CFoote

Geez, I better find myself a '11 or '12 RL to hold me over. This is silly...

JM2010 SH-AWD

I hope the car treats you well. It just got a scathing review in Consumer Reports, not because it does not perform well (it's essentially a Ferrari-built motor in the Chrysler 300 platform), but because of poor build quality, Chrysler parts bin materials, and so on. Looks like a cool car, but I'd easily pick the RLX SH for 16K less.

sp3334

If you click on "Go to 2014 RLX" at the bottom left of the nav bar on the left of the RLX home page, it goes back to the old landing page where it still shows the hybrid as "coming soon" and lists it in the pricing tab. So perhaps they are setting up to sell both the 2015 PAWS and the 2014 hybrid simultaneously.

George Knighton

I'm not sure that my observation is worth much, but for whatever it is worth....

I'm familiar with three Quattroportes in my small home town in the country. The owners are not all that happy with the quality.

mgalbr22

Not that I would even read anything that consumers reports has to say on cars. But if they gave something "a scathing review". I would be far more likely to consider the car in question. My priorities are not their priorities.
Go drive one with the twin turbo and awd and then post your own review.
I traded my granturismo f1 after four years and was sad to part with it but wanted a car I could drive year round.

mgalbr22

By the way, I'm not sure what report you were referencing, but this video review is just short of glowing and enthusiastic. I got the "blu emozione" as shown on the test car.
Enjoy:
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/v...2753028324001/

JM2010 SH-AWD

September 2014 CR at p.55 ("Even if you view the Ghibli as a four-door sports coupe rather than a cushy and accommodating sedan, those flaws and compromises are not befitting a car, such as ours, costing almost $90,000."); ("Many aspects of the car are undeveloped."); ("We found huge gaps in the trim and cheap looking switches from the Chrysler parts bin.") In the end, they gave it a 71 rating on their scale (compared, e.g., to a 96 for a S500 and an 89 for an LS460) - different kinds of cars, I know - and didn't recommend it.


I take these things with a grain of salt. I mainly rely on CR for reliability ratings. But I also consider what they say along with other reviews of cars too. But at the end of the day, all that matters is whether you like your car.

tsxacura

Not sure if anyone has seen this, and I'll paste the link at the end, but apparently cars.com has a price for the hybrid and seems that there's going to be a hybrid tech and a hybrid advance. http://www.cars.com/go/alg/index.jsp...=RLX&year=2015

2011TL

$68,181 for the hybrid Advance! I'll take if all the bugs are worked out, and they discount it $10k-$12k like they had to do to sell a handful of the PAW-S Advance.

If those prices are real then Acura is saying the RLX hybrid Advance SH-SH-AWD is worth about $23k more than the new TLX Advance SH-AWD. That is beyond stupidity.

tsxacura

I agree. I was shocked when I saw those prices. I know they won't, but I feel like Acura just needs to admit they were a bit lofty with their pricing, and fix it to better reflect the steep discounts they are giving. Maybe a 60-61k price tag for the hybrid advance would be a little better to compete with the GS/5/A6 pricing, then pricing the rest underneath.

getakey

is GS the right comparison?
compare Audi, Lexus, BMW with similar features
they are going to be right there

stagefoursurvivor

The Acura dealers will save a bundle since they won't need to hire additional security to handle crowd control!
The RLX debacle is just further evidence that Honda/Acura is clueless about marketing in the U. S. and their "flagship" will remain a minor league player in the market.

tsxacura

Audi, Lexus, and BMW all have well established players in the game and have the brand cachet and long-term sales to back up their prices. Acura was new to the game, and should've priced their car to compete better. The TLX is a great example of pricing done right IMO.

stagefoursurvivor

Completely agree!

getakey

You can have cachet, I'll take car

tsxacura

I think it could well be argued that if the vehicles are optioned the same way and also cost pretty much the same, most folks (proving by the sales) would choose the other cars. Value has always been Acura's bread and butter, but the RLX, in the minds of customers shopping in this class, does not seem to offer that value.

I hope whatever they're working on for MMC will try to alleviate this issue at least enough to justify the RLX's presence beyond just an "also ran."

hondamore

History tells us that the initial pricing is for early adopters and factory rebates and huge discounts usually come to those who are willing to wait for a while and negotiate the best possible deal. The full MSRP for the RLX is partially intended to enhance the car's flagship status but they are aware that discounts/rebates will be necessary to move any volume at all.

