So I received a call from dealership where I purchased my RLX. "Karen" from DMV department told me that they paid DMV registration renewal of $596 on my car and that they want me to pay them back. I replied to her "What are you talking about? Why wasn't this brought up when I sign documents over a month ago?" She didn't have answers so she transferred me to GM. Sales Manager explained to me that at the time when I purchased my RLX (Oct. 17, 2020) , DMV registration renewal wasn't due yet so they didn't include it in the contract. Indeed, line item on my contract for "Vehicle License Fee" was "n/a". I had thought they would take a portion of our agreed sale price to pay for all applicable DMV fees...so I didn't question it. I would have no problems paying for DMV fees if they had explained to me when I signed contract that renewal fees would be due in a few weeks. Why in the world the finance guy didn't include it in contract and never told me anything about it, I explain the GM that this needs to be disclosed at time of purchase. I told him I shouldn't have to pay any fees that wasn't included in the contract. He threatened to turn the bill over to collections. I asked to see a copy of the bill, all he sent me was a copy of my registration which I already have. So what do you guys think about this? Seems fishy? Like I said, I will absolutely pay any official DMV fees if it was included in the contract. We already agreed on selling price including all applicable fees. I shouldn't have to pay anything extra afterwards. Calling a customer more than a month after purchase to demanding additional payments is appalling. Has this ever happened to any of you?

 

If it wasn’t in the contract, i would just tell them to pound sand.. sounds like someone messed up and now trying to recoup costs. I don’t think your liable to the dealer.

 

Now that I've looked over my signed contract vs informal quote from Salesman, it's clear that they screw up and forgot to charge me for Vehicle License Fee. I guess they just figured this out and trying to recoup costs from me. I'm not paying a cent. They can't hold me to anything not in signed contract. Shady crooks.

 

Strange story for sure. Just thinking about it though, wouldn’t you have pay the DMV fees anyway? Whether the dealership paid for it on your behalf after the fact, or whether you paid for the amounts at the time the contract was drawn, or if you just received a bill from DMV. Just look at it for a second from this angle. They may have goofed, ponied up the funds, and just want you to pay them back. They may have done you a favor if they paid the fees. What if the just didn’t pay the fees and for any reason you were stopped by police, in an incident, etc. and your ride was not legally supposed to be on the streets. That would really be an issue.

If the dealership could provide proof they paid the fees, you shouldn’t have issue with paying them back. Wonder if you could contact DMV to see if the fees were actually paid? If they can tell you the fees were paid, they probably won’t, or can’t tell you who paid them. But if they were paid, you know you didn’t pay them. Good luck with this.

 

I have received my registration and permanent plates from DMV just days ago. On the registration, my name is listed as the owner and the bank is the lien holder. All that looks proper so I'm not concerned if I get pull over by police. For whatever reason, the finance guy put "n/a" under Vehicle License fee on my contract. I have looked over my signed contract, the final sell price and all fees (except Vehicle License fees) are correct. My monthly payment number and finance rate are also all correct. So if the dealer really did forgot to include Vehicle License fee on my contract, that's not any of my concern. It's all signed by me and the finance guy. They are obligated to pay DMV fees to get my car properly registered. As far as I'm concerned, my dealing with them is done. My only obligation now is with the bank to make monthly payments on-time. Dealer have no rights to come back 50 days later to demand more money for DMV fees. What pissed me off is the sales manager threaten me with collections. What world does he live in where he thinks it OK to demand more money after contracts are signed? If my down payment check bounced or final payoff of my trade-in was incorrect, then I can see they have a case to rewrite contract. But in this case, all the numbers are correct, they already cashed my down payment and paid-off and sold my trade-in. The deal is done.

I have sent a email to sales manager and CC: all his boss, General Sales Manager and General Manager. I told them I was very displeased how they handled this case. They have no legal rights to demand for anymore money. I don't owe them a cent and refuse to pay anything extra. Ball is on their court now.

 

Just a quick response without opining as to the substance of the issue regarding a claimed lack of “legal rights” referenced in your post above but the dealership actually does have a legal (or rather equitable) claim against you even if the DMV fee amount in dispute is not provided in your written contract. Why not just split the bill and move on?

