Initially I have some high frequency (but low amplitude) vibrations that you could feel in the steerng wheel and seat when speeds exceed 72 MPH. It was much more notieceable on freshly paved asphalt.

So I took it to the dealer and they did a road force balance and low and behold, both Michelins (car has 3500 miles) were defective! So they replaced both tires and road force balanced all 4 wheels.

Now the car drives ultra smooth but the last two days I've noticed a medium loud pulsing noise when the car is cruising in the 50-60 MPH range (like if one is left open). Makes no difference whether turning or going straight. What's weird is that there is absolutely no vibration anywhere in the car at any speeds!

Could a road force balance made the car so smooth and now it reveals something else? The car was previously with the dealer for 3 days (separate thread in the main forums section) for the vibration and other issues. I sure hate to keep bringing the car to the dealer. UGH!

What could possibly be the problem? I doubt a bearing problem with only 3500 miles. Since the two new fronts have less than 250 miles on them would this pulsing noise be remedied once the tires are broken in and adapt to the car?

Frustrated that a new TL would have these issues.

 

I'd wonder if its the other 2 tires they didn't replace? I had a similar problem on a Lincoln and the dealer ended up replacing all 4 tires to get rid of the vibrations and noises. They said the tires would balance OK but they weren't perfectly round from sitting on the truck with too low a tire pressure. It took a road force balance to find out how bad they really were.

 

Define a pulsing noise? I don't quite understand that. If I had a guess, I would also say its the tire tread problem but that would have a whining sound. How many miles total on the car?

 

I think I have the same issue but can't figure out if its the road or what. If I go to my dealer and ask them to perform this test will they do so right away? Or is this something they will try to push off to something else.

The other thing I notice is alot of feedback from both the gas/brake pedals (just while driving) do others feel more feedback than they are used to on other cars?

 

It depends on the dealer and if they have the road force balance machine. I've found most dealers send tire problems like this out to an independent shop. Years ago you could find the shops that have the machine on Hunters website but I don't know if they still do that. Back then there was only a few shops in and around Toronto that had them.

Yes I also find this car has unusual feed back through the pedals. It's not much but it is different from my previous car. At least you don't feel the pulsing of the wiper motor like my G35 did.

 

OK, to kill a few birds with the same stone.

The dealer is Acura of Boston and they have done a FANTASTIC job in trying to resolve things and make me happy. They have a huge service garage and supposedly very knowledgeable mechanics as per other people's post in the New England forum.

They road force balanced all 4 wheels. Within Acura specs is 10 lbs. The two bad ones generated a force of 25 pounds each. They tried to balance it out but only got it down to 15 lbs. so they replaced both.

They have two of these machines in house which I find surprising. Also, I think my car has been sitting on the dealer's lot (I live in NJ and bought it from Ramsey Acura) for a while which could have lead to flat spots. I don't think the the other two tires have flat spots as the vibration of the car and steering wheel is gone after the road force balance. Still I wonder about the other two even though most of the weight is on the fronts.

It is very weird that a pulsating noise does NOT translate into any vibration! To give you an idea of what a pulsating noise is, it's like driving with one of the rear windows rolled down partially. You get that negative pressure, positive pressure pulsing noise. Yes, I checked all windows, they are close. You hear a "thump" "thump" "thump" yet no steering wheel shake or chassis shake or pedals shake. Applying brakes when hearing this pulsating noise does not pulse the brake pedals either.

Car has 3500 miles. About 500 miles since the new tires were installed. I wonder if the new tires haven't worn in yet and something like this will go away after 1000+ miles.

I left the car at the dealer so I don't know if they can do a road force balance right away. I guess it depends on how backed up they are. Also, I don't know how long it would take.

As for pedal feedback, on mine, I feel nothing.

I called the dealer a few hours ago and they have a loaner for me next Monday. They also need to re-address the rattle in the rear cabin. They were not successful the first time.

 

Could be totally unrelated but mine had a whining noise from day one at 40 mph +. It occured 80% of the time and only after driving a few miles, never right away. The sound never changed frequency. It came on at 40 mph and faded as wind and road noise took over.

Was resolved by replacing the drive shaft. Bad bearing. Dealer found it by testing on a hoist. In my case this eliminated road and wind noise to help pinpoint it.

