Possible auto to manual swap
#1
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Possible auto to manual swap
I was a bit hesitant on making this thread because responses seem to always be "sell the auto and buy a manual". It's cheaper and easier, sure. But my local junkyard has a rare gem right now. A 2004 Accord V6 with a 6 speed manual transmission. Me and my friend plan on pulling it this Saturday, if it hasn't been touched yet. Junkyard prices a transmission for only $100, and other bits and bobs are about $7-$10 bucks. I'm probably looking at $200 total for everything. It's a no brainer of a deal.
I'm not sure if I'll be swapping it in the TL though, but it's a win-win situation of I do or if I don't. If I do, I can pass most of the knowledge onto my CL when I inevitably convert it. If I don't, I can sell it and use the money to fund a manual transmission for my CL. The thing holding me back is that when I convert the CL, then my CL, my girl's CL, and then TL will all be manuals. Maybe not a problem to some, but what if me or my girl just want to cruise around in an automatic? The CL is my race car, TL is a daily driver that we can relax in. It'll be modded, but not nearly as much as the CL is. Either way, that transmission is coming out of the junkyard with me (I hope).
The junkyard has the cars sitting on makeshift stands using old wheels. One is standing up, the other lying on it's side, welded together. There's not enough room to pull the motor out from underneath, the transmission might. But I have no way to hold the motor in place to just drop the subframe and pull the transmission out. So out the top it'll be coming. I've already read what I need to do to make it possible; not too difficult it seems. Much easier than pulling a J35A3 out the top of an MDX I'd imagine.
I have been reading threads on the conversion, and have a parts list. I copy pasted this from another thread:
- tranny
- clutch
- flywheel
- flywheel bolts
- ecu
- engine harness
- engine to ecu harness
- master cylinder- slave cylinder- clutch lines
- clutch pedal
- brake pedal
- shift cables
- shift lever + accessories
- clutch reservoir
- tranny mounts
- Speedo cluster
- starter
However, most threads seem to be converting from a TL to a TL. So I'm wanting to know what all is compitable from the Accord to the TL?
- Is the ECU from the Accord able to be used on the TL? How about the gauge cluster and interior bits for the shifter? I know I can use the auto's cluster for the time being, but if I can use the Accord's, why not take it?
- The axles; there seems to be mixed messages. Can I use the auto's axles on the TL, or do I need the axles from the Accord? If they're not needed, is it possible to remove the transmission without disconnecting the axles from the wheel hub?
- Are the pedals compatible from the Accord onto the TL? Don't see why they wouldn't be, but just making sure.
I'll still be lurking threads and doing more research even after posting this, but any information from pulling out the transmission from the top to parts needed, to even posting threads, is greatly appreciated. If I do go through with the swap, I'll be using this thread has a progress/build thread, and if I successfully do it, it'll be open for anyone to ask questions to help out others.
I'm not sure if I'll be swapping it in the TL though, but it's a win-win situation of I do or if I don't. If I do, I can pass most of the knowledge onto my CL when I inevitably convert it. If I don't, I can sell it and use the money to fund a manual transmission for my CL. The thing holding me back is that when I convert the CL, then my CL, my girl's CL, and then TL will all be manuals. Maybe not a problem to some, but what if me or my girl just want to cruise around in an automatic? The CL is my race car, TL is a daily driver that we can relax in. It'll be modded, but not nearly as much as the CL is. Either way, that transmission is coming out of the junkyard with me (I hope).
The junkyard has the cars sitting on makeshift stands using old wheels. One is standing up, the other lying on it's side, welded together. There's not enough room to pull the motor out from underneath, the transmission might. But I have no way to hold the motor in place to just drop the subframe and pull the transmission out. So out the top it'll be coming. I've already read what I need to do to make it possible; not too difficult it seems. Much easier than pulling a J35A3 out the top of an MDX I'd imagine.
