Good aftermarket clutch
10-31-2011, 07:31 PM
#161
All motor
Come to think of it, I need to change my slave cylinder as well. ASAP!
10-31-2011, 08:04 PM
#162
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
That makes sense if you've got the clutch adjusted so that the PP is never fully released. As the disc get's thinner with use, the pressure would be reducing over time. That would be bad for the throwout bearing and both the master and slave cylinder.
Maybe CM is selling a PP that just have too much throw for our systems?
Maybe CM is selling a PP that just have too much throw for our systems?
The PP should be ALWAYS FULLY RELEASED!! - you'll wear out the throwout bearing very quickly and you'll lose some of clamping force.
The pedal SHOULD NOT need any more adjustment once you adjusted correctly .The PP is what determines the point of engagement and disengagement of the clutch, the adjustment for the pedal is where you specifically want it to grab. You can adjust the pedal but not the PP so this plays a factor in your choice of clutch
With disc usage, Pressure would not decrease. Pressure comes from the PP only. the PP sits on the flywheel always putting pressure on the disc. So as your disc is getting used and "thinning", the PP still has the same pressure pushing it towards the flywheel. The only thing that would change would be the PP is now sitting closer to the flywheel due to the disc "Thinning" so that would make it farther from the throwout bearing. i dont see how it would make a difference though since the disc only has about 1/4 inch of material (guessing 1/8 on both sides) and the throwout bearing moves a full inch or two once pedal fully depressed thus making the engagement point lower than when first installed and indicating to user to atleast take a second look at things... You can then adjust when too low or replace.
With 99vtecaccords problem ( pedal not coming back up) it could be the slave cyl, master cly, not properly adjusted pedal or slight chance the PP. The PP springs/fingers are what push the pedal back up hydraulically. if it was the PP, then there would be tons of slippage, problems shifting (if even able to shift). He never gave an update as to what has been happening since that post in July but its been 8000 more miles.. ( 21K he just stated - 13K reported in july's problem)
The only report PP problem was seans SPEC KIT that literally was destroyed fingers and all.. This is why i asked 99vtec for pictures of the uninstalled kit when he goes back to OEM...
So all in all, as long as the materials ( friction disc on the flywheel and PP, fiber tough on the clutch disc ) hold up, and theres no real crazy abuse(power shifting, not rev matching), the clutch should hold up fine. i cant wait to really get on it once I can drive her again and get a good feeling of how she grabs at higher RPM. Adrian will be able to soon and will have true and tested testimony..
quick sources.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRDWO5qo_iI
and a good read
http://www.edmunds.com/car-technolog...operation.html
10-31-2011, 08:45 PM
#163
I've had the FX300 installed for nearly 13,000 miles now.. I want to say the pressure plate is acting up. At times at a complete stop, I will engage the clutch and it doesnt return with pressure (like a dead pedel without pressure). I would have to manually slip my foot behind the clutch pedel and raise it up to build pressure.
Once this clutch completely wears out, I'll definitely be going back to OEM.
Once this clutch completely wears out, I'll definitely be going back to OEM.
With 99vtecaccords problem ( pedal not coming back up) it could be the slave cyl, master cly, not properly adjusted pedal or slight chance the PP. The PP springs/fingers are what push the pedal back up hydraulically. if it was the PP, then there would be tons of slippage, problems shifting (if even able to shift). He never gave an update as to what has been happening since that post in July but its been 8000 more miles.. ( 21K he just stated - 13K reported in july's problem)
10-31-2011, 08:46 PM
#164
If the CM design of the PP from disengagement to engagement is longer than what our clutch system is capable, couldn't you have a situation where in order to disengage, you need to adjust the pedal toward the top end of the throw which could result in constant pressure on the throwout bearing?
If this happens, as the disc becomes thinner due to wear, over time, you will begin to slip because this condition is never allowing the PP to fully apply all it's spring pressure?
If this happens, as the disc becomes thinner due to wear, over time, you will begin to slip because this condition is never allowing the PP to fully apply all it's spring pressure?
