Tesla1856

I'm guessing Level-5 shows around 37% Compressed,
while
Level-0 (what yall are calling "No Compression") would show around 0% Compressed.

I don't have dBpowerAmp installed. I was hoping the parameter was available in Foobar2000 or Media-Info and I was just missing it.

EFR

Well, the mystery is (hopefully) finally resolved. Interesting because last night I read in a different blog about ELS and 0 compression, so maybe something to this. Admittedly know little to nothing about this stuff, but I thought FLAC was always lossless (assuming that means the same as 0 compression...

oblio98

ACURA/ELS 3D Studio Audio System

• WILL PLAY STEREO: [16/44, 24/44, 24/48, 24/96 .flac (any compression) and .wav files]
  WILL NOT PLAY STEREO: [24/192 .flac or .wav]
  
• WILL PLAY PROPERLY IN 5.1: [5.1 24/48 .wav files], [5.1 24/48 .flac files with ZERO compression]
  WILL NOT PLAY PROPERLY IN 5.1: [5.1 24/96 .wav files], [5.1 .flac files with > ZERO compression)], [DTS encoded .wav files]

The above is from my original 2018 post created in the quad (Surround) music forum:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/for...-system.25174/

oblio98

.flac is lossless, regardless of the compression. Normally people use Level 5 because it gives the best quality and the best storage size for files. The more compression, the smaller the file. I am no expert, and cannot understand why the ELS system needs zero compression on 5.1 files but not stereo files, but it's true. When I first tested the 5.1 in the car before I bought it, I was bummed because my 5.1 wav files played in 5.1 but my flac's did not. The reason I was bummed was because you can tag a flac file with graphics and info, but although it's possible to tag a wav file with graphics and info, the car will not read that tagging if the file is a wav.

Bottom line is this for 5.1. Format the USB as exFAT, it can be a BIG USB, like a Samsung T-5 or T-7 with 500Gb, 1 Tb, etc, and it will work fine in the car, but you must convert your wav and flac files to Zero Compression if you want them to work properly. Foobar is the easiest way to do it (for me). You can save the settings, then just select 'Acura', or whatever you want to call it, and you're done!

Tesla1856

Yes, easy enough to set FLAC Level-0 on your favorite Conversion Preset (Acura compatible).

But what about all these existing "perfect" Level-5 flac files I have? Can I create a Conversion Preset that will simply drop down to Level-0 ... BUT leave everything else the same?

EFR

and foobar is for windows only?

oblio98

YES!!! The only thing I would suggest is changing the destination directory from default (the same directory where the original files are located) to a new folder called 24-48 Zero or something like that. This way you are sure that the Zero Compression files are not mixed up with the Level 5's.

You will not lose any sound quality, although I believe you will have to re-tag them as they are now different. I will have to verify that when I get a chance

oblio98

Ed,
No, But I cant speak to it as I never have used it, but here's the link:

https://www.foobar2000.org/mac

EFR

OK, thank you. Don't now how I missed that...I thought I read Windows only (which is not unusual for us Mac users---left out of quite a bit of stuff---radar detectors are my latest annoyance that don't play well with Mac)
Anyway, that's some qualifier Foobar adds---LOL....

This application is provided as-is. It is by no means complete, though most of the features implemented are known to work reasonably well.

DrWoo

The DB files avive in this thread….I ran them through foobar with 0 compression and they retained all the tag info.

oblio98

Awesome. I wasn't sure, so I didn't want to give you bad info. Just covered my butt, I did!

Tesla1856

I saw the same.
Makes sense as (like other items left un-defined in Foobar2000 Preset) during a Convert ... they are not messed with.

It is interesting that you can't just set an output folder, and have it use the original file-names.
I had to set to:
%Artist% - %track% - %title%
Which is a good one, and the one that matches their existing structure.

Tesla1856

OK, let’s try this again. Third-time is the charm.
I have removed the FLAC compression (FLAC Level-0).
- For 5.1 / 6-channel compatibility on Acura ELS

https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...D4?usp=sharing


Fleetwood Mac : The Dance (Live Concert) Video-DVD with Dolby Digital 5.1 Tracks
-
Converted to 48khz-24bit 6-Channel FLAC tracks (by me from original DVD with Audio-Muxer).
Edited ID3-Tags in Mp3Tag and Paint.
Foobar2000 for FLAC Level-5 to FLAC Level-0 (No FLAC Compression) on this new fm-dance-level-0.zip file.

They also work on home-theater, but in that case … sometimes watching the DVD instead is a better entertainment experience (it’s 4:3 aspect-ratio but still well done).
Sorry for any trouble, but glad it seems we figured it out.

Please report back like before.

Tesla1856

The Doobie Brothers : The Captain and Me (1973)

The SACD released in 2011, directly converted to 48khz-24bit 6-Ch Level-0 FLAC tracks.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...Dm?usp=sharing

Please verify it works on Acura ELS.

