ScreaminVQ

yes, sorry guys, another vs thread

i'm looking at purchasing either a TL or a 330i pretty soon (i'm coming from a maxima). one thing i noticed about the TL is that it gets skittish over bumps while taking a turn. the bimmer seemed much more planted in almost all situations. however, the TL does handle decently...enough so that it isn't worth the extra 10K for my financial situation. my only question was, does outfitting the TL with the A-spec package get rid of some of this? and just generally, how much rougher is the ride with A-spec? can't seem to find a dealer that has one to test drive.......makes sense why not though. thanks.

EZZ

I think the previous C&D had a review on the A-spec and said that ride quality didn't diminish. If you think the A-spec is going to handle anywhere near BMW quality, think again. BMW has the BEST chassis tuning for both sport and ride quality found in the entry lux segment. A real drivers car. IMHO, $5k extra for the A-spec isn't worth it. If you are looking for a car that is good in snowy winters, then a Volvo S60R is also a great option and can be had for the same price as the TL A-spec.

VTEC=happiness

330i gets expensive when the options begin to pile on. IMO, if it was the 330 coupe, I would get it in a second. The 4 door is too pedestrian looking and there are just too many around for my taste. If you are looking for ride quality and handling and don't care about cost, 330 will win, but if you want a good alternative that is a little different and better in a lot of ways, go TL

GaleForce

TL is better.

vtec187

I'm a big fan of the TL, that's why I have one but the 330 is a better car plain and simple.It's all about the $.

GaleForce

No it isn't, thats the biggest load of BS. You pay a hell of a lot more for a hell of a lot less HP and features. The 330i blows.

VTEC=happiness

You can't really argue that the 330 is not a solid car that is also a good performer. You may get less horsepower, but the 0-60 times are not far off and the cornering and related performance is better with the BMW. Also, the build quality and ride quality are better. I love my TL, but I'm not blinded because I own one. Anything that the BMW is lacking in dumb features it makes up for in comfort, performance, and quality. I'm not saying that I would buy one (I think the 4 door versions are ugly), but try to be a little more objective here.

GaleForce

We have a BMW 525i, I am far from blinded... how can I not be objective? I like my TL better. The BMWs are bland inside and come with next to nothing, and the technology in them is nothing compared to a japanese car.

I would NEVER pay 35 grand STARTING for an empty 330i with 225 HP.

Zeuser

If BMW changes the next 3 series like they did with all the other BMWs, the lineup to get TLs will be very long indeed.

IMHO, the 3 series is the only BMW left that still looks good. As for the rest? I'll take my TL anyday. I don't drive like Michael Schumacher everyday so the whole handling/chassis thing is secondary. It's the rest of the stuff in the TL that (including quality), for me at least, makes choosing the TL over the 3 series a no-brainer.

SBTL

I have the 2004 TL 6MT with A-SPEC and having driven the car before and after A-SPEC, I believe the handling is significantly improved and the car magazines seem to agree. It still, however, has some front wheel hop when turning on bumpy roads. I don't believe that you can get away from that with FWD. Whether it is worth it depends on whether you can afford it. I believe it is. Would I rather have it be RWD or AWD? The short answer is yes. I didn't consider the 330i or A4 because of their small size. I'm 6'3" and there is no room in the back seat in those cars with me driving. I originally put a deposit on a G35 6MT but after 4 months they couldn't get me a car and I gave up and got my deposit back. In retrospect, I'm glad because aside from FWD, the TL is in every way a better quality car than the G35 with a much better interior, more features and more comfortable seats. More than a few G35 drivers have complained of leg pain related to the seat controls in the thigh bolsters. Bottom line, if you under 5'10", I'd probably go for the 330I with performance package, and that's from a TL A-SPEC driver who loves his car.

Aegir

The A-Spec package makes a dramatic difference in how the TL handles. IMO, it completely changes the personality of the car. The ride is firmer but not harsh. I can push my car very hard (it has more guts than I do) and it's a lot of fun to drive. I haven't stepped out of my car and into a 330i, so I can't make a fair direct comparison. If there is any way to test drive an A-Spec TL, I would encourage it.

