Road & Track 11/20/08 Road Test: 2009 Acura TL SH-AWD
11-20-2008, 07:19 AM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
Road & Track 11/20/08 Road Test: 2009 Acura TL SH-AWD
Looks like they tried to stay neutral and cautious. I think the mags are all afraid to take a solid position on the car. They are waiting like everyone else.
edited to add: Does anyone else think it's strange Acura quoted the SH-AWD to be the quicker of the two, yet thet say it's a tenth behind the bade TL? odd..
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=7232
edited to add: Does anyone else think it's strange Acura quoted the SH-AWD to be the quicker of the two, yet thet say it's a tenth behind the bade TL? odd..
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=7232
11-20-2008, 07:31 AM
#2
Racer
Thread Starter
Looks like they tried to stay neutral and cautious. I think the mags are all afraid to take a solid position on the car. They are waiting like everyone else.
edited to add: Does anyone else think it's strange Acura quoted the SH-AWD to be the quicker of the two, yet they say it's a tenth behind the base TL? odd..
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=7232
edited to add: Does anyone else think it's strange Acura quoted the SH-AWD to be the quicker of the two, yet they say it's a tenth behind the base TL? odd..
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=7232
sorry for the typo-o's it's early and i'm in a rush..
11-20-2008, 07:55 AM
#3
I'm not a magazine racer, I just drive my car on the streets. But my only opinion is that if you were to put some high end tires on the factory 18" rims on the AWD... you would see better times than anyone has yet to put out. As much as people want to say the summer HP package tires help, the 19" rims do not.
11-20-2008, 08:08 AM
#4
Racer
Thread Starter
I'm not a magazine racer, I just drive my car on the streets. But my only opinion is that if you were to put some high end tires on the factory 18" rims on the AWD... you would see better times than anyone has yet to put out. As much as people want to say the summer HP package tires help, the 19" rims do not.
11-20-2008, 08:15 AM
#5
Racer
Thread Starter
One other thing I find strange; Isn't the TL Type-S top speed limited to 147 mph? Why with 19" HPT's is the SH-AWD held back at 128? Could it be something to do with the AWD system being stressed at higher speeds? Heck, the 3G TL isn't even limited to that. Anyone?
11-20-2008, 08:18 AM
#6
Three Wheelin'
In my opinion, it's the weight. AWD models rarely will outrun their base-configured counterparts. (I think if Acura added about 40-50 more hp or torque, it would have made a significant difference). That being said, however, I still think Motor Trend can pull-off a sub-6 sec run, though.
11-20-2008, 08:23 AM
#7
AZ Community Team
Good review, R&T are like Edmunds and fairly balanced. Personally I'd rather see a RWD or FWD 5G TL.
The weight and added losses of AWD systems are always there wheither they are used or not. None the less for spirited driving in the dry the SH-AWD system does play a substantion active role unlike most other AWD systems which are more for low-traction environments.
Wow, look at the test data. For a 4100lb test curb weight it sure can handle and stop!
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/d...acuraTL_dp.pdf
The weight and added losses of AWD systems are always there wheither they are used or not. None the less for spirited driving in the dry the SH-AWD system does play a substantion active role unlike most other AWD systems which are more for low-traction environments.
Wow, look at the test data. For a 4100lb test curb weight it sure can handle and stop!
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/d...acuraTL_dp.pdf
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11-20-2008, 08:32 AM
#8
Racer
Thread Starter
In my opinion, it's the weight. AWD models rarely will outrun their base-configured counterparts. (I think if Acura added about 40-50 more hp or torque, it would have made a significant difference). That being said, however, I still think Motor Trend can pull-off a sub-6 sec run, though.
And I've already gotten a 5.8 0-60, so I know someone else will.