10-31-2011, 09:24 PM
#166
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
If the CM design of the PP from disengagement to engagement is longer than what our clutch system is capable, couldn't you have a situation where in order to disengage, you need to adjust the pedal toward the top end of the throw which could result in constant pressure on the throwout bearing?
If this happens, as the disc becomes thinner due to wear, over time, you will begin to slip because this condition is never allowing the PP to fully apply all it's spring pressure?
If this happens, as the disc becomes thinner due to wear, over time, you will begin to slip because this condition is never allowing the PP to fully apply all it's spring pressure?
As the disc becomes thinner, the throwout bearing would require more throw to disengage. the PP moves away from the throwout bearing which would cause a low engagement on the pedal and signs of wear to the user...
I dont think the engagement to disengagement points on the PP are over the TL limits though... The bearing moves inches and the PP could only move max 1/2( and thats a stretch)
I remember grabbing the fork for the bearing when i had the tranny open and it had alot of travel room..
10-31-2011, 11:31 PM
#169
Glad it feels better adrian. My clutch catches right under half way of the pedal travel and I know I can go lower. How high is yours?
Do what sonnick said, after the breakin period, readjust just to fine tune it to your preferred height and go from there. how's the grab so far?
Do what sonnick said, after the breakin period, readjust just to fine tune it to your preferred height and go from there. how's the grab so far?
So do you think I need to adjust the pedal a bit lower? I would just hate to go back to hard shifting.
I had my CM FX300 clutch installed little over a year ago (part & labor $1700). I put nearly 21k miles on it and its being replaced this weekend with an OEM set. I'm really disappointed with CM quality. As you stated earlier, having problems shifting smoothly into gears. I had the same exact issue as well. After adjusting the pedal, it fixed the problem. I did experience that once the clutch start to wear, it started slipping. I tried readjusting the pedal, but it didnt make any difference.
I wish you all the best with your CM clutch... unfortunately, I will not be purchasing their product in the near future.
I wish you all the best with your CM clutch... unfortunately, I will not be purchasing their product in the near future.
10-31-2011, 11:46 PM
#170
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
You def can lower it then. When I drove opels car, shit was LOW!! Something I wasn't used to and I made the car jump first try to move so you have a lot of room to play with. Ima take a video for you tomorrow where my clutch disengages. Instead of taking it to the shop, you should do it yourself so you can fine tune it and not guess where it'll be good.
11-01-2011, 08:21 AM
#175
All motor
I really hope you guys get this situation resolved. You guys are probably getting frustrated because when you buy something, it should work easily! Maybe call CM and see what they say about it?
Street, after all of this talk of the slippage possibilities, I'd opt for the XLR8 kit.
Street, after all of this talk of the slippage possibilities, I'd opt for the XLR8 kit.
11-01-2011, 08:33 AM
#176
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
I dont think there is a situation... Everyone here drives differently and this is a manual car. for 99vtec, this clutch doesn't work for him, for t0tal, he needs pedal adjustment, Opel its fine and works great, Sean- after 4 clutches is fine, KN_TL has the tilton twin disc and hes in here for discussion, You had a problem with pedal adjustment. I dont drive my car...
The only real negative thing here is the problem with 99vtec's clutch going out on him at 21K miles but he did have bleeding issues and like I stated earlier, everyone drives differently ( not saying you dont know how to shift)...
The only real negative thing here is the problem with 99vtec's clutch going out on him at 21K miles but he did have bleeding issues and like I stated earlier, everyone drives differently ( not saying you dont know how to shift)...
11-01-2011, 09:07 AM
#177
Burning Brakes
Clutches cltutches ,with us the cm we had in TLS types worked but pedal was high worked fine until boost kit went on not enough holding capacity , we got the newer revised version a few months back for a customer it worked but engagement and disengagement wasn't the best ,what I do recommend is own setup with p2r disc this is best setup as far as driveability same as own ,but a bit more bite engagement is smooth this setup works ,from disc of course is ultimate solution if you have money to throw at it ...
11-06-2011, 07:16 AM
#178
After 1k miles of driving, here's my review.....
I took my car to a trusted shop, because I didn't have the time or place to install myself. I had them install the CM3 w/LWFW, and replace my UNORTHODOX Underdriven crank pulley with my stock pulley. It took them one day to do the install. The mechnic did mention that he had to adjust the clutch though, but it was ready for pick up.
