I was all for buying an 05 TL...but after reading some of the posts and horror stories on here I am starting to think I should look elsewhere.

I realize every car will have it's little flaws that can be fixed...but the 2 that have me especially woried are the rattles and the paint.

Right now I drive a Mustang. The reason I wanted a TL in the first place was cuz I thought I would be getting away from cheap interior and rattles.

Even bigger is the paint issue I have been reading about. My Mustang is a '96 with 90K miles and I have about 5 very small chips on my hood and that's it (original paint). Lots of reports about people with only 1K miles and their paint is just chipping away. The rattles I'm sure can be fixed under warranty...but not paint chips!

So how real are these problems...HONESTLY!

Thanks in advance

-Pat

 

I think the paint is pretty decent.

 

If you want to have a car that has decent paint and rattle-free, I think you should look elsewhere. After I bought my car and realized that I have a paint bubble. I got over that, since I know nothing is perfect. In general, the car looks like it’s worth $40,000 from the dealership. But after 1000 miles, I felt like I was buying a hot looking civic. I had rattles all over the place. If you think you can fix some of these rattle… think again. The dealer cannot fix it, because they cannot duplicate the problems. I have learned that THE CAR RATTLES WITH RESPECT TO THE DIFFERENT TEMPERATURE from experience. Anyways, I don’t want to be a complainer here. Nevertheless, some people here have rattle-free TLs. But I just think you are taking a chance if you are considering a TL…

 

My car has been great. The dealer support and service is excellent and I have had no problems with ratlles, paint, or mechanical problems. The only beef I've had is the damn Bridgstone EL42 tires. For a tire to cost over $200 and be a pos at 6k miles is disgraceful.

The tires suck, but my dealer has helped me replace them with what I hope will be a much better tire and ride.

 

I have had no problems with my TL whatsoever....it's great, solidly-built car! I highly recommend it.

 

The TL is a great car, remember you only read about negative stuff, and for every negative there are 10 positives.

It is a great car, but it enjoy it, and have fun.

Michael

 

I'd buy the TL again... in a heartbeat.

I moved our 95 Civic today, and man, there is no comparison.

 

I have over 1K miles too and had a minor rattle in the B pillar that was promptly fixed by my Acura dealer. This car is everything I had hoped it would be. I am coming from a pristine MY00 S2000, and though I miss that ride, I am very pleased so far with the handling, ride, and toys in the TL.

I was also concerned with all of the forum reports prior to purchasing my TL. I have learned from following the S2000 boards over the past five years that you will get a biased sampling of problem reports on any car forum.

In my opinion, the TL is an excellent choice.

Good luck with your decision.

 

Pat........I've had my 05 at TL since April 11.I have almost 3,000 miles on it. I have no complaints.The car is excellent in every respect.
One thing I would do if buying the non-navi, is get the dealer to change the tires out to the Michelins that are on the navi model.
Do this only after you have agreed on a price, then let him know switching the tires is a deal breaker.
Good Luck if you buy the TL,I'm sure you will enjoy it.
CJB

 

Take it up a level or two, or minutiae will eat you alive, as you seem to be one susceptible to and heavily influenced by Internet sites like this.

My short advice is "do not sweat the small stuff".

Consider that only a fraction of TL owners posts here, that Internet Forum members are generally more picky than the owner population at large, that the TL's high resale values are not made up and are heavily quality and owner experience driven, and so forth. Also consider that most people post when they have an "issue" - like the national news shows, no news is good news does not apply to public forums. WQho wants to read "this car is great" when the "my car sux" guys are out there?

Also do not rule out that some of the wilder "my car sux" posts may be written by people with an axe to grind, ple with stake in seeing Acura fall (including owners of other cars, dealers, brokers, etc). Anecdote: In researching a particularly "nasty" exchange on S2KI.COM by some knowitall who questioned every bit of of evidence I posted that did not fall in lockstep with his anti-S2000 technical illiteracy, said nitwit made the mistake of emailing me a rancid, threatening, intellectually vapid rant - which I was able to trace back by his "footprints" to his place of employment - a Nissan dealer!!!!

Also, read some of the "big problem" posts all the way through. usually, embedded in all the noise are 1 or 2 posts by logical, rational people who question the issue, or some of the "proof" of it cited by zealots - example: there was reference to "supplier re-designs, Acura cover-ups, a wild claim that Acura said "they kne of the problem but had no fix", etc. Almost never can any of this be proven or even substantiated slightly. A re-design almost always has a TSB or a part no.change that leaves a smoking gun - example, the oil jet improvements to fix the known 2G and 3G auto tranny failure issue (which IS real).