 

Because that was not our deal. I didn't agree to sell price + $596 bill a month later. I agreed to a certain sell price + all applicable fees which the salesman showed me on quote. Vehicle License fee was listed on this informal quote. Only after seeing all these number broken out did I agree to the sale. Why F&I guy left out VLF on official contract is unknown (probably a ploy to con me out of more money later). At the time of signing, I only cared that final sale price and my monthly payment was correct. I probably should have question why VLF was left blank, but at the time everything looked correct to me so it didn't occur to me that anything was wrong. Imagine if every dealer came back a month later demanding additional money from all their customers. They wouldn't be in business for very long if they're allowed to do that. I've purchased many cars, new and used, never had any issues like this. This dealer is full of BS.

 

Believe me - I get where you’re coming from and if it happened to me I would react largely the same way. I just wanted you to be aware that the dealership does, in fact, have a legal remedy IF they choose to employ it (that is a huge if right there) that will end up costing you more in your time OR time and money if you have an attorney involved on your behalf than the amount in dispute. Similarly, it would also cost the dealership more than the amount in dispute as well.

 

Of course I want to settle this ASAP and as equitably as possible. I left emails for GM and CC: other upper management personnel to call me back, haven't received any calls. Either they know they're full of BS or they're planning something. I'm prepared to make my case.

 

Maybe it is just me, but I don't see how you can dispute something you would/will have to pay anyway. Yes, the dealership screwed up. An obvious administrative error on their part. But that doesn't mean you should get your DMV fees waived because they failed to charge you for them when the contract was written. You still owe those fees. You're the owner of the vehicle for which those fees cover. Cut your check to the dealership. Express your displeasure with their poor accounting practices to them, cc corporate Acura customer relations and move on. That might not do much of anything, but at least you'll be done with the matter.

 

I agree. A simple clerical error without intent to deceive. I don't know the legalities here, but it seems you profited from their clumsy error, and they simply want a correction. I understand this was an unfavorable surprise that you naturally don't want to deal with. Doing what's right is not always easy, but is better in the long run.

 

You are absolutely right. As I've said in OP, I have no problems paying any legitimate DMV fees. I never asked dealer to cover my fees. After carefully analyzing my contract vs quote from salesman and some recollection from memory of negotiations, I've come to this conclusion:

Short answer: I already paid for all DMV fees, it was included in final sale price. I should not have to pay it twice.

Long answer: During negotiation with salesman, he was trying to push me to pay extra for Rockledge security system. It's nothing more than a cheap $50 glass break sensor which they installed in all of their cars on the lot. They inflate cost of this "security system" and tried to force me to pay $499 for it. I adamantly refused many times to pay for it and even told them to remove the damn thing, I don't want it and never asked for it to be installed in the first place. Went back and forth for 3 rounds with sales manager about removing this sensor. I almost walked out when they came back and said I can have the car at the price I wanted with this Rockledge security included free of charge. Apparently it's too much of a hassle for them to remove, lots of wiring. I tentatively agree to the deal and asked to see informal quote listing final sale price and all applicable fees. Salesman came back a few minutes later with a print-out (luckily I took a photo of this quote on my phone so I have it) showing agreed vehicle cash price with all fees...including in the fees column were (Doc prep $85, License $566, Tire/Battery/VTR $10.75 and Sales/Use tax $4225.13). They total it all up and gave me a breakdown of monthly payment based on certain down payment brackets of $10K, $12K, $14K, and $16K at 2.79% APR. I did the math to validate payments and chose to go with $12K down payment. We tapped elbows, the deal with agree by both side. Salesman told me to wait a few minutes while he had F&I draw up contract. Half an hour later they called me into F&I. Finance guy went over all the line items on contract with me. I noticed on the contract they were charging $499 for Rockledge plus a sales tax was $4272.53 and AVRS fee $30, which was slightly different than on quote. Curiously with the Rockledge + some of the extra fees it nearly add up the VLF fee. He reassured me that they are giving me Rocklege for free, but they had to included in the contract so they can get "kick back" for it. After carefully totaling up all the numbers, it nearly equal to quote and my monthly payment was very close, only a few pennies more. So I didn't question the method he drafted the contract. I should have question why he left VLF blank at the time, but I had assume to make the math work, he had to leave it blank so he can add in Rockledge otherwise adding VLF in the final price would be higher than agreed. So to summarize, I already paid for VLF, which is included in final sale price even though it was not listed on contract. Now the tricky part here is my recollected memory or words against them. I should have got in writing stating they are giving me Rocklegde for free. Will they use the blank VLF to force me to pay for it again, maybe...but I hope they do the right thing and accept that I already paid for VLF. In hindsight I should have demanded F&I draw up contract correctly listing VLF, oh well lesson learned.

