Rabney

Hi, I found this forum and like the exchange and quality of info here. Maybe you experienced folks can help me out since I'm thinking of getting a 04 or 05 TL.

I've got a 95 Legend GS and, aside from a couple of rip-off repair bills, have had very good expierience with it. Overall, the TL seems like a great car and far better than the Maxima which seems more like a Buick. I have a small family (wife + 11 yr old son), like sporty driving and have given into the practicality of automatic (cell phone & voice mail usage, stop and go driving, etc.). My wife loves the 4WD SUV thing so she has the large-luggage trip car and I just need one for commuting and trips where the SUV hauling ability is not needed.

'Nuf about me, here's my questions:

NAVI: How good does the navigation system work? Does it using a DVD for the database mean the CD player won't work at the same time? How much are the d/b upgrades?

Anyone know why they discontinued On-Star?

What is "Home Link" listed in the 04 brouchure?

Those perferated seats seem like a problem. I like the Legend's solid leather seats since spils are easy to clean. My wife's cloth seats are a mess where junior sits. Mine have a couple of almost invisible blemishes - everything cleans up easy. Can the perf'd TL seats be cleaned of soada spills? Somehow I don't think so. And I've read some of the posts here on problems getting leather cleaner, especially paste, out of those small holes.

I think the rear seat posts, especially the passenger side, create a much bigger blind spot than the Legend. Do you find it a problem?

My dealer is saying he only has three 04's left but 'he can probably find what I want'. Are they thinning out? I'm in the Boston area.

The dealer told me that the 05's will show up end of September. I read the 05 posts here, sounds like nothing much if anything (other than $) is different. I'd love solid leather seats . Anything else news on the 05's?

And the big question - how to get the best $ on one?

Thanks in advance,

rich

JT3

1. The Navigation works from a DVD. The player is in the trunk, so this DVD does not take up any slots of the 6-disc changer in the dash.

2. I didn't even know Acura had On-Star. As for why they don't offer it on this car, who knows? I've heard a lot of people with this complaint.

3. Home link is a set of three "remote controls" affixed to the roof just behind the windshield. It is most commonly used as garage-door-openers, but could also control exterior (home) lighting, security systems, etc.

4. Everyone seems to be going to the perforated leather. This was an item of contention for me as well. The theory is that when you're sitting on the seat with bare legs, you'll find the seats to dissipate heat better, and thus you'll feel cooler on warm summer days, especially when the car's been sitting awhile. Personally, I think it's a personal preference, but unfortunately, you don't get a choice with this or a lot of other new cars with leather seats. It's the way of things right now, I guess.

5. You get used to the headrests in the rear. I've found the TL to be fairly devoid of blind spots. Again, this is probably a personal preference, or at least depends on your physical attributes, but I haven't had any issues with blind spots.

6. They aren't as much "thinning out" as "hard to find." Depending on your area, these babies don't stay on the dealer's lot very long. In my area, it's pretty unusual for a TL to be there more than a week or two, especially if it's an automatic. Plus, my local dealer only receives one about every two months, so from here, you almost have to order one, or have one located and shipped in. Still, they will thin out as the '05s come in, especially now that any orders placed will be for '05 models.

7. So far, the only substantial rumor I've heard is that Redondo Red Pearl will be replaced by a Ruby Red Pearl, although nobody really knows what color that will be. As an owner of a Redondo Red Pearl TL, I'm overjoyed by this, because it will make my car fairly rare. Still, I'm sure there will be some minor changes here and there, but don't count on much. They almost never change much from year one to year two, and '04 is the first year of this body style.

8. That's like asking how to get from New York to L.A. There are a million different answers. Some of the "easier" responses would be to shop around. If there are multiple dealers in your area, don't be afraid to start a bidding war among them. ("Well, THAT dealer is willing to sell me one for THIS price!") Also, be sure to check Edmunds and other such sources so that you'll know where you stand among others' pricing. Last, but certainly not least, check out the garage link on this board, that discusses what others are paying, and be sure to use this information in your negotiations. If the dealer won't go down on price, at least try to get as many goodies thrown in as possible. Once I got the dealer down as far as he was going to go, I still got him to throw in a wing spoiler. Others have gotten free oil changes, free maintenance, etc. This is a great way to stretch those dollars.