09 AWD

 

WOW! A bad driveshaft and bearings???!!! Yikes! Your symptom sounds like mine though at a speed range. My speed range for when this happens has gravitated to 60-75 MPH since my last post. You really notice it on freshly paved asphalt.

Car is going to the dealer tomorrow for this and the still recurring clunking noise in the read passenger side (separate thread elsewhere). I will mention your experience to them. Right now I've put in close to 1000 miles on the two new fronts so I doubt it is the tires. I double checked my last work order and they road force balanced all 4 after the two new fronts.

How did they test on a hoist as you're not suppose to run the car w/o load. Dyno? Can you let me know ASAP if you read this in time as I won't be able to check tomorrow morning. I want to plant as much info as possible in the dealer's head. They have been very helpful though.

Lastly, I hope this was covered under warranty?

 

Maybe I’m being too general. I didn’t speak with the Tech. I picked up the car late and talked with the service advisor. When he said they found it by running it in the shop I just assumed on a hoist. Don’t know if they have a dyno but what every they used they had to get under while it was running in gear and at speed (45 mph or so)

I don’t know if the drive shaft was bad or not. It may have just been replaced with the bearing. The write up called it a propeller replacement? Sounds like something my Audi dealer would call it. Ha!

Yes it was under warranty. No problem there. I drove the car for about 4 months trying to pin point the source. My dealer was on board the whole time and was ready to jump in when I gave them the word.

I was originally thinking it was a vacuum leak from under the dash. Being totally random I didn’t want the dealer to have to chase down noises that I’m sure would not show up on their road tests.

Hope this helps. If you need I can probably find the part numbers of the replacement parts.

 

Sorry about the typos above. I'm a hunt and pecker and by kids have worn the frickin keys right off this pc. Ugh!

 

LOL! Your kids must spend a lot of time on the computer!

No problem. Many times I read fast and I just read right over the typos or never notice them. Yep, the propeller shaft is common lingo for the drive shaft to AWD systems. My wife's Toyota SUV has has a "propeller shaft". Even the manual calls it that!

If you can dig up your work order and post the the part number and "description" that will be great. I can look it up online for the diagram.

I hear ya' about the dealer reproducing the problem. Like you, my pulsing sound doesn't happen all the time, even when I hit a speed that I thought should cause it and have in the past. And my home way from home dealer is in Boston, they don't really have smooth roads or freshly paved highways where they can do 70-75...unless it's like 2am in the morning! LOL!

 

Oh this doesn't sound good. So when I got to the dealer today I could not reproduce this with their shop foreman riding with me. It's not that it didn't happen, it's that it is in friggin' Boston. Where the hell can you find a fresh clean ashphalt highway where you can do 70 MPH???

UGH! If they can't reproduce it they can't fix it. What are my next option? Find a dealer near some nice less traveled blacktop???

They have kept my car overnight so let's see what they say tomorrow.... Starting to feely a little ansy!

 

Why don't you tell the dealer that it needs to be around 70mph and have them take you somewhere where you can do this?? I am glad I don't live in boston if there is no place to drive 70mph. That sucks.

 

They know about the 70 MPH. Either they can't get up to that speed w/o driving out to the suberbs or when they can get to 70 MPH, the roads are not smooth enough.

It's not just Boston but any large cities. I grew up in NYC so I'm sure the Acura dealer there will have a hard time getting to that speed w/o going to NJ!

 

I too have this low frequency pulsing/droning noise as soon as I get to 63mph all the way through 80mph. Only 900 miles on the car with Michelin Pilot Sport Plus A/S 245/40/19.

I am taking it in this saturday to have them look into it. Will mention what you have had done (road force and driveshaft) and see what they say.

I am lucky that I have several freshly paved areas that you can do 70mph legally. Will ride with the tech to properly point it out as I can reproduce it at will. I am inclined to think that it is the driveshaft out of balance as I don't have a ton of vibration coming through the steering wheel.

Will let you all know what happens. Thanks for your posts.

 

Kingmeow,

I had to drive from the suburbs into Boston to buy my car and take it home. I believe Rt2 has done some repaving and there are sections that are pretty smooth. It may be a mile or two to get to Rt2 from the dealer (if you are talking Bernardi in Brighton). You have to go to fresh pond parkway to Alewife station and then on to Rt2.

