I hate cars

This POS computer erased the first attempt at this thread so I'll keep it short before it gets thrown in the pool.

I finally have everything here or on the way.

Got a tracking number on the AE IB15s which should be here Tuesday.

Ordered the Massive Audio 6.5" coaxial slim mount (1.66" deep) for the center to replace the 5.25" Type R.

Every reference to the sub stage in the past few months has had the word "temporary" in it. I've used scrap pieces of MDF of different shapes and sizes to mount my two different IB setups since I thought they would only be in for a few weeks. A few weeks turned into 5 months but now the IB15s are almost here. I bought enough MDF for up to three 3/4" layers.

The Tempest X is already stupid loud on the low end and I should be gaining 70% more displacement with the two AEs.

It will be neat having a sub that plays flat from 18 to 150hz. I can't wait to try crossing it at something higher like 90hz. The MS8 is amazing for up front bass so this might just work out very well and take some of the load off of my Dyns.

The main point of this thread is to finally have a final thread with pictures of how this thing will remain for many years. This will be my first actual build thread.

Final equipment will be:

Dynaudio 342
MS8
MA 6.5" center
RF 1000.4 amp
JL 900/5 amp
"Niebur3" kicks for the mids
A new factory CD player since mine took a dump.
Tons of sound deadening.

Can't wait to get the JL 6 channel out of here. One channel is dead and it's sounding harsher and harsher over time.

I hope it sounds as good as I think it will. Between the CD player going out and the dead amp channel along with degrading sound quality and the super bottom heavy sub, I've forgotten how it used to sound.

Tempest X might be for sale. If you like rap, this is the sub for you.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Absolutely into following this thread...as always, I'm sure it's going to be amazing.

I hate cars

Lol. Probably not. I suck at car audio. I suck at wood working. I suck at carpeting and finishing. Hopefully it sounds good at least. I think I've spent at much time on the current system as it took me to produce a 10 second car.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^stop being negative.

btw, there's a thread that needs your attn, titled "I hate cars, something something"

TranceAddict

Congrats bro ....should sound nice . keep us posted ! Ive got my RK6's in the other day just waiting for my Sundown Sax 100.4 amp and need to buy more sound deadner . I got damplifier pro for the doors but am gonna add overkill . Money is getting tight wt my 105k service and other non sense BS things coming up

I wish I would of bought MS8's in the first place stuck wt LC8's . I'll have to trade or sell

hp1kw

Hmm, if you are going high-end, did you look into the Audison Bit-One and their amps? I'm thinking an all audison front end will sound infinitely better than the JBL/RF/JL stuff. Also, I would really, really re-think the whole IB setup. Great sound quality can be had in small boxes. Maybe a Focal sub would work?

But maybe I'm just jealous. Heh, I'm just going to do LOC to Polk SR front stage and a Focal Sub driven by old-school Soundstream power.

I hate cars

The IB setup is the only thing I'm 100% sure about. The AE IB15s in the IB setup are absolutely amazing. That's the one thing I'm sure about, the sub stage is going to be amazing. I've never heard anything with the kind of SQ that the one IB15 I heard had. The clarity, detail, lack of distortion, and the fact that it played effortlessly from 20hz to 150hz sold me. I've had sealed, ported, bandpass, and IB in the TL and IB is just better for my tastes.

I hear you on the amps though. I have no idea if I made a bad decision. I got tired of not having enough power, one channel of my 6 channel failed so I got something with some serious power. Time will tell though. If i don't like the RF stuff, I'll sell it and go with ARC or something along those lines.

I'm looking forward to getting this over and just enjoying the music. This thing has dragged on for way too long.

BTW, I would love to hear that Focal sub if we're ever in the same area.

hp1kw

Ugh its late. I just know that setting up an IB configuration is just a PITA. But if you have that all sealed up, sounds like it should work. I'm not sure if Rockford was one of the companies (PPI, Soundstream, etc) that went belly up or not, but I was never a big fan of the RF series. But I think to really improve an amp, stepping up slightly won't do it, so ARC would be a solid choice. Just get a small alpine 1000 watt digital amp for the bass stage. I have one on a JL W7 and it sounds decent. And if you are in my area, I would DEFINITELY want to hear your setup. Sounds like it will be top notch. Especially those Dyn's. Dang.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Shoot, I wish I was in BOTH your areas!

and PS...none of my skills at anything mentioned above are very good either AND I don't have a 10 second car.

hp1kw

No you don't. My area sucks. But, this time I'm trying to keep everything as light as possible. In my other car, I've had two Boston Pro 10s, with the box taking up the entire truck, driven by huge amps. So I figure this time, just keep it simple and as light as possible.