I do not question that some of the EL42 tires were defective, and that high mileage tires are susceptible to flat spotting, but the probs usually go away after a few miles of driving. For those that did not,k my talkeaway is that this is an issue for delaers to work through, and the responses of people here generally reflect that - dealers with good client sat practices and moderately intelligent dservice advisors got satisfaction on the tires.

On the driveline - considering the numbers of TL's that have been sold, and the relatrively small number of claimants for a driveline "misdesign:, the jury is still out, to this engineer at least.

My car?:No vibration - occasional tire noise of the EL42's when the car has sat for a week or two, but it goes away after 10 minutes on the hghway, or a few hot corners. Driveline vibration is what i would expect of an Acura - very smooth and quiet, other than some buzzing when the car upshifts into 5th at 45 mph - typical of what I would expect of this, done to give the best fuel mileage.

Rattles? Again, these are buzzes to me - as an auto journalist, we in the trade refer to rattles as
"metal on metal" sounds. The TL has its share of resonances/buzzes, but most worked themselves out after a few thousand miles, and an hour or two of sluething and application of some adhesive backed felt here and there, a dollop of silicone spray there, and a "do it yourself" attitude. The biggest whiners on this one strike me as people who expect perfection (unrealistic), compare a stiffly sprung sport sedan to a Lexus (unrealistic), this is their first "expensive" cxar (again, unrealustic expectations), etc. I will say the TL is no better or worse than the other 5 new cars I have purchased in the last 3 years - well, the S2000 is the exception, as it is built like a Swiss watch, and is so noisy that any buzzes that might exist are not audible - so it is one of those philosophical things - does a tree falling in the forest make a sound?

************************************************** **********************

My "honest" (what else would it be?) opinion is that the TL, of which this is my 4th, is a wonderful car, with huge value, a rock solid drivetrain, good looks (finally!), and while short of perfection like anything made by man, the issues are all trivial.

Show me "issues with balls": engine failures, transaxle failures, brake failures, fires, bad ABS, terrible re-saleability, high volume of recalls, and so forth. ......Bueller? .....BUELLER? Crickets?

ENJOY YOUR CAR - KEEP SOME PERSPECTIVE.

P.S. To those who have had minor or major issues with some of these issues, please do not re-air them here, or with me. I have read your posts, and feel your pain, but tried to take a "big picture" point of view on this one. Perhaps I have been "lucky" with my car, as some have suggested, or that my "special talents with cars" makes me less sympathetic to owners who have less, and experienced more. perhaps. But logic suggests that if these "horror stories" ( a butt print is a horror story?) were pandemic to the TL, the sales and re-sales figuires would tank, as the truth gets around. The fact that they have not suggests that a simpler explanation to the TL's problems exists - that they are greatly amplified.




Consider the volume of TL's that have been made, and what the "top 5 issues" here are (my estimates, in nor oder of magnitude).:

1) Paint
2) Butt prints on seat leather
3) Tire/driveline vibration
4) Rattles (more properly called "buzzes" based on what I have read and industry NVH coventions)
5) who knows what's next
************************************************** *********************

Most of these are minor annoyances that can be found on any new car - go to a Mercedes Forum, and you will find these (and many more) issues.
************************************************** **********************

"Honestly"? That is a bit of a put-off - did you expect we would lie to you?

Honestly:
1) Paint - all cars chip when hit by a rock - modern paints may or may not be more susceptiblel to this based on the use of more environmentally friendly techniques, but since paint systems are similar from mfr to mfr, I do not see this as an Acura "problem". Anecdote on cars you or someone else had 10 years ago are scientifically generally add nothing to proving or disproving anythinhg - I try to avoid them except to underscore a point, or identify a trend.

My car?: Nothing unusual to report. A few small nicks in 10,000 miles of driving. No waterspots. I clayed and detailed the car when it was new, removing some rail dust or airborne contaminants (not Acura's fault, so just a useless anecdote). The rear bumper has some orange peel - not uncommon on flex parts, easily wet sanded out if it botherds you enough.

2) Butt prints - purely a cosmetic issue, a re-design of the seat bottoms by Acura may or may not be a reaction/fix for this "problem".

My car?: My 2004 has some stretching, but the seats are also very comfortable and soft - great for long drives. While I may pursue getting 2005 covers at some point, this is minutiae. My wife's 1997 Outback has no such butt printing - but has leather like cardboard - getting to see what i mean about anecdotes?