I have been reading threads on the conversion, and have a parts list. I copy pasted this from another thread:
- tranny
- clutch
- flywheel
- flywheel bolts
- ecu
- engine harness
- engine to ecu harness
- master cylinder- slave cylinder- clutch lines
- clutch pedal
- brake pedal
- shift cables
- shift lever + accessories
- clutch reservoir
- tranny mounts
- Speedo cluster
- starter
However, most threads seem to be converting from a TL to a TL. So I'm wanting to know what all is compitable from the Accord to the TL?
- Is the ECU from the Accord able to be used on the TL? How about the gauge cluster and interior bits for the shifter? I know I can use the auto's cluster for the time being, but if I can use the Accord's, why not take it?
- The axles; there seems to be mixed messages. Can I use the auto's axles on the TL, or do I need the axles from the Accord? If they're not needed, is it possible to remove the transmission without disconnecting the axles from the wheel hub?
- Are the pedals compatible from the Accord onto the TL? Don't see why they wouldn't be, but just making sure.
I'll still be lurking threads and doing more research even after posting this, but any information from pulling out the transmission from the top to parts needed, to even posting threads, is greatly appreciated. If I do go through with the swap, I'll be using this thread has a progress/build thread, and if I successfully do it, it'll be open for anyone to ask questions to help out others.
Last edited by Thefireball; 05-18-2022 at 05:16 PM.
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Acura TL Builder (05-18-2022)
#2
Safety Car
I like your mindset. "Even if I dont use these parts, Ill have the knowledge that I can pass onto my CL, A Win-Win".
I'm not sure about all the parts you need to make this conversion, but the "to-pull" list you currently have should get you most of the way there. make sure you also get the cluster, it may not fit, but they sell for more than the autos and you dont want the automatic column bar when you use a stick after the swap.
Get the metal chassis bracket that holds the top part of the clutch pedal, as the autos in the TL are missing this. It looks like a "V" and the clutch pedal connects to it with one bolt and the V connects tohe chassis via two 12mm bolts.
The manuals on the Acura TL have stiffer sway bars than those of the Autos. perhaps this is also true for the Accord.
I'm not sure about all the parts you need to make this conversion, but the "to-pull" list you currently have should get you most of the way there. make sure you also get the cluster, it may not fit, but they sell for more than the autos and you dont want the automatic column bar when you use a stick after the swap.
Get the metal chassis bracket that holds the top part of the clutch pedal, as the autos in the TL are missing this. It looks like a "V" and the clutch pedal connects to it with one bolt and the V connects tohe chassis via two 12mm bolts.
The manuals on the Acura TL have stiffer sway bars than those of the Autos. perhaps this is also true for the Accord.
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Thefireball (05-18-2022)
#3
Senior Moderator
Accord trans does not have an Limited slip diff so you are loosing a performance aspect there.
Can't use the interior bits such as gauge cluster and I believe shifter box, but you should get the ECU, immobilizer, engine and trans pedals and other bits are good to grab too. Any Honda parts are fairly good to have on hand so I'd take whatever you can grab!
I get what you are saying about the subframe and removal, I'd honestly use one of the large hoists that they have there with a few straps around the engine and trans mount areas. Take an impact to the subframe bolts and the rest and let the tension on the hoist. You should be able to wiggle it out the whole shebang from under the car bring a friend to help . LKQ by me is the same way with the wheels holding cars up.
remember, you can bring a sawzall with you and make some cuts/access areas in the body to make removal way easier. NO one is going to be salvaging a frame rail! I'd take off the fenders and then start chomping away with a sawzall to make it easy.
Can't use the interior bits such as gauge cluster and I believe shifter box, but you should get the ECU, immobilizer, engine and trans pedals and other bits are good to grab too. Any Honda parts are fairly good to have on hand so I'd take whatever you can grab!
I get what you are saying about the subframe and removal, I'd honestly use one of the large hoists that they have there with a few straps around the engine and trans mount areas. Take an impact to the subframe bolts and the rest and let the tension on the hoist. You should be able to wiggle it out the whole shebang from under the car bring a friend to help . LKQ by me is the same way with the wheels holding cars up.
remember, you can bring a sawzall with you and make some cuts/access areas in the body to make removal way easier. NO one is going to be salvaging a frame rail! I'd take off the fenders and then start chomping away with a sawzall to make it easy.
