possible to deactivate seatbelt warning?
#41
Originally posted by TooLate
Is there a law that says cars need to have a chime?? If so, why aren't all the car companies out of business by now?
It's not like the dealer is taking the seatbelts out, they are disabling a chime.
Is there a law that says cars need to have a chime?? If so, why aren't all the car companies out of business by now?
It's not like the dealer is taking the seatbelts out, they are disabling a chime.
"I'll ask again, how can disabling a chime be a basis for a law suit?"
:lol1: :lol2: :lol1: :lol2:
You must be joking, right?
#42
Originally posted by Z Factor
There is no law to the best of my knowledge requiring a "chime" , yet every car does have some type of visual and/or audible warning or reminder.
"I'll ask again, how can disabling a chime be a basis for a law suit?"
:lol1: :lol2: :lol1: :lol2:
You must be joking, right?
There is no law to the best of my knowledge requiring a "chime" , yet every car does have some type of visual and/or audible warning or reminder.
"I'll ask again, how can disabling a chime be a basis for a law suit?"
:lol1: :lol2: :lol1: :lol2:
You must be joking, right?
So basically you are stating thangs as facts when you are 100% wrong
yet every car does have some type of visual and/or audible warning or reminder.
As for me joking, no I am not.
Maybe I should have wrote "strong basis".
I can sue you right now for posting in this thread, I really can.
But are you going to stop posting here just because I could sue you for it?
That would be pretty stupid, just like not disabling a chime in a car.
#43
Originally posted by TooLate
Actually you are quite wrong. My A8 does not have any type of visual or audible warning. My daughters 2003 Passat doesn't either. Many, many new cars don't intrude on a persons life.
So basically you are stating thangs as facts when you are 100% wrong So are you lying or just ignorant?
As for me joking, no I am not.
Maybe I should have wrote "strong basis".
I can sue you right now for posting in this thread, I really can.
But are you going to stop posting here just because I could sue you for it?
That would be pretty stupid, just like not disabling a chime in a car.
Actually you are quite wrong. My A8 does not have any type of visual or audible warning. My daughters 2003 Passat doesn't either. Many, many new cars don't intrude on a persons life.
So basically you are stating thangs as facts when you are 100% wrong So are you lying or just ignorant?
As for me joking, no I am not.
Maybe I should have wrote "strong basis".
I can sue you right now for posting in this thread, I really can.
But are you going to stop posting here just because I could sue you for it?
That would be pretty stupid, just like not disabling a chime in a car.
Now to the points you made. I am very surprised to hear that several cars you are familiar with do not have some type of reminder/warning device regarding seatbelts. Every vehicle that I've owned since the mid 80's has had either a visual and or audible reminder.
I do not personally consider a reminder to abide by the law, or to be safe an "intrusion on a persons life", anymore than a posted speed limit, or a warning sticker within the car regarding safe operation of the vehicle.
As to the lawsuit issue, while not being an attorney, I've seen enough civil trials to know that lawyers would pounce on the fact that a dealership (read deep pockets) would have purposely disabled a safety feature of the vehicle from the factory.
Keeping in mind that they also use these tactics to at least negotiate large settlements, you can be sure that the dealership would pay dearly regardless of whether or not the suit ever went to a jury. The liability insurance carrier of the dealership would also make them pay dearly as well.
I hope this has clarified my position, and will serve to resolve any questions you might have on this subject.
Have a Safe and Happy New Year
![Cheers](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/cheers.gif)
#44
Team Owner
Originally posted by TooLate
Is there a law that says cars need to have a chime??
Is there a law that says cars need to have a chime??
It's in Title 49, Chapter 301 of the United States Code.
Mike
#45
Originally posted by svtmike
Actually there is. A chime operating within the 8 seconds from the time a key is turned to the "on" or "start" positions is a Federal requirement for compliance with the Motor Vehicle Safety Standard.
It's in Title 49, Chapter 301 of the United States Code.
Mike
Actually there is. A chime operating within the 8 seconds from the time a key is turned to the "on" or "start" positions is a Federal requirement for compliance with the Motor Vehicle Safety Standard.
It's in Title 49, Chapter 301 of the United States Code.
Mike
" A motor vehicle safety standard prescribed under this chapter may
not require or allow a manufacturer to comply with the standard by
using a safety belt interlock designed to prevent starting or
operating a motor vehicle if an occupant is not using a safety belt
or a buzzer designed to indicate a safety belt is not in use,
except a buzzer that operates only during the 8-second period after
the ignition is turned to the ''start'' or ''on'' position.