Here's how I look at Acura's pricing of the RLX:

- The MSRP of the RLX and RLX hybrid places it in the "good value for the features" category but not really a great deal.
- Acura sells to the early adopters at MSRP or close to it and make a healthy profit on each unit sold. This is the "gravy".
- Acura's core buyers are loyal Honda/Acura owners who are traditionally "budget conscious" and will grind out the best deal they can.
- Acura begins to discount the RLX in the form of rebates to dealers or lease deals etc. in order to move more volume BUT the car still keeps it's MSRP price. That way, every bargain hunter luxury car buyer feels good about their purchase - "I just bought a $70,000 RLX for $60,000 that is the best value EVER for all the features and performance in the car". It is always a $70,000 car regardless of the price paid.
- Acura has accepted that they cannot compete with the cache and snob-appeal of Mercedes and BMW(which took a hundred years to create) and so they make the best car they can and sell it for as much as they can. The RLX is a small volume flagship that they debut their latest technology in and is basically a place for loyal Honda/Acura buyers to park their money when they arrive in the luxury car phase of their lives.
- If Acura priced the RLX MSRP $10,000 less than it is, I don't believe they would sell significantly more units because of the nature of the luxury car buyer mentality, they would just sell them quicker. That is, all the bargain hunters sitting and waiting would buy one right away BUT the early adopter gravy would be gone and the $70k label and associated enhancement to the brand image would be gone.
- The RLX was never really intended to be a large volume seller - the pricing of the TLX suggests that is where they hope to generate sedan sales volume. The RLX is the flagship sedan with all the latest technology that sells to loyal buyers and those true enthusiasts who can look past the badge on the grill. The TLX is the step below in features allowing the value pricing with profits made on volume sales.
- If at some point the SHAWD RLX is available for $58,000- $60,000 , that represents a GREAT value for a great car and plenty of loyal Acura people on this forum will be adding their names to the RLX Owner Sign-in thread.

This is just my best guess at Acura's thinking in the pricing of the RLX.

wstr75

Count me in regarding your quote above. You are right on with all of your post's comments.

JM2010 SH-AWD

Even at a sticker of 68K one ought to be able to purchase the car after the first months of on-sale for 62K (10% off MSRP). I think at 62K the SH RLX would be a good value.

Type-S RPh

I see more opportunity with the Tech at 62k and change. Give me 8-10K off that baby and we are talking mid 50s for that car. Now that is a steal!!!

neuronbob

at $58-60k.

I hope for reasonable pricing.

TampaRLX-SH

I will wait to see what Acura announces the pricing at. Then wait 6-12 months to see what fallout there is, if any, mechanically and how Acura addresses it.

On one hand I wonder if the 'order and build' sales model will support the higher pricing. On the other hand I have to agree that the price gap between real world PAWS sales pricing and SH will have to be reasonably minimized.

This rollout is awful. Fortunately Acura does not have a huge RLX audience to even take notice.

Waiting...waiting....waiting.....

eladts

On AOL Autos and AutoGuide:

Tech - $59,950
Advance - $65,950

http://autos.aol.com/acura-rlx+sport+hybrid/
http://www.autoguide.com/new-cars/2014/acura/rlx/

hondamore

The dealer invoice pricing listed on AOL Autos is $54.731 Tech and $60,160 for the Advance. Those (or a little better) become my pricing target and they appear very attractive indeed.

TSX69

Acura RLX Hybrid Delay "Technical"

Acura planned to debut its RLX Hybrid sedan in spring 2014.

But spring came and went, and as of midsummer the car still is not available for purchase in the U.S.

Rumors abound about the RLX Hybrid’s delay, but Mike Accavitti, senior vice president and general manager of Acura in the U.S., is tight-lipped, saying the car isn’t on sale yet due to a “technical” issue.

“I can tell you that it just hasn’t met with our expectations yet,” he tells WardsAuto in a recent phone interview.

Purported reasons for the car’s delay range from a lithium-ion-battery shortage to engineers needing to work out the kinks of the car’s 3-electric-motor Super-Handling All-Wheel-Drive system.

The RLX’s powertrain setup is similar to that in the future NSX supercar, a prototype of which went up in flames last month while undergoing testing on Germany’s Nurburgring track. However, the RLX Hybrid has a more modest output than the NSX, requiring less cooling.

The RLX Hybrid will make 377 hp via its powertrain: 3 electric motors paired to a 3.5L direct-injected V-6. The NSX is expected to make more than 500 hp from a mid-mounted V-6 with twin turbochargers mated to 3 electric motors.

Accavitti expects RLX Hybrid sales to commence relatively soon, noting some units were on a boat from Japan in late July.

“They should be arriving here within the next month or so, and hopefully they’ll get to dealerships soon after that,” he says.

