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As another winter approaches, it is a good time to go over the facts about winter tires.
How do winter tires work?
Here are a few pictures to illustrate the mechanics involved in winter traction.
If you look closely at a road surface you can tell that it is really not as smooth as represented by the model in this picture
With the high grip rubber compound used in your summer performance tires the contact area conforms to the irregular surface of the road.
That amount of contact can generate a tremendous amount of traction in the summer time but, what if the road in snow covered?
That brings us to the question, what makes a tire a good winter tire? The answer is a three part puzzle and without all three parts traction will be compromised.
Let's look at the first part of the puzzle; tread design
This picture shows a winter tire tread design which, as you can clearly see, utilizes a large number of sipes
When the road gets snow covered the tire is no longer able to conform to the surface.
The siping allows the tread elements to flex under stress create aggressive "biting edges" when braking, cornering or accelerating
Part two of our three piece traction puzzle is tread depth
While deep snow and ice-covered roads are two of the most challenging conditions North American drivers will face, tire developments during the last decade have noticeably advanced wintertime mobility. The technological revolution of dedicated winter tires for drivers in the snowbelt, and the continuing evolution of all-season tires for drivers living on its periphery characteristically offer more grip in snow and on ice than ever before.
However the basics of delivering traction and handling in snow and on ice remain unchanged. Tires must combine three fundamental features to deliver good wintertime performance, including an appropriate tread design, pliable tread compound and sufficient tread depth. If any one of these fundamental features is absent, the other two, regardless of their ability, cannot deliver the desired results! Since engineers can develop cutting-edge tread designs and chemists can develop advanced rubber compounds, it is often the remaining tread depth that is the variable in determining wintertime performance.
In most parts of the world, tires are considered to be legally worn out when they reach 2/32" (approximately 1.6mm) of remaining tread depth. U.S. law requires tires to have easy-to-see Tread Wear Indicator bars running from one side of their tread design to the other when the tire's tread has worn down to the minimum legal limit of 2/32 inch.
However in spite of the legal minimums, Tire Rack recommends that drivers expecting to experience wet conditions consider replacing their tires when they reach 4/32" of remaining tread depth. Tire Rack's tests have shown how shallow treads reduce wet braking traction and increase stopping distances
Tire Rack also recommends that drivers expecting to encounter snow-covered roads consider replacing their tires when they reach approximately 6/32" of remaining tread depth to maintain good mobility. Tires need more tread depth in wintry conditions to compress snow in their grooves and release it as they roll. If there isn't sufficient tread depth, the "bites" of snow that can be processed on each tire revolution will be reduced to "nibbles," and the vehicle's traction and mobility in snow will be reduced.
The third and final part of the puzzle is the rubber compound used. Rubber compounds vary widely from manufacturer to manufacturer but, the task is the same so, you will see similarities between the products. They all typically use compounds which utilize materials designed to remain flexible at cold temps in addition to traction enhancements from silica and other materials which add more bite on ice.
Now, for the next step ... types of winter tires
There are basically three different types of winter tires
#1.) Performance Winter
You want enhanced dry road handling from your winter tires and are willing to trade some snow and ice traction to get it.
Meeting severe snow service requirements and branded with the "Snowflake-on-the-Mountain" symbol, these low profile, H- or V-speed rated tires are designed to suit winter driving on European highways. They are available in many of the low profile sizes used as Original Equipment on sporty imported and domestic cars. Due to their unique designs these tires must be installed in sets of four.
#2.) Studless Ice and Snow
You want to maximize snow and ice traction from your winter tires without the inconvenience of using winter tire studs.
Meeting severe snow service requirements and branded with the "Snowflake-on-the-Mountain" symbol, these Q-speed rated tires feature the latest in tread compound technology to provide winter traction without the inconvenience of tire studs. They trade a little handling for excellent ice and snow traction. Due to their unique tread compounds these tires must be installed in sets of four.
#3.)Studdable Winter
You want the traditional security of studded winter tires for enhanced traction on ice.
Meeting severe snow service requirements and branded with the "Snowflake-on-the-Mountain" symbol, these non-, Q-, S-, or T-speed rated tires feature traditional snow tire tread compounds and studdable tread designs for good snow and ice traction. Due to their unique designs these tires must be used in sets of four. Use of studded tires is often prohibited or restricted. Check with local authorities to confirm legality.