3) Tire/driveline vibration
************************************************** **********************

 

These cars are selling like hotcakes because you get so much value for the price. I've owned mine for 3 months and 2500 miles. Here's my rating on a scale of 1-10, 10 being best:

Driving experience - 9 (fun, fun, fun, I can't wait to drive it each day; all wheel drive would make a slight improvement for me)
Fuel economy - 7 (not as good as expected, but makes sense for 270 HP)
Interior - 9 (beautifully laid out instruments, dash, colors, the "cockpit"; only some minor rattles that will be fixed on my first oil change)
Exterior - 9 (stunning, aggressive, sporty; slight paint mismatch on underbody spoilers)

Overall, I would definitely buy again. I have recommended it to a friend who just bought one and he loves it as well.

Now, if I could afford a Lamborghini, Ferrarri, high-end Lexus or hign-end BMW, I would have bought one of those instead. It came down to this: what car can I buy that is fun to drive, sporty, accommodates a family of 2 adults and 2 children when needed, I can rely on for 10 years and costs less than $40K out the door.

These were my criteria - yours may vary.

Good luck with you decision!!!

 

Just to share my experience... I shopped for this car for about 6 months... researching every model that I had interest in ad-nausaum. My choices ended up being between the 2005 Audi S4 (owned a 2000 S4), G35 sedan, TL and the 2005 GTO. I have spent plenty of time on all the popular forums for all the cars and found that there were scary complaints on all the models... people complain about the interior quality on the G35, transmission shifting (AT), stereo sounding terrible... people complain about the GTO with fit and finish issues, rear end bolts FALLING OUT, people complained about the S4 with serious transmission issues (gear problems), electrical issues... mumblings over lack of features for a 50K auto... with the TL... driveline vibrations and rattles... but at the end of the day, I drove all the cars multiple times... and for me the price and higher service issues killed it on the S4 (having had an Audi, I knew that going in to it)... the G35 interior killed it for me (AFTER seeing the TL by the way, the G35 up to that point was the winner), the GTO got killed by the news that I was going to be a father... so it came down to the TL. I was taken aback by the driveline vibrations complaints, and in the 3 that I drove (04 and 05's) they all exhibited it to one extent or another, but they ALL smoothed out after 5-10 mins of driving. Fortunately for me, the 05 I ended up with has been butter smooth since day one, and only on initial start up do I feel any vibrations at all. As far as rattles... I have heard a couple on occation... seat belt driver side mechanism in the B-Pillar and occationally in the rear deck. I have been over the car several times with detailing with claybar, zymol wax.. so I know the paint and it looks very nice to me... is it Audi nice? NO. But it's 16K less than the S4 I was looking at. The fit and finish and quality feel of the interior puts the G35 BARELY above Nissan class. Is it as quiet and tight fitting as my wifes Lexus? No... but again, Lexus had nothing to offer me for what I was looking for in my car. At the end of the day, I let my observations of the car make the decision and tried to keep in mind that all car forums have complaint threads as all cars are in fact man made therefore prone to flaws and imperfections. Just my ... I hope that helps some as I was in just the same spot as you are on the decision. Good luck with whatever you decide on! I will say that everyone who I have shown the car to and taken for a ride have been astonished at the price point for the feature set and both design and fit and finish. I am after 2 months still so excited about the car and very satisfied with my purchase!

 

Remeber, most people that have issues tend to write about them on these forums. But in reality, this car is very well built and fun to drive. I am very, very happy with the TL and don't plan on getting anything else over the next 4 to 5 years.

 

In areader's digest condensed version of the last couple of posts .. I love the TL .. I've had no rattles (or buzzes ... Rage) .. I've had a bit of a driveline vibration but it goes away quickly and is not something I'd complain about .. and the paint is what it is .. put clear bra on it or don't drive on the highway and you'll be fine .. get stuck behind a dumptruck on the freeway and you're gonna get chips ...

My advice buy it, take care of it, remember it's a car and you'll continue to enjoy it for years!

 

Whether you want to call it "buzz" or rattle, many owners have one of those in their TLs. They are reporting their rattle problems consistently coming from the same general areas. What does that tell you about the rattle problems in TL? Design flaws and cheap materials. When was the last time you heard a reasobably good car maker making so called "sunglass holder" that rattles like hell so that owners are forced to remove them? That's just one example. Thank god, I leased my car. 24 more months and counting.

 

Road Rage - that was a great write up!

The best part about this forum is some people complain about the most minor things. Anyone ever owned an audi? Not only do you have little rattles, butt prints, and other misc stuff - you also have engine problems, turbo problems and suspension problems.

