ck37

Sorry for the re-posting of this topic.(posted in the RL forum) Just needed to get some quick advice on this possible deal.

I was approached by my sales rep yesterday while waiting to pick up my 04 TL from the service center. He saw me looking at the RL and asked me if i was interested. I said Sure, but I don't want to spend more money really. Well to make a long story short we talked through some numbers. This is what was given to me:

Trade in Value for my TL 27,000
Pay off on my lease is 29,000
Price of RL after deduction 42,500
Total payments for me would be a 1010.00 down and 579.00 plus tax
4 years 12K

What are some opinions here. my TL is Blk/blk nav, auto, with kit and 19" Zenetti's
15k miles to date. leased it end of Dec 03.

My payments now are 547.00 a month including tax for a four year 12K lease. Drive off was all i put down.


Please let me know what I should do.

GIBSON6594

Don't know if this answers your question, but here is the future of this secenario in my head...

"I brought in my RL to get serviced and was looking at the NSX in the lot. The dealer came over and asked if i was interested, said i can get one for only another $60 a month...yada yada yada...should I do it?"

Not trying offend your intelligence, just saying that dealers are gonna do everything humanly possible to get more money out of you...if your not specifically looking for a new car, stick with what you have and don't let them sucker you in

elsensei

well, it actually isn't too much of a bad deal, your payment would go up a little and of course you will have to cough up $1k. Sounds like a good trade on your TL $27k for 15k miles on an 04 (hmmm...wonder what they would give me for an 05 with 8k..)

Also the price on the new RL they are giving you, $42k, is a steal

Really, it's up to you. What is it about the RL that you really like? I guess if it is worth the money to you then it is worth it.

If RL's were $42 when I got my TL I might have bought one, I mean that is only $9k more for what most people agree is a lot more car.

ck37

No offense taken. I know the deal. The dealership has 36 RL's on the lot and the salesman told me there are incentives for them to move them.

I was just curious as to how the numbers look etc. I like the RL and would only do it if it was the "right" move to make.

ck37

I feel the same way if the RL was out the same time as the TL I would have went the RL route. I like the traffic feature, being in LA and in sales, I find that a big plus, also the keyless access etc. Overall i like the technology the RL has. is it a speed demon, no, but with the amount of tickets I get at times for speeding, slower isn't all that bad

What is interesting is that this is the first round of numbers they threw at me. i might, just might be able to work a little better deal If I was ready to sign.
I leased my TL from the same dealership as well.

MR1

Using car for business = partial write off = why not?

Only if you continue to keep your miles down and plan to keep the job and have an escape route if necessary.

But RL off to a slow sales start = more depreciation than TL. But on a lease, who cares?

parkkuen

Your lease payment is more than my monthly payment... dude how about buying a car... 579 * 12 months * 4 yrs = $27,792 + $1,101 = $28,893 ....

ck37

What do you think lease payments go for on $40,000+ vehicles? Sure if I was to get something cheaper, lets say a mustang for example, I wouldn't be debating this.

Maybe you didn't read my post, I already pay 547.00 including tax on my TL lease. Remember, there weren't any discounts or incentives on the TL when i got it. Are people getting better deals? sure they are, but at the time I NEEDED to get a car and the TL fit the profile and I also have the luxury of writing off a lot of the monthly payment due to my occupation.

My question is if it a smart move for a few dollars more a month than what i am paying to get into the RL.

WdnUlik2no

27,000K trade in on an '04 TL-Navi is pretty good.
Just for the Heck of it I took my 05TL-Navi to get appraised by carmax a couple of months ago, Navi/6-speed/4K miles. They offered me $28000 for it. Not sure what they would offer for it now, but I imagine it will be around that same figure. Maybe a little lower. But $28000 is only $400 less than what I owe on it!

I am sure we both could get more for it if we sold privately though. I did a finance not lease, but I still think you may get the full payoff amount of $29,000 if you sold privately. All your buyer would have to do is to tender the check to the dealer and they will pay the leasing company off, you get the title, and then you transfer the title to the buyer.

If you really want the RL, I would go for it, nothing like driving and spending money on a car that you are not happy with. I made the same mistake when I had my 2004 Maxima, the worse car decision I ever made. After a year i sold it to a private buyer, and bought my new TL a few months later. To this day I don't regret getting out of the Maxima.

