHI | Automotive News
Posted Date: 11/5/04
TOKYO -- Honda Motor Co. expects U.S. sales of the Accord to fall this year as much as 7 percent to about 370,000.
"We're cautious about the Accord," says Honda Executive Vice President Koichi Amemiya. "We'll spend (incentives) mainly on the Accord."
Amemiya says that gasoline prices of about $2 a gallon in the United States, delivered "a body blow" to the industry.
The cautious outlook for Honda's most important model pushed the automaker to cut its North American sales estimates for the fiscal year through March to 1.56 million from the 1.565 million it projected earlier.
Amemiya expects 16.5 million to 16.6 million light vehicles to be sold in the United States this year.
"I'm not so optimistic" about the prospects for the industry, he says.
Last year, 16.7 million light vehicles were sold in the United States.
In the fiscal first half ended Sept. 30, Honda's North American operating profit slid 12.2 percent to 165.8 billion yen, or $1.55 billion at current exchange rates. The decline was the result of increased incentive spending on the Civic and Accord in the first quarter.
Unit sales in North America for the six months fell 3.2 percent to 757,000.
But operating profit in Europe jumped 37.2 percent to $216.6 million, thanks to the well-received diesel-powered Accord, the Civic and Jazz.
Business at home also was healthy with a 17.5 percent leap in operating profit to $781.6 million.
Robust profits in Japan and Europe, along with cost cutting and other efforts more than offset the North American results.
For the April-to-September period, Honda's consolidated, or group, operating profit rose 4.7 percent to $3.0 billion. Net income edged up 0.9 percent to $2.17 billion on top of revenues of $37.52 billion, up 3.5 percent.
Does it take a rocket scientists for Honda to figure out why there doing so well in Europe and Japan? Look at your damn product offerings, its as easy as a nice Civic and the Jazz. I'm postive that 5 door Civic Hatch they have over there would sell extremly well here.
11-05-2004, 11:15 AM
#503
Senior Moderator
Accord sales could have been salvaged with a redesign in 05 and the opportunity was there with the release of the hybrid. But I guess their too stubborn or just didn't realize how unattrcative the Accord Sedan is. Maybe redesign and re-tooling costs outweighed the extra sales that an attractive Accord would bring. 
11-05-2004, 01:32 PM
#509
Kabachitare!
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Honda cautious about Accord's future, predicts sales decrease in U.S.
News
Honda cautious about Accord's future, predicts sales decrease in U.S.
YUZO YAMAGUCHI | Automotive News
Posted Date: 11/5/04
TOKYO -- Honda Motor Co. expects U.S. sales of the Accord to fall this year as much as 7 percent to about 370,000.
"We're cautious about the Accord," says Honda Executive Vice President Koichi Amemiya. "We'll spend (incentives) mainly on the Accord."
Amemiya says that gasoline prices of about $2 a gallon in the United States, delivered "a body blow" to the industry.
The cautious outlook for Honda's most important model pushed the automaker to cut its North American sales estimates for the fiscal year through March to 1.56 million from the 1.565 million it projected earlier.
Amemiya expects 16.5 million to 16.6 million light vehicles to be sold in the United States this year.
"I'm not so optimistic" about the prospects for the industry, he says.
Last year, 16.7 million light vehicles were sold in the United States.
In the fiscal first half ended Sept. 30, Honda's North American operating profit slid 12.2 percent to 165.8 billion yen, or $1.55 billion at current exchange rates. The decline was the result of increased incentive spending on the Civic and Accord in the first quarter.
Unit sales in North America for the six months fell 3.2 percent to 757,000.
But operating profit in Europe jumped 37.2 percent to $216.6 million, thanks to the well-received diesel-powered Accord, the Civic and Jazz.
Business at home also was healthy with a 17.5 percent leap in operating profit to $781.6 million.
Robust profits in Japan and Europe, along with cost cutting and other efforts more than offset the North American results.
For the April-to-September period, Honda's consolidated, or group, operating profit rose 4.7 percent to $3.0 billion. Net income edged up 0.9 percent to $2.17 billion on top of revenues of $37.52 billion, up 3.5 percent.
11-05-2004, 02:39 PM
#510
Had the NA Accord looked anything like the initial drawings, it would sell a lot better.
11-05-2004, 03:35 PM
#512
There was also a gray one in sedan form, but I can't find that anywhere.
11-05-2004, 04:07 PM
#513
who's right, who's wrong?
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It seems like Honda does so well at stating the obvious, but they don't do a whole lot to improve sales in a US market. I think the Si would've sold like hotcakes if they had sent the CTR in its place, but of course then you're treading on the RSX's ground (in their eyes). I think the CTR and ITR could've thrived being sold next to one another.
11-05-2004, 04:22 PM
#514
bleh...
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Honda is just too slow to react to changes in consumer tastes/trends. Plus the Civic is bland and old, while the Accord is ugly. The Accord Hybrid will help with plunging sales, but not by much.....similar to the Civic line, the hybrid helps with sales even though its decreasing and remains flat.
Honda needs to bring over the CTR, ITR, and Jazz. I think those would really sell well.
Honda needs to bring over the CTR, ITR, and Jazz. I think those would really sell well.
11-05-2004, 04:23 PM
#515
bleh...
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Originally Posted by phile
Had the NA Accord looked anything like the initial drawings, it would sell a lot better.
11-05-2004, 04:30 PM
#516
Old fart
Originally Posted by phile
Had the NA Accord looked anything like the initial drawings, it would sell a lot better.
11-05-2004, 05:55 PM
#517
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Originally Posted by kansaiwalker1
"We're cautious about the Accord," says Honda Executive Vice President Koichi Amemiya. "We'll spend (incentives) mainly on the Accord."
Amemiya says that gasoline prices of about $2 a gallon in the United States, delivered "a body blow" to the industry.
11-05-2004, 06:24 PM
#519
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IMHO, exterior-wise they just need to fix the rear end and the front headlights. Then again, if they did that, it would look even more like the TSX, which would not be a good thing (at least for us TSX owners).
