NBP_BALLER

^^^^^^^Yes^^^^^^^

ISC Suspension

Car looks great thanks for posting it.
Thanks for the good review as well.

Is there ANYONE left who needs adjustment help, tech support, or anything? Let us or Josh know.

We are here for support, so use us!
In the meantime we would not complain to see some more installed TL pics

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

I am still waiting on a response from you. It's been 6 days since I was emailed and informed someone would get back to me in 24-48 hours.


I will also take pics this weekend after some minor adjustments.

ISC Suspension

Hey Chris,
Yes you are on our list of emails to respond to this week. Company has been shut down the past 5 days due to a family emergency (this is a family owned small business and 5 of us work here on the front end of the company) I appreciate the patience.

PS- looking forward to those pictures!

NBP_BALLER

I still have some clunking going on in the front over good sized bumps, which may be normal. My only concern is that my front end does not "bounce" but I dont think my shock damening adjustment is doing anything. From full stiff when driving I have been hitting my subframe on the ground every single day in random places. Its like the shocks allow the spring to compress after a bump to rebound. The new springs made a world of a difference, but I think the springs have caused the shocks to lose some of their dampening power. When I had them off I put them upside down and pushed on them, which required quite a bit of effort to compress them(the shock by itself). My reasoning behind thinking that the front shocks are not functioning properly is this. Rear set at full stiff is HARD! Front set at full stiff it rides smooth like factorym but nothing like the rear. I cannot ride full stiff in the rear, but about clicks down because I feel like im in a race car going to work. So mycurrect setup is full stiff front/ 5 clicks in rear from full stiff. How are everyones front riding? Is stiff REALLY STIFF? Because if so, I may have shock problems. Im 24" off the fround from GTF and subframe is about 2-3" off the ground. I would think it should be more stiff than it is, maybe im wrong. Does this sound like it should josh and ISC?

ISC Suspension

Comparing the rears to fronts on any vehicle is a little difficult due to different size shafts/stroke, spring rates, dampening, etc...

If the strut compressed under force when you pushed it down and came back up on its own you should be good, meaning you did not lose any gas or oil. If something was wrong with the dampening per say you would NOT be able to adjust it.
Sounds ok to me, although the only way of truly knowing with any adjustable damper would be to shock dyno it.

NBP_BALLER

I have not set it to full soft, maybe ill try that and see what happens and make a comparison between soft/hard. I know some guys say its very stiff on the front, but i dont feel it to be that way. The faulty springs were my main issue i know which really improved everything alot. A bang every few seconds is now a few clunks on the 30 minute drive to work over a inch drop in the stree(our roads suck her in dallas) and you can only avoid do much, but your going to hit a bad spot eventually. Appreciate your input!

TLDude876

iTrader: (7)

Just curious what damper setting do you guys run?

NBP_BALLER

Coilovers have 32 adjustments. Im running 32 front(Ful Hard) and 27 rear(5 off Full Hard)- My rear is more stiff than the front while driving.

TLDude876

iTrader: (7)

Damnnn. Shit doesn't break your back? My BC's have 30 way adjustment. Im running 16 in the rear and 13 up front. Still a bit too stiff/bouncy for me

NBP_BALLER

I think my front shocks are not dampening properly. It rides like factory in the front. Rear is slightly stiff but it rides really nice. If I go full stiff in the rear its hard as fuk! The fronts however do not really get stiff, so I think I have an issue.

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

Thanks for the response. I emailed you back as well but if it's easier to respond in here feel free to do so instead of emailing me. Here is my email back to you.

No problem man. And sorry for your loss.

At this point I have not made any height adjustments with the preload. The preload on all 4 corners is currently at 175mm. My concern is a couple of things.

• If you look at the pictures I sent I am confused as to why there is so much preload in the rear vs the front? They are both set at 175mm.

• in the rear I am low enough yet I can still go lower by adjusting the bottom collar. Probably another 1.5". The front is a different story. I have the bottom collar maxed out and it's just a touch higher than the rears. It just doesn't make sense to me.

• They ride great on most bumps. Dampening is set at 25 front and 22 rear. I have noticed on some bumps that I will hit the bumpstops, which I have never experienced on coils before. The last time I experienced that was when I was in high school and chopped Springs and shaved my bumpstops down

• Also, I do know how changing preload will make changes to the car. More/less body roll... Oversteer/understeer, etc...

What are your thoughts?

sauceja

iTrader: (2)

I have no clunking. I had them set at 175-180 preload and have been maxed out in the front since day one.