JetJock

I drove an RL a few weeks ago while waiting for my TL getting work done in the shop. Although I liked the RL, it seemed more like an "old persons" car than my TL. Sure, I liked the AWD, the paint, the obvious better quality craftsmanship, but it just didn't have the sporty feel I get in my TL. I'll pass!!

ck37

The RL is what I would say is a more "luxurious ride" to some degree.
I find as I am researching this and debating the deals there are out there in this type of vehicle segment warrant me to look at other options possibly. Like the A6, M35 etc.
The one thing I have going for me is the demand the TL has currently right now. I won't take a bath if I trade it in, or sell it outright, and the incentives out there on more expensive vehicles per say, keeps me around the same monthly.

Things to think about.

gbriank

Does anyone have the depreciation factor for the TL and RL?

elsensei

not sure how accurate it is, but Acura lists the residuals on their website. In fact, the RL is listed as worse depreciation on Acura's own site compared to the TL. Go to acura.com, check out the rl, then select comparisons and pick the TL to compare to.

Msnowdon

If it was me, I would hang out a liltte longer. I think we are going to see some upgrades to the 06 Acura. A/C seats, better wheels, and maybe a tad more power.

Drive your TL a little longer.

Michael

gbriank

Just got back from the dealer....it appears Acura is really pushing to rid themselves of the RL. Local dealer is selling these suckers for $43500 (if leased) and $44600 (if financed)....must be some manufacturer to dealer $$$. $587 and change is what I saw the 4year 12,000 mile leases going for.... Looks like 45% deprecation factor.

The lease is $67 a month more than my financed TL.... just don't know if I can justify the purchase.....

Msnowdon

Hang on to your TL!

ck37

See here is my delima, Could there be upgrades like you suggested for 06? Maybe, but if they upgrade features like that it would make a lot of existing RL owners a bit upset.

Also within 3 to 4 months the miles on my TL will go up and the value will not be there for a decent trade in. That is one of the main factors i am considering is the trade in value I could get for the TL at this time.

There is also incentives from Acura right now to move these cars. They outpriced themselves in the market, (which i predicted a long time ago on these boards)

Over all i am leaning towards making the move, but just a bit nervous in doing so. The TL jmped out of the gate as a winner in terms of demand and residual value. Acura's as a whole tend to hold ther value better than many vehicles on the market. My concern is if I do jump into the RL, lets say ina couple of years I might want to get intyo something else, chances are, I will be hurting o a trade in or private sell.

Am I right in this assessment?

Thanks to everyone for your opinons. Much appreciated. Please feel free to share more of your thoughts.

MR1

Yes I think you are hurting the financial future with a trade. However, how much of the additional payment will you be able to write off. Is the additional payment worth it to you? Isn't that all it realy boils down to? Just think, you coudda just bought a Kia Sophia for $9K+- and been done with it.

gbriank

My sentiments exactly.... I've got until the 5th to decide (Acura deal ends). I do like the RL, but just how much to I like it is the real question...... I'm gonna call my insurance and find out how much more it costs to insure.... Later y'all!

midas69

I have to admit, when I first saw the thread title I didn't really think of this as a smart move. But after reading again and seeing the actual numbers I've got to admit, it sounds like a pretty good deal. $1000 out of pocket isn't too much over 4 years and for a measly $30 a month more, that's a lot more car. You also are able to get out of the lease early on a 2004. To be able to do that and get a better car for such a small amount seems like a pretty tempting offer to me.

The talk about what might happen in 2006 to the RL is all speculation. Look at how little they changed from the 2004 to the 2005 TL if you need an example. The talk of lower residuals isn't even a concern because they've already quoted you the numbers and that's already in there. If you were purchasing I'd be more concerned about trade-in.

mickey3c

Well if the person cannot make up their mind how they want to spend their cash, then send it to me... What should I do what should I do... hell I will know...

gbriank

Follow-up: Well, I spoke to the insurance company.....an extra $220 per six months....

ck37

Thanks. That's what's tempting to me as well.
Just to throw some more wood in the fire, went and test drove the M35 last night. (I figured might as well be confident in my decision based upon the competition in this segment)
Nice car, has the low end torque but what's interesting is I can pretty much do a M35, Journey, Tech for a 39 month lease for the same amount. It was a total of 610.00 a month including tax. Thats around the 579.00 range roughly before tax based on CA 8.25%.