And I'll make this point again; the biggest factor keeping the SH from a better 1/4 mile time is that delay I mentioned off the line. If you minimize that the car really has some serious pull if you take it to the 6800 limiter. R&T notes on the data panel they upshifted to 2nd at 6k which is how I said you have to do it earlier to time the 1-2 shift at 6800rpm. The only question is how did they launch it? And it was 83 degress for their test, and only like 43 when I did my tests, and colder = more HP. So all in all I feel confident with their results. There are always variables, and someone will hit them all right and nail some better times. But if you had to put a number on paper that you could consistently run with the car i'd say they got that right on the money.
11-20-2008, 10:12 AM
#10
i've driven a gallardo and murcielago and that 'delay' that everyone speaks of is just as noticeable in those vehicles. it takes longer to get power to 4 wheels versus 2 (whether its fwd or rwd).
0-60 is pretty meaningless to me as traffic light driving is not meant for racing nor do i ever plan on 'racing' my 4 door sedan. it's get up to 60mph very quickly for a 4,000lb vehicle, it's no slouch, but not the fastest thing out there. highway/freeway acceleration is what matters to me, i want to be able to easily get around people and be in/out of traffic with ease. my merges from on-ramps are phenomenal, loads of mid range torque from 40-60mph, this thing shoots up to 90mph effortlessly for something that apparently weighs so heavy. where i want to see handling is backroads, windy roads, where you barely go over 60mph, and this thing performs exceptionally.
this is the right car for me. this is not the right car for someone going through a midlife crisis and thinks their speed racer in their g37. it's a family sedan, it's purposeful, not for racing. it's interior is top notch and that's what i enjoy. my step dad is 6'4 / 250, and he had more than 6" extra room in the back seat.
11-20-2008, 10:36 AM
#11
Racer
Thread Starter
i think you meant to say torque. you don't get off the line with horsepower. that 0-15mph zone or 0-2,000rpms in 1st gear in the AWD will always be delayed unless they figure out how to get more torque down there which is damn near impossible.
i've driven a gallardo and murcielago and that 'delay' that everyone speaks of is just as noticeable in those vehicles. it takes longer to get power to 4 wheels versus 2 (whether its fwd or rwd).
0-60 is pretty meaningless to me as traffic light driving is not meant for racing nor do i ever plan on 'racing' my 4 door sedan. it's get up to 60mph very quickly for a 4,000lb vehicle, it's no slouch, but not the fastest thing out there. highway/freeway acceleration is what matters to me, i want to be able to easily get around people and be in/out of traffic with ease. my merges from on-ramps are phenomenal, loads of mid range torque from 40-60mph, this thing shoots up to 90mph effortlessly for something that apparently weighs so heavy. where i want to see handling is backroads, windy roads, where you barely go over 60mph, and this thing performs exceptionally.
this is the right car for me. this is not the right car for someone going through a midlife crisis and thinks their speed racer in their g37. it's a family sedan, it's purposeful, not for racing. it's interior is top notch and that's what i enjoy. my step dad is 6'4 / 250, and he had more than 6" extra room in the back seat.
i've driven a gallardo and murcielago and that 'delay' that everyone speaks of is just as noticeable in those vehicles. it takes longer to get power to 4 wheels versus 2 (whether its fwd or rwd).
0-60 is pretty meaningless to me as traffic light driving is not meant for racing nor do i ever plan on 'racing' my 4 door sedan. it's get up to 60mph very quickly for a 4,000lb vehicle, it's no slouch, but not the fastest thing out there. highway/freeway acceleration is what matters to me, i want to be able to easily get around people and be in/out of traffic with ease. my merges from on-ramps are phenomenal, loads of mid range torque from 40-60mph, this thing shoots up to 90mph effortlessly for something that apparently weighs so heavy. where i want to see handling is backroads, windy roads, where you barely go over 60mph, and this thing performs exceptionally.
this is the right car for me. this is not the right car for someone going through a midlife crisis and thinks their speed racer in their g37. it's a family sedan, it's purposeful, not for racing. it's interior is top notch and that's what i enjoy. my step dad is 6'4 / 250, and he had more than 6" extra room in the back seat.