My first impression driving impression......the pedal was definitely stiffer that stock. Also the clutch engagement was lower that stock. The chatter was definitely there also. I had to get use to taking off with as little chatter as possible. Unfortunately I was not liking the gear shifting. Before it was pretty smooth, but now it was alot more harder. It was not ideal for me, since I like to shift quickly. I drove it like that for a few days to see if it would get better. It didn't. So I readjusted the clutch engagement higher till I was satisfied with the shifts. The shifts were better, but the clutch engagement was too high. It was very hard to take off without looking like I just learn to drive a stick....lol! I didn't have time to mess with the car again till yesterday. So I readjust the pedal back down to seems like just a tad higher that the stock engagement. Drove it around town yesterday, now it's perfect; shifts and all!
Performance impression is kind of mixed feelings. I did my break in period over 550 miles, before I got on it. Before when I had the LW pulley, my car had alot of low end to mid power. Now it seems like the power has shift from low/mid to mid/high. That's great for racing and all, but now I have less drivability. Like I have to shift later that early to gain speed during normal driving. I can also tell cause I can hear my exhaust more than before. Like I have alittle more load on the engine, where as before it was quieter. Don't get me wrong, it still get up very quickly as before, just seems like it takes more effort to do so. I was liking the sleeper sound, rather than hearing me coming....lol! Also notice the rpm's stay steady between shifts, vice dropping with the stock clutch which is a plus. It definitely hits hard when I really get on it from stop also!
So that is my mix feelings about this set up. I'm guessing I lost some low end power, because of the pulley. I know Opel suggested that I keep it on after the install. But didn't want to worry about switching it out later, incase I didn't like it. Now I'm thinking about putting back on. But I will drive it around for a while. Also the chatter isn't bad, just have to get use to it. The clutch doesn't seem too stiff anymore; guess I got use to that also.
But to be honest if I would do it again, I would have went with the stock clutch. This is definitely for the younger guys.....lol!
My first impression driving impression......the pedal was definitely stiffer that stock. Also the clutch engagement was lower that stock. The chatter was definitely there also. I had to get use to taking off with as little chatter as possible. Unfortunately I was not liking the gear shifting. Before it was pretty smooth, but now it was alot more harder. It was not ideal for me, since I like to shift quickly. I drove it like that for a few days to see if it would get better. It didn't. So I readjusted the clutch engagement higher till I was satisfied with the shifts. The shifts were better, but the clutch engagement was too high. It was very hard to take off without looking like I just learn to drive a stick....lol! I didn't have time to mess with the car again till yesterday. So I readjust the pedal back down to seems like just a tad higher that the stock engagement. Drove it around town yesterday, now it's perfect; shifts and all!
Performance impression is kind of mixed feelings. I did my break in period over 550 miles, before I got on it. Before when I had the LW pulley, my car had alot of low end to mid power. Now it seems like the power has shift from low/mid to mid/high. That's great for racing and all, but now I have less drivability. Like I have to shift later that early to gain speed during normal driving. I can also tell cause I can hear my exhaust more than before. Like I have alittle more load on the engine, where as before it was quieter. Don't get me wrong, it still get up very quickly as before, just seems like it takes more effort to do so. I was liking the sleeper sound, rather than hearing me coming....lol! Also notice the rpm's stay steady between shifts, vice dropping with the stock clutch which is a plus. It definitely hits hard when I really get on it from stop also!
So that is my mix feelings about this set up. I'm guessing I lost some low end power, because of the pulley. I know Opel suggested that I keep it on after the install. But didn't want to worry about switching it out later, incase I didn't like it. Now I'm thinking about putting back on. But I will drive it around for a while. Also the chatter isn't bad, just have to get use to it. The clutch doesn't seem too stiff anymore; guess I got use to that also.
But to be honest if I would do it again, I would have went with the stock clutch. This is definitely for the younger guys.....lol!
