Heracles

Found a 2013 black TL SHAWD, with umber interior-13K miles. $29800. Got to dealer, threw me keys, said have fun! Took if for a long test drive. Balance of factory warranty so out to 12/2017.

I spent alot of time in and around the car. Was ready to leave deposit but still want to sleep on it.

As you have read in previous post, there is an insane LIKE NEW 2011 335Xdrive Msport for sale locally. 10K miles. Factory warranty is up in July 2015, but the dealehrship is putting a 100K mile warranty on engine trans.

I went to see the bmw, they were closed but the doors were open, I jumped in and i love how that feels also- different- i guess german, much sportier, although smaller interior feel

BMW negatives:
-Need to replace runflats with normal tires
-need to buy a jack and a spare and put in the trunk
-might need to spend 3000 on a mechanical warranty or just drive at risk
-higher maintenance costs

Thoughts?

For the record, I loved the TL, the only thing i didnt like- was the boring white face gauges illumination. The black with umber is just amazing.

Mr Magoo

This may be a little biased but I say go for the TL.
I was in a similar situation except I was shopping 2010 TL vs 2010 3-series so a little older than what you are looking at. I have no regrets with my decision.

Pros
- More space that 3 series
- Plenty of power
- Awesome ELS sound system !
- Great seats

Some Cons
- Could be a little quieter
- No Bluetooth track info

I think BMW makes good cars, but I will be keeping this TL for a long time that's for sure

Heracles

or 2011 335 xdrive msport, $28800, 10K miles.

ChrisAbadir

that 335 has a banging set of turbos. much sportier than tl. but i love my tl

hondatuner03

One of the cons Mr. Magoo lists (could be quieter) was improve in the 2012 refresh

I would go with the TL. Although the BMW is a beautiful car, to me the upkeep is too expensive. Mods are also expensive.

Heracles

thanks guys... TL was relatively quiet, but interior road noise was more noticable than the 335.

I literally drove one hour home from the TL test drive 95% confident. I stopped where the bmw was, the door was unlocked- I sat in it for a bit just for some more seat time. It still felt nice inspite of just being in the fancy TL interior- just a different feel; not better , maybe sportier, firmer? But definitely felt smaller inside.

012TL-GLM

Don't be tempted by the badge. If you want a 3 series lease a brand new one. I will guarantee you wish you got the TL within a short month or two. The excitement of the badge wears off quickly. It's really not that great of a car

Cooldude01

It depends on how long you want to keep the car.
If you want a reliable down the road after the warranty exhausted, go with the TL but if you just want to drive the car for a couple years then trade it in for another then the BMW.
Besides, the BMW is 1k cheaper but that won't be enough to cover the repair when it's out of warranty.
Also, the majority of the problems on the TL you can fix them yourself with information on this site and help from our members in here. I'm not sure I can say the same about the BMW.
Either way, both cars are good choices.. it's YOUR car so make sure you like it because you will see and drive it daily not us... Good luck..

andrewcjduong

Every one of my BMW owner friends have switched from a Japanese brand, and they've never looked back. I personally would probably grab the 335i but you're on an Acura forum hoping people will say get the BMW.

Heracles

Definitely not motivated by the badge.. Was mostly the driving dynamics of the 335.

But agree with all you reinforcing the reliability and maintenance difference.

The main thing on the 335 is that it's a unique sedan I it's own right.

Trying to think of how the tl would make me happier in the long run

Heracles

Btw..
The tl is at CarSense in Hatfield pa.
It has a pinstripe. Once I pulled up my eyes were on it. I told them I don't want it and asked them to remove it.

They said they can't and would not remove it for me.

Isn't that weird? It's taped on. Does it come off easy?

JM2010 SH-AWD

Interesting. Most people I know who are former BMW owners who have moved to Japanese cars (Acura, Infiniti, Lexus) say they'll never go back to BMW.


Maybe the grass is always greener?

C8N

Lease: 335
Buy: TL

quake97

Pinstripes can be tape or paint. I've dealt with that dealer before and they don't want to do much to the car because they already spend a lot getting them cleaned up in the first place. A pinstripe isn't that bad. I have one of my TL. Came that way and it's not terrible.

Joe

echodigital

Like new 2011 vs 2013. Go for the TL.

morgan1819

The difference in ownership experience between the two cars is pretty obvious, but I'll re-hash it one more time.

- If you need more room, get the Acura. If you need a reliable car, that you commute in everyday, get the Acura. If you are at all concerned about cost of ownership, get the Acura.

- The BMW is a smaller, sportier car, with livelier driving dynamics. It will require more maintenance, but there are many enthusiasts who are okay with maintenance.

- The BMW cost of ownership will definitely be considerably higher, but again, many people are okay with this.

Both are great cars. Just be honest about your usage, and priorities, and you will be fine with either.

Don't expect the TL to be as dynamic as the 335. It isn't. But don't expect the 335 to be as reliable, roomy, or easy to own as the TL. It isn't.

Echo42987

100% this.

