2006 Consumer Reports Names TL Top Pick in the Sedan $30,000 - $40,000 Class
03-01-2006, 07:58 PM
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2006 Consumer Reports Names TL Top Pick in the Sedan $30,000 - $40,000 Class
03-01-2006, 08:36 PM
#6
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Originally Posted by trev0006
Just returned a loaner new TL while my girlfriends CL was in there and I absolutly loved it.
Trev not posting a video link. This is quite the occasion.
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03-01-2006, 08:39 PM
#8
Senior Moderator
They said:
So they didn't get one that rattled. 
Seriously, this is the third consecutive year it's won the honor. Congrats to Acura! This should keep the resale value up!
Another Honda product, the Acura TL provides a "near ideal blend of comfort, convenience and sportiness," Consumer Reports says. It's a quick car that still gets fairly good fuel mileage, the magazine said, and the interior has good fit and finish.
Seriously, this is the third consecutive year it's won the honor. Congrats to Acura! This should keep the resale value up!
03-01-2006, 09:09 PM
#10
Senior Moderator
Video Link. Hopefully this will work for non-subscribers.
And for those curious about Acura's overall reliability, from Consumer Reports....
And for those curious about Acura's overall reliability, from Consumer Reports....
03-02-2006, 04:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Bert Kanne
The TL makes so much more sense than a 3 series BMW or a Lexus IS....
I couldn't agree more. While I have to admit that I am the BMW nut, I was totally smitten by the TL when I test drove it. Not to mention that I would have to spend another five to six grand just to get the 325 sedan. Why spend more unless you have to?
03-02-2006, 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by neuronbob
Video Link. Hopefully this will work for non-subscribers.
03-02-2006, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by neuronbob
They said:
So they didn't get one that rattled.
Seriously, this is the third consecutive year it's won the honor. Congrats to Acura! This should keep the resale value up!
So they didn't get one that rattled.
Seriously, this is the third consecutive year it's won the honor. Congrats to Acura! This should keep the resale value up!
Fortunately Consumers doesn't read these forums.
I mean between the phutt phutt sound and the doors that attempt to assault us when they are opened it's a wonder Acura is even mentioned.
03-02-2006, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Bert Kanne
The TL makes so much more sense than a 3 series BMW or a Lexus IS....
03-02-2006, 10:12 AM
#21
TL hacker
Originally Posted by joed40
Fortunately Consumers doesn't read these forums.
I mean between the phutt phutt sound and the doors that attempt to assault us when they are opened it's a wonder Acura is even mentioned.
I mean between the phutt phutt sound and the doors that attempt to assault us when they are opened it's a wonder Acura is even mentioned.
03-02-2006, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Zeuser
I think you miss the point. Every car has faults... the TL, in it's segment, is the one with the least faults.
I tend to do that sort of thing. Since we're discussing cars and not human euthanasia I like to throw some humor in once in a while, and perhaps a slathering of sarcasm. I guess you didn't find it funny. Damn, I will try harder in the future. But thanks for clarifying the post for me.
03-02-2006, 11:01 AM
#23
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by CCogan
You certainly do get more "value" with the TL package. It's a very good straight-line cruiser, and the cheaper build quality has only resulted in a series of minor annoyances thus far.
^^^^ Value is the key with both Honda products & Consumer Reports.....which explains why 5 out of the 10 categories is occupied by Honda/Acura. That said the TL represents terrific value.
03-02-2006, 11:25 AM
#24
Safety Car
ahhh, just read it before coming to the boards. 5/10 are Hondas. Not one american car on the list. Just goes to show you why many American brands are not doing to well right now. It's not all about speed and power. Consumers want reliable cars as well as cars with NICE INTERIORS (eeeh ummm GM, eehh umm FORD). The TL offers a bit of of it all. Not to mention the fact that they don't try to overcharge you; unlike BMW who wants to charge over $40 grand for a comparable 325.
03-02-2006, 11:35 AM
#25
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im so glad im a part of a winning team.....keep up the good work acura and you will have a buyer for life... Now i have bragging rights against all of my friends...
03-02-2006, 12:31 PM
#26
2014 RDX Tech AWD
Was having a heated discussion/debate with my b/f last evening about getting rid of his Pontiac Grand Prix GTP coupe (which they no longer make); he's had it from new in 1997 and now is sinking $1500 to fix it for inspection (...you want to talk about rattles!!!!). He knows from driving the TL that he needs to get away from GM. So, ironically, 5-minutes later on the World News Tonight they had a segment on how for the first time ever forgeign cars have dominated Consumer Reports Top 10 list - and of course, we saw the TL 
.
