Pix of intercooler setup.

 

that's the way to do it!

 

Sick, but yea. Can't leave us hanging!

 

He had a good pic in his FS thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/member-cars-sale-49/03-acura-cl-type-s-m-t-supercharged-location-aventura-fl-917211/

What kind of power is it making? What are the IATs on it with the intercooler?

Also, one thing I've wondered - is boost rpm dependent like a centrifugal, or is it the full 10psi at low rpms since its a PD blower? It seems like Comptech does things odd (from what I'm used to seeing in a PD blower) and not having it take the place of the blower and be post throttle body. Wasn't sure if that makes a difference.

 

I recalled a member ran a setup like yours on a 3G tl, hbp and intercooler and only made 260whp. (White acura tl with diffusers)

 

Another way for me to see more boost is to get a bigger crank pulley

 

 

i'd love to have a top mount intercooler. There were i believe 2 made for the CL by scalbert a long time ago. One sold here within the last few years. There are sitll pics of it on vee six pee.

 

Yes, boost is dependent on rpm. It gradually builds as it revs.. definitely linear; no spikes; no hesitations...

The IM is cold to the touch after the meth has been sprayed; like really cold... to the point where it gets sweaty & humid under the hood... not sure what the temperature is as I've never measure it.

Not sure what it's making to the wheels as it was street tuned... I wasn't chasing numbers when we built it; just wanted reliability... she definitely moves though.

**********************************************

Out of respect to the OP, please take this convo to: YA4 Progress Thread

Apologies kingkong_dav.

 

Seeing your "front end" is getting me a little sweaty and humid under the hood too, man. I think meth might be overkill for me.

 

Very nice and nothing wrong with overkill. I think one thing that's important to note is the drop in boost HAS to happen with the intercooler. Pre-intercooler boost will be the same but but it drops after the intercooler because it's cooler and more dense. Power remains about the same, with the lower boost but cooler, denser air you just about break even in power but you've now got more headroom before detonation. Now you can bring the boost level back up with a smaller pulley for even more power without worrying about detonation.

The reason turbo cars don't see the drop when you add an intercooler is the wastegate controls boost level based on manifold pressure so it's automatically compensated for. When I added an intercooler my pre-intercooler boost levels went up 4psi while manifold pressure remained the same. This helps illustrate one of the ways an intercooler adds power even at the same manifold pressure.

 

That's is exactly what I am looking for in my build. and hope she goes to a good home. GLWS

 

IHC, is Comptech's implementation of the Eaton (pre throttlebody) the reason that boost is rpm dependent? I must say that while Eatons are popular in OEM applications, they are usually part of the intake manifold and are post throttlebody. Boost is constant regardless of engine RPM (which is by design since Eatons are air pumps that do not compress like a turbo or centrifugal.)

Wouldn't it be 'better' so to speak to use a larger blower like an M90 in the intake manifold position? I wonder if packaging height was the reason it wasn't? My thought was if you're doing a supercharger, why not replace the upper and lower intake and it would clear. I don't know about the alignment of the pulley though, that may be the showstopper.

 

I've seen a j32 civic online with a supercharger where the manifold is. It was sticking 10 feet out of the hood though.

 

https://acurazine.com/forums/second-...ch-kit-694376/


http://www.v6performance.net/forums/...on-m90-sc.html

 

waiting for gerzard rotrex s/c

 

Remember 313whp is still small but enough for the streets but don't forget I have even better numbers 320+whp 290+Wtq just with atlp pipes. It outperformed all pipes. Fucking awesome. Marcus have dyno charts. Stay tuned..

 

Dave, nice job man! Thank you for sharing and I am interested in the results of the j-pipe shootout. Happy to see that you got good results with FlashPro and the charger. Hopefully the next step is Meth Injection?

What do your IAT's look like near red-line?


Screaminz28 the M62 on the TL is post throttle body, it sits in between the throttle body and intake manifold, but because of packaging restrictions in the TL's engine bay Comptech didn't have it set up like you describe (GM L67 style). Take a look at the NSX roots style superchargers

 

150 degrees near redline. Pull after pull

 

150F is muy caliente, I really hope you plan to run meth injection soon. I don't have any first hand experience with FI but if I were in your shoes that's what I would do. I did some runs tonight and I logged IAT's of 64F at redline, its was about 50F ambient at the time..ahh Wisconsin You would be making some nice power up here in my neck of the woods .