Really appreciate you guys reading this long thread and offering your perspective. I'm a fair guy. I never asked for dealer to cover my DMV fees. If they had "forgot" to include VLF and did not include Rockledge on contract then that would be another story. I would have no issue immediately write a check to reimburse them for VLF fee that they paid on my behalf after purchase. But that's not what happened here. They're trying to make me pay VLF twice. That's absolutely wrong. I'll give dealer benefit of the doubt. Hope they analyze contract carefully with F&I guy and come to same conclusion as I did.

 

A somewhat complex situation with that Rockledge charge seemingly being informally swapped for VLF, then that deal being "forgotten", either intentionally or unintentionally. If they are sincere in all of this, they should agree to having you re-pay the VLF that they advanced on your behalf, if they also agree to repay you for Rockledge that you never wanted but were erroneously charged for. Financially, that seems pretty much a wash, so they should simply drop their claim of you owing them for VLF. If they disagree with such a settlement, the legal story seems murky, hard to tell who might win a small claims case.

 

Agreed, murky at best.
Or they should re-draw contract making it all correct this time. Not sure what the ramifications of this as I already made first monthly payment. Will they have to redo credit check and auto loans again? Not sure if I want to do that.

 

This underscores the importance of making sure everything is correct in a written contract before signing. I'm thinking of Judge Judy talking about everything being within the four corners of the contract. At this point there are factors both for you and against you if it went to court. The contract says you are buying the extra unwanted item, but on the other hand the dealer would have a hard time explaining why the VLF is n/a for this particular purchase. Ambiguities in a written contract are supposed to get interpreted most favorably to the party that didn't draw up the contract. Best if you can negotiate a solution.

 

#1 thing to remember about the dealers is: they are not your friend and they are in the business of making money... right way, or shady way - that is what they do. State and/or Federal Legislature letting them do it how they do it in the US is main factor to blame... however... back to the point:

If they came to you with the piece of paper where "(Doc prep $85, License $566, Tire/Battery/VTR $10.75 and Sales/Use tax $4225.13)" this was written, that alone is just a piece of paper - not an official document.
What you should be checking is the actual contract that you signed and that was processed. If they left VLF field BLANK (and not N/A) they can easily fill that out on their side and that's that - you are on the hook for paying it... Because I am sure in

By the time you explain and prove your point and have all the proof in the world, collections will dent your credit, etc. All the hassle in the world to think about, worry about, definitely worth considering how it will impact you, your time, nerves, etc.

My advice / what would I personally do if I was in your shoes:
- go preferred way #1...
- keep #2 option handy, as I am sure you will need to pursue it like 90% (dealers may be stubborn and not wanting to settle with giving free service, and
#3 - pay the fee, do not waste time, nerves, and potentially risk your credit to be dented by dishonest dealer...

details below:
1) Try to get service for free (transmission service, differential fluid service, 4-5 synthetic oil changes). That should be about $500-600 worth. I am sure the dealer will be more open to that option (that way $600 they tried to screw you over, they give you service instead).
The outcome is probably dealers offering some free service but not all I included above - after all, they will haggle and try to get you to agree on less than what you are asking... During negotiation to settle this, show them the copy of the price agreed upon (I still like that you have a photo of that, even if it's not usually a binding contract signed by two parties)
2) Contact Acura regional office and at the same time open BBB complaint - just so they feel the teeth of someone more formal and official... I am sure Acura corporate will not want a BBB complaint on their record for such a stupid dealer mistake...
Await the resolution and go after what the sale price promised was, and what was charged after all. Very important to Apparently dealer is trying to back out of the agreed-upon pricing and is leveraging blank field against you to retrieve ~$600
3) Contact Acura regional office, open up a case with them and wait their response... if their response is not a resolution to your complaint, go and pay the VLF fee to the dealer and move on with your life... some dealers are shady, some flat-out LIE, and some are fairly decent and very fair - but they will never be your friend... 99% of them do not even know details about the cars... just enough to make the sale happen, to push all through and there is that...