 

Yes, please let me know!!!!! I too do not have a ton of vibration coming through the wheel anymore after they replaced the two front tires after a road force balance. That's why I am a bit surprise with this audio pulsating! Usually with pulsating noise comes vibrations!

When I had the two bad tires, there were definitely high frequency vibrations through the wheel, and the seat, and the dash.

Don't forget to report back! It's been Day 2 and I suspect they will call this afternoon to tell me they fix the other issue (clunking noise in the rear) but that they couldn't reproduce the pulsing.

[BTW, when I mentioned that I read a post here about a bent/defective propeller drive shaft, the shop foreman said probably not the case with me as there would be a lot of rubbing noise and vibration. I did tell him that the other poster said that it happens 80% of the time. Service Advisor said they will call the Acura Tech Line if they have to for assisstance.]

 

BG, awesome, awesome, awesome!!! I will let them know if they can't reproduce it. Yes, it's Bernardi Acura of Boston. Great service department though!

I will give them the directions although it sounds like they would know where it is.

 

I will of course post back with what they find. I will say that I do have a very slight vibration that comes along with pulse/drone noise.

I also have heard a single clunk/pop noise on 3 separate occasions, once from the left front and 2x from the right rear and all while barely moving while pulling into a very smooth and flat parking space?

 

Kingmeow, honestly if you are having a pulsating sound inside the car, 99% of the time it has to do with the tires, especially when they are cold first thing in the morning. I would take the car to a tire place and see if they can balance them again. You should see if the dealer can swap out your tires with another TL on the lot and then go for a test drive and see.

 

The dealer has already road force balanced all 4. The front two were defective and not balancable so they were replaced. The rear two were well below spec. Also the pulsing happens regardless of cold or hot tires. I hear it driving up to Boston from NJ and that's a 200 mile trip one way.

I hope and wish that it's as simple as tires and I would be happy if that's all it takes.

Your idea of swapping with another set of tires they have on hand is a good idea and I will mention that to them. The shop foreman did say that he will drive a similar car on the lot and compare noises.

 

My clunking is the right rear. All the details are in another thread but to summarize, it does a SINGLE clunk when I accelerate normally from a complete stop. Sometimes it does the single clunk when deaccelerating to a complete stop. I'm talking normal stop and go and not panic breaking or WOT acceleration.

It's almost like two pieces are pushing each other at the seam/weld and then just "let go" like an earthquake making a single pop. At highway speeds above 50 MPH you can not reproduce it no matter how rough the road it. No constant vibrating at all and it's not because the clunk is drowned out by road/wind noise.

The first time I brought it in, they said they found the location at a rear seam and dimpled the welds (near the rear door cutout location). It was good for about two days and then it came back. So now they have the car again. They just called, they need another night so total 3 days. No biggie for me as I have a loaner and all I do is go to work up here in Boston.

 

Kingmeow,

I totally understand what you are saying about already having the tires balanced. You just need to understand the roadforce balance, and I didn't want to say this but when you reported the acceptable tolerances for Acura is 10lbs, well that is bullcrap. There is no acceptable tolerances when it comes to balancing a tire. It's either is or it is not. No ranges. Do me a favor, call a reputable tire company like firestone and ask them what the normal tolerances for a balance are and see what they say. Look at your rear tires and see if there is cupping on the edges, I bet you there is if the tires are withing 10lbs within spec. Tell the dealership to give you 2 days with a swapped set of tires and see if it makes a difference. I bet you, it will.

Now in TLNV's case, I think it has more to do with the 19" summer tires. They tend to be noisier and create an audible whining and pulsating sound which is normal.

 

Normally I would agree with you, however two things. First these are A/S not that it makes a difference. Second, I drove an AWD w/19" HPT with the exact same tires before this one and it did not have any noise/vibration/pulsing or droning.

 

chaiwala, I'm hearing you buddy and only repeating what the dealer said out the first time. They said that in a road force balance Acura's acceptable limits is 10 lbs transmitted back to the car. I'm only assuming here that the car's shocks and springs can absorb up to 10 lbs w/o making the occupants feel anything so thus the 10# acceptable limits.

