Philisophe

Acura RLX did better than

.....................Select Audi..Lexus Jaguar Large Cars..tied BMW..however ..............Tesla Model S Crushes Large Luxury Car Competition ( 2017 US Sales)

I just wrote a piece putting Tesla’s H1 2017 sales into a bit of perspective. At the end, I started getting into Tesla sales versus gas vehicle sales in the Model S and Model X classes, but then decided this topic deserved its own piece. Aside from looking at sales in the first half of 2017, I wanted to jump into sales in the first half of 2016 and how sales of these various models changed from H1 2016 to H1 2017.

Since Tesla doesn’t report sales by country/region but CEO Elon Musk has said on a few occasions that US sales have been about half of global Tesla sales, I’ve essentially run with that for my estimates. Note, though, that it’s been a while since Elon has said anything about how sales are split. The other figures come from Good Car Bad Car (thanks for compiling the data, dudes).

One more thing to note before jumping into the numbers is that I’ve broadened the competitors a bit beyond the size of the Model S and Model X since there’s extremely limited choice in the luxury electric car market. Electric vehicles are very different animals from gasoline cars and many buyers choose them specifically because they want zero-emissions cars, independence from oil, and/or instant torque. Tesla Model S buyers range from people who would like an Audi A6 size car to an Audi A8 size car but basically just have the Model S to choose from in those general arenas. The topic is actually much more nuanced and complicated than simply throwing the A6, A7, and A8 together (Tesla pulls buyers who previously had anything from a Honda Civic to a Lamborghini), but we don’t have all day to discuss these matters and you get the point.



The first key takeaway for me from looking at those numbers is that all of these models have seen their sales decline year over year except the Porsche Panamera and Tesla Model S. It has been a similar story in recent years as well. Does the Model S just keep pulling buyers away from these conventional large luxury car models? That seems likely, but it’s surely not the only thing at play.




On that note, though, an experience I had this week comes to mind. A few other guys and I recently got a Tesla Model S 85D for a European intercity Tesla Shuttle service we’re launching. The Model S was sitting outside of the coffee shop I call my office yesterday and a couple of super fit guys were taking a close look at it. I came over and offered to open it up and let them poke around. They were impressed — seriously impressed. It was cooler, had higher tech, had more range, had more space, and was quicker than they expected. The navigation screen stood out as huge — something you can just never capture in photos alone. Talking to them for a few minutes and then scanning the parking lot, I soon found out they had very luxurious and high-powered new Mercedes (a large sedan and an SUV). From an initial show & tell, despite probably no concern for the climate or air quality, I feel like they opened their eyes to the possibility of getting a Tesla down the road instead of another Mercedes. Who knows, but I told them we could go for a drive sometime, and I have a feeling that’ll make them think much more about the switch.

The point is: I wonder how many stories like that occur every day. A lot of people had their first Tesla experience yesterday. A lot of people had their first Tesla experience today. A lot of people will have their first Tesla experience tomorrow. Those experiences are by and large eye-opening introductions into a whole new world.



Related: Big Auto’s Fully Electric Car Sales Up 102% In USA

Another dramatic point from the table and chart above is how far ahead the Model S seems to be. Even if you add up Audi A6, Audi A7, and Audi A8 sales, they don’t get up to the Tesla Model S sales estimate for 2017. It looks even worse for the old automakers if you add up BMW 7 Series and Mercedes-Benz S-Class sales. Adding up Audi A6 and Mercedes-Benz S-Class sales is the only way to actually get two models to surpass Model S sales.

What will the story be when Tesla Model 3 production and sales ramp up? Will Audi A6 sales get demolished even further? Will Tesla awareness skyrocket, leading to even more Model S sales? Will Mercedes, BMW, and/or Audi have to shut down certain models (or even worse)? Or perhaps Model 3 sales will hurt Model S sales? I’m guessing the first three possibilities will come to fruition but not the last one. I think Tesla’s main Model S demand softener right now is simply lack of consumer awareness.