The most success you will probably have with Acura Corporate / Regional management vs individual Acura dealer... after all, dealers represent Acura...
Whatever you choose to do: Good Luck!



In my experience I learned a lesson with Nissan back 15 years ago: not only I was scammed out of extended warranty and $2000 vs "promised on paper" $600 pricing, but it gets worse: my floor panes RUSTED out after 6 years of owning the car... Nissan did not want to hear about it, out of warranty, it was not perforated through rust claim, etc. ... well, how I made Nissan pay around $1000 for repairs (replacement of floor panes in an independently certified body shop) was that my claim/complaint was for "selling me unfinished/incomplete vehicle that rolled off a production line without all required parts that it was designed to have". I had that independent body shop do a report and research on why it rusted so quickly: drain plugs were not installed causing the rust to spread ultimately blaming Nissan for failing to do this...
With the help of BBB Nissan ultimately asked "so what would you like us to do... simply said: I requested they cover fixing the rusted floors on 6yr old car" ... they paid it...
Lesson: This whole shitshow took me about 3 months of going back and forth, faxing over stuff, calls, call-backs, missed calls, etc. ... and for me 15 years ago $1000 was a lot of money... it still is today, but being more wise / older / experienced I guess - you want to consider how much is your time and nerves worth to you... because you can easily go and share your experience with this dealer online, and they will just need to lose ONE SALE - mission accomplished... BAD Review goes a long way...

 

@rl015 some great advice, thanks! On my contract VLF is filled in "N/A". In fact all empty line items are filled N/A. That's good news I guess. Hopefully they will call tomorrow and admit they're at fault and drop this ridiculous claim. If they persist, I will try other negotiation tactics offered here. I'm still giving the dealer the benefit of the doubt hence I haven't called them out by name yet, though many of you may already figured out who this dealer is.

 

This is definitely a strange and twisting story in reading all of these replies. I certainly can't relate because in NH (where I've lived my entire adult life), the only DMV-related item that a dealer can (must) do is to fill out the title application document, which gets submitted to the state DMV, and that the owner gets a copy of to hand off to their town clerk. After that, all license/registration must be done by the owner, first at the town level (registration fee yearly), then at the state level (plate fee yearly). Definitely keeps the paperwork simpler when buying/leasing. Good luck!

 

That is perfect! I would say Regional Acura contact along with the BBB should give good results. It will be easier to claim with all your documentation:

1. Dealer negotiated and agreed upon "THIS" price - here is the picture of what that deal looks like (you include a picture you took where it shows VLF is part of the negotiated price)
2. Dealer processed paperwork and contract was signed with VLF displaying N/A --- but your final price of the vehicle sold matches the #1 example, the picture you took of what the negotiated price was
3. Purchased the vehicle, financed whatever amount - the deal is closed...

Conclusion: The dealer making a mistake on the paperwork is not yours to pay. You paid the VLF via the overall price of the vehicle listed, a negotiated price that is...

Example: Agreed upon price was $30,000 (included $500 VLF) ... dealer did the paperwork and listed $30,000 on the vehicle price line that was agreed upon... ERROR! The dealer should have included a price of $29,500 and in the VLF field fill out $500... This in no way is YOUR fault... therefore you should not be on the hook to pay it...
I would be very surprised if Acura Regional and BBB turned their back and supported the dealer stating the buyer must pay the fee...