Another consideration aside from performance and cost: I work in the Bay Area and every day I see more BMW's on the road than I can count. I have yet to see another A-Spec on the road.

2004MT6TL

330 is really small... it's also 1999 technology

thegre8tone

What technology are you talking about? The only thing that's considered new technology on the TL is the Bluetooth and DVD-A. Did you think that Acura just invented the VTEC for the TL? Come on...

parabolica

I visited a local BMW dealership before I got the '04 TL and they quoted me an on the road price of $67.9K (Canadian) for a 330i speced out like a TL Navi. The dealership was very friendly but one got the feeling that they are complacent in that there is a large critical mass of BMW customers out there who are willing to pay these premium prices for the performance or prestige of owning a Beemer, so ergo there is not as much impetus to be really pushy in the sales arena. I think the BMW is a lovely car but at that price, there is a very real question of whether the premium over a TL is justified.

ndabunka

BMW is scheduled to change the 3-series body next year. If you like a dated body style, less HP, smaller interior, $5K+ more $'s, etc then go for the 330i.....I guess logic just doesn't work on some...

Tecworld

Straight up handling, the 330i is probably the best in it's class. The 325i may even handle better. The TL is better in just about every other way though.

ensley696

Ok, bang for the buck definitly goes to Acura on this one. I priced a stinken BMW 330i and to get that car to similar specs as the TL, it was over $40k dollars. Would I pay $8k-$10K more for ultimate handling/rear wheel drive vs handling that is better than most fwd cars and good looks and cheaper price and reliability, hey I can keep going here, HELL NO! The German cars are nicely engineered, however, they cost an arm and leg and don't have near the reliability. Hell, I believe the American cars just recently pulled ahead of the German cars in reliability. Its all a matter of what you like and how much more your willing to pay for a car, which by no means is an investment, but a money looser. My .02

SilverCL225hp

The best entry-level luxury sport sedans are BMW 330i, Acura TL, and Infiniti G35. There are still many other choices but none can beat these big three. Among these three each of them has their own strongs and weaks. Hard to tell, just see what your taste and preference are.

2004MT6TL

The fact that the e46 BMW was designed in 1994. It's old. :thefinger

thegre8tone

Yeah, and the TL is an Accord...So what's your point? Your new Accord, err I mean TL still couldn't handle a car that's 10 years old...Thanks for playing :thefinger :thefinger

Zeuser

The Accord was redesigned last year. I think that's the point he was getting at. Newer chassis.

And if the handling is better on the 330i, does it really matter all that much? How often are you really going to go speeding around corners in everyday driving?

EZZ

The "speeding around corners" argument is so lame. A good chassis communicates confidence in ever turn you make. The TL is unruly when going over humps and high speed corners. We have to remember that FWD cars plow through corners while RWD pushes (which inspires more confidence IMO). The 330i chassis is incredible and yes, I can EASILY tell the difference between a good FWD and RWD car. The 330i just feels "better" in everyday driving from going over bumps to taking a turn. Now, does it feel $10k better? Thats for the buyer to decide

BTW, the previous accord chassis did a better job of controlling torque steer so maybe the new chassis is inferior to that of the older one

DC5_Integra

The 330 is more fun to drive.. but however with the bang for the buck.. the TL is just as good for 10k less....

2004MT6TL

While I agree that RWD rules, a person purchases (or leases) a TL because of its over-all good value. I was hooked on getting a BMW for years, but the value is not there, if you can afford it, it's great. A 3-series IMHO is not really a BMW (with exception of M3), a great car none the less, but if you cannot afford a M3 or 540i, then you shouldn't get a BMW, same goes for Mercedes, you just don't get a C-class, you get an E500 or CLK500 at minimum, etc...

Aegir

Very good point. A great chassis is fun all the time. You don't have to push the car to its limits to enjoy it. Getting back to the original question, I can attest that the A-Spec package does this for the TL. Better than the 330i? You'll have to decide for yourself. Zero regrets here, just grins!

apwalsh

Yeah yeah there's always another car 10 years older and twice as fast. What's your point?

thegre8tone

The point is we're not comparing those cars in this thread are we? They are comparing the 330 to the ASPEC TL...Read the thread before firing off your answer jack@ss...