11-06-2011, 07:36 AM
#180
Don't get me wrong......if you like to drag race, this set up is perfect! I did a couple of stoplight takes. It does have "t0tal" advantage over my previous setup with the LW pulley. I had too much low end power where I had to baby it before getting on the gas. Now it seems that I can do half throttle to full before shifting to 2nd!
11-06-2011, 10:07 AM
#181
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
how does it hold/hows the grab?
i dont see how you would lose low end tho?? the pulley and flywheel both sit on the crank. the pulley you lose 7 lbs. the flwheel you lose 17 and put 7(stock pulley) back on so you lose 10-14 lbs total doubled than the ur pulley. i understand you still need momentum on the crank since its lighter weight which would require higher rpms to move but acceleration must be ALOT quicker.. i think you just need to give it more gas bro ALL THE TIME lol... Fucking mustangs! VTEC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thanks for the review. im trying for this weekend to do the pilot bearing. i'll get to 750 in no time...
Maybe we should've gone tilton... lol
i dont see how you would lose low end tho?? the pulley and flywheel both sit on the crank. the pulley you lose 7 lbs. the flwheel you lose 17 and put 7(stock pulley) back on so you lose 10-14 lbs total doubled than the ur pulley. i understand you still need momentum on the crank since its lighter weight which would require higher rpms to move but acceleration must be ALOT quicker.. i think you just need to give it more gas bro ALL THE TIME lol... Fucking mustangs! VTEC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thanks for the review. im trying for this weekend to do the pilot bearing. i'll get to 750 in no time...
Maybe we should've gone tilton... lol
11-06-2011, 08:13 PM
#185
Update to my review....
Ok after driving the yesterday, I was messing with the car for a bit. I took my throttlebody and intake manifold to clean it out. Sure enough there was alot of carbon and a film of oil in there. So I used Deep Creep, a toothbrush, and some rags to clean it out. I put the intake back together, didn't go anywhere after.
Anyway this morning I when to the store, and wow! What a difference! My most of my low end power is back! No fooling! The take-off is much better; my drivability that I loved so much is back. In fact, I can actually take-off without much chatter.
So after a re-review, I'm much happier with this clutch system! Now lets see how long it will last......
Anyway this morning I when to the store, and wow! What a difference! My most of my low end power is back! No fooling! The take-off is much better; my drivability that I loved so much is back. In fact, I can actually take-off without much chatter.
So after a re-review, I'm much happier with this clutch system! Now lets see how long it will last......
11-06-2011, 08:16 PM
#186
how does it hold/hows the grab?
i dont see how you would lose low end tho?? the pulley and flywheel both sit on the crank. the pulley you lose 7 lbs. the flwheel you lose 17 and put 7(stock pulley) back on so you lose 10-14 lbs total doubled than the ur pulley. i understand you still need momentum on the crank since its lighter weight which would require higher rpms to move but acceleration must be ALOT quicker.. i think you just need to give it more gas bro ALL THE TIME lol... Fucking mustangs! VTEC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thanks for the review. im trying for this weekend to do the pilot bearing. i'll get to 750 in no time...
Maybe we should've gone tilton... lol
i dont see how you would lose low end tho?? the pulley and flywheel both sit on the crank. the pulley you lose 7 lbs. the flwheel you lose 17 and put 7(stock pulley) back on so you lose 10-14 lbs total doubled than the ur pulley. i understand you still need momentum on the crank since its lighter weight which would require higher rpms to move but acceleration must be ALOT quicker.. i think you just need to give it more gas bro ALL THE TIME lol... Fucking mustangs! VTEC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thanks for the review. im trying for this weekend to do the pilot bearing. i'll get to 750 in no time...
Maybe we should've gone tilton... lol
11-06-2011, 08:58 PM
#187
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
Ok after driving the yesterday, I was messing with the car for a bit. I took my throttlebody and intake manifold to clean it out. Sure enough there was alot of carbon and a film of oil in there. So I used Deep Creep, a toothbrush, and some rags to clean it out. I put the intake back together, didn't go anywhere after.
Anyway this morning I when to the store, and wow! What a difference! My most of my low end power is back! No fooling! The take-off is much better; my drivability that I loved so much is back. In fact, I can actually take-off without much chatter.
So after a re-review, I'm much happier with this clutch system! Now lets see how long it will last......