It really does verify that at least Honda's are well built and reliable. E.g. when I bought my previous 94 del Sol used with 60,000-miles on....by the time I traded that sucker in with 130,000 miles during that period of ownership I didn't have any problems at all. Only regular maintenance and the tune-up. My b/f's Pontiac at 10-years old and 80,000 miles...what hasn't gone wrong. Heck - the transmission blew the first month. And not to mention IMO - the interior just looks too "plastic" for my preference.
Anyway - congrats to all TL owners! Have a drink on me tonight !
. It really does verify that at least Honda's are well built and reliable. E.g. when I bought my previous 94 del Sol used with 60,000-miles on....by the time I traded that sucker in with 130,000 miles during that period of ownership I didn't have any problems at all. Only regular maintenance and the tune-up. My b/f's Pontiac at 10-years old and 80,000 miles...what hasn't gone wrong. Heck - the transmission blew the first month. And not to mention IMO - the interior just looks too "plastic" for my preference.
Anyway - congrats to all TL owners! Have a drink on me tonight !
03-02-2006, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by KJW73
Anyway - congrats to all TL owners! Have a drink on me tonight !
Well thax, thats very nice of you, but harrisburg is not necessarily a hop skip and a jump away and im sure your boyfriend wouldn't like that.... jk.. lol
sorry couldn't resist... on another note .. im surprised the RL was rated poorly..
03-02-2006, 12:54 PM
#28
2014 RDX Tech AWD
Originally Posted by drdamian
Well thax, thats very nice of you, but harrisburg is not necessarily a hop skip and a jump away and im sure your boyfriend wouldn't like that.... jk.. lol sorry couldn't resist... on another note .. im surprised the RL was rated poorly..
sorry couldn't resist... on another note .. im surprised the RL was rated poorly..LOL! Luckily for me I work with a lot of men and it's a part of my job to socialize/network/bullshit with them after work at happy hour periodically. I gotta good man, I suppose.
And heck - Philly's only 90 miles to center city from here and on the Turnpike, I could pull a Fast Eddy Rendell (haha) and get there in about 45 minutes. 
I was reading Car and Driver last night at home and they too have poorly rated the RL; I couldn't understand their criticism. Granted during their test drive the car was in the shop more times than driven, but yet their test driver's still loved the car despite its issues (e.g. electrical problems with almost everything). I don't care...if I could afford the RL...I'd probably have one. I like 'em.
03-02-2006, 01:59 PM
#29
TL hacker
Originally Posted by joed40
I think you missed MY point, which was to throw some humor in to the day.
I tend to do that sort of thing. Since we're discussing cars and not human euthanasia I like to throw some humor in once in a while, and perhaps a slathering of sarcasm. I guess you didn't find it funny. Damn, I will try harder in the future. But thanks for clarifying the post for me.
I tend to do that sort of thing. Since we're discussing cars and not human euthanasia I like to throw some humor in once in a while, and perhaps a slathering of sarcasm. I guess you didn't find it funny. Damn, I will try harder in the future. But thanks for clarifying the post for me.
03-02-2006, 05:55 PM
#31
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by joed40
OK sunshine! 
03-02-2006, 06:21 PM
#33
NPR had the guy in charge of CR car testing dept on today, and I got a kick out of him saying an 8 year old civic is MORE reliable than a 2 year old VW passat.
Just a week ago I pointed that out to my wife, looking in the book, an 8 year old civic gets rated much better then a 2 year old passat (or any VW).
As a matter of fact, an 8 year old civic looks better then 90% of the cars out there.
The guy said lexus/toyota is tops, with acura/honda in 2nd place.
Some infinity suv was the worst (40% of people had problems in 1 year).
Brett
Just a week ago I pointed that out to my wife, looking in the book, an 8 year old civic gets rated much better then a 2 year old passat (or any VW).
As a matter of fact, an 8 year old civic looks better then 90% of the cars out there.
The guy said lexus/toyota is tops, with acura/honda in 2nd place.
Some infinity suv was the worst (40% of people had problems in 1 year).
Brett
03-03-2006, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Brettg
NPR had the guy in charge of CR car testing dept on today, and I got a kick out of him saying an 8 year old civic is MORE reliable than a 2 year old VW passat.