"
That buzzer goes off whether the seatbelt is on or not in my car, probably also in the TL.
So fooling the computer into thinking the seatbelt is buckled will not break that law or any other law.
Next...
#46
Team Owner
So fooling the computer into thinking the seatbelt is buckled will not break that law or any other law.
Next...
Next...
Mike
#47
Originally posted by svtmike
With all due respect, that's not what you asked. You simply asked if there was a law requiring a chime, and I responded that there is.
Mike
With all due respect, that's not what you asked. You simply asked if there was a law requiring a chime, and I responded that there is.
Mike
But it still does not come into play with this situation.
Thanks again for taking the time to answer my question.
#48
Burning Brakes
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bottom line is, you should always wear your seatbelt, and for those short trips where you insist not bothering with a seatbelt (for me maybe driving the car around the court), they should be short enough that it does not bother you.
#49
Team Owner
Originally posted by TooLate
But it still does not come into play with this situation.
Thanks again for taking the time to answer my question.
But it still does not come into play with this situation.
Thanks again for taking the time to answer my question.
Mike
#50
Originally posted by RJC RSX
bottom line is, you should always wear your seatbelt, and for those short trips where you insist not bothering with a seatbelt (for me maybe driving the car around the court), they should be short enough that it does not bother you.
bottom line is, you should always wear your seatbelt, and for those short trips where you insist not bothering with a seatbelt (for me maybe driving the car around the court), they should be short enough that it does not bother you.
#52
Originally posted by svtmike
Section 30122 of Title 49 addresses whether a dealer can disable a required safety device. The language is legalese and quite convoluted, and so a bit hard to interpret, but my read is that the dealer (or any mechanic) can legally disable a starter interlock or buzzer that runs constantly, but not a buzzer that runs in the first 8 seconds.
Mike
Section 30122 of Title 49 addresses whether a dealer can disable a required safety device. The language is legalese and quite convoluted, and so a bit hard to interpret, but my read is that the dealer (or any mechanic) can legally disable a starter interlock or buzzer that runs constantly, but not a buzzer that runs in the first 8 seconds.
Mike
I'd like to make it clear that when I say "disable the chime" I am not talking about unplugging the device that makes the noise (that would be too easy), I am talking about disabling the system that makes the device make a sound when the seatbelt is unbuckled.
I find the chime in cars to be important, especially on advanced cars like the TL. It can tell you to turn your lights off or disengage your parking brake, I would never disable the chime itself.
But I would disable whatever is making the chime beep when the seatbelt is unbuckled. And since that chime goes off for the first 8 seconds whether you are wearing your seatbelt or not, it will not break the laws that you mentioned.
#53
Originally posted by RJC RSX
no, i said "bottom line", not "in my opinion" because i stated fact
no, i said "bottom line", not "in my opinion" because i stated fact
Is that true? I said "bottom line", I stated it as a fact.
NO! Of course it is not a fact, just like your first post isn't a fact.
You have no basis to conclude what should bother me or anyone else on this forum, and saying that you do is ignorance.
#54
Burning Brakes
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you are not god, therefore that is not a fact.
you should wear a seatbelt, this is a fact.
a little beeping sound for several seconds should not bother you, this is a fact.
you are a tool, this is my opinion.
you should wear a seatbelt, this is a fact.
a little beeping sound for several seconds should not bother you, this is a fact.
you are a tool, this is my opinion.
#55
Originally posted by RJC RSX
you are not god, therefore that is not a fact.
you should wear a seatbelt, this is a fact.
a little beeping sound for several seconds should not bother you, this is a fact.
you are a tool, this is my opinion.
you are not god, therefore that is not a fact.
you should wear a seatbelt, this is a fact.
a little beeping sound for several seconds should not bother you, this is a fact.
you are a tool, this is my opinion.
But you are still a little confused with this fact & opinion deal. What's a matter, did the short bus drive away without you this morning??
#57
Team Owner
Originally posted by TooLate
But I would disable whatever is making the chime beep when the seatbelt is unbuckled. And since that chime goes off for the first 8 seconds whether you are wearing your seatbelt or not, it will not break the laws that you mentioned.
But I would disable whatever is making the chime beep when the seatbelt is unbuckled. And since that chime goes off for the first 8 seconds whether you are wearing your seatbelt or not, it will not break the laws that you mentioned.
This would be a more reasonable discussion if you checked your facts before hammering away at your keyboard. Perhaps you need to get your own talk radio show, though. Your methods work well there.
