princed

I have no info on this other than what the subject says. From what I've heard, dealerships received an e-mail from Acura saying that the introduction of the manual version of the TL has been delayed for one month -- the autos will be released as previously scheduled.

I would greatly appreciate it if Justin or someone with ties to Torrance can elucidate further.

I pray that somehow this turns out to be a mistake.

RJC RSX

Hopefully it's true

Charmed

Do you want it to be delayed??

need4spd_RENAMED

Why do you want it to be true?

need4spd_RENAMED

Sales manager at my dealer did not hear this (delay 1mo for 6spd).

Correction - he did hear this when I showed up at the dealer and asked him to check the notices from Acura

RJC RSX

Because I would rather they delay the manual for a month than release it on time with a notchy transmission or gear grinds. They've designed a brand new manual transmission, it might still need some work before it's perfect. The RSX Type-S is plagued with an infamous 2nd gear grind, and I just get the feeling if they spent more time developing it earlier and didn't rush to production it wouldn't be a problem. Although, it seems some of the 2003 models have it too. So basically what I'm saying is I would rather have them delay the product than rush it and not have it be perfect.

MrJumbo

Just read the message. It gives no reason for the delay. Although it says "a small quantity will be built for the month of October and dealers will recive one coverage unit from this quantity." The message also says "all orders for manual transmissions will be converted to models with Automatic Transmissions!"

I guess we won't see HPT models until November!

The Autoweek article said 15% of the units built will be manual, sounds a little high. Maybe in the begining but will probably settle around 5% in 6-8 months.

princed

Okay -- that's just ridiculous. I'm sure only a small minority of people are going to keep their original order if they substitute an automatic transmission. People who want a 6MT usually REALLY want a 6MT.

Anyway, many, many thanks for the info, MrJumbo. Do you happen to have a phone number, e-mail, or mailing address for someone in Torrance who actually knows what's going on with the new TL (the poor people at the 800 number have almost no info available to them)?

need4spd_RENAMED

I guess that Acura feels that the first order was by the dealership, and not for people (like us), so they are switching the 1st month allocation to autos so the dealers get their full allotment

I am bummed!

Better make sure the dealer orders your 6spd for the second allocation or you may have to wait until December!

lakeman

My dealer said he ordered the cars with the colors and equipment that he had deposits on. I was very specific that I only wanted a 6MT but could be flexible on colors (with Abyss my first choice). I will not take an automatic. One advantage in having to wait is that I can better determine my color choice and with at least one MT to test drive, I can see if it is still my car of choice. The TSX is still a great alternative.

On Order 04 TL 6MT HPT Abyss/Ebony

pcinoc

I don't disagree with the concept that they should not go to production with a design problem and address the problem later. I do have a problem with the fact it is implied the tranny has a design problem - the fact is that nobody really knows what the reason is at this point, unless you have some insider information...

For all you know, it could be due to production issues, production schedules or even a marketing strategy. I just don't want people to think there is a tranny design flaw on this car before it hits the showroom.

VtecMW

RJC RSX

What I implied was not intended to relate to Honda's past tranny problem whatsoever. I was just relating to the RSX-S. Like you said, it could be anything. Maybe the LSD needs to be tweaked, or brembo isn't ready to mass supply the brakes yet.

planman

Surely this means that all dealer stock orders will ship as auto rather than manual...not that they're forcing customers with deposits to accept autos instead.

Didn't the article say that 15% of the units SOLD were expected to be manual? Seems safe to say that 6-speeds will be hard to come by...may require a special order.

Stevens24

You guys sweat to much. It could be numerous reasons, most likely vendor related. when the 2003 MDX came out the first month there were no NAV units. The tranny is pretty much the same as the CL-S from 03. Just Relax, I know you want to be the first on your block with one and you will be the first one with a manual

VtecMW

I'm cool with it. I've waited this long. This does throw a wrench in my plans to make a "professional" maneuver. :pfawk: I have a company car, so I have to hang on until my TL arrives.

I hope the delay isn't too long. Then, I'd have a real problem.

need4spd_RENAMED

Thanks Mr.Jumbo for your confirmation and Princed for the original information, I went to my dealer and spoke to the guy doing the allocations, he confirmed, no 6spd's for first month, Sales manager found out when I asked.

What I did have them do is make sure I got one in the second allocation, this time a little smarter, I got rid of the HPT option (I will get my own high performance summer tires, thanks, not those Bridgestones and keep the all-seasons for the winter, maybe even a nicer wheel, the M6 by Moda looks alot like the concept cars) and went for the Nav system after seeing the photo of the non-nav dash.

Timing was good as they were just doing their second MOVE (allocation) for the 04 TL's for November delivery.