Thunder82

BMW looks like a nice car, but for some reason I hate seeing the 335's with auto transmissions. :P

My friend has a 2009 335 and it has been very reliable for him. Tough call, but i'd personally go for the BMW.

2012wagon

Same here, for me to reason to buy the 335 is a manual trans.

I am surprised OP sat in the car while the dealership was closed. Glad cops didn't come and alarms didn't go off.

Personally I drive 26k miles a year...too high for a lease..and too much for maintenance..otherwise a 3 series wagon would be a great driver.

BMW has much better driver dynamics.

saturno_v

Of course you are going to get a biased opinion on an Acura forum....however I will try to be as subjective as I can.

The 335i and the TL are two very different animals. The TL is much larger and in fact it competes in size with the 5 Series....it has a much more comfortable and isolated ride than the 3.


The 335i engine is a gem (reliability aside), the smoothest 6 cylinder in the business, straight line acceleration leaves the TL in the dust and the low end torque can be intoxicating....on the other side at high rev the 3.7 V6 VTEC sing with a much nicer voice.


The interiors of the E90 3 Series feels cheaper and simpler than the TL, and when it comes to seats it's a no brainer....TL all the way (for look and comfort).

The BMW may have reliability issues which can be costly if the warranty runs out.

The 3 Series is more agile also due to its smaller side but the TL handles extremely well despite its size and weight.

Finally, the 3 Series is so common that if you care about being different it may not be the car for you....it is as common as an Honda Civic....its styling is a bit bland and it does not look the part of a car that did cost north of 50K properly optioned ...the TL on the other side has a very unique styling and, to me, it look more expensive than it is.
The previous generation of the 3 Series has definitely not aged as well as the TL.

Even from your pictures it's evident to me that the previous generation of the 3 Series has definitely not aged as well as the TL.

The Acura SH-AWD system is more sophisticated than the xDrive (it has torque vectoring)

Final note....the black/umber color combination it's stunning...I would chose the TL just for that!!

JT4

^^ Same here and I was one of them that tried the German car thing. Had Acura, Lexus and Infiniti's and then tried MB.. After two MB's we're back with Lexus again, (still have the TL). And while I hate to say never, it's highly unlikely I would ever buy one again.

I also don't know of many people who have owned MB or BMW (who are honest with themselves) that were happy with them. They were always complaining about something, I was one of them.. LOL

OP - as others have said if you want a BMW lease a new one... If you're planning to buy and keep it go with the Acura. Also, if the price of the BMW seems to good to be true, maybe that's because it is, so proceed with caution..

Good luck either way..

2012wagon

The red interiors on the BMWs are sick. I have been seeing some Estoril Blue like new 3 series with red interior, not just white and black exteriors anymore

aIRpeACE

iTrader: (2)

go with the TL

Brock79

I looked at the 3 series BMW before I got my TL. The TL is definitely bigger than any 3 series offering. Most people do NOT cross shop the TL and 5 series. The price ranges differ to much. That's why most people on here cross shop the 3 series and TL.

Pros for the TL
Longevity
Bigger size(only if you want a bigger car)
Lower repair bills once out of warranty.

Pros for the 335
Faster car and more power
Has more of a notice me factor(if you're looking for that)

2012wagon

All TL owners think TL competes with the 5 series.

REal consumers cross shop the TL with the 3 series.

saturno_v

Interesting...any data points about your so called "real" consumer to prove that?? C&D opinions??

TL owners are the data points here...they are the ones that forked the money...so I trust more a TL owner than Mr. tight pants journalist taking a spin on a press car.


Never denied that many TL owners cross shopped the 3 Series....so as many cross shopped the 5 Series....as a matter of fact on this forum alone there are more 4G owners that cross shopped the 5 rather than the 3...here is your objective proven data point.

saturno_v

Exactly the opposite in my book...the 3 Series it has more of the "nothing to see here" factor.

thePearl

if i had the $$$ BMW for sure. Since i dont and wanted luxury with a decent cost of maintanance, ACURA TL will do.

REmember buddy, this forum will be bias as we all love our TL's and we REALLY love them SH-AWDys girls!

saturno_v

Now, you may have BMW loyalists (regardless, 3 or 5 Series owners) or German cars loyalist in general that would never cross shop the TL...but that it's a different story....they would never cross shop an Infiniti, a Jaguar or a Lexus neither....

JM2010 SH-AWD

Look at the stats. On nearly all factors (size, performance, etc.) the TL and 5 Series are within spitting distance. Oh, unless you're talking about the 4G MT; then the TL smokes the 5 Series. Oh, and price too. Same result.

andrewcjduong

I think you're going to have to go on a BMW forum and state this question too. You're going to have people answer "I switched from Japanese, I'll never go back" or things like "What are you even doing here comparing them."

I'll agree with most people here and say that it is a hefty price to own a german vehicle and while many will say reliability isn't there. I think it's about even for our TL's. I mean I've had continuous torque converter issues that haven't been solved as well as burning oil, drive shaft, and rattling across my car. But a friend of mine has also had issues with his 335i throwing a code due to sensors, camber issue. Etc...