But Do I Really Need Winter Tires?
The primary concern that our customers express is that they don't want to get "stuck" in the snow (or in the ditch) during the winter.
While in cities like Atlantic City, Memphis and Seattle located at the extreme edges of the snow belt, relatively new All-Season tires will probably work just fine. But the odds change as you move further into the snow belt or the All-Season tires have a few years of wear on them. And who wants to gamble...especially when their collision deductible and future insurance premiums are on the table.
We all know that tires are a compromise. One tire can't be the fastest on the track, most controllable in the snow, and longest wearing. The Ultra High Performance tire that grips the track with tread temperatures of 200° is incompetent as its tread compound becomes like "hard plastic" at below 32°. Today's 80,000-mile tires require tread designs and compounds that maximize long, even wear... not winter traction. And while many of today's all-season tires (Original Equipment, touring and performance) address some of these issues, they still emphasize longer wear, a quieter ride or greater performance...not winter traction.
Only winter tires are designed to excel in the colder temperatures, slush, snow and ice that many parts of the country experience for three or more months a year.
It's also important to note that the recent advancements in electronic driver aids, such as ABS and traction control don't provide more traction. They only help prevent drivers from over braking or overpowering the available traction of their tires. The only thing the driver can do to increase traction...to actually get more grip and control... is install better tires.
As in the past, there are 'general use' recommended packages for each model car to be found atTIRERACK.combut, if you would like to discuss other options for your specific needs please don't hesitate to give me a call at 800-428-8355 ext. 4789 or drop me an e-mail
You can also post in this thread but please supply the following information ....
year:
make:
model:
location:
tires only or winter package:
and I will respond directly to your post
I will also be adding to this thread periodically so, check back often
Wish you had done a comparison between the Blizzaks and your top rated UHP all season tire...
In terms of winter traction, there really is no comparison. Even the very best all season is going to pale in comparison to the least capable dedicated winter tire we carry. That being said, the best UHP all season for winter traction is easily the Continental DWS. So if you get very mild winters and do not want to swithch out to a dedicated set, the DWS is your best bet.
I've been researching performance winter tires and I think I have decided on Hankook Winter i*cept Evos, but noticed you guys don't carry them. Any plans to?
I've been researching performance winter tires and I think I have decided on Hankook Winter i*cept Evos, but noticed you guys don't carry them. Any plans to?
At this time we do no have plans to carry the Icept. Not that there is anything wrong with them, our existing lineup simply covers most customer's needs.
At this time we do no have plans to carry the Icept. Not that there is anything wrong with them, our existing lineup simply covers most customer's needs.
How do they compare to the Michelin Alpin PA[x] or Blizzak LM-60? Any reason for the close out sale?
Great information. I've gone with the DWS here in Utah and have been impressed but I might try out your Continental ExtremeWinterContacts this winter. They seem to have pretty good reviews.
Great information. I've gone with the DWS here in Utah and have been impressed but I might try out your Continental ExtremeWinterContacts this winter. They seem to have pretty good reviews.
i can get a solid deal on the same size tired and winter rim for an 2008 acura tl. anyone installed the same size tire and rim for winters? how does the car ride?
Thanks Sonny. I'm on the lookout for some 235/40-18 winter tires and I just purchased a new set of rims. Hard to find any in this size though. I was originally set on the General Altimax Artic tire but it's not available in this size.
Thanks Sonny. I'm on the lookout for some 235/40-18 winter tires and I just purchased a new set of rims. Hard to find any in this size though. I was originally set on the General Altimax Artic tire but it's not available in this size.
Any suggestions are appreciated.
I would take a look at the Bridgestone Blizzak WS70 at $186 each. They will be better in deep snow and ice than the General. Only real downside is a bit shorter lifespan on the Blizzak.
Hey all, I was looking for an answer all over this forum and I can't find it. Is it possible to put the 2G TL Rims (16 x 6.5") on our stock 3G TL (Base). I'm able to get a set of 2G Rims cheap for winter tires but I want to make sure they will clear before I purchase them. Thank you.
Contemplating dropping a dime on winter tires/wheels this year. I see the Good Year Ultra Grip Ice WRTs are getting some great reviews. And at $468 (after rebate) with road hazard included, they are sure priced very well. Any comments/criticism of this tire?
Also, for wheels, I'd probably just cheap out with the MSWs. Any comment on these?