Well said CL and thanks for the other info. Very sweet to have driven those exotics. I feel exactly the same way as to what I wanted and expected from this car, and it's exceeding all of my expectations. I knew it wasn't the fastest sedan on wheels, but I knew I would fit me the best with all it has to offer. Some may not like its design, but it offers such a well balance of things for the $$. It is now in a unique catergory of its own, luxurious, yet fun, and loaded with technology.
11-20-2008, 11:23 AM
#12
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i think you meant to say torque. you don't get off the line with horsepower. that 0-15mph zone or 0-2,000rpms in 1st gear in the AWD will always be delayed unless they figure out how to get more torque down there which is damn near impossible.
i've driven a gallardo and murcielago and that 'delay' that everyone speaks of is just as noticeable in those vehicles. it takes longer to get power to 4 wheels versus 2 (whether its fwd or rwd).
0-60 is pretty meaningless to me as traffic light driving is not meant for racing nor do i ever plan on 'racing' my 4 door sedan. it's get up to 60mph very quickly for a 4,000lb vehicle, it's no slouch, but not the fastest thing out there. highway/freeway acceleration is what matters to me, i want to be able to easily get around people and be in/out of traffic with ease. my merges from on-ramps are phenomenal, loads of mid range torque from 40-60mph, this thing shoots up to 90mph effortlessly for something that apparently weighs so heavy. where i want to see handling is backroads, windy roads, where you barely go over 60mph, and this thing performs exceptionally.
this is the right car for me. this is not the right car for someone going through a midlife crisis and thinks their speed racer in their g37. it's a family sedan, it's purposeful, not for racing. it's interior is top notch and that's what i enjoy. my step dad is 6'4 / 250, and he had more than 6" extra room in the back seat.
i've driven a gallardo and murcielago and that 'delay' that everyone speaks of is just as noticeable in those vehicles. it takes longer to get power to 4 wheels versus 2 (whether its fwd or rwd).
0-60 is pretty meaningless to me as traffic light driving is not meant for racing nor do i ever plan on 'racing' my 4 door sedan. it's get up to 60mph very quickly for a 4,000lb vehicle, it's no slouch, but not the fastest thing out there. highway/freeway acceleration is what matters to me, i want to be able to easily get around people and be in/out of traffic with ease. my merges from on-ramps are phenomenal, loads of mid range torque from 40-60mph, this thing shoots up to 90mph effortlessly for something that apparently weighs so heavy. where i want to see handling is backroads, windy roads, where you barely go over 60mph, and this thing performs exceptionally.
this is the right car for me. this is not the right car for someone going through a midlife crisis and thinks their speed racer in their g37. it's a family sedan, it's purposeful, not for racing. it's interior is top notch and that's what i enjoy. my step dad is 6'4 / 250, and he had more than 6" extra room in the back seat.
11-20-2008, 11:34 AM
#13
Well said CL and thanks for the other info. Very sweet to have driven those exotics. I feel exactly the same way as to what I wanted and expected from this car, and it's exceeding all of my expectations. I knew it wasn't the fastest sedan on wheels, but I knew I would fit me the best with all it has to offer. Some may not like its design, but it offers such a well balance of things for the $$. It is now in a unique catergory of its own, luxurious, yet fun, and loaded with technology.
And the other 'optional' things aren't a big deal to me and i don't feel cheated in the slightest:
-cooled seats (again, been in a lot of high end cars, and this feature wasn't noticeable at all)
-electronic steering column (nice feature in the Lexus when the wheel retracts when you exit the car, but it had no bearing on my decision)
-retractable side mirrors (nice feature in the Lexus as well, but I don't live in the city where this would be a must)
-adaptive front lights (i think the lighting system in the TL is amazing, i have had no issues seeing around corners)
-rain sensing wipers/headlight wipers (i don't live in an area where this has any effect on me at all)
And not to mention the technology the 4G TL has OVER these cars with apparently 'more features':
-AWD system is above and beyond anything in it's class
-Navigation system is probably the most advanced on the market at this time
-Interior fit and finish feel amazing, easily comparable to the the Lexus GS which is roughly $8,000 more
11-20-2008, 11:41 AM
#14
Unless they use diffrent 4wd set ups in these cars,I would have to disagree. i know its apples and oranges but my past two evo's got the power tothe ground instantly and had no traction issues. This ccar (tl) is heavy and the horsepower is not enough to overcome the wieght diff over the two. if done right, the awd setup can be a beast. But what you lose in horsepower loss through the drivetrain you makeup with lots of traction
Again, expectations from people are different. In line with what I was saying, this is a family sedan, and it has it's purpose. Someone with pure performance in mind will say this thing has terrible get up off the line. Someone who is happy having a fairly quick car will have no complaints about it's off the line speed.
