phee

iTrader: (5)

Couple of guys in the atlanta social group were talking about brake upgrades.

We 2g-ers like to swap the 2 pot calipers from the 95 legend LS coupe onto our cars as a simple and cheap BBK solution.

After some research i realized that the Base 3g TL and the 2g TL calipers have the same part number.

This means we have the same brakes and theoretically you guys should be able to do the LEgend Caliper swap.

2003TL caliper part numbers for front:
45018-S0K-A01 -R
45019-S0K-A01 -L

04 TL caliper part numbers for front:
45018-S0K-A01 -R
45019-S0K-A01 -L

links with pics
03 tl
http://www.acuraoemparts.com/delray/...All&vinsrch=no

04 tl
http://www.acuraoemparts.com/delray/...All&vinsrch=no

FirePR2002

the brackets appear to be different though???????

phee

iTrader: (5)

couldnt they just use a 2g braket?

prlwhtl25

iTrader: (2)

thats interesting cause now am wondering if the 3g tls factory big brake kit ..would fit and 2g tl

e r y k

iTrader: (2)

With some machining, you could pretty much use any caliper on the market Its all about the relocation bracket.

phee

iTrader: (5)

yea but if the calipers a direct swap this is like a 150 dollar bbk

phee

iTrader: (5)

it does

CJITTY

are the legend rear calipers single piston?

phee

iTrader: (5)

yea. rears are single

Majofo

Are the double pistons adjacent or side by side? I'm guessing side by side like on the 1G MDX..

edit: nvm.. side by side like most if not all..

95 Legend LS FR Brake Assy

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

so is this a yea? or a nea?

phee

iTrader: (5)

plausible

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

that isn't one of the options... don't tell me im going to have to be the guinea pig and pull them off the 1G TL and test them on the 3G

binhsterbinh

Any updates on the Legend two pistons installed on a 3G TL?

dc5chris209

So did anyone ever get to the bottom of this? I am interested in doing this on my TL

TLdream

iTrader: (4)

Its not worth the cost imho. I have the legend dual piston calipers on my J35 prelude. I took the brembo bbk off to fit smaller wheels. I couldnt tell the difference between the stock brakes and the legend brakes. If you want to do it for the coolness factor, or you might road race the car, or you drive hard, use NSX twin piston calipers. They bolt up the same as the legends.

Majofo

Great thread bump..

dc5chris209

I have read the NSX and the Legend calipers are the same minus the NSX logo.

I am doing this purely for function, the TL is a very heavy car and I would assume this would provide a little extra force and smooth braking to the 3G.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Had the NSX calipers on my CLs back in the day. The fronts bolted right up to the stock brackets. They worked OK. Felt a little better than stock, but not as good as a BBK.

If I were to do anything with the TL it would be the brembos.

dc5chris209

So I have started to do a little research

The knuckles on the 2G and 3G have different part numbers but from looking at the schematics the primary difference seems to be the angle of the end that receives the tie rod end, but on the 1G to 2G there was a substantial difference between the parts so I would not rule this swap out there.

As started prior the calipers are exactly the same. Also the rotors both appear to be a 16in but they have different part numbers, I assume that there is not much difference though due to our calipers being the same.

The last hurdle that seems to be placed in front of me would be different part numbers on the brake lines, but again since we share the same caliper there should not be an issue there.

I have a good feeling I will be posting a DIY and being the guinea pig on this one.

dc5chris209

I agree the Brembo upgrade would be nice, it is just not cost effective for my DD. I also read the 5AT took the cake in real world braking tests vs. the 6MT, the main advantage to the Brembo setup is heat dissipation.

http://www.brakeandfrontend.com/Arti...winPiston.aspx

The above link is for anyone who would like to learn a little about the advantages to the dual piston design, 2 being better initial torque and longer pad life, which would be nice seeing as expensive as pads are.

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

i'll bet u anything the rotors are not 16" even a high performance car like the nissan gtr has only 15" rotors. the 3g tl-s brakes have 12.2" rotors. 16" rotors are completely out of question for a TL. besides, how would a 16" rotor fit? the stock rims are only 17", not to mention the thickness of the rim, plus space for the caliper.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Well....this was not true for the NSX calipers I had on my CL. I went through pads in about 9 months. The Rotora Slotted Rotors may have contributed to that as well though.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

phee

iTrader: (5)

The 2g guys have been doing these swaps for a while. More info is available in that forum. I've driven with the 2 pots on a track and it DOES make a difference.