It keeps on getting harder and harder to make a decision

dano

We were looking at a TL/ Navi last night which leases for $449/48 months/ 12K with $2,000 down when the salesman said a lease on the RL's was much better. The lease deal @ Lindsey Acura in Columbus Ohio is $499/mo./48 months, 12k, with $4,500 down. Didn't sound that great at the time. When I got home the salesman called and said I could probably get in it for $499 with $3,500 or maybe even $3,000 down. So if you figuire at $0 down as opposed to $3,000 down would be an extra $62.50/mo. on top of the $499 = $561.50. Sounds pretty good.
The salesman said Acura is putting a ridiculous residual (50%)@ 4 years hoping to have a bunch of "Acura Certified" RL's on their lots in 4 years, which bring good money. Does that make sense?
BTW, I checked on a 2006 Lexus GS300, MSRP of $46,590 and the lease on it for 48 months was $640 with $5,000 down. No AWD, Navi, Bluetooth, DVD Audio, only 245hp. BUT probably the most beautiful car out there IMO.

ck37

From what I have read on other boards, Acura seems to be giving some incentives on the RL or "dealer hold back money " to move them.
Hence the lease numbers we are getting.

As for the lexus, It is Beautiful, but the lease rates aren't by anymeans. Give it a few months and they will be more attractive.

gbriank

You took the words.... I am sitting at my desk with an M brochure right in front of me. In speaking to the sales lady, I explained what great offers Acura is currently offering on the RL. So, she whips out her "offer" book and shows me some lease offers....most are right in line with what you have listed below. I liked the M35 except for the look of some dash components (I must be a die-hard Acura fan). The car was faster than the RL and sportier, but fuel economy sucked and i'd have to wait a few weeks for the M I wanted to come in. Plenty of RL's in stock and prices are closer to invoice...... Drat! What to do?!?!?!?

plastikman

I love the RL, but I have seen some really unhappy costumers at my dealership complaining about electrical issues with the RL. If it was me I would wait for the 06 Rl to come out, seems that most Car Companies work out most of the kinks after the first year of a car being in production ( this is the new styles first year ). But if its what you really want, then you should go for it, just make sure you have no regrets.

ck37

Well I think it's a go.
Here are the final numbers on the deal. They are giving mye about 28,500 on my TL as is. 19" wheels, aero kit etc. The Cap cost of the RL went down to 41,850.

Drive off 1000.00
Monthly including tax for four years 12k at 50% residual is 579.86 including taxes. Right now I am spending 547.10 including taxes.

How does this look. If it looks good, I will sign the paperwork tomorrow.

Now debating on color choices. Black on black is my first choice but the Lakeshore/black also looks good.

What does everyone think?

plastikman

You gotta do what you gotta do, good luck!

gbriank

CK, is the trade on the TL a break even (or are you getting money back that is being applied to the lease)? Could you give a breakdown on costs, etc?

Thanks!

ck37

My payoff is 29,400. The trade in is 28,500 so they are taking in roughly 950.00 and putting it into the final price of the car.

As far as regrets, I don't really feel regret but just a bit nervous. I think though we all feel like that (or at least I do) when we are investing into something new. I tend to do a lot of research and thinking before I make big decisions. That's why i appreciate these boards, becasue it's great to get people's feedback from all over, some biast and some un-biast.

elsensei

hey Ck, once you get the RL post back and give us a comparison of the two cars. Who knows maybe I will go look at the RL and see what's up.

Good luck, I think with the numbers you are dealing with you really can't go too wrong.

ck37

Thanks Elsensei,

I can give you some first hand opinoins now since I have test drove the Rl a couple of times now, back to back with my TL.

As others have said, the fit and finish is a step up in a big way from the TL to RL. As it should be though considering this is their flagship car. The leather is thick and luxurious feeling. Quiet inside the cabin. I can say it is one of the best looking interiors out there. I test drove the new A6, which audi's are known to have some of the best interiors in the industry, and the RL beat it hands down. Now the A8 is a different story, but then again, for the price difference it should be a bit better. But not by much.