New Zip file should be uploaded and online in an hour or so.

Tesla1856

I don't think so, at least not here.

FM Track #1
- Original Level-5 file, shows 41% Compressed. As expected, the file-size is a little smaller than the other.
- Ran through Foobar2000 to drop-down to Level-0. dBPowerAmp now shows 38% Compressed.

Tesla1856

Yall are pretty quiet. Anyway ...

I went ahead and downloaded the posted fm-dance-level-0.zip (just to double-check).
It tests fine (so that's good). I un-zipped it and put those file on my car's main 64gb flash-drive.
Of course, they still play fine on my Audi B&O (as Level-0 files).

On these current tracks (FM and DB), after I ran them through Foobar2000, I added "Level-0" to the Comments of each file (it's easy in your favorite MP3/FLAC tagger). Might not be such a bad practice since there might not be a reliable way to properly identify FLAC files that are already "Level-0".

HillbillyInBC

Back when I first started down this rabbit hole, I found a reference somewhere on the Web which noted that FLAC files with compression can be identified by frames tagged with the identifier "LPC". I use variations of the following Bash command in scripts to detect such frames (uses the command-line flac tool that you can easily install on a Mac using Homebrew):

This opens every FLAC file in the current directory, prints the file name, then prints a one if the file has compression enabled or a zero if not.

You can also use the flac command-line tool to read an existing file with compression and create a new version without compression, but this is left as an exercise for the reader.

ELIN

This version worked fine whereas the previous one didn't. Thanks!

EFR

Ditto. All work perfect. Glad this was resolved and thank you!

Tesla1856

Cool.

Ironic that Acura would glitch-out on something surround-sound related. They were pioneers in bringing multi-channel audio to the car.

Also interesting that they didn't go back and fix it on 2021-TLX. At least the work-around is painless (once you know of Acura ELS - FLAC Level-0 limitation the first place).

How are you liking the dual-subs in the new TLX ?

ELIN

Bass response has been fine so far but ultimately the content is crucial. It's weird because some tracks where you expect lots of LFE you don't get it and some other tracks you do.

My car recently experienced an update and I noticed the default volume for music appeared to be higher. I know some equate "louder" to being "better" without knowing the volume was increased but I've done enough comparison tests on my home theater to avoid that trap....mostly.

Funz51

i don’t see the hub bub of the zero compression. There is nothing to’ fix’. It is a limitation like anything else. The zero compression has been documented for years. Just b/c flac has compression that can be used does not mean it had to be used. It does not save much space anyhow and GB’s are cheap. 192k recordings cannot be played either…. Just a limitation.

Tesla1856

I guess one guy's glitch/bug is another's "undocumented feature" or just an accepted limitation as you say.

All I'm saying is that for a machine or device to properly "support FLAC files" it should play all valid variations of FLAC files (including those that might be multi-channel and/or flac-compressed). Is is after all, in the Specification.

It might have been documented long ago, but some of us here recently did not get the memo. And not everyone has Foobar2000 or other capable software installed. They just want to play some music.

I do agree that the space-savings for Level-5 (or any level) of FLAC Compression is very little and irrelevant. For now on, I will set all to Level-0. Like you said, no big deal. Thanks for the help.

Tesla1856

Checkout the Sugarcult (main link is above)

I know it's old but I recently came by a new (re-imagined ?) video-version. Now I can't stop playing it (mostly in the car, at around 70% volume). I even bought the MP3 for $.0.90 . It sounds the best.

But I'm noticing that a lot lately.
These multi-channel, re-mastered and/or Hi-Res versions of these old songs, they sound REALLY GOOD in these new cars. A little dash of the system's DSP effects brings even 2-ch MP3 to life.

EFR

Yes. I mentioned this to another poster here recently. These 5.1 FLAC songs are sometimes like listening to some of this stuff for the first time ever, it's that good. I don't recall ever hearing of Sugarcult, but checked in with my daughter and she knew who they were....said they use to be pretty popular. I like the video.. I also saw a song in your files '...featuring Dia Frampton'. I remember her from one of the singing competition shows a few years ago....The Voice or something. I thought she would have a pretty good career, but don't recall ever hearing of her again (par for the course for these shows I guess). Thank you again for the music you made available. As I have said before...too bad you cannot but these 5.1 songs in the same way you can songs on I-Tunes. I'm sure if the market was strong enough someone would make it available, but in the mean time those of us that appreciate quality sound depend on people like you and others that have posted links. Thanks!!!

Tesla1856

1. The PG version (flight into LAX) is good too and has some cool added sound effects.

2. Nice. Didn't know who she was. I do know that she did real-good on that Crystal Method track (making it one of the best on the whole Asphalt-8 Soundtrack). Yeah, we race on Apple-TV.

3. You are welcome. Like someone said, lots of music genre. There are some websites. Like HDTracks.com , but not sure how to filter by Multi-Channel (or if any are).