Just a week ago I pointed that out to my wife, looking in the book, an 8 year old civic gets rated much better then a 2 year old passat (or any VW).
As a matter of fact, an 8 year old civic looks better then 90% of the cars out there.
The guy said lexus/toyota is tops, with acura/honda in 2nd place.
Some infinity suv was the worst (40% of people had problems in 1 year).
Brett
Just a week ago I pointed that out to my wife, looking in the book, an 8 year old civic gets rated much better then a 2 year old passat (or any VW).
As a matter of fact, an 8 year old civic looks better then 90% of the cars out there.
The guy said lexus/toyota is tops, with acura/honda in 2nd place.
Some infinity suv was the worst (40% of people had problems in 1 year).
Brett
Two problems with these numbers:
1. They can't count. They like to pretend that the results of a survey of 2001 models conducted in the spring of 2005, when these cars were 3.5 to 4.5 years old, measures "5-year reliability."
2. Their numbers continue to contain the same problems they did last fall. Notice that the Dodge Magnum V8 earns an average rating, but the 300 V8 is much worse than average. Other than a liftgate on the Dodge, they're the same car.
I've gone into issue #2 in more detail here:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/anomalies.php
Some additional critiques of CR:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/shortcomings.php
Honda does appear to produce some very reliable cars, but the way CR reports its results it's hard to tell how much more reliable they are than others.
03-03-2006, 11:22 AM
#36
Originally Posted by mkaresh
That would be the Armada.
Two problems with these numbers:
1. They can't count. They like to pretend that the results of a survey of 2001 models conducted in the spring of 2005, when these cars were 3.5 to 4.5 years old, measures "5-year reliability."
2. Their numbers continue to contain the same problems they did last fall. Notice that the Dodge Magnum V8 earns an average rating, but the 300 V8 is much worse than average. Other than a liftgate on the Dodge, they're the same car.
I've gone into issue #2 in more detail here:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/anomalies.php
Some additional critiques of CR:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/shortcomings.php
Honda does appear to produce some very reliable cars, but the way CR reports its results it's hard to tell how much more reliable they are than others.
Two problems with these numbers:
1. They can't count. They like to pretend that the results of a survey of 2001 models conducted in the spring of 2005, when these cars were 3.5 to 4.5 years old, measures "5-year reliability."
2. Their numbers continue to contain the same problems they did last fall. Notice that the Dodge Magnum V8 earns an average rating, but the 300 V8 is much worse than average. Other than a liftgate on the Dodge, they're the same car.
I've gone into issue #2 in more detail here:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/anomalies.php
Some additional critiques of CR:
www.truedelta.com/pieces/shortcomings.php
Honda does appear to produce some very reliable cars, but the way CR reports its results it's hard to tell how much more reliable they are than others.
6. Stale information
Consumer Reports mails out surveys each spring, then first reports the results the following November. As a result, when a new vehicle is introduced in the fall its reliability isn't reported until over a year later. This is a long time to wait for someone interested in a hot new design; by the time its reliability is known it will no longer be hot.
In a related issue, the vehicles reported on aren't as old as Consumer Reports suggests. For example, while "three-year-old vehicles" are, on average, three years old at the time the auto issue appears, they were only about two years old when the problems were reported, and only about one year old at the beginning of the period being reported upon.
In contrast, TrueDelta plans to update its ratings quarterly, and (given a large enough sample) will first report reliability four months after a new vehicle reaches dealers.
Consumer Reports mails out surveys each spring, then first reports the results the following November. As a result, when a new vehicle is introduced in the fall its reliability isn't reported until over a year later. This is a long time to wait for someone interested in a hot new design; by the time its reliability is known it will no longer be hot.
In a related issue, the vehicles reported on aren't as old as Consumer Reports suggests. For example, while "three-year-old vehicles" are, on average, three years old at the time the auto issue appears, they were only about two years old when the problems were reported, and only about one year old at the beginning of the period being reported upon.
In contrast, TrueDelta plans to update its ratings quarterly, and (given a large enough sample) will first report reliability four months after a new vehicle reaches dealers.
First posted: September 5, 2005
Last updated: October 26, 2005
Last updated: October 26, 2005
03-04-2006, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Zeuser
That's just Truedelta trying to sell themselves as better than CR. Hardly a credible source for CR critiques. 
I learn from intelligent debate. The cheap shots from the gut don't help.
