octl

I've read the posts in the forum about the Octane debates, and there was a lot of very interesting information there.

Although I do not mean to spark any further debate, I could not find a simple answer I was looking for (just an honest and well informed, YES or NO would be most helpful!):

Will I destroy my engine if I use 87 Octane on my 3G TL?

Ron A

No, but your performance will suffer. I am not sure your mileage will suffer, though, because there are varied reports here on that, and the couple of times I tried regular gas (notably after Katrina when that was all that was available) my mileage remained the same as always.

If you drive reasonably and never get the tach up into the upper limits, you might not even notice it.

But then there is the other school of thought, which says that even though you have knock sensors to detect the knock and therefore retard the spark, think of this. If it is detecting a knock, that means there is a knock to detect, and knocks do not do your engine any good. Something to think about!

crzydrifter

i was wondering regarding the gas question, is it me or does it seem like the first half of a ful tank go down faster then the last half?

jupitersolo

^^I wouldn't say it goes down faster, it's just the way the needle reads. Even when the MID says ?? to empty many have stated to drive far then told. I think it then same way as my other cars.

I think it has something to with the level indicator in the tank. It does allow the full movement for the indicator to travel to the top of the inside of the tank and will sit in the middle of the tank longer.

Jetmaker

Why the debate? The difference in cost of a tank of gas between premium and regular is less than 2 bucks. Why would you risk it?

Here's an interesting observation: I have used mainly Shell and Safeway gas in my TL. I have consistently noted an average MPG of 21 with the Shell and 19 with the Safeway (I drive mainly in-city). Anybody else notice such differences between brands? And, since the Safeway fuel seems to burn inefficiently, it seems to me it is probably not as good for the engine as the Shell. For the same logic as above I have decided not to put the poorer quality Safeway fuel into my car any more.

leedogg

your computer will retard the engine so you can use the lower octane.

octl

THanks a lot for the responses guys. I feel pretty confident about not having to use the premium gas... The performance is not so important for me, and I probably wouldn't notice... my days of crazy driving ended several years ago

Well, $2-$3 per fill-up is not a lot, but it's not the "snowflake" its the "avalanche." Time and repetition is always the killer. I've done the math, and between cars that require premium gas, and our driving mileage over the last 10 years... switching from Premium to Regular Unleaded saves me about $700 per year -- that's not $2-$3 anymore - that's the way I seez it

leedogg

Its not about performance. Its about efficiency. Your car will run most efficiently at the octane spec'd for it. Its like trying to use a cruder oil because its cheaper.

Make sure your calculations measure the difference in actual gas usage & mileage, because you will get worse.

lights

iTrader: (1)

He just answered ur question and my answer there for you.

meburdick

In the NorthEast, at least, the average difference in cost between Regular and Premium unleaded fuels seems to be right around $0.32/gallon. Assuming a 15 gallon "complete" fill, the difference in cost is actually much closer to $5 per tankfull.

I have always found that, for my driving style, it costs me less money to use the higher octane fuel. With the lower octane stuff, I tend to have my foot in it more because the car degrades performance with the lower octane (I don't drive like a maniac, I just want my car to move when I tell it to).

CobraGuy

I guess I just don't understand paying this much for a car then cheaping out on the gas to run it. Makes absolutely no sense to me. If you want to risk detonation on a high compression engine, then by all means by the cheap gas. The ECM can only pull so much timing when it detects detonation, so you are putting a lot of faith in what you hope the factory made dummy proof....

JohnDoe2

It's just you.


(However an argument could be made that your mileage may get better as the gas is consumed and the car has less weight to carry)

Ernie Golfs

When you bought the TL you knew up front it used premium fuel. I don't understand why folks buy a car they either can't afford to put the proper fuel in or are just to cheap to do what is required. I wouldn't put anything but premium in my TL or my RL. It isn't worth the 3 to 4 dollars I might save per tank.

I've read several threads on this subject and Im getting tired of them. Why don't you just put in ten gallons at a time and save the weight of a full tank, that will give you better milage. If you want to save on gas you should have bought a Civic. Oh, you could skip changing the oil, just reset the info screen that'll save a few bucks!

OK, I'm about finished venting. If you're leasing the car, put whatever crap you want in it. If you're buying, remember the old saying, PAY ME NOW OR PAY ME LATER.

coykiam

another gas debate ? wasnt there a thread like this a couple months ago ?

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

If you bought the car and intend on ever selling it, I hope you inform the buyer that you used lower octane fuel.

octl

I suppose the question should be:

Has there ever been any evidence of a 3.2L Acura TL ever destroyed due to use of Regular Unleaded Fuel?

crazymjb

Think of it this way, evertime your engine detects or you hear a ping, the piston is shuddering and wacking into the cylinder walls. You can figure out what that can do, especially to an aluminum block.

You spent 33-36K on the car, give it it's premium. They through an 11:1 compression ration in that engine, not an 8.5:1 compression ration, put premium in it.



Mike

octl

Thanks Mike.... so, even with knock sensors, there is a high risk of this happening?

leedogg

Thats like asking, if you carefully play with fire a couple hrs every day, is there a high risk of getting burned or setting something on fire?

depends on the quality of gas, the age of the gas, the capabilities of your computer to adjust itself constantly. I've gotta think that this sensor can only determine after the fact, meaning it treats it like 91 until it detects the early detonation.