Last edited by csmeance; 05-18-2022 at 07:22 PM.
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Thefireball (05-18-2022)
#4
Senior Moderator
hoist example:
#5
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Me and my friends know all about those hoists. They just love to turn when going straight.
We could drop the engine and trans connected together , but trying to disconnecting it with it on the ground would be difficult. Then there's also the other aspect and of the hoist holding the trans/engine while being underneath it. God forbid the strap breaks, then I'm dead. Already had a strap break when pulling out the J35A3 last time. Wasn't too bad, and it's kicking ass in my CL currently. I'll take my chances with the pulling it out the top.
Though, now that I think about it, I guess I'm going to be underneath it anyways when I disconnect the subframe. I'll figure it out when I'm doing it.
Also not worried about the LSD. I care more so about that on the CL than the TL. I just want a manual damn it!
We could drop the engine and trans connected together , but trying to disconnecting it with it on the ground would be difficult. Then there's also the other aspect and of the hoist holding the trans/engine while being underneath it. God forbid the strap breaks, then I'm dead. Already had a strap break when pulling out the J35A3 last time. Wasn't too bad, and it's kicking ass in my CL currently. I'll take my chances with the pulling it out the top.
Though, now that I think about it, I guess I'm going to be underneath it anyways when I disconnect the subframe. I'll figure it out when I'm doing it.
Also not worried about the LSD. I care more so about that on the CL than the TL. I just want a manual damn it!
#6
Safety Car
Me and my friends know all about those hoists. They just love to turn when going straight.
We could drop the engine and trans connected together , but trying to disconnecting it with it on the ground would be difficult. Then there's also the other aspect and of the hoist holding the trans/engine while being underneath it. God forbid the strap breaks, then I'm dead. Already had a strap break when pulling out the J35A3 last time. Wasn't too bad, and it's kicking ass in my CL currently. I'll take my chances with the pulling it out the top.
Though, now that I think about it, I guess I'm going to be underneath it anyways when I disconnect the subframe. I'll figure it out when I'm doing it.
Also not worried about the LSD. I care more so about that on the CL than the TL. I just want a manual damn it!
We could drop the engine and trans connected together , but trying to disconnecting it with it on the ground would be difficult. Then there's also the other aspect and of the hoist holding the trans/engine while being underneath it. God forbid the strap breaks, then I'm dead. Already had a strap break when pulling out the J35A3 last time. Wasn't too bad, and it's kicking ass in my CL currently. I'll take my chances with the pulling it out the top.
Though, now that I think about it, I guess I'm going to be underneath it anyways when I disconnect the subframe. I'll figure it out when I'm doing it.
Also not worried about the LSD. I care more so about that on the CL than the TL. I just want a manual damn it!
#7
I am dumb
Thread Starter
I'll go ahead and throw this out there since I won't be going until Saturday, but if y'all need anything from the yard, I don't mind taking a look if I have time.
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#9
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Express pull n save in LaVergne is where I go to. There were 3 or 4 3G TLs last weekend. I pulled 2 field coils from two of them so I can fix the AC Compressor clutch not engaging. Already checked both fuses and jump the One under the hood; no go.
One of them also had 2 'borghini' wheels on them, but some one took them the next weekend I went. Funny name. No Type S cars though.
Also, if you're in my neck of the woods and see this post, please don't take the transmission before I can. I need this . But I could always use a hand if some one wants to come.
One of them also had 2 'borghini' wheels on them, but some one took them the next weekend I went. Funny name. No Type S cars though.
Also, if you're in my neck of the woods and see this post, please don't take the transmission before I can. I need this . But I could always use a hand if some one wants to come.
#10
Safety Car
Express pull n save in LaVergne is where I go to. There were 3 or 4 3G TLs last weekend. I pulled 2 field coils from two of them so I can fix the AC Compressor clutch not engaging. Already checked both fuses and jump the One under the hood; no go.