I even adjusted my preload to about 200mm or so in Swoosh's driveway to get a little lower. Ride didn't seem to be affected but I didn't get much lower.

I have since adjusted back to 175-180 preload. I am at around 23 3/4 GTF.
That is with 225/40/18 tires on a mild stretch.

I have contacted both xlr8 and ISC about the fronts getting stuck when I maxed it out the first time.

I am thinking most of it is my fault for not researching and getting a stiffer spring right off the bat.

I would get the sport springs but honestly I am thinking of going a lot more aggressive of a rim/tire setup and would most likely get the race setup which would mean selling my coils.

But I have total confidence in the customer support of these two vendors. That is not a complaint at all.

I would not hesitate buying from xlr8 again. And ISC has answered the phone and helped me the two times I called.

I am just curious how a couple people that have these coils are laying frame and I can barely tuck tread in the front.

NBP_BALLER

If you set the preload up more you can go lower, it will make it more stiff, but it is possible. 5mm preload off zero lash is the "recommended" setup. Im assuming you have 200mm Springs which are the least stiff. If your setup is at 175-180 you have a ton of preload on it. 15-20mm from zero lash, now if your locking rings are both alost touching upper(spring pre=load set) and lower(height adjustment) then you should be really low. I can go a little more but not much where im at. Im on the 180mm springs now, and im preloaded 175mm for a total of 5mm. 24" FTG and tucking factory tires slightly. You should be able to go lower, but that means tightening your preload even more(yes i know its tight) and moving your bottom cup up some more. It will ride stiff, but it will go lower. Correct me if im wrong, but you should ba able to get at least 23" or maybe more with lots of preload

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

I have done a lot of research on preload, mainly on tracking forums. The general consensus is that preload does NOT affect stiffness. Also, everything I have read says that for street use preload on coils should be set to ZERO. So why is 5mm recommended on these?

NBP_BALLER

You may be correct about stiffness, but in my personal opinion preload makes it stiffer. Which I have believed my whole life. Your putting more load on a spring, in turn making its height shortened, causing less movement. Less movement which is felt as being stiff. So it should be stiffer, but im not a engineer so i cant tell you 100%. A thicker spring makes it stiffer, but preload SHOULD too... 5mm is what ISC and XLR8 will tell you to set it up as so you have no noise issues. You dont want the spring loose on the coilover.

NBP_BALLER

"What preload does is it changes where in the stroke of the shock the car sits at rest."

"Preload does not effect the stiffness AT ALL"

Referenced from - http://www.ziptied.com/forums/index....ic=939.20;wap2

Also, this website is very technical, but it makes sense, if you can understand.

http://www.zoomsquared.com/technical...load-explained

So in the end, preload does not affect stiffness, it only affects height. It does this by only allowing so much shock travel. This makes sense when they talk about putting tension on the spring when there is no weight on the vehicle. The wight will still be dispersed the same when the weight of the car is on the coilover.

Hooke’s Law

Hooke’s Law: F = -kx
There are tons of resources to find out exactly what Hooke’s Law is, but for our purposes it’s enough to know that this equation tells us what is going on with a spring when we know two of these three variables:
F = Force, aka Restoring Force (Weight)
k = Spring Constant (Spring Rate)
x = Distance Spring is Displaced From Equilibrium (Compressed or Stretched)

I guess the stiffness is the same, but the shortened distance(suspension travel) will be felt as it being more stiff...?

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

Preload will only affect stiffness if you are reducing the spring travel by a lot....

My springs are preloaded quite a bit for a stiffer ride and less spring travel, you can feel the difference....and if you are preloaded like I am, you can certainly drop the car but reducing the preload (increasing the spring travel).....

I love the setup I am at because when I drive, I am set to 26F and 24R (I am on Street/Sport) setup....and when going on trips with the wifey, I turn then down to 14F and 14R and the ride transforms and the wifey can actually take a nap in the car otherwise even a dime on the road wakes her up LOL

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

Lies. Pregnant women can't sleep in racing seats that don't recline!

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

she is a brave lady....

drove with me to Chicago on various occasions until she was 35 weeks pregnant....

we took my car 4 times and hers the last 2 times....I flew in 2 times after she was 35 weeks pregnant as I insisted that she is not traveling....love that lady

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

LOL - and she cooks too!