So in comparisson, the Acura is pretty darn good. The best part is when people have rattles and can not duplicate them......could it have been something in the car?

The car rocks!

Not to mention i have a legend with 225000 miles! Acura makes a good vehicle. And they treat you and everyone else like a person!

Good Luck

 

I have had several acuras, several rattles, and several trannies. Do not compare today's acura with the legend of yesterday. Hell the 95 legend was a 40,000 + car. do not even dare to compare it to a 33,000 tl. The car wil have more refinement and more performance than many cars, but it will also have more issues as well. Unless you are lucky...

 

As for paint chips, maybe the brand new Mustang might have the similar issues due to the new environment-friendly standard. My '94 and '99 vehicles have the perfect paints so far, lawmakers probably didn't demand that at that time, I guess.

 

Most people stumble accross a forum because they are either looking to buy, or have a problem. Maybe 1% at absolute most, of the TL owners are members here. Most probably found it trying to find the solution to a problem.

 

I absolutely LOVE my TL. I did so much research and drove every comparable car. No other car had this complete of a package. The G35 was very nice as well, but the interior was garbage compared to the TLs.

 

I've had my TL for over a year and have been very happy with it. Keep the complaints in perspective.

 

I have 25k miles on my TL (grey on black w/Navi). no rattles, no paint problems. great car. absolutely a winner for the price and compares well to more expensive vehicles. this is a great site for information, insights and general discussion, but as mentioned previously, the problems get most of the focus (minor as they may or may not be). i'm about to replace the worn OEM tires with michelin sports and plan to drive the car until it dies...hopefully a long time, lol.

 

I bought mine since Aug 2004, and i just hit 20,000 miles. The car is awesome! love to drive it everytime and i love it more since i just lowered it which is even more fun! Only rattle i had was some clanking sound in the back seat which the dealer fixed, also the center console rattle went away after i bought a new brand of tires. The rattle issues with some owners sound like a big fucking deal but its really not when the dealer can fix it. Even a buddy of mine bought a new TL

I love the car so much im thinking of purchasing a used car to keep the miles down on the TL, and i'll probably buy again even better if theres a TL coupe

 

Great advice.

I wish that this email were required reading prior to entering this site for new users. Most of the advice on this board is very good and the people writing it have your best interests at heart, but not all. Advice and just all around griping taken without a proverbial "grain of salt" can appear like we all just bought 10 year of Hyundai Excels and are hating every moment behind the wheel.

For what it's worth, I too had the common "door/window rattle" that many people on this site complain about and got it fixed easily and quickly by a dealer. No big deal. No other complaints. Some very minor gripes (soft steering during high speed cornering) but over all, I love the car and would buy it again in a second. IMHO, this is the best car for the money in this class (lux/sport).

 

I could not agree more. I did love my S4, but it was in the shop ALOT, and not for small things like rattles... sure it was under warranty, but it was a royal PITA with all the issues and the dealer NEVER put me in a comparable loaner, it was a POS chevy cavalier or mazda 626 or a SHUTTLE to work. Sadly, I still loved that car, such a blast to drive. But chances are I will not have to take in my TL because 2nd gear blew out in the traney or the fuel injectors are leaking gas all over the engine or the anti-lock brake system freaked out making the car undriveable... (no turbos on the TL so those will never die... heheh). Yeah, my Audi was a love/hate relationship. And STILL I considered the '05 S4... what's up with that!??!?

 

I have an '05 NAVI with about 5k miles. No rattles, no problems with the paint. I love the car and would definitely recommend it. I just got my first oil change and and my gas mileage went up 3-4 mpg. Now I'm getting about 24 mpg with a lot of city driving.

 

05 aren't as problematic or severe as were in the 04...but 05 is not immune...still much better

 

Don't let the complainers scare you away. I love my 05 and have no issues with it. Unfortunately many of the folks with problems purchased the 04. You always take a chance when you buy a first model year redesign. Many of the 04 issues were addressed and corrected on the 05.

 

I originally wasn't going to chime in, but what the hell...

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE MY 2004 TL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Has it had a couple of issues? Yes. Did the dealer fix them? Yes. Would I consider trading my car for something else? No (well, I would for a Porsche 911 convertible...one can dream can't one?).

If you have any further questions, see my second sentence.

 

Thanks for the encouragement guys! I knew every car has it's share of problems...but these were the first I had heard of from the TL...so it worried me at first. But you guys have put my mind at ease a bit.

Thanks!