Hopefully, you'll find this information useful. I'm sure others will pipe in with even more. Bottom line: You WON'T be displeased with your decision to buy the TL. This is a fabulous car, and for the money, it's in a class of its own.

cpurick

I think they perforate the leather as a cost-cutting measure. When you build close to 100,000 cars per year, the amount of leather saved, one little perforation at a time, really adds up.

Never underestimate the power of small savings in high volume.

Ron A

How does perforating save leather, unless you take all the little perforations and glue them together to make more leather, or were you injecting humor in our sometimes prosaic atmosphere?

And the leather savings would probably be offset by having to pay that guy more to punch each of those little holes in the leather, one at a time, laboriously.

SergeyM

A word of advice: Do not expect Legend's build quality or longevity from TL.

dwcolt

This is a joke, right? Because I think it's pretty funny to think about a machine punching thousands of tiny holes in a large strip of leather and Acura somehow collecting the thousands of little punchouts and then miraculously creating another solid strip of leather. That, my friends, would be impressive.

cpurick

He probably gets paid a lot, too. He really cuts those holes in a perfect pattern.

They must really be saving a lot on the leather if they're going to such great lengths!

aGenKa

there are about 7 or 8 dealers within the boston area if you are willing to goto NH or RI to find the best price. finding a 04 should not be a problem nor a good price. i was just at acura of boston in brighton on friday, they still have a lot of 04s on their lot, i think 3 manuals too which kinda surprised me. also a sweet looking black aspec

arkk

One word....Crazy Glue.

Alan

Ron A

Sorry, that's two words

arkk

Ok....Crazyglue. Is that better? :gheywave:

PoochaKannInc

Well...crazyglue is better, but to be perfectly correct, it's "KrazyGlue"

To the original poster:
I don't think the perforated leather will be hard to clean spills from. (Of course, to avoid spills I don't allow people to drink anything but water in my car, and no eating at all. I can see how that might now work for you since you have a child). I have the ebony leather, and one of my friends spilled his soda on a part of the back seat. It cleaned out pretty well. Not sure about the other color leathers. I don't mind the perforations...but the comment about saving leather was hilarious!

Far as I knew, OnStar was only available on the RL, and from what I heard (aka wild guess at remembering what I read a year and a half ago), Acura didn't renew the deal with GM for OnStar. I think I read something of that sort in a car mag.

In terms of the blind spots, if you adjust your mirrors correctly, it is less of a problem, but it can still be aggravating, because you can't thin out the thick C pillars. Something that some ppl have done is just to take down the rear headrests. To me that is more trouble than it is worth. I just try to be as cautious as possible.

In terms of the 05 TL, sometimes the extra money you pay for the newer model can pay off in terms of less depreciation and higher resale value later on. I'm not advocating this, because I don't know the price differential or your particular situation, but I'm just throwing an idea out there. I haven't heard of any other major changes to the TL in 05, but I would advise you to check the "sticky" thread at the top of the first page for more info on the TL. That sticky is particularly dedicated to discuss the 05 TL.

Good luck!

donkeykang

???????????

92NSX

I too would like to know what makes you say this?

Jss1

The build quality of mine is already better than any other car I have owned. One trip to the dealer in 10 months for an oil change and transmission fix. The last GM car I bought was delivered with a battery that went dead the first night and it was downhill from then on with unbelievable problems.

cpurick

Compared to GM, yes. However, I would not say the TL is up to the standards of any other premium brand, except maybe Infiniti. Lexus, BMW, Audi, MB -- in my opinion these brands generally deliver a more solid-feeling, better assembled car. At least that's my perception based on the time I've spent driving them.