 

This is why I reacted they way I did when they called to demand more money. My deal was and is legitimate. I have paid for all fees already. What I think may have happened was DMV clerk at dealer was reconciling her accounting numbers for DMV payments. She saw that her dealership paid for my VLF but line item on contract was "N/A". So she assumed I didn't pay for VLF. She automatically calls me to demand payment without confirming first with her F&I manager. Sales Manager that I spoke to probably wasn't clue in on my deal with F&I either so he too demanded payment and threaten me with collections if I refused. Horrible customer service and they both should be reprimanded for their actions. Policies should be in place at dealer to check paper work between their internal departments first before contacting the customer. Even if I did legitimately owe them money, they should have sent a polite letter thru US Mail to explain the situation and offer ways to settle. Calling a customer at 2:30 pm on Friday afternoon to demand money, when I'm already stressed out at work, is not a good idea. Sales Manager got an ear-full from me and he deserved it. I have every right to be angry. Still giving them benefit of the doubt and hope they will call today to realize it is their error.

 

jdpdata, With all of the money that auto dealerships spend on advertising, you would think that they would realize that giving you a call and saying that they made a mistake and they will look after the VLF would be money well spent on their part. To continue to hassle you for money is undoing untold thousands of dollars in advertising. Bad word of mouth spreads much faster than good and reputation damage is very difficult/costly to reverse.

Your approach seems to be the fair and logical course of action as far as I'm concerned. Good Luck.

 

Update: Karen, DMV clerk from dealer, called me yesterday to explain why she asking me to reimburse them for Registration fees. She said that when I purchased my car on Oct 17, 2020, it still had more than 3+ months of registration left from previous owner so that's why they didn't list VLF fee on contract and didn't collect it from me at that time. Don't know if this is true or all BS. Isn't all dealership required to collect VLF fees from buyer at time of purchase regardless of when registration renewal is due? I told her I should not have to pay for VLF again since that fee was already included in the final price. I emailed her copy of the quote that listed all the fees including VLF and told her to talk to her F&I guy. He drafted the contract so that $499 Rockledge + some other misc fees offset VLF fee...not sure if what he did was legal. I'm now waiting for them to call me back.

Lesson learned, make sure contract is 100% accurate. Get everything in writing. Don't fall for BS verbal promises that is difficult to prove. If they don't agree to drop this BS claim, I will contact Acura Corporate, owner of dealership, and file complaint with BBB.

Here is snippet from DMV handbook. Dealers are required to collect proper DMV fees

 

Good progress, there will probably be somewhat of a back n forth w dealer and communicating how they figure this out... I still feel the dealer dropped the ball, they need to get crafty around how they handle this...
If I was the dealer to resolve this, I would get at least $1200 worth of maintenance service(s) and gave you all that but ask you to pay for the VLF $600 - that way it all ends up being wrinkle-free... but that's just me

 

Nah, I want nothing to do with BS dealership again. Fair thing for them to do is refund my $499 Rockledge fee which I never agreed to pay, then as soon as I receive the refund, I'll write them a check for VLF fee. Or they can rewrite the contract to make it correct, but that may be too much work to do. We have a local Acura dealer nearby where I go for all maintenance service. This other dealer is too far from me, it's a good 1hr drive.

 

UPDATE #2:F&I guy finally called me back. I explained to him that I did not want this crappy POS Rockledge in my car and asked for it to be removed and that they should issue me refund of $499. He agreed. So now I need to setup an appointment to go to dealership so they can deactivate Rockledge and issue me a refund. After all that is done, I will write them a check for $573 for registration fee. That sounds fair and resolution I wanted. What a freaking nightmare this turns out to be. If you buy a car with Rockledge pre-installed, ask for it to be removed ASAP and don't pay a penny for it. It's a POS $50 Glass Break Sensor that they up-charge to all their customers. Purely profit center for them.

 

UPDATE #3: They called back again. Now saying I can keep Rockledge, they don't owe me anything and I don't owe them anything. The two fees cancels each-other out. Simple resolution that should have been dealt with among themselves and not involve a call to the customer in the first place. I did ask for this agreement in writing so they don't come back a month later asking for anything else. Good riddance and I can finally sleep in peace tonight

 

[QUOTE=jdpdata;16666489]UPDATE #3: They called back again. Now saying I can keep Rockledge, they don't owe me anything and I don't owe them anything. The two fees cancels each-other out. Simple resolution that should have been dealt with among themselves and not involve a call to the customer in the first place. I did ask for this agreement in writing so they don't come back a month later asking for anything else. Good riddance and I can finally sleep in peace tonight [/QUOTE ]
Sanity finally prevails! Congratulations!

