SHaFT7

i've got a 04 5AT with 69k on it. as far as i know the tranny fluid has never been changed.

now i've noticed zero problems listed on the forum here with my tranny. it feels fine all the time. i've also read here and there that changing the fluid when the tranny isn't exhibiting problems may lead to the problems starting.

so what's the consensus? change the fluid? or leave it alone for awhile?

keep in mind, i'm at 69k, so i'm out of warranty.

i also called superior acura of kansas city, and they said they hadn't heard of the tranny problems on the 04s, which i don't know if i believe.

erick3

...every 15k my man
yikes! lol

ssmtl2nv

iTrader: (2)

Every 15k a must....

Will Y.

Go with the Acura recommendation per the Maintenance Minder in the MID at a minimum- if A3 or B3 haven't shown up, change the fluid now and every 30K miles thereafter.

My TL auto trans fluid was changed @ 28-30K as I had the car for longer than 36 mos. at that point.

wasupdog

iTrader: (2)

it's cool, just go ahead and change it now but make sure you do 3 drain and fills with 3 quarts of fresh tranny fluid each time, so it's 9 quarts total. if the price at the dealer to do a 3x3 is too much go to an independent honda/acura mechanic. it's a fairly easy diy.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

If you'll note, the A/T service only calls for a fluid change:

"Driving in mountanous areas at very low vehicle speeds requires fluid changes more frequently than recommended by the maintenance minder. If you reguarly drive your vehicle under these conditions, have the transmission fluid changed at 60,000 miles (96,000km), then every 30,000 miles (48,000km)".

I realize that this release is for the 2008, but it's some interesting reading:
SEQUENTIAL SPORTSHIFT 5-SPEED AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION

Both the TL and TL Type-S are equipped with a 5-speed automatic transmission. With a 4-shaft design and higher torque capacity, it is a more robust design than its predecessor, yet it is more compact. On the TL Type-S, gear changes can be made with the shifter or via steering wheel-mounted paddle shifters.

Designed for low maintenance and a high level of durability, the TL's automatic transmission requires no scheduled service until 120,000 miles. To provide strong off-the-line acceleration coupled with a relaxed, fuel-efficient cruising rpm, the unit has one of the widest gear ratio spreads of any 5-speed automatic transmission in its class.

http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.aspx?id=4215

Will Y.

The A3/B3 code in the MID specifically calls for a transmission fluid change-- the 60K/30K is the extended-use/higher-stress use recommendation.

If OP bought the car used or otherwise missed the MID code, it can't hurt to change the tranny fluid.

SHaFT7

bought the car at 41k...A3/B3 hasn't shown up yet...but i will go ahead and do the fluid

and yes, i know about the 3x 3qt thing...

thanks guys

SHaFT7

recommended fluid? honda atf?

i'd search, but it appears that search is currently broken

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Check the FSM, no fluid change unless under the mountanous, low speed driving conditions as listed above.

Will Y.

That's different from the Owner's manuals and the Maintenance Minder codes, isn't it?

Does the FSM mention the "3" MM code and what to do when that pops up?

wasupdog

iTrader: (2)

yea it's honda/acura atf-z1. u can buy it at any honda or acura dealer and i've never seen it for sale anywhere else. for some reason my acura dealer is actually cheaper than the honda dealer, just call around.

ecliptics

yup change it with the honda atf-z1. get it at the honda dealer too, its cheaper.. acura just puts the acura sticker on it n sells it for a lil more ive heard.

mine tranny felt fine too but after you change it you'll realize it feels a lot smoother. my tranny fluid came out dark black though lol

I hate cars

UOAs on the stock Z1 fluid after 30,000 miles are scary. The fluid flat out sucks for durability. Change the Z1 every 15,000 miles or run a quality synthetic for the factory recommended interval. I've run Amsoil ATD (not recommended by Amsoil for Hondas) for 45,000 of the car's 69,000 miles. Unlike the Z1 which turned black at 20,000, the ATD looks like the day I put it in. This is the only aftermarket fluid I trust because it has more zinc like the factory fluid.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Owner's manual has the same instructions for "3" as the FSM:
Replace transmission fluid
Then goes on to repeat what I previously wrote, that the fluid is to be changed at 60k and then every 30k IF driven in mountainous areas and at low speeds. No recommendation as to normal drain and refill mile intervals, only to change when directed to do so by the MID.

Hey, I change the engine oil when directed to do so by the MID, so I'll also wait for the MID to display the "3" message.