One of them also had 2 'borghini' wheels on them, but some one took them the next weekend I went. Funny name. No Type S cars though.
Also, if you're in my neck of the woods and see this post, please don't take the transmission before I can. I need this . But I could always use a hand if some one wants to come.
One of them also had 2 'borghini' wheels on them, but some one took them the next weekend I went. Funny name. No Type S cars though.
Also, if you're in my neck of the woods and see this post, please don't take the transmission before I can. I need this . But I could always use a hand if some one wants to come.
Most of the time, I wont post something I'm looking to buy until after I bought it, just so no one snatches it from under me. If someone is bidding on an item on Ebay, I wait until 5 seconds to closing to begin bidding.
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Thefireball (05-18-2022)
#11
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B140807 (car-part.com)
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B90576 (car-part.com)
#12
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Acura TL Builder, I understand that you have many projects on your plate; however, if you are up to making a quick buck, perhaps the transmissions on these two CL-S6's are still 'harvestable' in your neck of the woods? These came up when I did a quick search for MT engines.
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B140807 (car-part.com)
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B90576 (car-part.com)
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B140807 (car-part.com)
2003 Acura CL Engine Assembly-Stock# B90576 (car-part.com)
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Acura TL Builder (05-18-2022)
#13
Safety Car
Always looking to make extra money!
That first one needs to be saved and repaired! 90k miles and in immaculate condition! Second one may be more tricky to get to. what do these trannys usually run?
I did a quick search of ebay with no results(but you know how my searches go).
You werent kidding Zeta, these are literally up the street from me. Ill call them tomorrow to see if they are still available.
That first one needs to be saved and repaired! 90k miles and in immaculate condition! Second one may be more tricky to get to. what do these trannys usually run?
I did a quick search of ebay with no results(but you know how my searches go).
You werent kidding Zeta, these are literally up the street from me. Ill call them tomorrow to see if they are still available.
Last edited by Acura TL Builder; 05-18-2022 at 09:42 PM.
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Thefireball (05-18-2022)
#14
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
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#21
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Speaking of transmissions, I wasn't aware the 6 speed in the non Type S 3G TLs would work in the CLs. Gives me more options to look at, but is there any differences in the gearing? I want all the power and speed I can get, so if the CL-S 6 Speed is better, I'll just stick to that.
Kind of tempted to put this accord trans in the CL though, but I do want that LSD.
Kind of tempted to put this accord trans in the CL though, but I do want that LSD.
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Thefireball (05-19-2022)
#23
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Speaking of transmissions, I wasn't aware the 6 speed in the non Type S 3G TLs would work in the CLs. Gives me more options to look at, but is there any differences in the gearing? I want all the power and speed I can get, so if the CL-S 6 Speed is better, I'll just stick to that.
Kind of tempted to put this accord trans in the CL though, but I do want that LSD.
Kind of tempted to put this accord trans in the CL though, but I do want that LSD.
06TLMT
03CLMT
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Thefireball (05-19-2022)
#25
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
^
Theoretically,
Since the 04-06 3G MT was derived from the previous 2G CL-S6 tranny, I believe the 'guts' are pretty much the same between the two as well.
Theoretically,
Since the 04-06 3G MT was derived from the previous 2G CL-S6 tranny, I believe the 'guts' are pretty much the same between the two as well.
Well, here are the pics of a 03 CL-S 6spd....
Sorry, but the only differences I can see between this and the 04-06 TL-S 6spd are the additional crank sensor in pic 1 and the shift linkage attachement point on the large select lever in the last pic , if you look you will see another hole in the arm, this is where the attachment pin would go for a 3rd gen TL or 7th gen AV6. Both tranny shafts are just as hollow as the 3rd gen TL and the gears, ect do not seem to be of any better materials or hardening.
Sorry, but the only differences I can see between this and the 04-06 TL-S 6spd are the additional crank sensor in pic 1 and the shift linkage attachement point on the large select lever in the last pic , if you look you will see another hole in the arm, this is where the attachment pin would go for a 3rd gen TL or 7th gen AV6. Both tranny shafts are just as hollow as the 3rd gen TL and the gears, ect do not seem to be of any better materials or hardening.