11-20-2008, 11:45 AM
#15
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I come from the Evo community as well. You can get loads of power from a stop on that thing when you drop the clutch. Not something I would be doing in my Acura. Two totally different cars. The TL is hardly slow to 60, it's just this initial delay which I've experienced in many other high end cars (and I don't categorize the Evo as high end). I got off the line just fine last night with 2 large passengers.
Again, expectations from people are different. In line with what I was saying, this is a family sedan, and it has it's purpose. Someone with pure performance in mind will say this thing has terrible get up off the line. Someone who is happy having a fairly quick car will have no complaints about it's off the line speed.
Again, expectations from people are different. In line with what I was saying, this is a family sedan, and it has it's purpose. Someone with pure performance in mind will say this thing has terrible get up off the line. Someone who is happy having a fairly quick car will have no complaints about it's off the line speed.
But I suspect the manual AWD TL will be lighter and thus faster, no?
11-20-2008, 12:51 PM
#17
I know we've talked about this before, but I still don't see weight as an issue. Drivetrain losses yes, but weight? Both AWD and RWD need a driveshaft, so to me, the only difference (between AWD and RWD) is the weight of the two front half shafts. To me, if you're already running a driveshaft for the rear wheels, most of the added weight is 'spent' so why not hook up the front wheels for an extra 50 lbs?
11-20-2008, 01:15 PM
#18
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0-60 in 6.3 - 1/4 mile in 14.8/96.7mph - Top speed
128 mph
Not that far off the Edumonds test.
128 mph
Not that far off the Edumonds test.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 11-20-2008 at 01:20 PM.
11-20-2008, 01:35 PM
#19
And 128mph top speed... seriously??? Family sedans need to be going 150mph on US roads.
11-20-2008, 01:54 PM
#20
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Is it good for a sports sedan? - no
Is it on a par with other cars in its 'class'? - no.
"a key competitor, the BMW 335i, which generates corresponding numbers of 5.0 and 13.5 at 104.5"
"G37 sports the mechanical equivalent of a gazelle's legs. It tears to 60 mph in just 5.4 seconds (5.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) on its way to a quarter-mile sprint of 13.7 seconds at 102.8 mph."
Is it slower then the base '09TL? - yes.
"Even the front-drive version of the new TL pips the SH-AWD flagship in acceleration by a tenth in each contest, despite a slightly taller final-drive ratio and 25 less bhp from a smaller 3.5-liter V-6."
11-20-2008, 02:28 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
Is it bad for a family car? - no.
Is it good for a sports sedan? - no
Is it on a par with other cars in its 'class'? - no.
"a key competitor, the BMW 335i, which generates corresponding numbers of 5.0 and 13.5 at 104.5"
"G37 sports the mechanical equivalent of a gazelle's legs. It tears to 60 mph in just 5.4 seconds (5.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) on its way to a quarter-mile sprint of 13.7 seconds at 102.8 mph."
Is it slower then the base '09TL? - yes.
"Even the front-drive version of the new TL pips the SH-AWD flagship in acceleration by a tenth in each contest, despite a slightly taller final-drive ratio and 25 less bhp from a smaller 3.5-liter V-6."
Is it good for a sports sedan? - no
Is it on a par with other cars in its 'class'? - no.
"a key competitor, the BMW 335i, which generates corresponding numbers of 5.0 and 13.5 at 104.5"
"G37 sports the mechanical equivalent of a gazelle's legs. It tears to 60 mph in just 5.4 seconds (5.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) on its way to a quarter-mile sprint of 13.7 seconds at 102.8 mph."
