I have been searching for performance automatic clutch packs for around 2 years now. There has been a lot of vaporware with several companies. However I finally found a company that is serious about making custom clutch frictions in either carbon or Kevlar. Basically our goals is a material with a higher coefficient of friction and higher heat capacity. Combined with a quality ATF with a lower amount of friction modifiers. I do not see why we can't build a AT to handle some abuse.

In order to save production cost I wanted to see which clutch packs are most troublesome. I was thinking about just 1st-3rd since there shouldn't be many full power shifts in those gears. If anyone has a destroyed AT they want to donate I will pay for freight.

I wanted to get an idea who would be interested in some performance AT clutch packs. These will have to be produced in batches depending on cost I may or may not stock them.

 

This guy runs a Turbo J32A2 Civic w/ AEM EMS and Odyssey auto trans (early trouble-prone unit). I tried contacting him about his custom trans controller, but he hasn't been active on youtube. He is a member on here (mhassett), but hasn't been logged on for over a year.

His trick to making big power on the automatic was his custom controller. Combined with the AEM EMS, he was able to kill the injectors/plugs during the shifts and he could control the line pressure going to the shift solenoids (making faster, harsher shifts). He told me that he used an off-the-shelf rebuilt kit on the transmission (stock/OEM quality) and a mix of type-F and DW-1, I believe. This means that the clutch packs aren't necessarily the weak link.

I'm also curious to know if the TL/CL-S LSD or some aftermarket unit will bolt up to the automatic. All of the parts catalog diagrams (exploded views) show the differentials to be very similar.

I think it's pretty neat what this guy has done. I don't how the Ody trans differs from the 3G TL 5AT, though.

 

interesting, subbed for more info.

 

Sub'd. I want to see where this goes incase my tranny takes a dump.

But I hope it doesn't. Ever. -knock on wood-

 

I would definately look for upgrade parts if mine was broken, but I don't have any need to tear into mine at the moment, I hope it works out, and I also hope you don't see any of my money for it any time soon lol.

 

I only have a minute but the problem with the auto is not parts breakage, it's clutch wear. Good clutches, less FM, more line pressure and most importantly is shift timing. Find a way to control shift timing whether it's mechanical or electronic.

 

Cool idea for those Auto guys in need of a solid solution.

 

I have seen his work. Pretty impressive stuff however I am not really looking for drag tranny controller. His controller doesn't have grade logic or shift pressure control. Basically just hard shifts controlled manually. This works great for a drag car however daily driving it would get annoying.

So good clutches and less FM should be able to take some abuse unit there is a way to adjust the shift timing. Would shimming and the accumulators help at all with the timing?

 

sub'd.

when you "build", possibly add LSD? clutch? torsen?

 

Richie, I love you.

 

I could try, I have a few 6 speed LSDs laying around. If possible I will take some measurements of the differential and see if anything matches up. A LSD insert might be a viable option however I am not sure how effective it is.

http://www.phantomgrip.com/

Love you too. No :ghey:

 

Woah...so Richie are you building an reliable AT transmission for the AT guys that had their transmissions take a dump on them? If so....count me in...my transmission took a dump on me last week and I am now saving up for a new tranny....
P.S. Was planning to send money your way for some new HFPC but seems like I may be sending them for a new tranny instead

 

I've been working on a product that raises line pressure electronically. I had plans to sell it but let's face it, I'm not a vendor or a salesman. I can turn over what I've gotten so far via email if you want. It's a first step, definitely not the only step. It's hard for me to test this thing anyway with as little time as I have.

The balance with an auto is having very quick, snappy shifts that are on time but not so hard that you're breaking hard parts from the shock. Since our autos haven't really broken hard parts I would probably concentrate on the shifting first and if something breaks, address it then.

I'm sure you've seen Bert's build, the 5at with Type F and new pressure switches did fine for quite a while with I *think* 15,000 boosted miles and over 130,000 miles total at 400whp. At 500whp it gave up quickly but never broke anything.

More friction (line pressure, Type F, clutches) is a big part of the battle. But we need a way to help the shift timing, one set of clutches releasing and the other set of clutches applying at just the right time to prevent a flare or a bind. I think the idea of shimming or locking out the accumulators is a great idea, it will change the shift profile which will slightly change the timing as well. It will definitely cut down on the "slip time".

The performance clutches advantage is two-fold. Better friction and holding power and probably just as important, they will take a little more slip and temperature before burning and giving up. No auto clutch is going to like slip but this will give you a little headroom.

But again, back to shift timing, the one thing I don't know how to control, it will mean the difference in a 100,000 mile 5at behind a 500whp J and 500 miles behind the same engine. It will also INCREASE driver comfort and lessen shock on the hard parts if it's done right. Odds are it's going to be mechanical mods such as drilling some passages larger, restrictors in other passages, and I'm sure replacing springs and/or shimming springs.

We would need a way to get a pressure profile for each gear, maybe there's a place to tap into for each hydraulic circuit for a pressure sending unit that can be logged. One place to look is anyone who offers a shift improver kit for this transmission. These are not shift kits, these usually eliminated factory defects and improve things to make them more reliable without sacrificing comfort. Some of these companies do the homework for you because they concentrate on shift timing. I know for a fact the 3rd gear hydraulic circuit's exhaust port will have to be drilled out which will greatly extend 3rd gear's life expectancy but it's not going to make much of a difference in how much hp it will hold. Time for my morning coffee, I've got to wake up, hopefully I won't come back and read this and go wtf?

For anyone wondering, shift timing is not the rpm it shifts at, it's the timing between gears on a shift where one clutch pack is releasing and one is applying. It's hard to get perfect and it's one of the most critical areas for long life.

 

Sub'ed for more info. The more you know, the better to make the car last.

 

bump?

 

definite bump

 

Any updates???

 

Bump looking to rebuild mines now.