Maybe if you stick with the more reputable gas stations that keep their gas fresh, you can get away with it. But of course they usually have higher prices anyway. I'm sure all it would take would be one bad batch of gas at the lower grade that has water in it or is older than usual and you'll get knocks.

SouthernBoy

The cylinders aren't aluminum. There's an iron sleeve pressed into each cylinder.

However, I completely agree with your premise. Buy a car that recommends premium fuel? Use premium fuel. It's that simple.

ayethetiense

you guys are funny.... my wife drives a legend and she puts the higher octane in it and she can use the lower octane. she insists on putting the higher octane in it even though we've put the lower stuff for a long time with no problems at all. sow hike you guys argue about being able to go lower, my wife is putting the higher stuff in hers.

if it says to put premium, just put premium. all you gotta do is get one less cup of coffee at starbucks for each fill up you do. and honestly, there are studies out there that show that if you put a lower octane gas then what you are supposed to, the engine uses more gas to compensate and/or you lose performance.

Ken1997TL

In a Legend's engine, premium is a must. My '97 TL has the same motor, regular fuel will starve its power AND kill fuel economy. Its CHEAPER to run premium, its that big of a difference.

ayethetiense

she gets the exact same mileage. hers is a 94

Ken1997TL

Depends on the driving conditions too. But I do a consistent 275 mile route. 75 mph with the A/C set at 75 degrees. 32 psi front and rear tires.

I'll get 30 mpg with premium. And around 26 with regular. Tried it several times just to be sure and its very consistent.

black label

Short term, no. Long term, yes. The ECU will make adjustments so the vehicle can operate on regular fuel. This is for occasional use, there are parts of the midwest (Montana comes to mind) where regular is 84 octaneand premium is 89. The ECU was designed so if you are driving through an area like this you can fill up and continue your trip.

The engine was designed to run on 91 octane or better and long term use of lower octane will slowly damage the engine.

The rule of thumb for normally aspirated engines (non turbo) is if you compression ratio is higher than 10:1 you need premium, if it lower than 10:1 you use regular.
Turbo charged engine need very specific air to fuel ratios and are much more finicky, therefore, regardless of there compression ratio you need premium.

The question is are you in the TL for the long term or do you turn your cars over every few years. If you are getting out of the car in 3 years it doesn't matter much to you, it will matter to the next owner. If you are like me and attempt to drive a Honda or Acura product into the ground (that's not an easy thing to do) you are doing yourself a disservice not using premium.

I've been on premium fuel since the 90's, it's gotten to the point where I don't even look at the lower prices, you'll get desensitized the price, treat your baby right.

crazymjb

Completely slipped my mind, thanks. I took apart a blown(timing chain snapped) intrepid engine once so I have seen that before.

Mike

Rpappi

if you dont want prem. and are worried about 87 then go mid grade.

ndx2

Ok, my brother did a simple test with different grades of Premium (93, 92, and 91 octane) when he was coming to visit me from Michigan.

The only thing is, he has a J32A2 with a few engine mods, so it's a tad different from ours A3's.

https://acurazine.com/forums/car-parts-sale-361/f-s-01-02-chrome-outer-grill-03-cls-look-129452/

Basically, better mileage with the highest octane. He didn't even bother with regulars or mids, because that's just plain stupid.

lights

iTrader: (1)

exactly.
we canadians spend WAY more than 33-36K for TL here, and canadian dollar conversion is only 1.12 to US dollar. My TL costed $46K CDN. Go figure.

Put premium gas period.

Desert_TL

I know it's been said over and over, but I might as well throw my 2 cents in and agree with many of the people on here. I don't understand how someone could spend $30k+ on a luxury car and then complain about a 20-30 cent different in premium vs. regular gas. If you can't afford the extra $5 or less per tank of gas for premium, then you can't afford the TL and you should never have purchased it, period. If you are really that short on cash, you should have purchased an Accord or Civic. Even if you really can afford the TL and the premium gas, why risk ruining your $30k luxury car by putting bad gas in it? Would you put Golden State oil (the worst there is) in your TL? Of course not. I just don't understand. Either treat your EXPENSIVE LUXURY car with the respect and care it deserves and put the premium in there, or buy a Civic.

leedogg

Dont knock the guy for trying to save money. Rich people get rich by being frugal and budget conscious in EVERYTHING. A couple dollars here and there add up to 100's and 1000's of dollars a year, and if that is saved I dont even need to go into how much the compound interest would be...

With that said, the TL is a very budget conscious deciision for a luxury vehicle. The number of features, the performance, the enjoyment factor, not to mention that despite it's premium fuel requirement, it is one of, if not the most fuel efficient luxury vehicle out there. Usually performance and fuel efficiency do NOT go hand in hand...

Now. Given all this, the car runs the most efficiently on a 91 octane, which means it gets the best mileage at that octane. You'll get the least number of problems if you use that octane which translates to fewer problems down the road. The difference in gas savings vs the worse mileage + cost of problems down the road attributed to using a lower octane do NOT equal out.