We are running these GT Radial Champiro Winterpros on my wifes car in CT. Ran them all last winter and they were phenomenal. We had several storms that were 1' plus and never had an issue.
My local honda dealer recommended them over some of the major brands. They're pretty cheap. Nice alternative if you dont want to drop a lot of $$$ on winter tires.
Curious to see how they do this winter being a season old now.
Contemplating dropping a dime on winter tires/wheels this year. I see the Good Year Ultra Grip Ice WRTs are getting some great reviews. And at $468 (after rebate) with road hazard included, they are sure priced very well. Any comments/criticism of this tire?
Also, for wheels, I'd probably just cheap out with the MSWs. Any comment on these?
I went ahead and installed the MSW/WRTs from TireRack about a month ago. The WRTs got their first snow trial last night in 4-6 inches of snow. They did not disappoint!
These things are absolutely fantastic in snow, couldn't be more satisfied so far.
FYI, they do have a slightly noticeable "hum" at low speeds (30-40 mph), but it's only audible at that speed range and it's not bad at all. I assume it's due to the tread design. It's nothing that should stop anyone from getting these tires, love them
We are running these GT Radial Champiro Winterpros on my wifes car in CT. Ran them all last winter and they were phenomenal. We had several storms that were 1' plus and never had an issue.
My local honda dealer recommended them over some of the major brands. They're pretty cheap. Nice alternative if you dont want to drop a lot of $$$ on winter tires.
Curious to see how they do this winter being a season old now.
i went with Champiro Ice Pro, studable, but not legal and didn t do it in Ontario. On my wifes Civic, their 3rd season and still rocking. maybe a little noisy but doesn t get driven on long trips. tires are great for the value.
Thank you for the info regarding the winter tires, I was avoiding this for a season or two and paid the price the hard way so now it is important that I get good winter tires.
I drive a 2007 TL Type S, which winter tires would be a good choice?
Is anyone here from the Toronto area? The Acura dealership is offering the package at ~$1,700 which includes Continetal XtremeWinterContact with steel rims and sensors.
First snow of the year, and I am SO disappointed. Everybody says they are the greatest all season tire in the snow.
I guess this just means I definitely side with the "you need snow tires with FWD" crowd.
Conti DWS are great All-Season tires but will pale in comparison to dedicated snows in the snow. Makes sense when you think about it......
I found brand new Blizzak WS-70s on CL for $325 a couple of weeks ago and had them mounted on Sat for $30. Now just waiting on some of the white stuff.
First rant... Stop using Photobucket!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Next, no one ever regretted buying Blizzaks. I have a set of WS80's on factory Type S rims and ran all over the upper midwest last winter, deep snow, etc... I snowboard too so getting to all the spots was no problem. These things were amazing.
First rant... Stop using Photobucket!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Next, no one ever regretted buying Blizzaks. I have a set of WS80's on factory Type S rims and ran all over the upper midwest last winter, deep snow, etc... I snowboard too so getting to all the spots was no problem. These things were amazing.
Man....I kinda feel like WS80's are too overhyped. I hate how unstable they feel, and they're honestly not any better in snow than my Conti EW's or Michelin XI3.
My wife's car has the Blizzaks. I had Contis on mine until I bubbled a sidewall on some MASSIVE railroad tracks. I bought a brand new set of Xi3's to replace them just as winter ended lol.
Wear is also crazy fast on the Blizzaks for obvious reasons.
Conti Si's or Michelin Xi3's are the sweet spot, I think.
I need to put winter tires on My 2008 TL-S, looks like i cant just put regular steele and tires since it wont fit over the front brakes. do you guys recommend that use the stock rims or is there
a size of seeles i could get that will fit the car and also what size tires
I need to put winter tires on My 2008 TL-S, looks like i cant just put regular steele and tires since it wont fit over the front brakes. do you guys recommend that use the stock rims or is there
a size of seeles i could get that will fit the car and also what size tires
Thanks
Correct, I have yet to see a set of steelies fit over the Brembo brakes; if you go over to TireRack they currently have 17 alloy wheel types in stock which will clear the brake calipers; prices range between $98.00 per wheel to $150.00 per wheel.