Tesla1856

Did everyone get it that wanted it ... the DB-Captain files?

Was thinking I could take that down and put up something else.

4th Acura

Tesla1856 - Thanks for the FM and DB downloads. I was able to play them in 5.1 in my 2020 RDX and add them to my collection. Any future downloads you would like to share would be greatly appreciated by me. 5.1 really adds to these oldies but goodies.

EFR

For me, yes.

EFR

So, related I guess. Any tips on how to 'copy, clone or duplicate', on a MacBook Pro, a USB that has music from above files, to another USB as a backup copy.After reading about USB devices my concern is about the possibility of something going wrong on the USB and losing this great music. I generally do not have enough available room on my hard drive to save them there, so essentially just need to copy straight across from a USB to a USB. Because it's a late model Mac it does not, of course, have any ports besides USB 'C's, but I do have a couple of those all-in-one devices that allow the Mac to have 'anything' plugged in to it. Hopefully this makes sense....

oblio98

In the Holiday spirit, please find the following Surround Sound 5.1/4.1 tracks formatted for Acura ELS USB surround. I chose tunes from a wide range of sources, so you will probably know at least one of these tunes. They all sound incredible in the car. These links will self-destruct in a week or so. Feel free to share the files after that, of course, if you find them decent


David Essex - Rock On (Quadraphonic Mix)

https://mega.nz/file/aQB2XDpb#rhatJa...7s6u_lgl_R99c0

John Lennon - Crippled Inside (Rehersal)

https://mega.nz/file/eNQCnB4R#2ZEOPk...x3B1Rq9RaK0k68

AC/DC - Highway to Hell

https://mega.nz/file/PQByyJYL#Ru088u...Ge5rNjvTGQVmG8

America - Three Roses

https://mega.nz/file/fdI2hRBC#Zm2_i6...mtucTHQV12b6Ck

Billy Ocean - Carribean Queen

https://mega.nz/file/LFgCACAb#tYtKsk...SAiG67B768Homw

Funz51

i have a late model Mac. I have a 250 G and a 64G thumb drive that is used in the rdx. I backup all my music onto a separate hard drive. A terabyte or two is not expensive these days. I use a separate HD for timemachine backups. Copying on another thumbdrive is fine also. The chances of both 'going bad' is really really low.
Sounds like you have a usb-c to usb3 convert box. Yes, just plug in both thumb drives, or the thumbdrive and your new back up drive into the box. You will see them both in the Mac finder and just drag files from one to another.
If you would like more details, PM me. I wouldn't mind explaining on the phone if you want. I like to give back to the peeps on this site. All great people and just want to have fun.

EFR

Thanks Funz. I'm sure I am overcomplicating the process, but reading that USB's can or have had issues with losing the data on them, well...caused great concern because losing my little hoard of 5.1 music would be horrible. My concern about copying was reading about a similar process called cloning and the I wasn't sure that, of copying or cloning, which was the right process. I understand the odds of the USB going bad are low....I have never had it happen, but I don't want this music to be the first time! If this does not go well or s easy as it should, will make contact to get on the phone for a walk-through. Thank you!

Addikt

Has anyone tried putting these flac files on their phone and using it as a USB device since there's likely a lot more storage space there?

Tesla1856

1. If you mean "De-trapping" that is rare. However, I have seen USB-drives go bad in other ways (especially cheap, no-name ones).

2. Like any important files, always good to have a second-copy somewhere safe.

3. I keep a recent copy of my main car's USB-drive backed-up to HDD or NAS like everything else. It's expendable.

Tesla1856

1. I don't think that works on Apple iPhone but maybe Android.

2. Not sure I follow you. You can get a high-quality Samsung 128gb flash-drive for $20. It can be just for car-music (and/or videos).

RiotfunK

Android you should be able to. But flash drives are cheap af. Plug two in the computer and then drag all the files over you wanna copy. 128gb thumb drive is like 17$

Addikt

Fair points. I'd prefer to just have my phone plugged in and be able to switch between AA (Spotify) and USB Audio vs. swapping devices in/out.

How many uncompressed FLAC files can you get onto a 128gb flash drive?

Personally, I'm annoyed that i have to go through all this effort vs. just using a CD, but I guess I shoulda looked closer before purchasing ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Tesla1856

Yeah, Audi dropped optical-discs back in 2020, and more models in 2021.

But even when I had one, I only carried (exact) burned copies of my discs in the car. In it's most basic form, you can easily rip a perfect .WAV of each CD to a Folder. It sounds exactly the same and only " the media type" has changed.

Funz51

Assuming you have enough room on the phone. And 5.1 will not play thru the phone, and the highest resolution stereo rdx files will not be played at that high resolution thru the phone.
I actually took a 4 throw rotary switch in a little box to switch the USB from #1 USB (her music), #2 USB (my music, essentially all), a line to the iPhone and a empty slot. No more plugging in back and forth, just rotate the switch. A little afternoon project. Works well tho.