I hate cars

Lol, at least you're not in the armpit of California.

You should give the IB setup a try. My two IB15s combined weigh 34lbs and the MDF weighs 30lbs. That's pretty light for two 15s and 90% of the trunk usable.

hp1kw

Hell yeah, but it seems like you have a TON of patience. I however do not. Heh, I am also limited in skills. Hell I will be happy when i'm done running the cable. So setting up an IB config and plugging all holes would likely drive me insane (again). But yeah Bakersfield. I don't even know where it is. How far from LA?

Steven Bell

iTrader: (2)

I'm anxious to see the pics! Best of luck IHC-it sounds like your setup will be great.




.

eggyhustles

I'm tryin' to figure out what's getting what power wise

I hate cars

Patience? Lol. Not a whole lot. I tend to do an hour or two of work until I get frustrated and then take a break. Plugging the holes is no big deal. An IB does not have to be air tight, just the big holes have to be plugged. I accidentally ran my first setup with the stock sub and midrange holes wide open and it lost a little output but nothing like you would think. I sealed everything larger than 2". More than that might make a difference but you will never be able to hear the difference.

I'm about 1-1.5 hours south of LA, right over the Grapevine.

Just cut the part of the baffle the subs will be going in and I actually took pictures. I always forget to take pictures. It's a real struggle for me. I taught myself how to build cars and I was able to drift my first car perfectly 10 minutes after getting my driver's license but car audio is a real challenge for me. Honestly, it's the money I spent on components that's making me build this thing right so I don't feel so guilty for spending so much.
Me too. Everything is still on the 5 channel 6 channel amp lol. Haven't decided what to send to what on the new amps. While the midbass need power, the mids and tweeters are 8 ohms. It sort of complicates things. It will probably end up being the 1000.4 on the midbass and mids and the 900/5 on the tweets, center, and subs. I waited for a while to order the amps because the IB15s only need 250 watts each but if I had to go with something else I might have needed the full 1,000 watt infinity that I've been running forever.

eggyhustles

Ah, i forgot u had a center

I was thinking

900/5 bridged to midbass + subs
rf on mids and tweets

I hate cars

This is the most trouble I've ever had in deciding what channel goes where. The RF has more than enough power for the midbass without bridging and the 8 ohm mids. I was thinking the JL might do better on the 8 ohm tweeter since it requires a little less power than the 8 ohm mid. The center could use either amp. I don't like it that loud. It's going to be pretty neat running a 6.5" coax in the center though. Only problem is I'm still not sure I'm keeping the MS8 and if I get rid of it, the center goes too. Maybe I'll put the pair in the rear.

I'm running the center currently on the MS8's built in amp and with only 75 watts per channel at 4 ohms on the JL it keeps up fine. That might change with more than double the power with the new amps.

On a different note, I cut the baffle for the IB15s tonight. Didn't take into account the width of the bit so instead of two 14" holes I have two 14.25" holes.

LostSol

Sub'd! Best of luck, cant wait to see the finished product!

jda123

Not to be nosy, but can you post up the numbers on that 1000-4 when you get it? I am immensely curious. You get the new AD?

I would run the tweets and mid range on the cleanest amp that you have. It matters.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

in

hp1kw

This sounds right. Eggy knows his stuff. The class D stuff should be hitting your lows with the nice sounding A/B on the mids/highs. I've run Class-D through my highs and it just sounded harsh. Wondering though, did you pay MSRP on that RF? IB should be sweet though.

But yeah, Bakersfield/Barstow I get them confused.

I hate cars

I heard the same thing about the class Ds on the mids/highs from a well respected member that owned two 600/4s. So definitely sounds like the class D will go on the lows and subs and the A/D or whatever it is will go on the mids/tweets. Only problem is the damn center which is currently powered on the MS8's internal amp.

And now an update. Recieved the AE IB15s today. They're beautiful lol. They're sitting in the living room in the baffle I made for them. Looks like it's going to be one baffle with the 14" holes that they're in now, another with 15.5" holes that goes over the front, and another that mounts to the car's chassis along with some minor bracing between the subs. They're super light, I can hold one out in front of me with one hand by the magnet. Suspension is soft too. I promised the GF I would not "waste" any time on my car audio stuff until this weekend.