I need to put winter tires on My 2008 TL-S, looks like i cant just put regular steele and tires since it wont fit over the front brakes. do you guys recommend that use the stock rims or is there
a size of seeles i could get that will fit the car and also what size tires
Discounttiredirect is selling some MB Revolts in TL 6MT fitment for $90/ea (shipped). 25% instant rebate. And $160 in mail in rebates via their black friday sale.
That nets out to like $110 for a SET of wheels.
tyres are on sale for $160 off too.
17x8 +28. Too bad its a little too agressive for a 1G TSX lol
Looking for good set of winter tire + wheel setup. Couple of quick questions.
Any difference between Michelin X-Ice Xi3 vs Blizzak WS90?
Also, anyone looking to get a SMALLER wheel and bigger side-wall tire for winter setup? I've read on other car forums where people got smaller diameter steelies for winter setups.
Looking for good set of winter tire + wheel setup. Couple of quick questions.
Any difference between Michelin X-Ice Xi3 vs Blizzak WS90?
Also, anyone looking to get a SMALLER wheel and bigger side-wall tire for winter setup? I've read on other car forums where people got smaller diameter steelies for winter setups.
Thanks for any and all help!
Does your RBP TL have an automatic transmission or the 6MT? If the automatic, then yes, a 16" wheel will fit along with 215/55 R16 tires will work very well. If you have a 6MT, then the minimum wheel size is 17".
Also, anyone looking to get a SMALLER wheel and bigger side-wall tire for winter setup? I've read on other car forums where people got smaller diameter steelies for winter setups.
I'm also in KC. I am not sure there is much perk for us to run narrow setups. Rarely are we driving on packed snow here. For the majority of the season we are driving on cold and/or wet roads, not snow/ice covered roads. My "theory" has been to find winter tires that most closely gave similar driving dynamics as A/S tires. Good cold weather characteristics that lean more heavily on dry and wet performance than deep snow performance. I'm running Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3 on OE 17" rims. When on dry pavement, my car handles roughly the same as it did when I had Michelin Primacy MXM4 on it. Not on rails by any means, but generally well planted and secure.
I'm also in KC. I am not sure there is much perk for us to run narrow setups. Rarely are we driving on packed snow here. For the majority of the season we are driving on cold and/or wet roads, not snow/ice covered roads. My "theory" has been to find winter tires that most closely gave similar driving dynamics as A/S tires. Good cold weather characteristics that lean more heavily on dry and wet performance than deep snow performance. I'm running Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3 on OE 17" rims. When on dry pavement, my car handles roughly the same as it did when I had Michelin Primacy MXM4 on it. Not on rails by any means, but generally well planted and secure.
Yeah, the narrower tread/taller sidewall thing is most useful when you are driving through accumulations of snow, especially heavy wet snow. That said, for those of us with the front Brembo brakes, we do not have the option of dropping down to 16" wheels.
Does your RBP TL have an automatic transmission or the 6MT? If the automatic, then yes, a 16" wheel will fit along with 215/55 R16 tires will work very well. If you have a 6MT, then the minimum wheel size is 17".
5AT (ugh...sigh...should've gotten the 6MT but too late now). Thanks for the wheel/tire size recs!! @horseshoez
Originally Posted by Jackass
I'm also in KC. I am not sure there is much perk for us to run narrow setups. Rarely are we driving on packed snow here. For the majority of the season we are driving on cold and/or wet roads, not snow/ice covered roads. My "theory" has been to find winter tires that most closely gave similar driving dynamics as A/S tires. Good cold weather characteristics that lean more heavily on dry and wet performance than deep snow performance. I'm running Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3 on OE 17" rims. When on dry pavement, my car handles roughly the same as it did when I had Michelin Primacy MXM4 on it. Not on rails by any means, but generally well planted and secure.
Good point, @Jackass . We don't get too many heavy snow/ice days (a handful of really bad days per winter) but agreed that I'm definitely looking for good tires that performs well in the cold/wet and can withstand low temps.
Originally Posted by horseshoez
Yeah, the narrower tread/taller sidewall thing is most useful when you are driving through accumulations of snow, especially heavy wet snow. That said, for those of us with the front Brembo brakes, we do not have the option of dropping down to 16" wheels.
Ah that makes sense from a physics/common sense perspective.
09-03-2013, 10:31 AM
I've gone with the DWS here in Utah and have been impressed but I might try out your Continental ExtremeWinterContacts this winter. They seem to have pretty good reviews.