Is it slower then the base '09TL? - yes.
"Even the front-drive version of the new TL pips the SH-AWD flagship in acceleration by a tenth in each contest, despite a slightly taller final-drive ratio and 25 less bhp from a smaller 3.5-liter V-6."
11-20-2008, 02:33 PM
#22
Is it bad for a family car? - no.
Is it good for a sports sedan? - no
Is it on a par with other cars in its 'class'? - no.
"a key competitor, the BMW 335i, which generates corresponding numbers of 5.0 and 13.5 at 104.5"
"G37 sports the mechanical equivalent of a gazelle's legs. It tears to 60 mph in just 5.4 seconds (5.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) on its way to a quarter-mile sprint of 13.7 seconds at 102.8 mph."
Is it slower then the base '09TL? - yes.
"Even the front-drive version of the new TL pips the SH-AWD flagship in acceleration by a tenth in each contest, despite a slightly taller final-drive ratio and 25 less bhp from a smaller 3.5-liter V-6."
Is it good for a sports sedan? - no
Is it on a par with other cars in its 'class'? - no.
"a key competitor, the BMW 335i, which generates corresponding numbers of 5.0 and 13.5 at 104.5"
"G37 sports the mechanical equivalent of a gazelle's legs. It tears to 60 mph in just 5.4 seconds (5.2 seconds with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) on its way to a quarter-mile sprint of 13.7 seconds at 102.8 mph."
Is it slower then the base '09TL? - yes.
"Even the front-drive version of the new TL pips the SH-AWD flagship in acceleration by a tenth in each contest, despite a slightly taller final-drive ratio and 25 less bhp from a smaller 3.5-liter V-6."
11-20-2008, 02:41 PM
#23
AZ Community Team
11-20-2008, 02:49 PM
#24
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Where is the premier performance in the current numbers?
11-20-2008, 03:01 PM
#25
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Motor Trend clocked the '08 Cadillac CTS earlier in the year at 6.3 sec 0-60, yet it won Car of the Year.....the CTS is similar in size and hp rating as the TL SH-AWD........there's much more to a car than what it can do acceleration-wise........for an "old" guy, you should know better.
That being said the CTS comes in a number of flavors including 263HP, 304HP & their flagship, the fastest production sedan in the world, the 556HP V series.
You think the TL SH-AWD being a new car will win COTY for '09?
11-20-2008, 03:04 PM
#26
Acura add copy: The 2009 TL is simultaneously Acura, yet wholly unique. Designed in Southern California, the evocative and powerful exterior body design dramatically advances the TL’s prominence as a premier performance luxury sedan.
Where is the premier performance in the current numbers?
Where is the premier performance in the current numbers?
It says performance LUXURY sedan, which I believe is quite on par with the numbers. Clearly you haven't driven one yet as well. Maybe you should head down and try one out.
11-20-2008, 03:05 PM
#27
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11-20-2008, 03:09 PM
#28
Racer
Thread Starter
"FYI - Lexus has Direct Injection engines, has for a few yrs now. One of which is its 3.5L V6 w/303 HP motor in the GS350AWD, moving the 3750lb car from 0-60 in 5.3sec, 1/4 mile 13.8 @101.8 (Road & Track) Yes it has a 6 speed AT, but that DI motor is pretty nice."
11-20-2008, 03:13 PM
#30
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You are right in that I haven't driven one, not much point, since in its current form I can't get past the styling & will not be replacing my TL with another one.
The TL second on the list to get replaced, my BMW goes in '09 & the TL will go in '10. Will see whats available in 2010 but I don't believe the TL will change that much.
11-20-2008, 03:31 PM
#32
Racer
Thread Starter
CleanCl, didn't you read this whole thread. I posted about that this morning here while referring to R&T's data panel. What they did was acutally correct. In Manual (S) mode if you don't pull the paddle by 6K you will hit the rev limiter. It's revving up really fast in 1st gear so that's how long it takes for the trans to actually shift. Of course when you shift from 2nd to 3rd it's happening slower so you can wait till about 6700 and it's a perfect shift just about 6800.