The Model S

Richard Howells

Well after reading this wonderful column I guess I will have to retract a couple of statements I made because my facts weren't totally correct. With that said there is still plenty of disappointment for the RLX between the years of 2013 and 2018. I have discovered that I can get most of all of the features back starting with the 2018 RLX sport hybrid model, which gives me back my fog lights my rear automatic sunshade and rear side shades and yes even my ball chiller. So here's the catch I have to buy a hybrid to get those features and my all-wheel drive. As I said before I love my 2009 RL. It has all of that and a gasoline engine. So with my 2009 RL purchase I was absolutely totally 100% satisfied, that I got the car I wanted and in the perfect color. So I'm about to look for a 2018 sport hybrid but at the end of the day I'll still be not 100% satisfied because I don't like to drive a hybrid car. Acura would have done a lot better of just discontinuing the front wheel drive version and making two versions of the RLX and all-wheel drive gasoline engine and the all-wheel drive hybrid version. The only consolation is that from what I've read in sport mode the engine will not shut off every time I stop at a light. So I patiently wait for a 2018 sh hybrid to come off lease in the right color. Now I understand why there are dozens of 2018 RLX front wheel drive versions on the internet for sale it very very good pricing actually below Market. Nobody wants one.

at the end of the day I feel a little better because most of what I said was wrong provided that I can find a 2018 hybrid with the right color choice for me. Thanks for listening

mk5

I think any RLX Sport Hybrid Advance pkg from 2014-present will fit your requests. They all have the sunshades and the seat coolers. The 2016-present has the 360 degree camera.

If you keep the car in Sport mode all the time, the engine will never shut off and you'll not really use the hybrid battery at all. It will charge it up, that's for sure. That will take care of the "hybrid" issue, and you get the benefit of the SH-AWD.

I came from every Honda in the world, then a TLX (which was too small and cramped for my needs) and ultimately an RLX. I told my wife just the other night that I would buy another one or a Tesla X if I had carte blanche for a family sedan today. The car does have it's quirks and the technology should've been updated/updatable (the 2015 TLX had Siri Eyes free and the 2014-2020 RLXs do NOT), but it has been a fantastic car. Roomy, lots of power and good mileage, which is what I was looking for.

mrgold35

The RLX Sport Hybrid only has two modes of default Normal at start-up and Sport mode you have to select everytime after engine start up. Sport Mode disables Auto Stop-Start, holds gears longer, and charges the battery pack to 100% for max time with full 377hp/341tq. The RLX sport hybrid will drive just like the fwd RLX with the 3.5L: but, the RLX sport hybrid will have more TQ and quicker response to throttle inputs because of the 7DCT and 3 electric motors. Power of a turbo with the response of a supercharger is how the sport hybrid feels to me. The only way someone knows your car is an hybrid is when you are cruising at low speeds and the RLX makes a funny "UFO" whirling/humming sound you can only hear from outside of the car instead of a regular engine sound. You still get the full power in normal mode; but, the battery pack might not be charged 100% for longer power runs.

I've driven non-hybrid RDXs and MDXs with auto stop-start and the hybrid system is way smoother in engagement. Depending on how you drive, you might not notice or feel the EV to engine transition unless you like to accelerate hard. I would drive the +18 fwd RLX with the 10AT compared to the hybrid to see how each feels. So far, I've haven't seen my mpgs below 26 in the city and as high as 34 mpg on the hwy.

Limelight

Driving the SH in Sport mode all the time would not be enjoyable - it’s far too aggressive in typical scenarios for me anyway. Simply put, it’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Sure it’s nice when you need to pass quickly or when you’re feeling sporty or teach someone a lesson, but I would never use it all the time. It really needs three modes in my opinion - ECO, normal and sport. I could use more “sport” in normal mode and perhaps a little less in Sport mode.

