j_young

agreed bro, best $1000 i ever spent 😂

BEAR-AvHistory

I expect its because the three brands don't really advertise against each other in their corporate marketing strategy. Or if the do its very rare, I remember a good but short live series between MB & BMW. So it seems like the various forums tend follow that trend.

They have the recognized tier one product lines that Acura wants be be the member of. Was a stated corporate goal with the introduction of the larger TL 4G cars. Case with Acura is they incessantly advertise against the 3 German brands. So they set up the game & others will come to play in the forum.

Legend2TL

I always enjoyed BMW's ad of Dieter Zetsche last day at MB then going home to drive his new BMW i8 in his garage, sorta tongue in cheek but was cute.


And BMW and MB have had a "friendly" rivary for many years and shown in their advertising.




But in terms of BMW's or MB or Audi's in direct Acura advertisements are there any? As far as I know there are Acura marketing comparison video's but they do not qualify in mass media advertising IMO. Is there a actual Acura ad in TV video or mass media print with a German competitor in it? I thought Lexus did a long time ago, but haven't seen anything recently

There are certainly Acura comparison videos on their website but that's not advertising. I've never seen any of them on TV or print, do they do lots of comparison marketing (video's and print) with the PR group oh yeah. But that's not advertising, that's marketing and product positioning. If you find any, please post them.

one4all

Which doesn't happen here...I'm sure there can be balanced and nuanced discussion that isn't some groupthink circle-jerk safe space for fanboys (ie any thread involving Tesla).

What?? Neither have been "debunked". Honda/Acura have generally been consistently highly ranked for quality/reliability, and Acura ranks well above Audi in JD Power's dependability survey. Just because it's a brand new car doesn't mean things will suddenly change. Also it's a undebatable fact that a Type-S costs less than a similarly equipped S4. Some dealers have mark-ups, but others don't. Once the aura of the reborn Type-S nameplate wears off and production ramps up over the next year, I'd bet that all dealers will be charging MSRP.

How is stiffening up the chassis stupid? Every review I've seen lauds the TLX-S as one of the best handling 4000 lb cars in existence.

Everyone markets against the 3-series since it's still perceived as best in class. It's like how all the family car ads target the Accord.

It's funny you say that since I can almost guarantee you that most BMW and M-B fans don't consider Audi to be "tier one", and there are many valid reasons why: the stigma of a "fancy VW", Audi is actually relatively new to the luxury segment (you could legit argue that Acura has been producing luxury cars longer than Audi), FWD architecture (or front-biased from AWD) from top to bottom of the sedan lineup, cheaper etc.

Even AMG has only become a serious M competitor recently. As recently as the 90's MB was almost exclusively a "status symbol" luxury car for dentists and wealthy elderly people. And many purists have bemoaned the mighty 3 series cars shift away from strengths like steering feel, manual transmissions, sportier suspensions, etc.

Every sports sedan brings something to the table, and I still think the Type-S has a winning formula of great handling, beautiful looks, good powertrain, and a solid value, despite its oft-repeated weaknesses.

....anyway apologies for derailing the topic, congrats to all the new Type-S owners!

pyrodan007

Although some may dislike CR data, the TLX scores lower versus other similar models. How you seen engine videos of the 3.0T internals? It has a lot more moving parts versus older Honda V6 engines, who knows what can happen long term. Right now, it's average.

There goes the "similarly equipped" theory, when Type-S can't match the models. From the dyno numbers, you're also getting less power; hence the lower price.

Everyone lauds the Type-S as being the heaviest and slowest out of the bunch. That x-brace does jack to help besides adding even more weight. Why don't the others have a handicapped trunk, because Acura got lazy with minimal structural changes versus TLX 2.0. Or maybe, just maybe ... it's too freakin long for no reason.

BEAR-AvHistory

Its a global brand & when I lived in England it was listed with Jaguar, BMW, MB as an executive company car choice. They have a full product line convertibles, sports car, 4 door sedans, SUV. Coups. Product line runs from $40,000 to $155,000. Nine models are over $100,000. The RS5 is a M4 competitor with 444hp 443lbft he number that matches the old M4. 60 mph in 3.3 seconds, 1/4 mile 11.8 seconds at 115 mph.

ELIN

I think the weight disadvantage can be attributed to the heavy (pun intended) use of steel vs aluminum due to cost advantage. Acura won't be able to overcome this unless somehow they luck into a bauxite mine not owned by ALCOA. LOL.

Camaro194

Just got an update from the dealer. Car looks to be build the first week of August. They said deliveries for every model have been sporadic lately, so hopefully things stay on track for getting it next month. Only risk is whether I can get enough of a heads up to give me time to try and sell my old car privately before the new one comes in. I can go a few weeks without a car, but not months. Their trade-in offer is @ $2k less than what I should be able to get private party.

jhb31

The side skirts should be standard on the type S. Not having them already on that model is a fail on Acura's part.