11-20-2008, 03:33 PM
#33
CleanCl, didn't you read this whole thread. I posted about that this morning here while referring to R&T's data panel. What they did was acutally correct. In Manual (S) mode if you don't pull the paddle by 6K you will hit the rev limiter. It's revving up really fast in 1st gear so that's how long it takes for the trans to actually shift. Of course when you shift from 2nd to 3rd it's happening slower so you can wait till about 6700 and it's a perfect shift just about 6800.
Have you pegged the limiter yet?
11-20-2008, 03:39 PM
#34
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11-20-2008, 03:41 PM
#35
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Torque 275 lb-ft @ 5000 rpm
Most likely to hit the HP peak as it shifts & stay near peak torque when the shift is finished.
Not sure why they picked 6000 I would have hit the switch at 62-6300 to let it run slightly over the HP peak & come in higher on the RPM band. I am sure they ran it a number of times, with a number of start & shift point techniques & posted the best results they got.
For what its worth I shift right around 6,200 on the 6MT in my car. Seems to get the overall best performance that way. That being said the 6MT has a better ratios in the box so the RPM drop is not as much as the 5AT. A 6 or 7 speed auto would help the TL a great deal.
Very few racers will make a red line shift for two reasons. 1. You are past your power peak & no longer accelerating at a decent rate.
2. If you make the slightest mistake you hit the rev limiter & all the power goes away. It a traffic light race you best stick a fork in it because its done.
11-20-2008, 03:45 PM
#36
Umm, well since I do own the car, and R&T are professionals, I don't know why you are doubting this. And yes I have hit the limiter (it happens at about 6800-6900) a few times in first and second because I was testing out the best times to upshift and if you tried it you would see how easy it hits the limiter in 1st.
11-20-2008, 03:50 PM
#37
Racer
Thread Starter
[QUOTE=BEAR-AvHistory;10207689]Horsepower (SAE) 305 bhp @ 6300 rpm
Torque 275 lb-ft @ 5000 rpm
Most likely to hit the HP peak as it shifts & stay near peak torque when the shift is finished.
Not sure why they picked 6000 I would have hit the switch at 62-6300 to let it run slightly over the HP peak & come in higher on the RPM band. I am sure they ran it a number of times, with a number of start & shift point techniques & posted the best results they got.
For what its worth I shift right around 6,200 on the 6MT in my car. Seems to get the overall best performance that way. That being said the 6MT has a better ratios in the box so the RPM drop is not as much as the 5AT. A 6 or 7 speed auto would help the TL a great deal.
Very few racers will make a red line shift for two reasons. 1. You are past your power peak & no longer accelerating at a decent rate.
2. If you make the slightest mistake you hit the rev limiter & all the power goes away. It a traffic light race you best stick a fork in it because its done.[/QUOTE]
Bear, I understand what you mean but regarding #1. This 3.7L does love to rev and if that limiter wasn't there it would easily pull past 7000k. Yes the max HP is lower at appr 6300rpm but as I have said in another thread here, you want to come into the next gear above the VTEC engagement point (4750)or you have a dead spot in the lower RPM range. If it had a 6 Speed AT then this would not be such an issue as the gear ratio would be tighter and you'd come into the next gear easily in the VTEC. So going as close to the rev limiter did provide me with the fastest 0-60 and 1/4 mile times. When I let is shift automatically, which is between 6300-6500, it was at least .2-.4 tenths slower on all accounts. As for your #2, that is absolutely TRUE! If you hit the limiter, now you've lost WAY more time than shifting a little too soon. I'm just trying to explain why R&T wrote that they shifted at 6k, it is in my own experience the highest you can let it go in 1st before it will bump the limiter and ruin the test run or race.
edited to add: and yes I'm way past the recommended break in
Torque 275 lb-ft @ 5000 rpm
Most likely to hit the HP peak as it shifts & stay near peak torque when the shift is finished.