To tell you the truth I've never even seen a road force balance machine before, only the "regular" ones. Even with those, there has to be some "vibration" when a tire is completely balanced, no? Even V8s have some vibrations when running and they are totally balancable on paper. Nothing is 100% as these are mechanical devices with tolerances. Not trying to refute you and I do hear what you're saying when either it is or is not balanced.

Well, getting a new set for a 2 day loaner will be hard to do in a sense that I drive back home to NJ from Boston for the weekend and then I'm not back in that dealer's area until two weeks later.

Question: if I can ignore it, will it wear itself back round in a few thousand miles? I'm willing to live with that if I can know that it's not a mechanical problem. Giving my current work situation, it's not exacatly the easiest to diagnose these problems.

 

No ignoring it is not going to solve it, because tires don't correct themselves usually because tread wear will be uneven between the fronts and rear. I really wasn't saying that the 10lb difference is causing the pulsating sound, I was more insinuating that if they told me that I would lose all faith in them. On a new car, you really don't want 2 used tires and 2 new tires regardless of the very little miles on the used set. Be persistent and see if they can change all 4 tires to a better set of rubber and see if helps. I despise the Michelin MXM's so much so that I already have a new set of Michelin Primacy MXV4's en route to my place so I can balance them and once my car arrives I'll mount them.

 

Ugh! Just got an e-mail that they need to hold the car another night to let the seam sealer dry (for the clunking noise). I think they're just randoming taking stabs to try to solve this clunking noise.

So that's Monday through Thursday for the record. No biggie as I have a TSX loaner BUT they didn't even attack this pulsating problem yet!!!!!!

So a) they are taking this much time for the clunking noise only? I don't even want to know how stripped my car is right now! And b) bring the car back the next time you're in the area and we'll look at the pulsating problem. There goes another two weeks! Oh well, at least I'm getting my car back until then and they are willing to continue until I'm happy.

 

For what its worth, mine was a constant drone or hissing sound over 40 mph. Very tough to pinpoint but a long story tightened up, it ended up being a "front prop shaft bearing" p/n 40100-TK5-A02 - shaft, propelle. I don't mean to get you guys off in another direction and by your discussions I think my issue is unrelated but you have to look at everything. In my case, I was chasing a vacuum leak for 4 months.

 

Hey, thanks for the part number and the diagnosis of your issue. Like you said, you have to consider everything and look every where. The dealer didn't get to this problem all week. He was trying to resolve the rear clunking noise. After 3-1/2 days in the shop I believe they finally got it this second time around. Additional seams rubbing when the body flex. This time it was at a junction point where 4 seams/panel came together. They dimple the spot welds, and gently separated some areas and applied seam sealer. Seems to be working fine - knock on wood!!!!!

The car is going back in two weeks (next time I'm up in Boston) to address the pulsing. They didn't even touch that issue this time.

 

Maybe you can record the pulsing noise for the dealership?

 

I was actually thinking about that but it's subtle and I don't know if a normal microphone would be able to capture it. I'll give it a shot and see. Now if I have one of those really expensive studio ones...

 

Pigeon II, wow that part lists for $1056! I will mention that you had this problem and maybe they can check it out if they come up short in finding a source on my car.

Well, I'm glad to report the inside clunking noise is resolved! Let's hope they are as determined in resolving this pulsing noise.

 

Ok, update time. Took the vehicle in on Saturday for it's appointment regarding this issue. They are having their master tech work on it.

I took him on a short drive and since it happens every time above 63mph, it was very easy to reproduce and have him acknowledge.

Did several short runs at 60mph very smooth with no pulsing/droning noise or vibration, then took it up over 63mph several times in order to reproduce the pulsing/droning and vibration.

Here is what he has done so far to troubleshoot, in the order performed.

1. Road force balance all four corners.
2. Drive - issue still present.
3. Rotate front to rear
4. Drive - issue still present.
5. Test drive brand new AWD TL w/HPT for base measurement - no issues.
6. Remove wheels from my TL and install to test TL.
7. Drive - no issues.
8. Install wheels from test TL to my TL.
9. Drive - issue still present.