Can it be harmful to change sooner, naturally no, as many have the feeling that the trans fluid is questionable when it comes to longevity. Not too familiar with the Honda fluid, but I'm certain it's like most other transmission fluids that will turn color when in use, which is normal. In the Jeep community you'll have guys changing the fluid at ridiculously low mileage intervals when the fluid is actually good for 100k. They say it's turned brown and needs to be changed, but that's the nature of the fluid. A/T fluid is colored red to distinguish it from other liquids, but with time and usage, it turns a darker color which is perfectly normal.

Will Y.

So I take it you agree with what I said in post #7. vv
Oh, and the MM code may show as "A13" or "B13"- combining the A1/B1 and "3" codes- rather than as A3/B3.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

No I don't agree, read the post closer. Once again, there is no specific mileage to change the ATF unless the MID indicates the need for a change.
The owner's manual and FSM requires a change at 60 and then every 30 ONLY WHEN DRIVING IN MOUTAINOUS AND LOW SPEED DRIVING CONDITIONS. Otherwise wait for the MID.

I hate cars

It's not about a feeling. I've seen enough UOAs with the 5AT/V6 combo to know that the Z1 fluid is oxidized by 20,000 miles.

"Low speeds in mountainous areas" is just another way of saying "if you heat the fluid real good" which most of us do.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

You certainly are reading between the lines, and oxidation in 20,000 miles give me a break!!!!!!
Once again, if the fluid is light brown that's not a problem as its normal deterioration. This is why Acura/Honda has 100k warranties, so that they can replace the transmissions every couple of years, and the 2008 120k mile service interval.
Take a survey on here how many 5A/T's have been replaced on the TL, not a large percentage. They have more problems with the manuals then the autos.
If you want to change the fluid every 15 or 20,000 miles that's certainly your prerogative, but let's not just make a statement that the fluid is shot in 20k miles in every TL, or every car using Z1 fluid. The trans shops would be lined up with business for 10 years if that were the case

I hate cars

You're making assumptions. I didn't say the trans would fail immediately when the fluid is "used up".

It will shorten the expected lifespan of the trans whether that's 50,000 or 500,000 miles.

The fact of it is the fluid oxidizes very, very quickly. This is backed up by UOAs on the fluid. I don't know what more you could ask for. I'm not basing this solely on the color of the fluid.

And again I said nothing about Z1 not lasting for any car. It holds up very well in the 4 cylinder models.

As for the reliability, take a look around the board. There's a new failure just about once a week. While it's not entirely the fluid's fault, that was a bold statement you made when the TL has one of the least reliable transmissions of any car ever made.

Will Y.

OK.
1) We agree that the MID is the primary indicator of when the transmission fluid should be changed.
2) Since OP SHaFT7 bought the TL used w/43K, he should change the tranny fluid because: A) we don't know if the "3" code has already occurred or been cleared, B) OP has no idea if the TL was used in mountainous and low-speed conditions, and C) changing the fluid cannot hurt.

Now why shouldn't OP change the fluid now, as opposed to waiting for a MID message that may not appear?

SHaFT7

thanks will, that's what i'm looking to find out.

now, i've read of a test you can do to check out the tranny for failure: if i remember right it goes like this:

cruise at 30mph and allow it to shift to the highest gear automatically. in my case, this causes it to run at ~1500rpm on a level surface.

next, punch the accelerator, it should immediately downshift and take off. if it lags in gear or the rpms go up reallll fast like a slipping clutch, then the tranny is suspect.

I did this twice and came away with these results:

first time: got the car to 30, waited a few sec, and then punched it. the revs climbed from 1.5->4k during the shift (this was maybe .2 sec....maybe) and the car took off.

second time: same start, only this time the punch cause the car to torque steer like mad and peel out some. (love that v6 power). it acted pretty much the same way.

now, on other automatics i have driven, they have acted equally or with much less response time to what i just posted.

anyone else have results from something like this?

Will Y.

I don't think that is going to work, due to the ADAPTIVE transmission ECU, unless you have a cleared ECU.

FYI: The TL's transmission adapts to the driver's normal driving patterns, and most people don't drive like they stole it. As a result, you may experience some momentary lag on flooring the car unless the ECU is cleared to default.
Moderator csmeance posted the procedure to use w/o disconnecting the battery; the other way is to disconnect the battery from the car for 20 minutes (but you'll need the radio and Navi codes).

Just do the 3x drain-and-fill fluid change and go from there.

stevenxD

thanks for this thread, was just looking around to see when my ATF needs to be replaced. car is at ~37k and i haven't recalled the A3/B3 code pop up yet. but I'll take a look at the color and go from there. any guides on this forum about DIY with ATF?

AZuser

Since we're on the subject of ATF changes and such... is the tranny fluid filter (easily?) replaceable/changeable on the 3G TL?