If you could get the IAT's to 100F and below (dependent on ambient) you would be in nice shape,pick up some power and reduce the chance of knock. What AFR are you at WOT with your tune?

 

After 20 runs I have no knocks the 150degree temp is what I over heard the tuner and Marcus talk about but I'm sure it's a steady 145. I know what your talking about because I use to do live data on my fp and laptop and my intake temp was 116 on wot

 

145 degree is not that big of a threat to me. The power and response and mpg has always been the same. It's safe in my eyes because I experience it 1st hand.

 

That's great logic lol.

So, where's your IAT sensor located? 145F is cooking. At 26psi on an 80F night, my gauge is pegged down at 50F. 100hp/l (at most) is not exactly great for a FI setup. The S2000 makes the same hp/l NA. My 2.0l BMW with $300 in mods will destroy your TL in low end torque, drivability, peak hp, average hp, everywhere, because it has a very well implemented FI setup. You need to properly implement the blower and part of that includes cooling the charge air back down to ambient. Your setup is not complete. It's like doing heads and cams and running the stock exhaust. Right now you're sacrificing power and reliability because you're too stubborn and arrogant to listen to people who have been there before with actual experience.

 

Matt, didn't you hear, he thinks it's perfect and the best and it's fine. Just say good job and best awesome sc set up fastest car stuffs.

I swear, Dave...some people just can't read!




























Seriously, still waiting for the driving videos.

 

By that logic, back in the day when we sprayed a CRX with a 200 shot we were ok too. Oh wait, we sprayed it that 4th time and guess what we experienced then...lol

 

a cold intake?

 

A multipiece motor, lol.

 

but...after it was blown and didn't run, the intake stayed pretty cold?

 

Lol. I'm done for real this time. Well, until the inevitable happens.

 

just let him do his thing. His happy. If it blows its blow, if it doesn't it doesn't

 

don't encourage the bad behavior!

 

I h c I know your education mean a lot here to other people but I will never take advice from someone that uses atf in a acura ps system . Sorry u lost credibility s long time ago w me. And since u wrote a thread on it you want other members to lock up there steering racks n pumps. For you to say my motor will grenade was insulting. But there still will peace. Btw intake temp sensor is on manifold not in front of the bumper like some deseprate ppl.

Btw your BMW will not destroy my tl. I put money on that

 

i'm guessing he's reading the sensor on the manifold, so pretty close to the blower exit. I honestly thought it would be higher on the HBP but still.

you really should get a water/meth kit. they're not expensive, easy to install and you already have tuning in place to set it up properly. And don't forget you'll gain a decent amount of power.

 

Let's see, I started using ATF that closely matches the stock pSF viscosity almost 2 years ago. Additives are almost the same. Base oil is far superior. My steering feel no longer varies by ambient temp. My rack is just fine and so are the others that are using it. The magnet shows less metal than it ever did with the stock and the Amsoil fluid. Show me one "locked up" steering rack from using Redline ATF. In the thread I specifically stated I don't recommend anyone else try it even though I know it's perfectly safe. Are you dreaming again Dave? If that's all you've got, go back to blowing up your 300hp " race car" lol.

Unlike your paranoid frozen steering rack comments, we have seen what, 30 TLs with blown engines from these superchargers? It has happened and it will continue to happen. As I said in this thread yours has a better chance of living since it has an actual tune but given enough time with a nut behind the wheel it will blow. There's just not enough ring gap to survive the temps long term. And like I said, without an intercooler and/or meth, it's not complete. You just don't run forced induction without some form of intercooling. Maybe back in the 80s it was acceptable and on big engines that only required low boost to make big power but it doesn't work well on the TL. Case in point, a supercharged 3.5l making under 350hp. Be careful with those V6 Camaros, one bad launch or a missed shift and you're toast.

Yes, the BMW will beat your TL. I suggest you try racing one with a tune before I have to insert your foot into your mouth against your ragged out "race car" with my fiancées stock family car on runflats. The tune goes back on as soon as it's broken in. I suggest you hurry and set something up before that happens. You have zero chance 0-60 even without the tune.