Mike
#59
Originally posted by svtmike
The chime stops when the belt is fastened, and doesn't sound at all if the seat belt is already fastened when the key is turned on. So disabling the 8-second seatbelt warning buzzer would break that law, regardless of the buzzer's use for other warning conditions.
This would be a more reasonable discussion if you checked your facts before hammering away at your keyboard. Perhaps you need to get your own talk radio show, though. Your methods work well there.
Mike
The chime stops when the belt is fastened, and doesn't sound at all if the seat belt is already fastened when the key is turned on. So disabling the 8-second seatbelt warning buzzer would break that law, regardless of the buzzer's use for other warning conditions.
This would be a more reasonable discussion if you checked your facts before hammering away at your keyboard. Perhaps you need to get your own talk radio show, though. Your methods work well there.
Mike
Originally posted by TooLate
[B]That buzzer goes off whether the seatbelt is on or not in my car, probably also in the TL.
[B]That buzzer goes off whether the seatbelt is on or not in my car, probably also in the TL.
I also did not include the "probably" in the second post that I mentioned it (I figured you would remember, I was wrong).
So now you are right, 100% correct in that it would be against the law for the dealer to do that. I have no problem admitting that I am wrong (but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
As for the radio show, I'm up for it!
#60
Originally posted by RJC RSX
yeah, understanding facts is always a good thing
yeah, understanding facts is always a good thing
![Wink](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif)
Should I be comfortable in my current chair? You seem to be the only person allowed to make that decision for all of us.
#61
Burning Brakes
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Originally posted by TooLate
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
#62
Originally posted by RJC RSX
This is like people asking how to roll back their odometers. On Club RSX, this thread would be locked by now.
This is like people asking how to roll back their odometers. On Club RSX, this thread would be locked by now.
Any laws stated in this thread are referring to the manufacturer, not the owner.
As I stated before, you can legally take the seatbelts and airbags and roof off your car if you so desire, maybe your intentions are to use it on the track? Whatever.
He can legally disable the chime so he is not asking about illegal activities.
#63
Originally posted by TooLate
Actually you are quite wrong. My A8 does not have any type of visual or audible warning. My daughters 2003 Passat doesn't either. Many, many new cars don't intrude on a persons life.
So basically you are stating thangs as facts when you are 100% wrong So are you lying or just ignorant?
Actually you are quite wrong. My A8 does not have any type of visual or audible warning. My daughters 2003 Passat doesn't either. Many, many new cars don't intrude on a persons life.
So basically you are stating thangs as facts when you are 100% wrong So are you lying or just ignorant?
I myself was puzzled by your comment about the lack of devices in your A8, and found this regarding it.
http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2...f/03-26872.pdf
Also, read Standard #208, and it will give you some more insight.
Based on reading other documents as well, it would seem that visual/audible warnings are considered safety features that the NHTSA has established for cars to be driven in America.
#64
Burning Brakes
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i did say potential liability. the point is, it's questionable legally, and if there's any question at all, it would be wise from a owner's perspective to not permit these discussions. in other words, our "harping" is justified. then again, i wouldn't want to interfer with darwin...
#65
Moderator Alumnus
Originally posted by TooLate
Here is what I originally said:Notice the "probably" meaning that I didn't check the TL yet.
I also did not include the "probably" in the second post that I mentioned it (I figured you would remember, I was wrong).
So now you are right, 100% correct in that it would be against the law for the dealer to do that. I have no problem admitting that I am wrong (but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
As for the radio show, I'm up for it!
Here is what I originally said:Notice the "probably" meaning that I didn't check the TL yet.
I also did not include the "probably" in the second post that I mentioned it (I figured you would remember, I was wrong).
So now you are right, 100% correct in that it would be against the law for the dealer to do that. I have no problem admitting that I am wrong (but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
As for the radio show, I'm up for it!
I really hope you can find a way to let the system chime 8 second in the beginning, then make itself disable afterwards. As well as your vehicle still understands you're not fastening the seatbelt(just disable the chime only), so the airbags won't give your the false inflation.
I agree ppl's opinions, always buckle-up, it's the natural response ppl should have. We cannot force you to use it, it's your right to do whatever you prefer to doing. It's free country to you.
![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Happy New Year.
#66
Team Owner
Originally posted by TooLate
(but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
(but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
Mike
#67
Team Owner
Originally posted by TooLate
I also did not include the "probably" in the second post that I mentioned it (I figured you would remember, I was wrong).