As far as styling, well the RL wasn't and is not supposed to be a bigger TL. Two different markets. Have you seen the new S class from Mercedes? Very simple, not like the CLS. Two different markets. Same with BMW. The RL does look sporty. The 17" wheels might be a bit conservative to some, but its not a car, to me at least that would look right on "bling bling" 20"s. I think the body style doesn't compliment that look, as opposed to a 300C, S class, 7 Series. The car needs a classy wheel, simple, yet complimentary to the fluid lines of the car. If you find something in the 20" range that does compliment the car, great, but the ride will suffer. Something that is personal preference.
That I might say, was my biggest regret on my TL. i went 19"s , lowered it, and while it looked good, the ride was harsh and sometimes embarrasing when I had business associates, and friends in the car. If I was to do it again, the 18" aspec wheels would be my choice, if anything for the ride factor. My opinion only for what it's worth.

As for the power, here are my thoughts on it.
When ever you have a two wheel drive car, you will feel the acceleration a bit more over awd. For example, My mother used to have a 1990 honda accord. I had an X5. When I would drive her accord I thought, "man, this thing is quick" but to be honest it really wasn't quicker than my X5. in fact it was much slower if you look at the numbers. But the AWD doesn't give you that thrust like a two wheel drive car does. Same thing a couple of years ago when I was shopping and i was looking at the FX's. the two wheel drive FX35 seemed quicker than the 45. Was it? no. it's the initial feeling you get.
That's how I would compare the RL to the TL. I personally felt the torque more in the RL. The TL feels more nimble but the RL feels solid. The Rl feels like you have total control "SH-AWD" where as my TL, even lowered with 19"s didn't feel that way. in fact, I was hesitant at times.

You won't miss the power coming from the TL to the RL. If you have a manual TL, you might feel a little difference because you have complete control over when the car shifts to utilize the power, but coming from an auto no difference really.
Also as you know, Japanese engines seem to need a longer break in period to get the most out of them in terms of performance. So when you hear people talking about the RL being slow on the Test drives, well take into consideration the amount of miles the car actually has. When I first got my TL, I thought "man, this thing is slow for 275 hp. " But around the 4000 mile mark, she came alive. I imagine the same thing will be evident in the RL.

I know for a fact, Infiniti has the issue to with some potential buyers. Many of my friends cross shopping vehicles were un-impressed with the acceleration of the G35 coup or even the M45. But see, they are coming from the German side, where you jump in and feel the power almost right off the bat.

Well these are some of my opinions. Take it for what it's worth. Either way you can't go wrong. both are aamzing vehicles in their own right. it's up to you, your finances, and the image you want to portray to others in all honesty. The RL exudes class and a bit of sport, while the TL is sport with a nice bit of class.

gbriank

Folks, I need some help.... Just got back from the dealer on my second test drive of the RL.... I like it. The lease that the dealership is offering is stellar.

$709 down
$579 / month
4 year / 12,000 mi.

This includes Texas TT&L. If I trade my TL in, they said I should get $27'ish. He was being vague (car has navigation, clear bra, floor mats, mud flaps, door edge trim, body side moulding, back-up sensors, and 18" rims....i'm keeping the 18s and transferring them to the RL). Any thoughts?!?!?!?!? PLEASE!

ck37

looks good. You might be able to pull out more on the trade in. depends how many miles you have. That is the key in all of it.

I hear you texans get some great deals due to certain laws pertaining to the state.

gbriank

I've got 16,800 miles on the car....

Rules in Texas vary on leasing/smart buy. I'm not sure about all of the specifics, but I better get edge-u-ma-cated by tomorrow. Any good sites on leasing?

ck37

Interest rates just went up so if I would take that into consideration on how quick you want to make a move. What's good today might not be good next week.
Just food for thought.

ck37

leasecompare.com edmunds.com also google "car leasing". Lots of info. To be honest its about the same deal I am getting. I think the down is slightly lower due to different state fees. I live in CA sothey get you pretty good here.

my lease on my TL is 547.10 a month with just drive off as the down. As I see it we are getting into a lot more car for a few bucks more a month. well worth it. also check on the insurance rates. Just a note on that, With State farm, they list 3 different RL's. i am guessing US mainland, Alaska and Hawaii. Make sure they pick the right one. Rates differ about 20.00 or so dollars a month. also you get a special discount because of the safety factor.

Make sure your 18"s fit the RL. If not see what they will give you on the trade in with the wheels.

mio

I don't think it is a good investment for trading TL for RL...

ck37

Why do you say that?