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

NBP_BALLER

All this talk about the front suspension noise and I forgot all about my rear noise. Here is what I just did, maybe it will fix it, it should. I added mylar tape around the rear lower coilover bolts(which is now snug). My rear clunks slightly over bumps, I could grab my wheel and move both rear up/down and the play was between the bushing of the coilover and the bolts. Either the bolt or the bushing is worn. This very minimal 0.05 thick tape should be just enough to tighten up the gap. So far no movement with the bolts in, I will drive it and see what happens.

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

@ the crew from ISC. Thanks for working to try and help me with my issue of rears going much lower than fronts. Here is the info you asked for via email but I am posting here as well. Might be helpful for others as well.

Preload Setting = 175mm on all 4 corners
Dampening Front = 26
Dampening Rear = 22
Collar to Collar Distance Front = LF-40.5mm, RF-39.5mm
Collar to Collar Distance Rear = 111.35 on both sides
Distance Ground to Fender Achieved Front = LF-24 3/8" , RF-24 3/4"
Distance ground to Fender Achieved Rear = LR-24 1/4" , RR-24"

I am on Street/Sport springs and have but about 750 miles on the coils. The coils ride smooth and handle pretty good in high speed corners. here is my frustration.

• FRONTS - If you set the preload at 175mm and max out the bottom collar, the lowest you can achieve collar to collar is 39.5mm. In my case this results in the front being over 24" ground to fender. The RF is lower than the right rear and I will assume that this is because of the extra weight of the drivers side. I still need to adjust more to get each side even.

• REARS - The preload is also at the recommended 175mm. The rears can adjust a solid 2" lower than the fronts. This makes no sense to me at all. I still need to do some more adjusting to even out each side of the rears.

These coils are great as far as build quality and ride quality but they need more height adjust-ability in the front. I don't want to mess with the preload but I might have to in order to achieve what I am looking for.

Here is a picture for you to see. THE FRONTS ARE MAXED OUT. The rears can still go lower... Yet the rear is already lower than the front. I am so frustrated!

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

car looks like shit Chris....






































looks awesome buddy....the pix dont do justice....

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

Thanks, Anil! I might do some more adjusting tomorrow. I bought that 2.5 ton HF jack. Glad I did... That thing is a beast and it goes up 20 3/4".

On a side note. I have a general rule to not buy anything from Harbor Freight that has a motor and or plugs into an outlet. It's guaranteed to break in 3min and 18sec.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

I like HF stuff...the tool chest I got was $100 and better quality than $700 craftsman work bench from Sears....

I do have a cutting/sanding tool from HF and I like it

sauceja

iTrader: (2)

Haven't taken measurements in mm but sounds pretty close to my same dilemma.

H&R Race springs tuck more tire in the front than ISC coils do.

1sictypes

cool

1sictypes

good info

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

Quick question about the 19mm nut on the top of the coilover assembly. How tight should the bolt be? should it lock down or just be really snug?

Reason I am asking is that I just realized in the past day that I have a clunk from my right rear only on larger bumps.

NBP_BALLER

It should be tight, i always use just a ratchet and a socket and that gets them tight enough, no impact needed. However, a spec for this nut in tq lbs from ISC would help in issues. My rear clunk, I havent hear them clunk since I put that mylar tape in my lower bolt that ges in the control arm. You might wanna check that as well like I did. My problem was slack between the bolt and the coilover bushing. If I jacked up the rear, I could very slightly move both rear wheels up/down and it gave me a clunk. My fronts are still clunking over moderat bulbs, but I think its mostly the LF that I notice. Its not huge bumps, I think the shock is bad. The springs I just pu on from ISC made a huge difference, but im starting to believe that the weak springs I had ruined my shocks...

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

If you read on the ISC page it tells you to use a 19mm wrench because you should use a 5mm Allen driver to hold the center threaded bolt in place. I never did that... Wonder if it makes a difference or if it's only needed if it's very loose?

NBP_BALLER

Well the reason I use a socket is because I never puller my rear shelf out to get the coilovers in. I just pulled the seat back and bottom out, so i had only a few inches of clearance and the front bolt that holts the coilover to the strut tower is in the way, so socket it is. It gets tight. I know if it is loose it will clunk, especially on the front. ISC and XLR8 have had many issues with clunking because the coils were shipped to the customer with the top nut not being 100% tight. Im sure it tells you in the instructions to tighten it during installation, but who reads that shit anyway... The manual didn't make any sense to me, and our coilover wasn't in it. Just some pictures... I've pretty much heard about ever single possible noise these or any coilover can have now after all my issues. Now your lowering part, I thing you just have to adjust your preload tighter and keep moving the bottom nut up...