My '02 A4 was a far tighter and better-finished vehicle.

SergeyM

A friend of mine owned a 94 GS. I owned a 2002 TLS. Most people on this board are very yound and do not know anything about the Legend. It was one of the best build cars of its time. TL has a headliner that needs to be fixed with a scotch tape. Do I need to say more. Going to get a TL early next year anyway. It's the best value in the near-luxury class. But you get what you paid for as always.

neuronbob

Welcome to the board, rich. The only question not directly answered so far is why On-Star was discontinued after the 2003 model year. No one is quite sure, but the feature was apparently not overly used by owners. I, for one, would have used it and paid for it.

Cleaning the leather: just use Lexol cleaner (liquid sprays on) like most of us do and you'll be fine.

We won't know anything official about the 2005s for another few weeks at least. Everything else you read here is speculation based on dealers, who are a notoriously poor source of information. If you want one, and your dealer can get you a 2004 (preferably with a high VIN), don't wait, you might be able to get a better deal on year-end merch. There are many users here from the Boston and Massachusetts area, hopefully they'll chime in.

As far as reliability, if you click the "Rvw" link in my signature below, you'll see my reviews over the last few months--I have an early build TL purchased just prior to official release in October 2003. It's been a good ride so far....

donkeykang

I had a legend...*sniff...totalled...*sniff *sniff...

it was quality but i was thinking the TL would be able to compete...seeing as how most often car culture doesn't regress into more negatively built cars...meh

JetJock

I also had a Legend....sniff...sniff.."totaled".....and I miss that car, but the only thing that was actually better on that car was the quality of the paint. It had an awesome finish not matched by the new "EPA" regulations type paint all manufactures use now. As far as overall quality of the vehicle, I feel that my 04TL equals or exceeds the quality of the Legend. There are differences, of course, but the TL is quieter, more solid, and has better interior "fit and finish" than the Legend. The metalwork is much better, and it's just a better overall car. Also, I won't ever miss those Legend cupholders that rattled and spilled coffee. They must have been the worst designed cupholders in any vehicle.

smoore

My only real problem with this car is the blind spots. I have my mirrors properly adjusted (ie out wide enough to pick up cars as they pass out of the view of my interior rear view mirror). In every car I have previously owned, I really didn't need to do a shoulder check to know if anyone was beside me. With this car it is imperative to do a shoulder check because cars can sit in the blind spot created by the headrests and C pillar for a long time. I find I must be particularly attentive when merging from an on ramp that comes into the roadway at a significant angle.

Tedanddenise

Perception is everything, they say. When I read the post regarding the perferations, I assumed it saved not the leqather, but, saved $$ since they had only a single choice of material which could be ordered in bulk and another material (solid leather) wouldn't gum up the production. Isn't that the rationale of producing a car with very few options? Anyway, I have already called the factory to get a truckload of those tiny holes - they make great soil enhancer!

Pot80h

I noticed that Onstar is included on the feature list for the RL at Acura's website, so maybe it's coming back...

I'm highly suspicious of Onstar, mainly because of it's GM connections. I've had a very bad experience of GM's recovery people, and if the TL came with it, I'd ask for it to be disabled. I don't need to get telemarketing calls from GM while driving (happened to a friend of mine in her Suburban) or to be told I'm on my own when I have problems (when our Suburban started popping fuses 200 miles from home). I'll stick with AAA!

PS: Love the OnStar commercial where the lady's driving around and is being followed by a cop, a fire truck, paramedics and a tow truck. Once you realise she's driving a GM, you know she's gonna need it!

planman

I agree. At one point, we had a 1988 Legend coupe and a '92 sedan in the family. Both of those were outstanding cars (OT: I think Acura is only now recovering from killing the Legend name.). But overall quality of the '04 TL is at least as good as those were.

We'll have to wait and see if they hold up as well, of course.

planman

For me, the small rear window is more of an issue than the pillars. Takes some getting used to but no serious blind spots. My opinion...FWIW...