BEAR-AvHistory

If Penn reduces the taxable purchase price of a new car you need to see if a private sale will cover both the dealers offer & any tax savings.

Edward'TLS

Let's look at it this way. Not having the side skirts as standard equipment on the Type-S saves the majority of buyers (not wanting the side skirts) $1K from their final purchase bills.

Camaro194

They do

$10k is the trade-in offer, that's why I would like to get $12k to offset the tax savings, inconvenience, and having to rent a car to drive to the new one.

Midwestuser1

It’s probably not a 1K difference as you’d have to subtract out the value of the standard ones installed to get the net increase.

4G-Lover

Where I agree that Audi is still not quite at BMW and, in particular MB, level in terms of public perceptions they been making expensive luxury cars well before Acura (I owned couple of them in the 1980)

Audi 200 Turbo...it was a rocketship in its days (1979)



The successful 1980 Audi Quattro (World Rally Champion) was priced at Porsche 911 Carrera territory



The 200 Quattro of the mid 1980s was a spaceship sedan, AWD and one of the fastest in the world, it had a top speed higher than the BMW M5 of that time.



1988 Audi V8



The limited production Audi Quattro Sport in 1985 was priced at Ferrari Testarossa level and it could accelerate like a 911 Turbo...




None of these cars shared VW components. What Acura was producing in the 1980s?? Tarted up Accords....

ELIN

Don't forget the cost of labor....or do dealers normally put it on for free? I've never tried...

Legend2TL

AFRAIK, all of those Audi's shared some parts with VW, from hood latches (even a Porsche 928 used the same hood latch as a VW Dasher) to hall effect ignition modules and all sorts of various parts bin engineering.
It's common to see both logo's on factory OEM parts too. Nothing wrong with that, Audi and VW have shared parts from the 70's to current times. Also owned a '76 Audi and a friend had two as well.
And a Acura Legend was not an tarted up Accord, in Japan it was the Honda Legend. But while sharing common parts like the VW and Audi did. It's major components (chassis, suspension, motor which would eventually get into a mid-90's Accord )
One major difference though between 1980's Audi and Acura. Acura's lasted and were dependable

As to the top speed claim, again no. E28 M5 was faster than a 200 Quatro by 6MPH.
My brother had a E24 M6, Audi Turbo 20V 5 was cute technically but pales compared to the mighty M88/3 used in the M5/M6.

https://fastestlaps.com/models/audi-200-quattro-20v

https://fastestlaps.com/models/bmw-m5-e28

Honda430

List for the side skirts is $800 before installation. It’s easy enough to get 15% off on accessories when buying the vehicle. That savings should cover the installation.

4G-Lover

If you mean sharing some modules or components yes but these cars did not share VW chassis, suspension or engines...the Audi straight 5 was an Audi exclusive and so was obviously the V8. The entry/mid level Audi did use VW engines (currently is the same)

The 200 turbo was absolutely faster (Italian magazine road test) than the E28 M5...few mph but it was (the E28 could not get even close to the claimed 250 km/h) ....the E28 was a brick aerodynamically compared to the Audi 100/200 which was the most aerodynamic sedan of its time. Sure the M5 had a better acceleration.

Back to my point, Audi has definitely more heritage than Acura and made high end luxury and sport cars for longer.

BEAR-AvHistory

Agree, Acura was in the recent past the top of the line Honda Accord. The NSX the Acura HALO car is sold as a Honda everyplace in the world but here & maybe Canada,

Tony Pac

In Kuwait (middle east) as well. It's sold under Acura NSX!

Legend2TL

FIFY

I know many former Audi owners from two who had godawful 200's who each successfully sued Audi. Neighbor also had a 2G A8 which was another awful car, add in my neighbor who had a A6 allroad quattro again just simply awful as it broke down so often. Until the last decade Audi was the Land Rover of German auto makers. It took Porsche and their newfound quality system to straighten Audi out to what they've become today. But make no mistake, Audi made some nice cars from '70's to '00's that broke down frequently.

As to what was faster I showed two links, if you have some links for speed then please post them. I found 150MPH for 200 Turbo and 156MPH for E24 M5.

The late 90's 1.8T is shared openly between Audi and VW. I've worked on as well as replaced a turbo on a friends, and learned from that experience how Audi and VW are very often linked.
Sometimes they're separate, the V8 is a good case in point.

someguy11

While I agree with you and I absolutely loved the photos of the historic Audis you posted, specifically the gorgeous Audi Quattro that couldn't help but smash all sorts of Pike's Peak records in its hey day, Audi also built cars that accelerated on their own (whether you blame user error or the cars, that is the stigma) and had absolutely abysmal reliability ratings. A lot of Audi owners were one-and-done. As in learned the lesson never to buy an Audi again thanks to their 80s cars.