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

ISC we need a pic of whoever is posting on this forum...we like to know our vendors personally

twigglius

iTrader: (6)

This info was posted in the ISC photo thread but should really be in this thread...
Quote:
Originally Posted by elkev View Post
not happy about isc coilover... I bought my coilover this summer... they have run great about 3 to 4 months... but now i have fucking clunking noise from my front left coilover... the preload is good... all the ring are tight and the 19 mm is tight too... i don't know what is wrong... but it's look like i have already a blown shock or top plate issue.... i'm really disppointed about this coilover...
Quote:
Originally Posted by swoosh View Post
I think ISC is working for a solution on this....nothing is blown....

where is/what level is your dampening set to?
Anil is correct, nothing is blown. I feel your frustration though. I have not said anything yet but after reading through this thread over the holidays I decided to offer some thoughts.

I want to start by mentioning that the crew at ISC NA have been aswesome when I have had to deal with them directly. Josh (XLR8 Performance) has also been wonderful to work with over the years. Great guy and business owner that I have primarily purchased almost all of my mods from, going back many years.

These coils have felt great on the road since I "helped" Anil install them back in September. The rebound on them and the overall feel of the car is much improved over my Tein SS Coils. The car corners very solidly and I can push through corners at a much higher rate of speed than before.

My problem is that they do clunk... But it's only on certain types of bumps/road surfaces. All nuts are tightened all the way down. The preload has been checked and double checked several times. The coils are NOT blown, I know that. On bumps that protrude from the road my car goes over them like a champ. The car feels glued to the road. On bumps that depress in the road i almost feel the opposite. I almost always hear a loud clunk and the car jumps/drifts to the side briefly. The left rear seems to not clunk on any of these recessed bumps, the left rear clunks occasionally, the right front does pretty often and the right rear does all the time.

I have owned many sets of springs, shocks, coils, combos over the years. I have not experienced this type of clunking since back in highschool when I had ground controls on my accord but had the collars so far down, the clunking was from the spring banging on the perch. When I hear the clunking it makes me feel like I am driving a $2,000 1989 civic, not a car that I paid $30k for and have kept in great shape since I took delivery on (12/26/05 - happy 8 years b-day).

I have gone back and forth several times in my head and debated selling them for Tein SA's. I have never had noise issues like this with any Tein product unless I hit a giant pot hole with my car. Again, there is nothing physically wrong with the coils, they just make noise and it bothers me. This is just my since this has been on my mind.


The views and comments above are simply my experience. They have no reflection on Josh, XLR8 or ISC NA. They are simply my opinion and do not reflect the views of others. Rebroadcast of this requires expressed, written permission fromn the NFL.

NBP_BALLER

After my new springs were installed on the front 180mm most of my clunking went away. However, there is still a lot of clunking going on. The old spring coils were touching each other at 5mm preload. Now when I had the shocks out i flipped them upside down and pushed them in to see how much tension was on the shocks(which i always do when i replace shocks) They didnt seem blown, but man does that sound horrible when you hit something. Same noise as described from your post above twigglius

beastUA6

sucks you guys are having so many problems with your coils. I installed my isc's (street/sport setup) myself and I have zero clunking. my rears are set at recommended preload and 16 on the dampening. fronts are at recommended preload and 22 on the dampening. made sure the top nuts were tight while installing. fronts are bottomed out and the car sits 24.5" fender to ground. rears have a lot more to go and I have em set to sit at 24" fender to ground. car rides great and I have zero complaints....here's some pics:











Big thanks to ISC for making a quality product and thank you to XLR8 for making them readily available. I'm definitely a satisfied customer

NBP_BALLER

My rear clunk too over slight bumps, but there's a slight amount of play between the bolt and the bushing for the bottom bolt on the shock. The issue there is a worn bushing im assuming. Ive put some clear thick mylar tape on it and it kind of helped for a while but its back, very minimal though. You can actually pull up/down and hear it clunk. Not worried about that though. My fronts are 24" FTG and rear at 24 1/2 FTG, I still can go lower front/rear. But my tires are hitting my fenders and getting gouged out... Front dampening is full stiff and rear is about 5 off stiff. The front doesn't seem to change when adjusting the dampening. The rear however do. Full stiff in the back is BRUTAL! Here is a 5 month old pic. I haven't taken ant in a while... its cold or raining or something all the time it seems like now. Cant keep her clean...

beastUA6

^^ have you rolled your fenders? if not, I highly recommend it. especially if you don't want the tires to get gouged.