I would recomend to all buyers that they do the same and head to their dealer tommorow to make sure they get the 6spd ordered for the second (November) allocation, or it may be too late and you will have to wait for December (I remembered from Justin that this week was the November allocation).

Good Luck!

iVTEC_Inside

RJC RSX

Brand new tranmission? Isn't this manual the one taken from CL-S 6 speed?

RJC RSX

I don't think so, someone said earlier it would be a brand new transmission. Anyways, I'm convinced it's a supply problem, otherwise they wouldn't release one unit as a demo per dealership. They could be gauging the M/T interest as well to get a better idea of how many 6sp's they should make.

typeR

trust me it is the cl-S' 6MT they didnt bother developing a new engine but you think theyl'll develope a new tranny for the old engine ?a trans that they'll only sell 15% of? hopfully it's the auto thats all new

Peter7777

Does that mean that each dealer is required to keep two TLs available as demos -- one automatic and one manual? I was thinking that they might sell everything they have in October leaving some people unable to do a test drive until November. I'd really like to get my greasy little paws on an automatic TL for a test drive during the week of October 6..

kurt_bradley

To slightly clarify this one, dealers are still going to recieve 1 6-speed model to designate as their driver. If there was a flaw in the cars that they were aware of, they would not allow any to be shipped at all. They simply stated on the email yesterday that there was a very limited number of them being produced initially, making it difficult to fulfill initial orders. Once again, I'm going to say it. If there was an error in the gearbox, why would they still ship them 1 to each dealer for the first month? Why would they lie to their dealers?

crystalclear

After the introduction of drive by wire, what is the difference between a manual and an automatic?

Old manuals require the driver to physically perform the gear change. Old automatics have complicated hardware to it.

With drive by wire, the only difference between a manual and an automatic is not in the gearbox, but in what controls the gearbox. There is no point in being too tight fisted to pay for an extra button, and there is no point in a manufacturer making a button optional. It costs more than giving everybody the same.

Lets look at a Volkswagen's gear controls.



If you want an automatic, leave it in drive, if you want a manual, change gears with +/-. (Surely nobody can expect a Mercedes to have a 7 way H gate! +/- is more logical except for skipping gears.)

What about Renault, what are they doing?



Daimler Chrysler?



Peugot



BMW?



So if you have an old style mechanically operated 6-speed the lever will look a bit like this



And Honda, who are the best and leading the race will give you something like this:-




Drive-by-wire erodes the distinction between manuals and automatics. If you don't want new technology, Ford's are now less efficient than the model T was 100 years ago. I cannot really understand anybody cancelling an order for a modern car to buy the version just before an improvement.

Let's see another Honda again!

VtecMW

So is there any chance the 6 MTs might arrive a bit early, based on their availability to fulfill demand?

Raheel

So CrystalClear what are you saying?

That Buying Auto is better than Manual?

I have never driven a Manual, but I hear its quite fun and when you race, you get more power out of it..

I myself am buying the Auto, but if you race a lot wouldn't u want a Manual?

RJC RSX

drive by wire is for the throttle, it has nothing to do with the transmission. A manual is still a good half second faster than its auto counterpart.

RJC RSX

I talked to a guy who works in the Marysville plant and posts on Club RSX; here's what he said when I asked him about the delay:

lakeman

I want my MT V??

VtecMW

Sounds like a delay to me.

dulux

drive by wire is for the accelerator and the throttle body. For example, if your car starts to go up hill, the car will sense this and open the throttle body therefore sustaining your speed as if it were on cruise control. ie. You no no longer have to push the pedal down to stay at the same speed when the incline increases, the computer will measure the amount of pedal distance from the floor and manage your speed that way.

kurt_bradley

When it comes to the curiosity of Honda's "delay" on the car, it's not intentional. As for the car getting in earlier than they have already stated it to be, it won't happen. The car will be here in November as stated. Like they said before, they didn't produce nearly enough of them initially to meet the initial orders of the dealers.

JeffPhx

From your statement Kurt, can we assume that there is a decent demand for the maunul TL? I was just wondering since Honda/Acura has been so reluctant to put a manual in their V6 models. It would be nice to see a greater availability of the manual transmission and I hope this is a good sign.

larchmont

Just got back from holiday weekend, surprised as hell to see this news. As well as the reactions.

I think y'all are being way too kind.

This is just a bad job by Acura, regardless of the reason. Aside from it being a bad idea to disappoint people who've been led to expect something, at the best it makes it look like Acura isn't in command of its own situation. And at the worst, it makes it look like something went wrong. It would be somewhat less bad if a clear reason were given, and hopefully if it were a good reason.

But, bad job regardless. Acura, we expect a lot better of you.