There's no car out there that's perfect. If you want reliability, get a Corolla. Just kind of annoying when people think our vehicles are so amazing. I've ran into so many problems and the Acura brand seems to have gone no where but downhill in all their 6 cylinder vehicles from the CL (my tranny blew 3 times) to my current TL (tranny/torque converter, burning oil) to the new gen TLX's with their stop sale. Only my TSX which is a 4 cylinder has had no mechanical issues.

KarKraze

Totally agree with you,to date i haven't had any issues with my Tl but my mileage is very low.This however does not mean the i am oblivious to the issues that exist with the 4G Tl.

I am not saying that the TL isn't a good car,it is just not as great as some people rave over it.

Every car has a critic and the only critic that is important is yourself,buy what you like for the reasons you like it,period.

OP,in the end only you can decide what it is you are looking for in your purchase.You have some great responses here and i can assure you that if you pose the same question on a BMW forum you will get more thumbs up for the 335.

saturno_v

The TL it's no way perfect but it is a hell of a "bang for your buck" car, powerful and refined in its power class.


I cannot think of anything even close in value for your dollars nowadays in the market. The TLX (in V6 and SH-AWD trims) cost basically the same and it is a substantially inferior car pretty much across the board.

Greatcar

I have 2012 TL SH AWD Tech Black/Umber 19" Wheels. Lease is up. Ordered TLX AWD Tech today. TL was wonderful car. Had BMW's for years. Quality went downhill, price went up. I suggest the TL.

Brock79

Most people shopping for a new car have budgets to stick to. This is the reason most people cross shop the TL and 3 series. Of course the TL and 5 series are more comparable in size but that doesn't factor in budget. Most 3 series owners couldn't afford a 5 series and the same with tl owners. A 5 series optioned out the same as a sh awd is gonna run somewhere around 20 grand more. Just because you walked into a bmw dealer and looked at a 5 series and then realized the price was to much doesn't mean you cross shopped them.

If your budiet is 45k then you are cross shopping 45k dollar cars, 3 series fits here not the 5 unless it's used. And if you're looking at used tls and 5 series then the 5 will still cost more given the cars are similar mileage and year.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

This.

Consumers with say a 45k budget will cross shop a decently optioned 3 series or a stripped 528i or used 535 or 550.

A person with a 45k-75k budget is most likely going to shop the 5, E, GS, M. Sure a small minority will cross shop a TL and buy one and are a handful of members here on AZ.

If someone is budget/value minded first, they will buy a TL and get 8/9 10ths of BMW 5 size and performance for a steal.

Sent from my iPhone using IB AutoGroup

2012wagon

Thank you. Nice to see some reality vs fanboism. Budgets pertain to the real world


Great post.

andrewcjduong

When I was shopping for my 09 TL, I also looked at an 09 BMW 535i. So technically it is comparable. I think the reason why people don't "cross shop" the TL and the 5 series is the new gen F10 5 series came out in 2011, and of course the newer body style would have costed more where as a 2011 TL is still a 4th gen TL and not a 5th gen TL so everyone is trying to compare the outdated 4th Gen TL to a fully optioned and priced up modern F10 5 series.

So technically you could compare an E60 BMW to a 4th Gen TL and the prices would end up being the same.

saturno_v

A slice of real world for you "monthly payment theory" fanboy...not everyone buys a car stretching his/her dollar budget to the max...especially int he luxury segment.

Real world for you, for my wife ride in September we did look a cars that had as much as a 30K gap between them. An impossibility in your perfect world.

Do you know, according to a Lexus sales person at Lexus of Bellevue dealership (one of the wealthiest zip code in the country by the way), what is one of the most cross shopped car, in his experience, with the Lexus ES?? Drumroll.....The MB E Class....

Look at the price differences between the two....shock!!!

Most 3 Series owners do not want a 5 Series, especially now.

Heracles

Well.. It was an odd sequence of events.
After the test drive on Thursday at CarSense I came home.. Sat in the BMW at the lot a little.. Went to work in the am.. Dealer is on way to lot... Stopped again... Sat in it... I felt the BMW remarkably felt much more quality inside as fancy as the tl interior may be.
Went to work with the feeling to leave around 9 and take the BMW oit for one more good drive.. The dealer said someone was coming in the am.. I thought he was just doing his thing.
Left a little later.. At 10am..dealer is literally 5 miles from work. As I walked to my car he calls said the car was sold.
I won't lie I felt nauseated. At same time.. I had a deep feeling that the tl was the smarter choice.
Took the family to CarSense Friday night and we came home with the tl. Was 29800. I could of saved money and went with a 2012... But the color combo of interior and exterior, low mileage, and being a 2013 made me just go with it.

I like it.. Although I'm a little disappointed still thinking of that 335. I noticed how well it Handles... So flat around turns.. Rides firm..and surprisingly feels fast!
Have to set up hfl.. Bottom line just thinking I'll be happier long term u guess!

Getting light tint... And led light everywhere.