Not sure why they picked 6000 I would have hit the switch at 62-6300 to let it run slightly over the HP peak & come in higher on the RPM band. I am sure they ran it a number of times, with a number of start & shift point techniques & posted the best results they got.
For what its worth I shift right around 6,200 on the 6MT in my car. Seems to get the overall best performance that way. That being said the 6MT has a better ratios in the box so the RPM drop is not as much as the 5AT. A 6 or 7 speed auto would help the TL a great deal.
Very few racers will make a red line shift for two reasons. 1. You are past your power peak & no longer accelerating at a decent rate.
2. If you make the slightest mistake you hit the rev limiter & all the power goes away. It a traffic light race you best stick a fork in it because its done.[/QUOTE]
Bear, I understand what you mean but regarding #1. This 3.7L does love to rev and if that limiter wasn't there it would easily pull past 7000k. Yes the max HP is lower at appr 6300rpm but as I have said in another thread here, you want to come into the next gear above the VTEC engagement point (4750)or you have a dead spot in the lower RPM range. If it had a 6 Speed AT then this would not be such an issue as the gear ratio would be tighter and you'd come into the next gear easily in the VTEC. So going as close to the rev limiter did provide me with the fastest 0-60 and 1/4 mile times. When I let is shift automatically, which is between 6300-6500, it was at least .2-.4 tenths slower on all accounts. As for your #2, that is absolutely TRUE! If you hit the limiter, now you've lost WAY more time than shifting a little too soon. I'm just trying to explain why R&T wrote that they shifted at 6k, it is in my own experience the highest you can let it go in 1st before it will bump the limiter and ruin the test run or race.
edited to add: and yes I'm way past the recommended break in
11-20-2008, 04:33 PM
#38
Not just a smell
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Acura add copy: The 2009 TL is simultaneously Acura, yet wholly unique. Designed in Southern California, the evocative and powerful exterior body design dramatically advances the TL’s prominence as a premier performance luxury sedan.
Where is the premier performance in the current numbers?
Where is the premier performance in the current numbers?
Let's compare it to the Lexus line, as Lexus states:
IS350 - sport luxury sedan
ES350 - luxury sedan
GS350 - performance luxury sedan
As you can see, the IS350/GS350 show the difference between "sport" and "performance". The same goes for the BMW 3 & 5 series.
The big problem for the TL is that its outstanding value and more than capable performance makes it too easy to compare it to cars in a different class with more sport and less luxury, i.e. the G35/37, BMW 3 series, IS, etc. The fact that magazines choose to compare the TL to sport sedans is a compliment to its performance capabilities.
Right now, the 4G TL is priced like the ES350, yet has performance like the GS350, which makes it a very competitive package.
As for looks, all fun aside, before I started my research, I did not have a clear idea what the 2/3G TL's actually looked like. And it took me more than a month after I bought the car before I trained my eye to pick other TL's out of the general traffic (boy there were a lot of them... where were they hiding?!!!). I love how my 3G looks now but you can say that its beauty grew on me
I don't think the 4G's will have the same problem blending into traffic. And I don't think this forum nor auto journalists are truly representative of its target demographic: 40 something family man making +100k/year.
11-20-2008, 04:42 PM
#39
Suzuka Master
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Will have to take a closer look at it but I think the RPM drop with the 6MT on most if not all the gears is less then 1K so its pretty easy to stay in the power band.
The reason this thread interesting to me is all during the build up to the '09 release all you read on this site was how the 300+HP TL was going to kick every bodies butt big time.
Now that its here & so far it doesn't seem to be able do that the guys have changed to well what do you expect its a luxury car or its not a sports sedan or its the published times are all wrong.
The reason this thread interesting to me is all during the build up to the '09 release all you read on this site was how the 300+HP TL was going to kick every bodies butt big time.
Now that its here & so far it doesn't seem to be able do that the guys have changed to well what do you expect its a luxury car or its not a sports sedan or its the published times are all wrong.