Last edited by zeta; 05-19-2022 at 09:59 PM.
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Acura TL Builder (05-19-2022)
#26
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Also I said I wouldn't get into a race, but a 3G TL with what sounded like a resonator delete pulled up next to me on the highway. I couldn't resist, especially since it sounded like they revved their engine at me. Was behind them, and they started pulling away, but I threw it in 3rd and caught right up to them. There was an opening to merge over, so I did so, and just floored it, hoping they'd chase. Not sure if they tried at all, but by the time I looked at them and then my speed, I was already at 120mph.
Man the CL is so much fun. I'm starting to get the bug to modify the TL now. I'm getting the motivation to swap this 6 speed in. I want to do it NOW.
#27
I am dumb
Thread Starter
After a couple days of anxiety, the transmission is still here. Already got the IM off, and pretty much all of the wiring harness disconnected. Friend will be here soon to help out. Just taking a break out of the sun for right now. Didn't bring enough water.
There's also a CL-S here. Took one camshaft already, plan to get the other. Girl also wants the trunk lid & windshield, and an user on here wants the fog/indicator lights. So much to do. Junkyard is like an adult playground for me.
There's also a CL-S here. Took one camshaft already, plan to get the other. Girl also wants the trunk lid & windshield, and an user on here wants the fog/indicator lights. So much to do. Junkyard is like an adult playground for me.
#28
I am dumb
Thread Starter
I need help ASAP. I can't get the transmission off the motor. All of the bolts on the bell housing are off, and it's broken free of the motor. But something inside is holding it on. I don't see screws under the dust cover that I need to remove like I do on the autos. What am I missing?
#29
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Nevermind, some one helped me get it off. Didn't speak English, but thankfully my girl speaks Spanish. Now to get the pedals.
Also, axles might be fucked. I'll take them anyways.
Also, axles might be fucked. I'll take them anyways.
#30
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Transmission is safe and secured in my garage. I got almost everything, but I'll need to order some stuff. The heat got to us and we started getting frustrated. I didn't grab the ECU because it wasn't needed as I'll be ordering an 07-08 for tuning. Didn't grab the brake pedal, and I'm not sure if I needed the wiring under the dash of the car. If I did, I'll order all of that.
I got the entire wiring harness that was underneath the hood attached to the engine and transmission. I'll figure out what I'm missing when putting it into the car, and just order them as I go. Hoping the axles will be alright though. But I also hope I can just use the TL's because they were a pain to deal with.
Won't be attempting to put it in for awhile. But damn, that sucked.
#31
Burning Brakes
Nice haul, hardly look at the 3G section since I sold mine.
Don't you also need the subframe and mounts from the manual?
Don't you also need the subframe and mounts from the manual?
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Thefireball (05-21-2022)
#32
I am dumb
Thread Starter
#33
I am dumb
Thread Starter
I should have mentioned that you don't need the manual subframe. I got the MT transmission mounts. I think one of the lower ones was bad; torn off. The top transmission mount was definitely bad though. It was torn when it was on, came apart in two when it was off. My friend threw one at my nuts, that's how I know.
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Slpr04UA6 (05-22-2022)
#35
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Also, I have no clue why it was stuck. This older skinny Hispanic guy just grabbed the transmission, lifted up the entire thing until it was standing up, and just manhandled the transmission until it came off. Picked up like 600lbs like it was nothing. Gave him money for the trouble. Couldn't get the clutch and flywheel off either. Figured I should buy a new one anyways.
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Acura TL Builder (05-22-2022)
#36
-------Tim-------
I believe there was a one less mount for the manual subframe. Automatic has one more, if I remember reading correctly. I also believe you can use the AT subframe, just missing a mount (which shouldn’t be a problem). Don’t quote me on this..🤣
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#39
Burning Brakes
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#40
I am dumb
Thread Starter
Who knew a transmission would be harder than removing & installing a motor.
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