ELIN

I wish I had been an Acura owner earlier. They really don't make them like they used to!

richii0207

What did they used to do that they stopped doing? Some on the forums make it out like they used to make race cars and Bentleys. Their sports cars didn’t even have LSD. The RSX was fun for what it was, but the Civic Si was the better performer.

ELIN

I really liked my friend’s ’97 Integra and a coworker had a beautiful ‘07 TL Type S.

richii0207

I think Acura still makes good looking cars.

Edward'TLS

I have been an Acura owner since 1990, and I can reassure you that Acura vehicles are becoming more powerful, better handling, and more high tech from older generations to newer generations.

The only thing hasn't change is the lack of viable upgrade path for existing Acura owners, who want to move upmarket to true luxury vehicles packed with 400+hp. Such buyers have no other choice but to move on to MB AMG, BMW M, and Porsche.

fiatlux

The Civic Si that also didn’t have an LSD nor DWB, had the base RSX engine, and had a 5MT was somehow a better performer? I want whatever you’re smoking.

richii0207

It came with the 197hp K20 that was paired with a 6 speed and LSD. Unless their was a 200hp base RSX that was released and I didn’t know about.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...-drive-review/

“Honda has upped the ante with a new 2.0-liter DOHC 16-valve i-VTEC four-cylinder engine that bumps horsepower from 160 to 197 at 7800 rpm. This is a refinement of the K-series four employed in the Acura RSX Type-S, with a balance shaft and other tweaks. Mated with a new six-speed manual transmission“

“The key is a helical limited-slip differential, similar to the one in the Acura TL, that eliminates wheelspin in hard corners when the weight's off the inside front wheel. The RSX lacks this useful device.”

bilirubin

That's the 8th gen Civic which came out about 4 years after the RSX. The 7th gen Civic was the RSX's peer as they came out about a year of each other. That generation's Si had a similar 160 hp K20 as the base RSX.
If the RSX/4th gen Integra had a successor at the time, that would've been part of the 8th gen Civic's cohort.

richii0207

The 8th gen Si and the RSX had a one year overlap (2006). I remember because I was cross shopping them at the time.
Another example would be the first gen TSX to the 8th gen Si sedan. Manual with LSD (Si). There were two years of overlap between them.

There are people comparing the Accord to the TLX (2 years overlap since 2022 is end of this accord gen) so it’s only fair to compare with the same rules applied.

bilirubin

correct, and the 7th gen Civic had a 4 year overlap with the RSX, which is why they are part of the same cohort. The RSX was on its way out when the 8th gen Si came to be.

richii0207

The initial conversation was about how Honda sold cars that were better performing than what Acura offered at a given time. I provided one example but I can list more.

For instance:
RSX Type S and 8th Gen Si (2006)
1st gen TSX and 8th Gen Si
ILX and Civic Si
Current Gen Integra and Civic

All the above are or were offered at the same time at one point, some longer than others.

leomio2.0

I drove my brother's 2012 X5 extensively during the holidays, back to back with my RDX. Despite being 11yrs old and having 132k miles, the X5 had less road noise (though comparable wind noise) and almost no creaks, rattles or clicks ... while mine would do exactly that over the same stretches of highway the very next day. 2011 & 2012 were ironically said to be the worst in terms of reliability for the X5, and surprisingly, he hasn't had any major issues. The build quality is leaps and bounds better though. This weekend really solidified what camp my next car purchase is likely to come from.

fiatlux

So you cherry picked a single point in time where the RSX and 8G Si overlapped by a single year to conclude the Si > RSX? And then proceed to also compare the TSX with the Si when the former is a rebadged Euro Accord and has nothing to do with the Si? You might as well go ahead and compare the RDX to the CTR too.

richii0207

Out of all the comparisons, how do you manage to cherry pick a specific comparison provided and find a way to try to prove a point while entirely missing the topic at hand?

fiatlux

This actually weakens your argument. People are saying the “older” Accord outperforms the newer TLX. The fact they there’s only a 2 year overlap is worse for the TLX because it means the TLX should be kicking the Accord’s butt since it’s that much older. 2021 TLX losing to a 2018 Accord? WTF?

In the case of RSX, it’s about 4 years ahead of the 8G Si which makes it more understandable that the Si outperforms it, considering the 8G Si is largely an evolution of the RSX Type S. 2001 RSX losing to a 2006 Si? Not surprising.

richii0207

Soooo…..you’re saying that a Honda performs better than an Acura? Now why does that argument sound familiar? Oh that’s right, I said that a few posts ago.

ELIN

It's upsetting that instead of making the TLX better and more powerful than the Accord, the solution was "let's kill off the 2.0L turbo for the '23 Accord"! Not a good look for Honda/Acura.

bilirubin

That's an example of a "Time Period Bias" from which one cannot draw any conclusions outside of that period.

richii0207

Comparisons of different generations that span over 15 years including the current generation seems rather fair. Outside of the civic comparison I mentioned is the accord vs tlx comparison that fiatlux brought up a couple of posts back.

bilirubin

That's true as well. Make any comparison you want, but you cannot draw any conclusions beyond the period of your time-biased selection. For example, one cannot reasonably conclude "Si is better than the RSX" from looking at 2006 alone, as one would be ignoring the four previous years when the RSX was superior to the Si. You could say, however, "the Si was better than the RSX for a year in 2006".

mike03a3

In addition to the two you mention, my personal favorites are the HUD, which I use all the time and the iPhone app that has two features I use constantly: Look up an address on the phone and push a button to transmit it to the NAV and use the app to set a planned departure time and the car will be all warmed up when I get in.
The seats and wheel can also be set to turn on automatically if the temperature drops below a selected degree.

ESHBG

I was referring to the TLX lineup in general which is missing a lot: remote start, auto fold in mirrors, 360 camera, HUD. You need to get the top trim for all of these options (which is then not very sporty) yet they are now common on cars costing less. How can you be luxury-ish and command a premium when you are missing so much? Acura corrected this with the RDX where you can now get the A-Spec and Advance packages.

richii0207

Not big on the HUD, it’s too distracting to be on the windshield. I don’t like anything on the windshield at all. HUD seems like a gimmick IMO but personal preference I guess.

The nav and planned departure feature is actually what I use with my Type S (doesn't have the feature to start car automatically at a specific time). That seems like a neat feature for colder climates where it snows.

fiatlux

That’s what we’re all saying, but the premise is that in the past Acuras performed better than their Honda counterparts. The whole point is that current Acura is lagging in performance relative to old Acura. Nothing you have shown indicates otherwise.

richii0207

And that’s what I’ve been saying throughout my previous post. Is this a common ground we finally come together on? It only took most of the year, I’ll grab a few beers for us to celebrate.

Tony Pac

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu...r/69794370007/

+1 for Integra

bilirubin

wow, North American Car of the Year! Congrats Acura! Now's a good time for them to reveal more Type S info.

Tony Pac

Indeed! Acura got the best lineup. Just need to make cars now and resolve the supply issue.