While the RLX Hybrid is expected to be a niche vehicle for Acura, Accavitti says the unique 3-motor/AWD technology under its hood lends cachet, and the Honda near-luxury brand is “looking forward to getting that in the marketplace as soon as we can.”

For the past year, Acura’s U.S. dealers have had only the front-wheel-drive non-hybrid RLX flagship sedan to sell. Volume, while up through July, is a fraction of what the segment’s top sellers racked up.

From January through last month, RLX deliveries rose 7.1% over the same period year-ago, to 2,285 units.

The Mercedes E-Class and BMW 5-Series sold 41,244 and 33,293 units, respectively, in the 1st 7 months. The totals made the German cars the No.1 and No.2 top-selling models through July in WardsAuto’s Middle Luxury Car segment.

However, the RLX is performing better than its predecessor, the RL, did in its final years.

From 2009 through 2012, RL sales ranged from a peak of 2,043 to a low of 379.

The 2nd-generation RL’s best volume, 17,572 units, was in 2005, the car’s 1st full year of sale.

Accavitti says Acura has plans to boost FWD RLX sales but won’t go into detail.

“That’s a real difficult segment to compete in,” he says. “We’re never really satisfied with our sales rate. I’m not. I think we can always do better.”

stagefoursurvivor

Personally, I find it insulting he isn't being candid regarding the reason for the delay.
I have some familiarity with corporate secrecy and this wreaks of engineering ineptitude.
This will hurt sales because it creates, or lends to, a worry of, is it the batteries, the rear tire rod failures or ??

KeithL

And again, with limited sales even when it ships they need a traditional SH-AWD model ASAP.

stagefoursurvivor

Not a bad idea but, very unlikely unless the RLXh is a complete disaster

Shiratori1

Gotta love the armchair experts and their "outrage" within this thread. Going off of nothing but speculation and unconfirmed information.

TampaRLX-SH

Being told 'Coming Soon' for months....
Ad campaigns 'We are there yet'
Disappearance of ads or mention of the vehicle
Silence from Acura

That is all real. None of that is speculative.

It is baiting and approaching fraudulence.

George Knighton

To do that with the 5G Legend would require a third stamping design of the same basic body.

I wish they'd thought of that, but I don't see it happening.

At this point, I'm imagining I'll have my P-AWS RLX as a long term car, just like all the other Hondas I've bought. :-)

hondamore

I'm also disappointed in Mike Accavitti's response. He could have won a lot more friends and gained more patience from the masses had he responded, "We love the performance of the new hybrid RLX but at the last minute in testing we discovered an easy way to add substantially MORE performance and so we've made the choice to implement those changes in all of the Hybrid RLX's before we ship them. We know there are plenty of loyal Acura buyers chomping at the bit to get one, but we just couldn't pass up the opportunity to make a great car even better. Thanks for your patience - you won't be disappointed."

Accavitti's reply suggests that George Knighton's assumption that they've gone back to the drawing board to get a better 0-60 time out of the hybrid is likely correct.

Acura needs to hire a new PR firm or hire any one of a number of Acurazine enthusiasts to write their press releases.

neuronbob

Bleh. Vaporware.

TampaRLX-SH

The only vapor Acura has produced on this front is offensive smelling and a public embarrassment.

hondamore

^^^ At this moment, VP Mike Accavitti is disappointed and not yet impressed by the stench of the flatulence he is producing but hopes that you all line up with $70,000 cash in your pockets until he can do better. Engineers at Saitama are apparently shipping a new mix of beans and cabbage to the executive in a last ditch attempt to satisfy his needs.

Edward'TLS

^^^^^

Not many potential $70K luxury sedan buyers have such patience to wait and wait and wait, before off they go to other luxo sedans that are readily available from other competitor brands.

neuronbob

Bleh. Vaporware.

And LOL.

CFoote

sigh. So frustrating -- my guess is that this car won't hit until Spring....

This segment isn't hard to crack -- make a killer product (we know Honda can do that), sell it at a great price, and rack in the sales from the Germans and Japanese competitors. This isn't rocket science...

I found a late model low mileage RL. I don't know whether to pull the trigger or not. My RL is at 130k and is running like a top, but I'm not sure how much I want to push it. Cars are not pocket change in cost. Ugh!

CFoote

Ok then, tell us what you know. TampaRL is exactly right -- we've been going off what we've been hearing in the news, and while some of that may be rumors, most of it is fact.

JM2010 SH-AWD

I suspect you have a good 50-60K to go on your RL before you begin incurring substantial repair/replacement costs.