TLdream

iTrader: (4)

at the track yes. on the streets, i didnt notice.

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

I love my tl-s brembos

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

I'm jealous.

dc5chris209

I got that size from the Acura parts site it is likely a misprint. I have yet to get in there and size anything up on the car.

xtmslyy00

Can someone tell me the exact model for the 95 legend? I cannot seem to find a 2piston... I would not mind trying this as a simple BBK...

xtmslyy00

Nevermind figured out its the front of the LGS we are talking about... I found this on a honda forum...

http://www./forums/showthread.php?t=30097


If I am not mistaking this is the same setup??...

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

still no one has done this yet? i may be the first guinea pig?

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Do it.

I hate cars

There's very, very little to gain by going with a 2-piston caliper. 4 piston has a few small advantages, 2-piston not so much. You still have the slider mechanism and uneven pad wear/pressure. Besides, heat dissipation is still governed by the rotor so they're not going to perform any better under repeated stops either. On the negative side, if you increase overall piston area (not sure if you do or not), you're going to get more front brake bias and stopping distances will be longer. You can't just mix and match calipers and rotors without hurting braking distance.

TLdream

iTrader: (4)

Thats what i tried to say. Coming from someone who has used them all (currently have them all) The brembo bbk works the best. But as far as the rest are concerned. My Single piston calipers with good brake pads worked much better than the nsx and legend calipers with cheap pads. I guess what im trying to say, if your going to spend the money to get a little better rotor, spend the money to get better pads while your doing it.

T Ho

I've got the Brembos on my 6spd, but I also have a 2g '02 TL-S.

I put the Legend calipers on the front of the 2g, along with the 3g A-Spec pads. Both were bolt-on items with no mods necessary. I find that the Legend calipers feel more "progressive" under normal driving than the original single pistons. There is a more linear response, more similar to the feel of the Brembos on my '06.

The piston area is almost exactly the same as the singles. (FYI, the NSX pistons are smaller...).

I got what I was after- brakes that feel similar between the '02 and '06. I don't race, track the car, drive like a jagoff, etc, so fade after 6-8 hard stops was irrelevant. Getting the two cars to feel similar in daily driving was important, though- mission accomplished.

P.S. I thought our cars have EBD- electronic brake distribution, so variances in front-rear braking are compensated for (within reason, of course). If so, the point above about piston area is moot.

I hate cars

That's a huge assumption about EBD. I've done my own tests and even paid for white papers on EBD and still can't draw a conclusion. Besides, you want the car to be mechanically optimized before electronic intervention. Ideally the electronics should not have to do much.

The difference in feel was most likely because you had to bleed the new brakes when you installed the new calipers and I doubt you used the exact same brake pads. If you installed 4 piston calipers with two pistons on each side I could understand the more progressive feel. With the 2 piston with both being on the same side, you're retaining the crappy sliding pin mechanism which is the the single biggest reason for 4 pot calipers, to get rid of this mechanism.

Of course the NSX fronts would have less piston area, it has much less weight in the front.

jlee133541

I have a 2G TL. It has the worst around town braking of any car I've ever driven. It's all up front. There was a TSB regarding brake pulsing that covered the 2000's and a couple other years. The cure was to have the dealers cut the rotors. That was not the cure. I started by changing over to EBC rotors and Red Stuff pads on the front. I followed the EBC recommendations for bedding in the pads. The problem continues. There are not enough miles on the car to warp the EBC rotors and it's never driven that hard. The problem with the car is the tentative braking, 50 plus slowing but not standing on the brakes. 50-0 is no problem if you stand on the pedal. The stopping distance is noticeably shorter using EBC verses stock. I have always believed that the problem lies with the calipers, the brake hoses and or the fluid. I'm doing the 95 Legend swap. The surface area is about the same. I'm hoping that the Legend calipers work better than the 2G. The Legends mount the calipers on the opposite side of the wheel (I'm pretty sure). I don't know if the placement on the 2G's is part of the problem. I know that brake pulsing seems to be intrinsic to the 2G's I'm replacing the hoses and the fluid. I'll get to the rear if I can fix the front. If not, I'll sell the car. That's how disjointed I am with the way it stops. Two grand for a big brake kit makes no sense from a cost perspective. I paid $3900 for the whole car. I'll put the EBC rotors on the lathe and spin them when I swap the calipers just to verify they are not warped.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

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