Also recieved the Massive Audio SX-6 set that will go in the center to replace the temporary Type-S 5.25". The problem is they sent me the SK-6 component set which retails for double. They're 6.5" instead of 6.25", have a 25mm silk dome tweeter vs a 20mm tweeter, go a little lower, handle nearly double the rms wattage, and are still 1.66" deep. I'm going to try mounting one of the tweeters to the underside of the factory grill (a spare one I have) just to see if it's doable or if I should send them back (or sell) for the coaxials. Pictures to come.

eggyhustles

What are you gonna do with the exodus sub? Would make a killer HT sub

I hate cars

It's in the FS section for $150. I would love to keep it for exactly that reason but a certain someone is putting the pressure on to get rid of some of this stuff. Plus, I'm still in an apartment and the 8" sub already gets complaints. Can't seem to find a house that doesn't have everything ripped out by the previous owner. Got the 12W6 for sale too along with a single Massive Audio SK-6 for the center for sale. I hate to get rid of any of it.

Nick337

iTrader: (2)

hey Matt, my last day here is thursday, hopefully we can meet up or something before i head back.

I hate cars

Definitely. My 5th Droid died so I don't have your number. I'll PM you my work cell.

I hate cars

So here's what came in today:




Comparison of the Massive Audio SK-6 to the Image Dynamics CTX65


Comparison of the SK-6 to the IDs, Type S 5.25", and Infinity Reference 3.5". You can see the Massive 6.5" is actually shallower than the 3.5" Infinity with a huge frequency response advantage over all but the IDs.



One more shot of the now extinct IB15

niebur3

Very nice subs. I am excited for you that you actually received them!

I hate cars

Thanks. I hooked one of them up to the center channel of my HT just for the heck of it. Talk about efficiency. It was much louder than the 5" that it replaced. I tried the same thing with the Tempest X and there was a large loss of SPL.

The really weird thing is this 15" woofer was playing upper midrange very well. It was almost weird to look at the speaker of that size and hear treble from it.

So I got the baffle pretty much finished. I ended up doing the 3/4" baffle with 14" cutouts heavily braced with more 3/4" MDF on the backside, practically two baffles sandwhiched together. Then I did a top one with two 15.5" holes that will mount to the chassis. Overall thickness is 2.25" I hope that's going to be enough.

These pictures were taken before I decided to make the second baffle so add another 3/4" to the thickness. The face plate part obviously has to be cut and contoured to fit the car so it's not screwed or glued to anything yet, just laying there.

Doing this without a router is not fun and it's time consuming. This is my first half way serious attempt at any kind of wood working so it's not pretty but it's functional.

InFaMouSLink

iTrader: (10)

update on the sk-6? should be a quick check that your g/f wont find out about lol

Nick337

iTrader: (2)

Clear your pm box Matt, Pm me your address.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

You're the man, Matt...looking forward to seeing this IN the trunk. I've been toying with the idea of regaining my trunk and taking some weight out by putting in a serious 8" sub in the stock location and sealing up underneath...but I can't fathom such a small surface being able to recreate the lows I'm used to with 2 12's.

I hate cars

In the process right now. I spend 6 hours last night on the subs and started the center about an hour ago. I've already hooked power to it and it sounds very good. I can play it loud without the tweeter getting harsh. Lows and vocals are vastly improved over the 5.25" I was using before and even that was a huge upgrade over the Infinity 3.5".

The 6.5 slips right in, couldn't be easier. I'm trying to bring the mid right up to the bottom of the dash which presents a problem for the tweeter location. I could always mount the tweeter flush mounted on the grill but it might look weird. I have one last option I might try that shouldn't be hard if it works.


Try your current 12s IB lol. I'll post pics later today but I would say I still have 90% of my trunk usable with the two 15s in there. You almost don't notice them.

I hate cars

Subs are 100% done. Center is 90% done. I experimented with an old stock grill which I have to swap out for my newer grill after I mod it. The center comp fit in easily. The tweeter is under the factory grill but off to the side a little. It's an easy install. I broke the "legs" off of the grill so I could mount the mid up against the bottom of the dash without poking any holes in it. Having a large center with the MS8 makes a huge difference.

Crossed the subs at 85hz along with the midbasses and center.The midbass seems to have more clarity with it crossed a little higher. The IB15s easily play these frequencies.

Pictures of everything complete to come soon. I've spent over 12 hours on it this weekend, I'm not going to attempt to get on the computer for any more car stuff this weekend or I'll end up dead...