-Pat

 

My '05 TL is almost at 5K miles and I have not experienced ANY of the problems reported by folks. No rattles (that I didn't cause myself, e.g. CD cases in the glovebox), no paint bubbles or chips, no butt prints in the seats, ...

I love the TL and I am so glad I got it!

I am very impressed by the engine, which delivers great power whenever needed while giving me terrific fuel efficiency. My MPG for combined city/hwy is around 25, pure hwy is around 32. Either way, I am getting better than the EPA estimates. In fact, even feeding it premium fuel which typically is ~20 cents/gal higher than regular unleaded, my cost-per-mile is lower than two other family cars get that use regular.

Conclusion: HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!

 

Excellent post, Road Rage, but then I'd expect nothing less!

 

YAY!

a positive thread

 

I've got 4,000 miles on my '04 and my only complaint is about the flat-spotting EL42s.

The flat-spotting is annoying, but it does go away once the tires warm up, and I find that the car handles and stops well with the tires. I haven't driven the car much in the rain, or at all in the snow, so I can't comment there.

I have noticed a slight vibration at roughly 1,500RPM/60MPH. but it's not a big deal. I just drive a little faster or slower if I want to eliminate it.

I have no rattles or squeaks, everything works as it did on day one, and I consider the leather to be wearing normally with slight stretching and creasing. The leather in the TL is softer than that in my Solara, so it has stretched/creased a bit more than that in the Solara in its first year.

Late next month will mark one year that I've owned my car, and I can easily say that I have NO regrets.

My only outstanding concern is the transmission. I knew before buying about the 2G problem and assumed that there was a possibility I might face a similar situation. The extension of the service campaign to early 3Gs didn't thrill me, but I hope that means that later 3Gs have the oil-jet fix already, or that they will be recalled soon to ensure long transmission life.

I recommend Honda and Toyota product without hesitation, and my experiences over the past eleven months has done nothing to change my feelings about Honda/Acura.

Regards,

 

I am a happy MAN

 

05 SSM/Ebony Navi AT picked up 12/31/04 5000 Miles Now - and YES - It is a Beauty- but NO - The Quality just is not there - Rattles ( Buzzes- whatever -they should NOT be there - No matter what the temp is - Dealer has worked on them - they come back) Dealer replaced 2 Michelins to get the vibrations down - better but still not the smooth ride it should have. And what is with the seats!- the fix for the the 04 butt prints has pulled in the side thigh bolsters to a point where they pinch your thigh - very uncomfortable after just a few minutes ( and no I am not a fat slob - anyone with over a 34waist has got to feel this - ironically the 04 feels much more comfortable - a case of not testing the solution) And why does this car not track straight down the road - you have to constantly correct the steering to hold a line - and I live in smooth and straight road Florida - my 01 Accord EX V6 did not have this problem - come to think of it - I have NEVER had a problem with the Accord - No Rattles, No Vibrations, Nothing - Now it's my son's car) Here's my scorecard: Styling A+
Engine B+
Driveline B-
Ride C- ( firm is good - bouncy is not)
Interior A for Style C for Assembly
Stereo A ( but hate the passenger side door "Buzz" with a decent bass note
Navi A+ Best in the Biz
Overall Quality C ( Right in line with JD Power

 

that's why there's a forum! helps you decide whether to buy or not! helps you prepared what's coming!

 

Sport suspension + wide low profile tires do not equal a soft Accord ride. The sport seats are a little tight for some mature bodies. BTW, I had a low mile 05 Buick LaSabre(sp?) rental for a few days, what a soft POS that was. All things considered, I would buy my TL all over again.

 

I LOVE my '04TL. Although I've only got 5600 miles, so far there are NO buzzes, rattles or vibration anywhere in the car. The paint is beautifull, although the design of the front end makes it likely you're going to get paint chips. If this bothers you, get a bra. The tires suck, and although I got the HPT option, I dumped the tires after 3 months and purchased Michelin PS-2's. I'd rate the car 9/10 so far, and give the interior a solid 10! Would I do it again?......I'm on my 3rd TL.....that says it all. It's not perfect, but for the money, the '04 TL is an absolute steal compared to other cars in it's price range.

 

No problems, I was also concerned when I started reading some of the posting here last year.

I have a four month old 05 TL with 3.6K miles, no issues other than a outdoor temp display that had a temporary anomaly (it solved itslef probably a software problem). Been very pleased with the TL, no rattles, buttprints, or vibration. Gas mileage has been consistant 25MPG mixed suburban driving.

Also had two previous Acura's, both went well past 200K miles before they were donated both still working. I would definitely buy the TL again.