When I was contemplating the Sport Hybrid, I too said I would hate the auto on/off in EV mode, but it’s a non issue really and you get the benefits of fuel economy. I often joke that I bought a 377HP car yet spend most of my time behind the wheel trying to see how far I can go without engaging the ICE lol.

psheu

What's not to like about the hybrid? It's the best of both world (better fuel economy and added more power). RLX SH is the total package without the breaking the bank. That's why I jump back into another one in a heart beat

mqs1

Got the 16SH back from service (new battery under warranty, rear caliper TSB, alignment and AS3+ put on) and I gotta say the car feels as fresh and tight as when I picked it up 3 years ago (got the all important transmission flush/remap TSB last year). Man I love this car.
I wasn't a hater of the OEM tires like some here (got almost 40k out of them) but the AS3+ does make the ride smoother and quieter, probably should have switched them out sooner.
On the radar: the steering column making the TSB squeal periodically but the dealer couldn't recreate it. Be diligent with the transmission flush. The brakes are STILL at 9/10 so it seems a non-maintenance items now?!
The "bones" of this car are so good that Acura IMO for next generation would just need to improve the infotainment, smooth out the ride a bit, freshen up the interior and take some weight out and it would be good to go and competitive.
The 2020RDX loaner was a bit of a disappointment unfortunately; poor throttle response, ride and incredibly the infotainment system still sucks (although I didn't use CarPlay). Reafirmed to me that I prefer a sedan than an SUV unlike my wife who is very interested to see how the next gen MDX will look like.
I think I'll take her to steamboat springs next week and test out the tires.

hondamore

Richard Howells, I feel confident in saying that, if you love your '09 RL, you will love the RLX Sport Hybrid even more. It is much roomier, significantly faster, handles better (the SHAWD technology works even off-throttle), obviously MUCH better fuel economy and even rides smoother and quieter than your RL. The engine-off technology is seamless thanks to the electric motors, you wouldn't really notice it if not for the tachometer needle dropping to 0 every now and then.

To be honest, I bought the Sport Hybrid version of the RLX simply for the AWD feature but I have since become a HUGE fan of the hybrid technology (so much so that I bought my wife an MDX Sport Hybrid as well). As I've said many times before, the weakness of any of the Honda engines is that they don't really make their power until you get the revs up. With the Sport Hybrid, you have INSTANT torque available from the electric motors to boost the ICE until the revs climb into VTEC range. The other obvious benefit, which had ZERO influence on my buying decision, is the fuel economy and, as Limelight mentioned above, I too have become obsessed with my car's fuel economy. I couldn't care less about the money savings because I drive so little, but it is just so cool to drive across town in stop and go traffic and then look and see that you got 35+ mpg on the trip.

My advice would be to go for an extended test drive and see for yourself. There has been a saying on this forum for quite a while...If you drive it, take your checkbook because you are going to buy it.
Good luck in your search for a new vehicle.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

While I had my Blackbird as I liked to call it, I enjoyed driving it very much. It was both stealthy in that it didn't draw attention to itself, but it also had real road presence. It looks wide and big which can be viewed as intimidating. Every time I see one come up behind me (which is rare), it has a menacing look about it, almost as if it has attitude. The new Mustang has that similar look in my mind, even though they have nothing in common. It is just my interpretation. If I wanted to drive it limo smooth I could. If I wanted to act like a Hoonigan it was a sport mode click away. So was a felony speeding ticket. My time with it has past, but my experience with it is still fresh in my mind. I am not sure if I coined the comment or just supported someone else, but it is true if you are going to test drive it, bring your check book.

Richard Howells

thanks so much for putting a smile back on my face I was beginning to give up hope. Happy to hear that the hybrid version has good marks. And yes very happy to hear of the increase gas mileage. If I can find a 2018 sh hybrid going to do some color I will try to make a move on it I give my 2009 RL to my son. LOL can't bear to part with it. So I think I have just made the decision to stay with Acura and hunt for the right car. I must say in the past 20 years now I have not been unhappy or any Acura that I've driven.

Thanks.