InFaMouSLink

iTrader: (10)

thanks for the update. Pm the left over details

I hate cars

Starting to put everything back together.... I'll take some more soon but you can't tell the subs are there anymore when you pop the trunk, they're completely hidden. This shows just how little space they take up.




From inside completely finished....

I hate cars

Just updating with a little more listening time. I've noticed something new with these subs. At what sounds like the same SPL, these things are vibrating things that have never vibrated. I have the factory wing spoiler (which I didn't want but it was the only black on black TL on the lot in '05). It goes crazy, looks like it's going to break. I see no way around this problem other than to order the factory lip spoiler which I think looks better anyway.

The side mirrors become unusable, the passenger seat back moves a lot without a person in it, anything that is set down on the arm rest vibrates off.

I can only think of two theories.... One is these subs will play midbass better than any 6.5" midbass can. Maybe it's these midbasss frequencies that are doing it.

The other is something a member at DIYMA told me would happen. As you get into subs (and any speakers) with less distortion they won't sound as loud as they actually are. Apparently distortion makes speakers sound louder. I noticed with my Dyns, just as Jerry said, they might not sound that loud but try talking out loud and you can't hear yourself talk. Now these subs are kind of the same way. You don't realze just how loud they are.

Currently have them lowpassed at 85hz. I'm still amazed at how well two 15s play this range. I keep moving the low pass up little by little and they just sound better and better.

I learned a few years ago that a 15" sub can play as tight as a 10" and it's not the diameter that determines this. But I think the tightness and snap of the bass especially in the upper region would surprise many. I have yet to hear a 10" sub with this kind of kick to it.

I haven't found one type of music that this sub likes. Usually your system will play certain types of music better than others. That has been the case with every system I've owned, even the W6 in IB form. With these, they hit the low, lows as well as the Tempest which is saying somthing. But they reach up to 85hz effortlessly. They literally sound as good on rock and punk as they do on rap. They blend so well, on music that's not bass heavy you can't tell they're on until you actually turn them off so you can see how much they're contributing.

It's like you have an 8", 10", 12", and 15" in the car, each playing it's most efficient frequency all the time. No EQ needed, I haven't had to boost or cut anything. Even my 12W6 had a little peak around 50hz that had to be cut. My Tempest X had to be cut heavily in the 20-50hz range.

Distortion is just about non existant and that's only good when you crank the volume because with two 15s, during normal listening you can't see the cones moving.

I played a lot of older stuff like Bad Religion, NOFX, Goldfinger, etc with a lot of quick snappy bass and they played it perfect. Each time I get used to this music it amazes me when they can play so low on rap.

I played "Put on" because it has that one 27hz low note that most systems won't play at all. That's the lowest I've heard in actual music. But where my other boxed setups wouldn't play it at all, the Tempest X would and the 12W6 when IB'd would but it ran out of excursion very quickly, these covered 27hz with ease and sounded good doing it. I only wish the subsonic filter on the MS8 would go lower. I have it as low as it will go at 20hz/6db but I swear it sounds like it interferes with 30hz and below region.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

That is SUPER intriguing. I'm thinking I may need to step my subwoofer game up. That looks rather simple to put together.

I hate cars

If I can put it together, anyone can. This is my first attempt at this and wood working has never been my strong point. One thing I learned from my two "temporary" setups as I was waiting for these subs to arrive is to build a baffle just large enough to house the subs. Don't worry about forming the baffle to fit the car's contours perfectly. It's so much easier to build the baffle to house the subs a little on the small side, mount it solidly, and then seal up the gaps. That's what I did on this one. There's about an inch on either side of the baffle which are easy to seal. Previously I spent an entire day getting the baffle to fit the car perfectly. This also introduced squeaks from the wood rubbing on the chassis.

You won't be disappointed as long as you use a suitable sub. I've heard the Image Dynamics IDQ 15s in this setup and they're awesome. You can pick them up for pennies. This is the one I heard for about 1.5 hours at the last CA Acurazine meet..

http://caraudiomag.com/articles/acura-tl-sub-install

It's so nice to have a system that will play every type of music well, go down into the subsonic range for impact and play midbass if required. Plus watt for watt, IB is very efficient. It won't win any SPL contests but that's why most use a lot of cone area.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

That's very good information to know. I would have to research, be curious to see if the audiobahns I have now would like IB...I had them in a sealed box and faced forward toward cab and it sounded like crap...

You are wayyy more into it financially than I want to delve any time soon. Then again, you already have nice cruising car and fast race car...so sound system was the next logical step! Thanks for the info and words of encouragement!