03-04-2006, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by leedogg
interesting.... I read this:
and then I read this:
and then I read this:
That said, if someone provides a valid correction to my critique, or brings new information to my attention that suggests that my critique is out of date, then you'll see an update.
03-05-2006, 09:21 PM
#39
A valid correction to your critique
Originally Posted by mkaresh
This is an article. How often are articles usually updated? About never?
That said, if someone provides a valid correction to my critique, or brings new information to my attention that suggests that my critique is out of date, then you'll see an update.
That said, if someone provides a valid correction to my critique, or brings new information to my attention that suggests that my critique is out of date, then you'll see an update.
Beyond that, the general suggestion that you engage in self-promotion on other people's websites is completely accurate. As we both know, Epinions is filled with literally dozens of your car columns. I sincerely compliment you on their generally high quality and informational content, but you must concede that you also pack each and every one with three paragraphs of boilerplate advertising for your own website. Under the circumstances, your outrage that someone would accuse you of a penchant for self-promotion strikes me as protesting just a bit too much.
03-06-2006, 09:27 AM
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You're absolutely right on the QX56. I can't believe I said Armada. Same basic truck, but different trim.
I'm not outraged. And I wasn't challenging the charge of self-promotion per se. What I was challenging was the suggestion that, because my site competes with CR, that whatever I have to say about CR is not credible.
I made some assertions. I asked that these be evaluated based on the facts. Note that no one has yet challenged my assertions based on their content.
We also have a question of causality. Do I disagree with CR's approach because I have my own site, or did I start my own site because I disagreed with CR's approach. The latter is definitely true.
But the former might also be true. Competition is generally good. It will keep me searching for ways to continuously improve my research, in part by noting weaknesses in other's approaches. And it might eventually encourage CR to update its practices. The Internet makes far more possible, yet they still do things the same way they did them twenty years ago.
I promote the site where it seems relevant. I don't just mention it anywhere and everywhere. And I don't mention it at all unless I feel I have some useful information to contribute. In this case I noted two issues with CR. I pointed people to the articles on my site in case they wanted more detail. I wasn't going to retype it all here.
I wrote reviews on Epinions for years before starting the site. I created the site because I was discussing prices in each review more thoroughly than you'll find in any car magazine, but prices and rebates changed so frequently that whatever I wrote was out of date within a month or two. Because it's not feasible to keep hundreds of reviews up to date, I opted to start a website that I could feasibly update at least once a month.
The same goes for the reliability information. Once it is up and running I'll have quarterly updates. I'm not going to update every review quarterly--the way Epinions is set up this would take forever.
The website was set up to complement the reviews, hence the mention in each one. I use the boilerplate, because otherwise people who read more than one of my reviews might think the sections say something new, and would waste their time reading them every time. I highlight these sections so that those who have read them in past reviews can just skip right over them.
I'm not outraged. And I wasn't challenging the charge of self-promotion per se. What I was challenging was the suggestion that, because my site competes with CR, that whatever I have to say about CR is not credible.
I made some assertions. I asked that these be evaluated based on the facts. Note that no one has yet challenged my assertions based on their content.
We also have a question of causality. Do I disagree with CR's approach because I have my own site, or did I start my own site because I disagreed with CR's approach. The latter is definitely true.
But the former might also be true. Competition is generally good. It will keep me searching for ways to continuously improve my research, in part by noting weaknesses in other's approaches. And it might eventually encourage CR to update its practices. The Internet makes far more possible, yet they still do things the same way they did them twenty years ago.
I promote the site where it seems relevant. I don't just mention it anywhere and everywhere. And I don't mention it at all unless I feel I have some useful information to contribute. In this case I noted two issues with CR. I pointed people to the articles on my site in case they wanted more detail. I wasn't going to retype it all here.
I wrote reviews on Epinions for years before starting the site. I created the site because I was discussing prices in each review more thoroughly than you'll find in any car magazine, but prices and rebates changed so frequently that whatever I wrote was out of date within a month or two. Because it's not feasible to keep hundreds of reviews up to date, I opted to start a website that I could feasibly update at least once a month.
The same goes for the reliability information. Once it is up and running I'll have quarterly updates. I'm not going to update every review quarterly--the way Epinions is set up this would take forever.
The website was set up to complement the reviews, hence the mention in each one. I use the boilerplate, because otherwise people who read more than one of my reviews might think the sections say something new, and would waste their time reading them every time. I highlight these sections so that those who have read them in past reviews can just skip right over them.
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