That's where Lexus and Acura in the 80s and 90s had an opening to come in as strong competitors in performance and reliability. I know of several people who have driven nothing but Lexus since buying their first one in the 90s. And Acura has that sort of customer loyalty too with the MDX (sedans maybe not so much after the mid 10s).

Edward'TLS

During the 1980's, the North American Audi brand had significantly tarnished due to the "unintended acceleration" fiasco with Audi vehicles, and it had almost brought the North American Audi brand down on its knees.

someguy11

It's nice to see us all on the same page about something!

Every once in a while, I see a Peugeot, Renault or Sterling on the road. I wonder how close Audi was to suffering the same fate in the USA as those.

4G-Lover

We were not talking about reliability here.....(I owned two 200 and I had little issues with it but nothing major)
The bad quality reputation it seems that it was earned in North America, in Europe, for some reasons, we did not have the same serious problems and Audi were generally regarded of high quality.

As for the 200 - E28 M5 comparison, I do not have any links but, if memory serves me well, neither were capable of reaching 150 MPH.

Ghostof TypeS Past

Are we all on the same page?

I thought I clicked on “Who has actually purchased a Type-S,” somehow I was redirected to a page with a bunch of chatter from users that have not purchased a Type S talking about cars that are not Type S… and then patiently waiting to be attacked for bringing back up the Type S.

Anybody in the market for a 2021 Apex Blue Pearl/ Red Leather Type S? It’s a turbo charged 3.0L V6, 20” upgraded wheels, all weather floor mats - $62k OBO. By the way it’s an Acura…

dmski

Another thread derailed into AudiZine....

TypeSDreams

I’m seriously over it Lol. I though this was a good place to feel welcomed. Not like rehab but at least supportive. How is it so toxic?

someguy11

I'm all for getting this back on topic. I was enjoying a brief moment of alignment amongst us while we were trashing Audi reliability.

What made you feel unwelcomed? The only toxicity here is to rebut when people say dumb stuff or want to argue on a personal level. If you're looking for a Type S support group, I heard there is a Facebook fanboy club you could join.

As for this forum, think of it more like a garage, but without the oil rags, cursing and cat calls. For whatever reason, your post made me imagine a clean cut millennial wearing Ray Bans and a pink Polo shirt walking into the back of a shop full of a dozen guys in overalls wrenching away on cars on lifts, oil on their hands and cigarettes in their mouths, and yelling, "Hey, why can't you be more supportive of me!?" because your oil change is taking too long.

leomio2.0

If you're just joining the conversation now, I can see how it appears that way. Problem was, this time last year, there were plenty of people here (and all over the internet) saying that this thing was going to dominate the segment. Even despite power and curb weights being unveiled, nope, they were saying Honda is able to spin magic engines that defy physics.

Now that indisputable evidence has come to light that it doesn't perform any better than the numbers suggest, and behind all of its competitors, the fanboys have recessed into their private FB groups and the masses of undue praise have disappeared from public forums.

Most of the toxic comments are from pent up frustration and "I told you so"-ism. Juvenile? Yes. Satisfying? Also yes.

fiatlux

On that note, I think you forgot to quote this post

​​​​​​

airnupe

Just got my baby back. Ceramic tint and full front paint protection. Side skirts next.

KrylonBlue

BEAUTIFUL.

I’ll be doing the same thing. Tints and PPF.

Ghostof TypeS Past

Finally “who has actually purchased a Type S.” What is the front paint protection and how much did that cost? Have my front bumper appointment for 3MM appliqué… $900

airnupe

Llumar Valor paint protection. Front bumper, headlights, front hood, front fenders, A-pillars, mirror stalks and door edge guards. $1799.

Legend2TL

Guessing some people just like to be toxic in this thread.

The best was someone apologizing for your toxicity comment that it's only their responses to "dump stuff" then creates "The TLX Sucks - Especially Type S"
oh the irony is lost on them

Legend2TL

there are several E28 M5 top speed links over over 150MPH, it's nothing new.

Even the official BMW M5 spec said the top speed was 155
bmwe34m5.com
https://www.encycarpedia.com/us/bmw/85-m5-e28-sedan

someguy11

WTF are you talking about? I created the "Type S Sucks" thread. That's a place for us haterade drinkers to channel some unbridled negativity and troll the koolaid drinkers.

I never apologized for anything I, nor anyone else, said here on this thread, nor elsewhere on this forum, to make Karen von Snowflake feel unwelcomed here. That sounded like something I wouldn't say, so I went back to reread that I asked why he felt unwelcomed and suggested a fanboy club instead if we hurt his feelings.

Maybe you're thinking of someone else? Please feel free to elaborate on this load of irony you think you observed.