Having eliminated wheels and tires etc on my TL, tech is conferring with Acura engineers this morning (Monday the 30th)

Sorry not much else to report on the issue, other than I am very glad that I am not going crazy and the issue is real.

Told them to keep it until the issue is resolved.

Cannot say enough great things about this dealership and the way they have treated my wife and I over the last year. First class.

Will update as soon as I have more info.

 

Here's my update, only because this is getting interesting! I just dropped it off to Acura of Boston. The last time they had the car and kept it for a week they ran out of time to address this pulsing problem. Instead they resolved (to 98%) the rear interior clunking noise (seams were rubbing) so I'm happy with that. No sense chasing after the last 2% and ripping the car to shreds.

So, the car is back to them for this week. Pigeon II was nice enough to scan his work order which described his dealer's diagnostic steps and what eventually fixed it (replaced propeller shaft to rear of car). I printed it out and gave it to them as a "suggestion" if they don't find anything wrong.

The secondary problem is that there's not really good smooth roads here in the Boston area. I did suggest Route 2 as BGinMA suggested. Let's see what they find. One "turn off" this morning is that the shop foreman briefly quipped that so far he has not determined that there is a problem. He did drive the car with me the last time I brought it in and today he said that incident was "vague" in the noise he hears. He suggested that maybe I stop by one day in the morning and drive another TL AWD and see if I hear the noise in that one. Most likely not!

I'm crossing my fingers that it's not one of those "We don't hear it so it's not a problem!" He said he would drive it around and see. One thing he suggested that I didn't do and it makes sense, when the pulsing happens, put the car in Neutral. If it's a propeller drive shaft issue then the pulsing should stop (I think) as in Neutral I don't think the power shaft to the rear is spinning. I also mentioned maybe they can put it on the hoist as they did for Pigeon II.

One surprise was this time my loaner is an '09 RL. Nice!

 

TNLV, thanks for the update. It sounds like you may have a similar problem to Pigeon II as it looks like they have completely ruled out tire/wheel issues (like me). Once they figure this all out, can you also scan and e-mail your work order (personal info blanked out) so I have yet another reference point - should it go that far?

I really hope it's something simple but at the same time I don't want them to ignore something that's real, though they may claim "We don't hear it".

I wish mine was more obvious. It is if they fix the damn roads around here!

An alternative is to leave it and let it wear out to the point that it becomes obvious and then they will have to fix it. I have an extended warranty to 6 years and 120k miles though the factory drive train warranty is 7(?) years and I don't remember how many miles.

 

**update**
Stopped by the shop after work last night and spoke with the tech. He said that after spending much time with the engineers at Acura, he has been instructed to swap the entire drive shaft from a brand new AWD with mine to see if the issue resolves itself.

He will be doing that this morning so will let you all know later on what he finds. He says beyond that, if it does not resolve the issue, Acura is scratching their heads and will need more time to investigate what his next move should be.

 

Damn, another potential drive shaft problem. Do you know how long would that take? If they take longer than a week with my car I'll have to drive back to NJ with that nice RL and use it for the weekend!

 

Unknown at this point. What I know as of right now is that they are removing one from a new AWD and swapping it with mine and was supposed to happen this morning/today. Not sure what happens if that is the problem. ie: do they leave the swapped one on and order a new one for the vehicle it came off or do they remove it and order a new one for mine?

Until the vehicle was in the air I had no idea that these have 3 piece drive shafts and are replaced as one unit.

 

Kingmeow and TLNV, keep us updated.

I'll have to keep my ears open tonight for any "pulsing noises." I assume it's VERY obvious and similar to the noise when one of the rear windows is opened partially.

It's odd that both an 09 and 10 model are affected, as most bugs should have been worked out in the 1st year release.

 

Bingo! Though in my case you need to be on a smooth road to hear it. Otherwise road noise from bumps, etc. will drown it out. Also, when coasting, say off ramp or to a toll plaza, the sound is more clear as the engine noise does down as it idles.

In Pigeon's or TNLV's case it might be more obvious.

Once thing asked by the mechanic that I never considered doing is once I hear the pulsing noise, let go of the accelerator and put the car in Neutral. That can be another data point in the diagnosis process. I don't know if the noise should remain or go away if it's a drive shaft issue.