One word of advice, try taking it to the track and see what it does instead of lame flybys and speedo videos.

 

Oh Ding Dong Dave your mind works in simple ways

 

People tell you to stop trying and your wasting your time why do you continue? Anyway I shouldn't diss you like that because you r helpful and smart. Sorry. But with the atf steering ack thing I had to diagnose a customers car a while back that steering wheel was hard to turn and sure it had atf in the ps resvior. It was in there for years and sure enough it takes years for it to lock up. Juss saying.

 

IHC, I know you go back to the ring gap being too small and I understand the ramifications of if the ends touch. However, is there evidence that shows that has happened on TLs around here, or just based on the tight tolerances. I only ask because from what I can tell, every FI engine on this forum has grenaded from detonation/lack of proper tuning and not just rings touching.

I know the Nissan VQ is a much more popular platform for FI than the J, and its ring end gaps are comparable, in fact a bit tighter on the high end. I've researched and looked for good evidence of ring end gap causing broken ring lands or engine failures and most of the evidence shows they are reliable to 400+ WHP and then the rods are a weak link. There's the usual tune related problems, but I've seen enough busted built 2JZs to know a dope that can't tune can kill anything.

While I know everyone wants a 600HP monster, I dont. I'd be happy with 350 - 375 whp. I'm fine with pulling the stock pistons and increasing the gap a bit as cheap insurance. However, with J32s being so cheap, I'm tempted to let it ride and see what happens.

Also, since the ring gap expands based on temperature, would running E85 be sufficient to cool combustion down enough to avoid it? I know everyone has their druthers, I'm just not a fan of meth and corn is cheap here.

 

No hard evidence that it's the gap other than broken ring lands with no damage to the top of the piston or the usual pits from detonation. I firmly believe in the beginning the failures were 99% detonation related. Once people began using meth and monitoring knock the failure rate went down considerably. It just seems like most of the failures of those who were monitoring knock didn't happen until they did an extended top end run or lots of back to back runs.

I think E85 would be a big help. I also think my prior advice to run pure meth isn't the best. I think on a TL with a stock bottom end, a mix of water/meth is better because while it won't make quite as much power, the water does a better job at cooling combustion temps while the meth flashes off so quickly it cools the air more.

I don't hate E85. In fact, I like it. For a street car it has it's problems like availability and mpg but that's totally the owners preference. Performance wise the only real downside can be harder starting but again, that's up to the owner. It probably will keep a supercharged engine safe and is the perfect solution for someone who wants the benefits of meth but without the complexity.

I think the bottom end itself will withstand 600hp with no knock and if the heat is kept in check. With E85 and limiting it to 1/4 mile runs with a cool down it might just last a long time at that level.

Just one thing though. I like overdriving the superchargers so boost comes in earlier and using the bypass to limit boost. It can create a little more best though. Using an intercooler will allow you to run a smaller pulley for boost to come in sooner due to the pressure drop across the intercooler.

MOST IMPORTANTLY I've never mentioned it but I think this supercharger is set up to bypass most of the time until you're in the higher rpm range. This would be due to the horrible "tuning" they came with, to avoid detonation. Now that we have tuning, meth, intercoolers, and E85 available, the boost can safely come in a lot sooner. There's no reason why boost shouldn't be instant even at 1,500rpm if you wanted it to be. It is a positive displacement blower. If you screw with the bypass and it's associated plumbing I bet there's an easy way to get instant boost and TONS of low end torque. Obviously too much too soon will hurt things but there's just too much intentional lag with this kit. I would be looking at that bypass setup very closely if I had one. You could literally make peak torque from 2,000rpm or whatever you deem safe.

 

This is exactly what I observed. The second ring was jammed in it's groove with the ends together and both lands had cracked. There was no evidence of any damage to the top of the piston, heads or plugs. Just the usual carbon deposits.

I was driving mine with the cracked lands, noticed lots of blowby, did a leakdown and saw that one cylinder was bad. No grenades here. There was no damage to the cylinder walls.

Max boost was about 8lbs.

 

I don't think anyone expects to follow someone's advice blindly. But when they know what they're talking about, at least show appreciation for the advice even if you don't heed it. Could be true...