SpringsAcura

BTW -- TL is not an Accord any more than the MDX is an Odyysey. Honda designed what is called the Global Midsize Platform (Accord). There are three sizes small (TSX & European Accord), medium (Accord) and large (TL). Look at the base specifications on the two cars. Track, length, engine are all different. One of the things I love about Acura is that unlike Lexus, there is nothing in the Acura line that exists in the Honda line.

KrgTL04

OMG...how many 330i vs. TL threads do we have now?...lol

I can't even believe these two cars are cross shopped...they are so different


If you want a groundbreaking, modern, sweet looking, luxurious, feature packed, value-minded, super-reliable, Japanese midsize car...then go for the TL

If all you care about is "image" and handling...and you can live with an overpriced, bland, unattractive, cramped, compact RWD german car that's dated and comes with less standard features than a Kia...then the the 330i is for you

SBTL

If one is tall (like me) and has a family, it is ridiculous to argue which is the better car 330i or TL. The 330i is just too small to be considered. That's why I bought the TL.

Size matters...just ask my wife!

apwalsh

I read the thread, and in the post I previously quoted, you ARE comparing a 10 year old car to the TL, jackass. Now hurry up, the short bus is leaving.

thegre8tone

Easy there sunshine, no to rain on your parade, but it's everyone on this forum that likes to compare the TL to the BMW's and Infiniti's; in truth, it should be compared to the Maxima's and ES300's...In fact, you should paint your Accord, opps TL, 'yellow', put "The Little Engine That Could" on DVD-A and pickup those people that thinks they can compare the TL to the 330 or G35 on the way to get your tranny replaced...

digital_b

thegrea8tone? you dont need the 't' and the 8 its redundant. thanks for playing. their are more bmw whores in this forum than would be believable. stop saying the bmw 330 is better than the tl because it isnt. all you can ever say is 'it handles better in the curves'. and tl owners keep saying 'its way over priced relative to the tl' and practically everything else in the category. since when is value a bad thing? the tl is quicker and faster and has more stuff for less money. and what the fuck does 'entry luxury' mean anyway. sounds like a car mag fanboy term.

1SICKLEX

Cough, the TSX is the European HONDA Accord. The RSX is the Honda Integra in Japan. The RL is the Honda Legend. The TL is only sold in America (where it is built and designed). All 30-40k cars are called entry level luxury. This is common knowledge. Well Acura avoided direct competition. Similar to the G35.
3 series and IS and C class -176 inches long
TL and G35-186 inches long
next class up
5 and GS and E-189-191 inches long

thegre8tone

A spelling lesson from a guy who named digital_b? Okay 'b'...Regardless, read the title, ASPEC vs. 330...An ASPEC model brings the price of the TL much more in line with the 330...So there goes your overpriced theory...Oh, thanks for playing 'b'...

1SICKLEX

BTW, the back of Car and Driver (the one with the CLK 55 and 645) has a real honest review of the A-spec TL. Basically they say it's your money. They won't say get it but they won't recommend it (it is a lot of money).

TLud

Aegir-

I'd love to feel how your TL A-spec drives. I put in an order for one, but never got to test drive one. If you lived somewhere in TX, I'd propose meeting up and trading rides (330Ci w/ Performance package).

digital_b

the not great one: a spec is not necessary to beat any 3 series hands down. and they only 3 series that is quicker and faster than the STOCK tl is over 50 grand. game over. lame nick.

TLud

Sorry digital_b, read the reviews: 330 with ZHP (performance package) is faster than the TL (0-60: 5.9 sec.) and it is certainly less than $50k. A-spec has nothing to do with the speed of the TL.

thegre8tone

Oh okay, now you're smoking more crack...The TL couldn't even handle a G35, let alone a 330...I know you think the TL is a 5 series, but hate to break it to ya, not even in the same class...Lame nick? That's a good one analog_c...Sorry, you're not even in the game...