So now you are right, 100% correct in that it would be against the law for the dealer to do that. I have no problem admitting that I am wrong (but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
As for the radio show, I'm up for it!
I also did not include the "probably" in the second post that I mentioned it (I figured you would remember, I was wrong).
So now you are right, 100% correct in that it would be against the law for the dealer to do that. I have no problem admitting that I am wrong (but I wouldn't mind other people saying that the original 8 second entry chime goes off when the seatbelt is buckled as well for back-up).
But that still leaves us in a thread full of people on soapboxes and high horses telling the thread start in their high and mighty vioces that he shouldn't do something, instead of just answering the simple question that he asked.
As for the radio show, I'm up for it!
It is legal for him to disable the devices himself, that is true. And it would be legal for the dealer to do it under certain circumstances (like preparing a vehicle for off-road racing). For anyone to actually give advice, though, well, people have been sued and lost for far less foolish things in this country. I personally wouldn't provide the info even if I knew, but that's just me being selfish.
I have no soapbox or high horse to get on with this topic, although I put my belt on every time I get in the car, whether I'm going two doors down or across the state; it's just habit now, and I think a good habit.
Everyone have a safe and happy new year. Don't drink and drive, and watch out for those who might.
Mike
#68
TL hacker
This is strange for a TL but understandable in other cars. I disabled the seatbelt warning light and chime in my '93 del sol when I went racing (autocrossing). The reason is that I had a 4 point harness which was legal for auto-xing but not for street use. So I had to switch back and forth between the factory seatbelt and racing harness.
Part of my race prep was to disable the seatbelt warning and the way it was done in my del sol is to go under the seat and unplug the wire.
I'm pretty sure this isn't the same in a TL because of the electric seat but but it should give you some ideas. hint hint... find the electrical diagrams for the TL.
Still, why would you want a 4 point in a TL?
Part of my race prep was to disable the seatbelt warning and the way it was done in my del sol is to go under the seat and unplug the wire.
I'm pretty sure this isn't the same in a TL because of the electric seat but but it should give you some ideas. hint hint... find the electrical diagrams for the TL.
Still, why would you want a 4 point in a TL?
#69
Racer
What is annoying about the seatbelt chime is that it doesn't come on until you are in motion. It is NOT safe to put on a seatbelt while you are driving.
The chime should come on as soon as the car is in gear and turn off when the car is in motion to avoid distracting the driver.
The chime should come on as soon as the car is in gear and turn off when the car is in motion to avoid distracting the driver.
#70
ZHP 4CE
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I had a Ford rent car a year ago, and the damn thing would beep at me for not having my seatbelt on when the car was in park (not sure if Fords still have this feature). Now that pissed me off. Between the annoyance of that buzzer and the remote possibility of someone crashing into me while parked in a lot, I'll take my chances on the kamikaze driver.
I have to admit that when I'm wearing a suit and I make the three minute drive from my office to the courthouse or to lunch, I'd rather not wear the seatbelt. I don't have my TL yet, but having something beeping would actually force me to wear my seatbelt all the time, which in my opinion is a good thing.
Studies suggest that most accidents happen on the short trips, where people are less likely to wear their seatbelts. My gf is also an attorney, who works for a firm handling auto insurance cases. Her personal experiences, although not scientific, seem to support such studies. So, even though my current car doesn't come equipped with a reminder chime, I usually have one in the passenger seat.
I have to admit that when I'm wearing a suit and I make the three minute drive from my office to the courthouse or to lunch, I'd rather not wear the seatbelt. I don't have my TL yet, but having something beeping would actually force me to wear my seatbelt all the time, which in my opinion is a good thing.
Studies suggest that most accidents happen on the short trips, where people are less likely to wear their seatbelts. My gf is also an attorney, who works for a firm handling auto insurance cases. Her personal experiences, although not scientific, seem to support such studies. So, even though my current car doesn't come equipped with a reminder chime, I usually have one in the passenger seat.
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#71
Originally Posted by TooLate
Wearing your seltbelt is smart, but someone taking a 7 minute ride to the store at 25MPH on backroads isn't an idiot because they didn't buckle-up. And if you still say he is you must be more of an idoit for not realizing that some action or activity you do is more dangerous than riding without a seat belt.
but what about that drunk driver in the dark with his lights off who T-bones you when he is going 40+. youll wish you had your seatbelt on then.
![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
4 friends got T-boned by a car with their lights off last year. 3 of them had their seatbelts on, 1 didnt... guess who had to go to the hospital?
they were also like 2 minutes from work and just went to get something to eat.
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