 

I worked at Acura dealer on Southern calfornia last year, and this sounds super fishy and scummy

Our policy was when registration was due within 90 days of sale, new registration would be paid at time of purchase (buyer would pay obviously and just be added to price).

Glad it worked itself out, but what a headache.

 

Glad it's done and over with, but really sorry that you had to go through this crap in the first place.

The lure of extra commission is sometimes enough for otherwise "good" people to forget their moral compass at home. The short-sightedness of this "gouge-em for every penny you can approach" is completely eclipsed by the instant gratification of a bigger payday.

Before I paint all auto salesman with the same brush, I have an outstanding rapport/trusting relationship with our Acura sales associate and I am sure there are many, many more like him out there. That said, he's been at the same dealership for 20 years, so he sees the value of long term customers.

 

This is what should have occurred after the very first call. You were charged for something you didn't want, and they forgot to charge you for something. The two boo-boo's net. Move on.

Lessons learned on both sides. Looks like both you and the dealer need to brush up on contracting. They need to review what they missed with the DMV fees, and you need to make sure you understand line by line what you are signing for. So the next time you are not spending monies on some cheap glass break alert system that probably doesn't work. Lets just hope you don't have to find out whether or not it works!

 

Definitely, the dealer tried to pull a fast one on you and make you pay the $600 fee ... what a sleazy move... all of the sudden now everything can be done, when you showed the will to fight on this... well done... I am very glad this has been resolved.
Good move on asking for this in writing so you can keep it for your records... that way collectors do not come knocking on the door in 2-3 months from now after a sleazy dealer decides to make your life more difficult.

 

The threat to turn the matter over to collections is particularly irksome. I have purchased my last four cars from the same Acura dealer; one reason I keep coming back is because I believe I am treated fairly and respectfully. Taking an honest disagreement about a fee and turning it into a collections threat tells me a lot about those guys at your dealership.

 

Yeah seriously, these guys are a bunch of clowns. They have wasted my time, caused me undue stress, and forever lost my business with any of their dealerships. All this back and forth for a mere $573. Don't they have anything else to do rather then go after me with a ridiculous claim. They should have never called me in the first place. Though they may have not broken any laws, what they did or tried to do was very unethical. I'm seriously thinking about writing a letter to the owner, David Wilson, to file a complaint.

 

Lessons definitely learned! As I've state in OP, I didn't realized anything was wrong with the way the contract was written. F&I guy told me he included Rockledge but it would cancel out the VLF, so I agreed. Big mistake. I should have refused it from the get go.

Sleaze balls for sure. They tried to make me pay for VLF twice, essentially. Wonder how many other of their customers they've scammed with this move. The Sales Manager was like "Would you like to take care of this fee right now on the phone with your credit card?" HELL NO! I said.
I check my credit reports annually, if I see any derogatory marks from them, I will be pissed for sure.

 

Dafuq? That's awful, but I'm glad the resolution was to your liking. Here in Ohio, would have been $54 for registration though...

 

I always have my lawyer look over stuff I have to sign. Same with my car purchase contract.

 

Dang only $54 to register car? Why am I paying 10X as much in California. I need to move out of this state.

I did all my due diligence with looking over contract before signing. I'm not unexperienced at buying cars and looking at contracts. This dealer was trying to pull a fast one on me afterwards. I fought back and prevailed. An honest dealership would never do anything like this to any of there customers. But then again are there such things as an honest car dealer?

 

Does he charge contract review fee, or it is a family friend who does this on-fly?

 

In Illinois, I believe there is no vehicle license fee, but rather only registration which is now $149 flat I think lol.
While we do not have a vehicle license fee, they get you at property tax which is super high lol, right up there with California and New Jersey.

 

It's part of the legal subscription that comes with my job. I find this service very useful.