Anyway this morning I when to the store, and wow! What a difference! My most of my low end power is back! No fooling! The take-off is much better; my drivability that I loved so much is back. In fact, I can actually take-off without much chatter.
So after a re-review, I'm much happier with this clutch system! Now lets see how long it will last......
11-06-2011, 09:21 PM
#188
Safety Car
iTrader: (7)
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Jose, CA/ Charleston, WV
Posts: 4,045
Received 619 Likes
on
459 Posts
so the CM kit is good right? I don't want to buy it and then bitch about it later. I will try it with the UR pulley first and see how I like it. If not I can always swap the OEM pulley back on
11-07-2011, 09:03 AM
#191
All motor
11-07-2011, 12:16 PM
#192
Performance impression is kind of mixed feelings. I did my break in period over 550 miles, before I got on it. Before when I had the LW pulley, my car had alot of low end to mid power. Now it seems like the power has shift from low/mid to mid/high. That's great for racing and all, but now I have less drivability. Like I have to shift later that early to gain speed during normal driving. I can also tell cause I can hear my exhaust more than before. Like I have alittle more load on the engine, where as before it was quieter. Don't get me wrong, it still get up very quickly as before, just seems like it takes more effort to do so. I was liking the sleeper sound, rather than hearing me coming....lol! Also notice the rpm's stay steady between shifts, vice dropping with the stock clutch which is a plus. It definitely hits hard when I really get on it from stop also!
So that is my mix feelings about this set up. I'm guessing I lost some low end power, because of the pulley. I know Opel suggested that I keep it on after the install. But didn't want to worry about switching it out later, incase I didn't like it. Now I'm thinking about putting back on. But I will drive it around for a while. Also the chatter isn't bad, just have to get use to it. The clutch doesn't seem too stiff anymore; guess I got use to that also.
But to be honest if I would do it again, I would have went with the stock clutch. This is definitely for the younger guys.....lol!
So that is my mix feelings about this set up. I'm guessing I lost some low end power, because of the pulley. I know Opel suggested that I keep it on after the install. But didn't want to worry about switching it out later, incase I didn't like it. Now I'm thinking about putting back on. But I will drive it around for a while. Also the chatter isn't bad, just have to get use to it. The clutch doesn't seem too stiff anymore; guess I got use to that also.
But to be honest if I would do it again, I would have went with the stock clutch. This is definitely for the younger guys.....lol!
12-04-2011, 09:39 PM
#194
Chapter Leader (NY/NJ)
iTrader: (10)
Well Clutch is in CORRECTLY with the Pilot bearing. when i first installed, i had to adjust the hell out of the pedal to get it right where i wanted it, and now with same clutch and installed correctly with the pilot bearing, the pedal is much higher. I need to adjust again. Is there a reason for this.. All i did was remove and reinstall all same exact components and the bearing... The pilot bearing doesn't take any space sitting in between the flywheel and crankshaft does it??
12-04-2011, 09:42 PM
#195
12-07-2011, 08:21 AM
#196
Can anyone weigh in on this Clutchmasters FX100 vs a new OEM setup? (I'll be using the OEM flywheel with either disk/pressure plate). My original clutch is dying at 70k and I'd like something that feels similar but lasts a little longer.
12-07-2011, 09:16 AM
#197
civicdrivr is the only 2nd gen cl I know running the cm stage 3 kit and he had paul nva-av6 install it. He said they had to shim the clutch. Seems like a fitment issue to me.
I am gonna stick with oem cause you just can't trust anything for my car.
I am gonna stick with oem cause you just can't trust anything for my car.
12-07-2011, 09:34 AM
#198
All motor
Can anyone weigh in on this Clutchmasters FX100 vs a new OEM setup? (I'll be using the OEM flywheel with either disk/pressure plate). My original clutch is dying at 70k and I'd like something that feels similar but lasts a little longer.
12-07-2011, 10:19 AM
#199
Can anyone weigh in on this Clutchmasters FX100 vs a new OEM setup? (I'll be using the OEM flywheel with either disk/pressure plate). My original clutch is dying at 70k and I'd like something that feels similar but lasts a little longer.